Do the new ads show a promise of a open release of OSX?

[dergoog]

This is completely out of my own mind, but... did you notice in the party's over ad that PC is more "fed" up with Vista and actually is arguing with other PC's about it?

Here's a hypothesis for you- the ads are a part of a storyline - that will end up with Leopard being released, not only for mac's, but for all PC's, and PC is overjoyed in the commercial where he starts to gloat back at Mac.

Lot's of reason's why this wouldn't happen, like, apple has labeled themselves to be a hardware company in addition to a software company, and an open release (one that can be legally installed on any machine) could hurt their overall sales of hardware... but isn't the profit on software sales much bigger?

Most everyone I know who has a PC isn't upgrading to Vista because their current machine still works and Vista would eat it alive. They've used my mac and seen how effortlessly it works - but aren't prepared to drop at least $500 to switch... they said they would drop $129 for an OS - especially if it dual booted.

That's my thought... what's yours?

 

[clevin]

i don't think so, but i hope so, just feel apple should put much more effort on compatibility issue if it were to do so.

 

[glennyboiwpg]

i don't think so, but i hope so, just feel apple should put much more effort on compatibility issue if it were to do so.

This will never happen... and you should be thankful. Because if they offered OS X to run on any pc, you could kiss the flawless experence goodbye.

why?

Because right now Apple programmers know EXACTLY what hardware to code their OS to run on. They don't have to worry about 3rd-party drivers, or 3rd-party support for their OS.

YOu want to see what OSX would be like if it ran on a PC? Install linux.

Linux... great OS and i've installed it on my machine many times... i've used different distros but the experence is the same... any hardward other then basic configs is a nightmare to get working.

Do you want to spend 3 weeks trying to get your OSX installation to reconize your wireless network card? I don't.

just my two cents.

PS, If have offended any linux dudes out there answer me this, How do I get my DLINK wireless netword card to work on linux without pulling out my hair. And NO, "Buy a new wireless card", doesn't count.

 

[0007776]

I don't think that they would do they should, the last time that they tried it it didn't work well, and they make less on OS sales than on new hardware.

 

[smueboy]

I rather doubt it, but i am sure they at least have/are considering it

 

[localoid]

...PS, If have offended any linux dudes out there answer me this, How do I get my DLINK wireless netword card to work on linux without pulling out my hair. And NO, "Buy a new wireless card", doesn't count.

Whether you "like" the answer or not, the "right" answer to this "problem" is to make sure of compatibility before you buy any components.

 

[glennyboiwpg]

Whether you "like" the answer or not, the "right" answer to this "problem" is to make sure of compatibility before you buy any components.

Or I could just buy apple hardware and KNOW that APPLE Software will Always work with apple hardware

(as long as it meets min requirements ofcourse)

and i've searched the web on this topic quite a bit... Tell me what wireless card IS supported by linux.

Even Windows kicks the snot out of linux when it comes to hardware compatiblity.

 

[localoid]

Or I could just buy apple hardware and KNOW that APPLE Software will Always work with apple hardware

(as long as it meets min requirements ofcourse)

You're over simplifying... As much as I love OS X, I will admit to the fact that Apple doesn't make each and every piece of hardware a person might need/want to connect to a Mac. For example, if you want a discrete sound card, you won't be able to buy an Apple sound card. If you want to use a flatbed scanner, Apple doesn't make one. If you want to use a printer, Apple doesn't make one. In all these cases, you'll need to do your research, and buy something that is supported under OS X, etc.

and i've searched the web on this topic quite a bit... Tell me what wireless card IS supported by linux.

Even Windows kicks the snot out of linux when it comes to hardware compatiblity.

If you think you can plug in any (Windows) hardware device ever made into just any "Windows box" and it will (magically) work, you're in for a big disappointment.

You can't fit a full-height video card into a slot designed for a half-height card in a 3U case, for example. I could buy a great-sounding "pro" soundcard that says it has "Windows XP and Vista drivers" and then find it has no 64-bit driver support under the Window Vista or XP 64bit versions. Again, my point is that it pays to do your research first, and then buy... regardless of what OS you're using.

As far as Linux goes, I've been running Linux servers online since '94. Most, I've built myself. All the hardware components used in these servers have all worked flawlessly. If they didn't, I wouldn't have been able to make a living.

As to what wireless cards do work with Linux -- have you checked the Linux wireless LAN support page?

 

[epochblue]

If they did, I think they'd have a hard time continuing their "Just works" brand of marketing.

I'd say just leave it on Apple hardware. I'm perfectly happy paying the "Apple Tax" knowing that it'll work when I buy it.

 

[glennyboiwpg]

Ok, so yes, if I do the research and build myself a list of components that are... "linux certified" (for lack of a better term) then I guess it would probably
all work.

But that could be said for windows too can't it? If I go to what ever site (i'm assuming microsoft has one) and build a computer from the ground up
with "Microsoft approved compents"
then it should all work with the drivers that came out of the cd/dvd right?

But alot of people use linux for those old windows boxes out there that are just too slow to run the latest and greatest version of windows. I
ts a way fo squeezing
a bit more value at a machine that was once bought for 2000 and is now worth 200.

But your not that guy are you? Your a professional techie who does this for a living, so yeah I bet you have your approved linux hardward list pages
bookmarked on your browser, you build every machine according to whats approved by your information and it works for you.

But thats like a machanic fixing his own car, i'm sure he does the same thing. He has his sources for the best parts to put his his cars. So yeah its always
going to work great for him.

My point? Not everyone who drives a car is a machanic and not everyone who uses a computer is a professional tech guy who builds his
wn machines for a living

My original point? You shouldn't need to be a hardware professional to use linux.

 

[clevin]

This will never happen... and you should be thankful. Because if they offered OS X to run on any pc, you could kiss the flawless experence goodbye.

why?

Because right now Apple programmers know EXACTLY what hardware to code their OS to run on. They don't have to worry about 3rd-party drivers, or 3rd-party support for their OS.

YOu want to see what OSX would be like if it ran on a PC? Install linux.

Linux... great OS and i've installed it on my machine many times... i've used different distros but the experence is the same... any hardward other then basic configs is a nightmare to get working.

Do you want to spend 3 weeks trying to get your OSX installation to reconize your wireless network card? I don't.

PS, If have offended any linux dudes out there answer me this, How do I get my DLINK wireless netword card to work on linux without pulling out my hair. And NO, "Buy a new wireless card", doesn't count.

My built-in wirelesscard worked out of box in Ubuntu 7.04, i didn't spend a second to guess why.

u can spend a year to see if u can get HP laserjet 1020 printer to work with OSX. let me know when you get the answer.

im sorry apple isn't producing everything, and we can't live in a world completely made by apple.

Your reason for restricting OSX is .....may I say baseless? all the "consequences" are imaginary and based on the assumption that apple can't deal with the compatibility issues.

Are you so not confidant about apple's developing ability? M$ can do it, even Linux are not afraid of doing it, and getting better, why apple can't even try?

My original point? You shouldn't need to be a hardware professional to use linux.

I don't see how this topic of "should apple open OSX" becomes a topic of bashing linux, if thats what you want to discuss, we need a new post.

 

[glennyboiwpg]

My built-in wirelesscard worked out of box in Ubuntu 7.04, i didn't spend a second to guess why.

u can spend a year to see if u can get HP laserjet 1020 printer to work with OSX. let me know when you get the answer.

im sorry apple isn't producing everything, and we can't live in a world completely made by apple.

Your reason for restricting OSX is .....may I say baseless? all the "consequences" are imaginary and based on the assumption that apple can't deal with the compatibility issues.

Are you so not confidant about apple's developing ability? M$ can do it, even Linux are not afraid of doing it, and getting better, why apple can't even try?

I don't see how this topic of "should apple open OSX" becomes a topic of bashing linux, if thats what you want to discuss, we need a new post.

Sigh....

Ok lets try this again shall we?

"why shoudln't Apple open up OSX to run on any computer?"

Answer:

"Then you would loose your flawless expernence"

Clarification:

I'm not talking about printers, scanners, cameras, USB flash drives. I'm talking about what goes into the computer, ram, video cards, sound cards, motherboards, wirelesss network cards.

Now i'm a programmer, I do a change for OSx, i, (or someone) has to test those changes. Now if i'm at apple, I know there are only a set of hardware configurations that osx will run on (powerbooks, mac books etc)
So I only have to test those configs... I can produce a product with less chance of blowing up because of that.

Windows programmers do their changes do the best they can with testing and then release it. They have NO idea what hardware your running. all you can do
is hope that the hardware providers produced quality drivers/products.

why is this different from macs? because i'm sure that steve jobs gets in written guarentee from ATI that they will product quality drivers for lets say a powerbook
if ATI doesn't? then apple doesn't use that card.

Now the next point, well if I buy my windows box from dell then it works out of the box right?

Yes... but what if windows blows up and you have to reinstall windows? YOu had better hope that they provide you a proper set of drivers on a cd/dvd.

And yes, Sometimes they don't. I had a friend who had a dell that had some no name sound card, and when he reinstalled the windows, the drivers on the disk didn't work and you couldn't find them on the internet.


So THAT is why Apple won't release osX to the general pc population, because SJ doesn't want his apple users to go through that mess.

phew.

PS sorry for my bad spelling.

 

[clevin]

So THAT is why Apple won't release osX to the general pc population, because SJ doesn't want his apple users to go through that mess.

PS sorry for my bad spelling.

, no p, as long as I understood your points.

this is classic argument, and my answer is same, you are assuming apple has no innovative way and developing ability to handle it well. which, may or may not be true.

you listed a bunch of reasons about "why apple will not be able to deliver good quality if OSX were to released for 3rd party computer hardwares", and subsequently coz its users to "go through that mess".

but

what if apple "can deliver the good quality"?

Its still that You don't trust apple can do it, right?

 

[glennyboiwpg]

, no p, as long as I understood your points.

this is classic argument, and my answer is same, you are assuming apple has no innovative way and developing ability to handle it well. which, may or may not be true.

you listed a bunch of reasons about "why apple will not be able to deliver good quality if OSX were to released for 3rd party computer hardwares", and subsequently coz its users to "go through that mess".

but

what if apple "can deliver the good quality"?

Its still that You don't trust apple can do it, right?

I actually AM a professional programmer, so I know first hand what a mess testing can be.

And you know what? apple HAS an innovative way of doing it's best to insure a better quality product....

ITS TO ONLY ALLOW MAC OS TO RUN ON A MAC!

That IS thier innovative way of insuring quality.

and I think its works quite well don't you say?

EDIT: Even if SJ found some magical way of getting OSX to work on any computer, no matter what, he wouldn't...

VERY SIMPLE REASON. Because that would reduce the amount of people who would spend big bucks on expensive apple hardware.

 

[dergoog]

Yes please, keep on the topic - we aren't talking about linux

I guess the real question here has become whether or not we believe apple can take on the daunting task that M$ does with their OS releases - make it work as good as possible on every piece of hardware out there - and then really smack it to M$ by not just doing it - but doing with the same swagger that all their other products have - it just works.

Here's something larger to consider: though we have seen a new rendition of OSX every year or so, apple had been secretly running an intel processor in a mac for an undisclosed amount of time, and well before they did that, hackers had gotten OSX to run on their home based PC's.

Who is not to say that APPLE has been working on drivers for every piece of hardware out there for the past 5 or so years? No one in the industry can keep things like this under wraps better than APPLE.

I personally think they can do it and it would be the next logical move to ensure market share growth into the double digits. I am not sure the Mini got the penetration into the cost conscious buyer APPLE hoped it would.

Is it the right move? I don't know. I personally hope they do it with that same APPLE dependability we have all come to trust. Otherwise all the microsoft bashing that goes on comes with one huge disclaimer - we're better than you, as long as we don't develop outside of our hardware.

I don't look at developing on only your hardware as innovation - that's just plain wussing out. IMHO

 

[QuarterSwede]

Who is not to say that APPLE has been working on drivers for every piece of hardware out there for the past 5 or so years? No one in the industry can keep things like this under wraps better than APPLE.

Maybe because that would be humanly impossible? Do you realize how many different pieces of hardware exist let alone the number of possible configurations that may conflict with each other there are?

IF Apple were to do this they would have to completely change the way things are certified.

 

[dergoog]

Maybe because that would be humanly impossible? Do you realize how many different pieces of hardware exist let alone the number of possible configurations that may conflict with each other there are?

IF Apple were to do this they would have to completely change the way things are certified.

I am aware, and I don't care as would any consumer, I am only stating the issue and you have answered my question. No apple can't do it.

Now I am going to sound like an M$ supporter- should we really fault Microsoft then for putting such rigorous requirements on hardware? I mean, it does shorten that list for devices to develop against. (then again, doesn't excuse just how awful the thing runs).

Besides, you're thinking within existing parameters... your same thought line would have us still using the now obsolete PowerPC platform (Which MS ironically uses in their X-Box 360- they should have taken a hint from APPLE on how to cool the darn thing); this is APPLE after all, whose to say they couldn't figure out a way to do it?

Every time APPLE comes to market with a new product, it exceeds almost everyone's expectations (MAD TV's iphone gave eternal life) and people marvel at how they got the seemingly impossible done.

Maybe I am a wild-eyed hopeful, but you're sounding like a jaded one. One day someone will pay you what you're worth and you will finally get that respect you so honestly deserve.

 

[Celeron]

I think the reasons expressed here pretty much sum it up. OS X is stable today because Apple controls the hardware is runs on. OS X only has to know about x number of permutations of hardware. If its a 12'' Rev.B Powerbook it has This set of base hardware. There's no guess work there.

This is the same reason gaming is so seamless on consoles when compared to PCs. A game programmer for the Xbox360 knows that each system will contain the exact same hardware thereby reducing the programming complexity involved in getting the game to run properly. With the PC there's always some poor schlub somewhere with an odd combo of hardware that causes the program to explode when he runs it.

Could Apple deal with an infinite amount of hardware combinations like Microsoft does? Maybe, maybe not. If I was Apple, I wouldn't even bother trying. They haven't for over 20 years and I don't think they are about to start now.

Maybe I'm just imagining it but Apple seems to be picking up quite a bit of speed lately. I personally just dropped my PC in favor of a Mac Pro. For this past Christmas I bought my mother a Macbook, which she loves to death. I hope Apple's hardware continues to improve in the coming months and I hope OSX stays bound to it and only it.

 

[clevin]

bundling with hardware's result is low marketshare, altho apple is surging, it won't pass 10% if it keeps this model, does apple like it? who knows.

however, I must admit, if apple won't release osx to other hardwares, business/money is a far more convincing reason than compatibility.

 

[NoOneButMe]

Apple probably wont do this - Look at how secret they are over Leopard screenshots, let alone the actual disc image of the beta's. Not to mention the beta's still having protection built into them in order to prevent incompatible hardware from running..

Though i have seen - though i havent done it myself - OS X running on 'incompatible' hardware(P4, FX5200, Onboard AC97 Audio, Onboard networking) - osx86 *whistles* - and it ran normal enough - and stable for the most part (Some SSE3 > SSE2 opcode problems but i think those were fixed by now..) so stability didnt seem to be a major problem.

 

[p0intblank]

I hope we never see OS X on PCs... that would really piss me off. The best part of being a Mac user is we are exclusive. We have both the hardware and the software.

 

[localoid]

I hope we never see OS X on PCs... that would really piss me off. The best part of being a Mac user is we are exclusive. We have both the hardware and the software.

If you have an Intel Mac, you're using a PC. You just don't realize it.

The only functional difference between an Intel based Asus laptop and a Apple laptop is EFI vs BIOS. Apple no longer manufacturers Macs in California. Today's Macs are made by Asustek, Quanta and other firms who use the exact same (PC) components in the laptops made for Dell and other PC "manufacturers."

 

[Cameront9]

Ignoring the rest of the thread, I think the OP is reading a little too much into these ads.

If anything, I think the point of the ads is that PC really wishes he was a Mac.

I'm not saying that Apple will NEVER release OS X for all computers, but to claim that their advertising--which they hired an outside firm to create, anyway--is really a secret message for the Mac faithful is just crazy.

 

[dergoog]

Ignoring the rest of the thread, I think the OP is reading a little too much into these ads.

If anything, I think the point of the ads is that PC really wishes he was a Mac.

I'm not saying that Apple will NEVER release OS X for all computers, but to claim that their advertising--which they hired an outside firm to create, anyway--is really a secret message for the Mac faithful is just crazy.

I have to disagree there. Having worked as an advertising specialist myself for many years now (too many that I don't want to admit) - I have known about sports team's trades before the players even had an inkling. I have had prototypes of products well before production or public announcement was under way... why? All those materials don't get made overnight.

Apple has a long standing with their ad agency- very long. They may not share everything with them, but they are an integral part of strategy.

 

[dartzorichalcos]

Never should OS X be on a PC. Mac OS X only belongs to Mac Hardware.