YES, I tried several Thunderbolt 3 docks, all have their drawbacks. OWC one is really good but it's lack of 85W charging (only 60W, that's a joke for MBP users) and 4K display did not work properly. Plus the Ethernet port is having the issue all the time (it's could be just my unit, who knows.) Overall, I need an 85W dock. Belkin and Elgato one looks great too, but unfortunately, dual 4K displays are not supported. I don't believe it's my monitors' problem. There are users on Amazon and apple forums talking about Thunderbolt 3 dock's 4K display problem. Only Caldigit's one was reported positively. In my test, I could successfully connect Dell and LG 4K/60hz monitors to Caldigit's displayport and thunderbolt port via a usb-c to dp dongle.
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Dongle thread for the new Macbook Pro's
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YES, I tried several Thunderbolt 3 docks, all have their drawbacks. OWC one is really good but it's lack of 85W charging (only 60W, that's a joke for MBP users) and 4K display did not work properly. Plus the Ethernet port is having the issue all the time (it's could be just my unit, who knows.) Overall, I need an 85W dock. Belkin and Elgato one looks great too, but unfortunately, dual 4K displays are not supported. I don't believe it's my monitors' problem. There are users on Amazon and apple forums talking about Thunderbolt 3 dock's 4K display problem. Only Caldigit's one was reported positively. In my test, I could successfully connect Dell and LG 4K/60hz monitors to Caldigit's displayport and thunderbolt port via a usb-c to dp dongle.
Is anyone here running a adapter that is allowing them to charge the MacBook while at the same time running a 4K display via Type-C to Displayport? I went and spent $100 on the Satechi and I don't think it can do what I need unless I have a defective unit.
You’d need the CalDigit USB-C dock plus special firmware that allows for 4K/60Hz output (reduces USB to 2.0 speeds).
It’s not an adapter, rather.a full-fledged dock, but it will charge up to 60w and do what you need.
Posted on the USB-C thread already, but in case you missed it - this upcoming one from HyperDrive looks like the best option for a MBP desktop solution.
http://t-643bn.fnd.to/hyperdriveUSB
The new version of the Hyperdrive USB-C Hub has a Qi Wireless charger, so it's a great option for iPhoneX and Macbook Pro. It's just been updated with a new form factor & removable USB-C cable.
Unfortunately no Thunderbolt support, but as a desktop USB-C hub it ticks a lot of boxes...
http://t-643bn.fnd.to/hyperdriveUSB
The new version of the Hyperdrive USB-C Hub has a Qi Wireless charger, so it's a great option for iPhoneX and Macbook Pro. It's just been updated with a new form factor & removable USB-C cable.
Unfortunately no Thunderbolt support, but as a desktop USB-C hub it ticks a lot of boxes...
So if I go with the Caldigit TS3, it would allow me to connect my 4K monitor and run it at 60HZ as well as charge my 13” MacBook?
I’m sure it does since it comes with a cord just to plug into one Thunderbolt 3 slot and the other will allow me to charge it and then I can hook up via display port to run my monitor at 4k@60
http://shop.caldigit.com/us/Docking Stations/Thunderbolt Station 3/TS3-US05
I’m sure it does since it comes with a cord just to plug into one Thunderbolt 3 slot and the other will allow me to charge it and then I can hook up via display port to run my monitor at 4k@60
http://shop.caldigit.com/us/Docking Stations/Thunderbolt Station 3/TS3-US05
If you have a thunderbolt 3 MacBook Pro, 13" or 15", you can use caldigit TS3 or TS3 Plus to output 4k60. It can charge your macbook pro too.
Yes, that will work fine. You use the one plug to charge and run your monitor. All through one cable.
that looks like a pretty good dock. and lower priced than previous docks. Back in Feb, I had to pickup one of these
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074G4X7CL/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
which was 199$ at the time, as I need to have thunderbolt to mDP for an apple cinema display. Now, seems I could do that same with this dock for 1494, and not have to buy the apple thunderbolt to mdP adaptor even.
I will say, the one I have above seems smaller and sleeker than the OWC version, but that really doesn't matter to me much.
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A USB-C Dock can only support one 4K 30Hz display (ignoring USB DisplayLink adapters).
A USB-C Dock is usually always less expensive than a Thunderbolt 3 Dock. But a Thunderbolt 3 Dock can support 4 times as much display bandwidth (two 4K 60Hz displays or one 5K 60Hz display) and includes another Thunderbolt 3 port that can be used for a second display, or a USB 3.1 gen 2 (10 Gbps) device or another Thunderbolt device (a display, dock, raid, Thunderbolt dual display adapter, other display adapter (DisplayPort 1.2, HDMI 2.0, VGA, DVI, Dual Link DVI), USB-C displays like the LG UltraFine 4K, Thunderbolt displays like the LG UltraFine 5K display, PCIe expansion box, eGPU, etc.).
A USB-C Dock is usually limited to 5Gbps of data (does anyone make a USB 3.1 gen 2 10Gbps USB hub?). The display data is separate in the USB-C cable. Every kind of display or display adapter should work (except Thunderbolt) but only up to 4K 30Hz.
A Thunderbolt 3 Dock can provide up to 40Gbps of data (up to 2800 MB/s? for PCIe data) minus the amount of data used for the display(s). Upstream data rate (reads to the computer) is not limited by the presence of displays; only downstream data rate (writes from the computer) can be affected by displays.
If you're using a Thunderbolt 2 Mac, then a Thunderbolt 3 Dock will be limited to Thunderbolt 2 speeds (20 Gbps), which is still more than enough for all the ports (except only one 4K 60Hz display can be supported, or two 2560x1600 60Hz displays). For example, the OWC Thunderbolt 3 Dock uses 0.8 Gbps (FireWire) + 1 Gbps (Ethernet) + 5 Gbps (three USB ports) + 5 Gbps (two more USB ports + audio + SD Card Reader : I'm not sure which USB controller the SD Card Reader is connected) + whatever you use the second Thunderbolt 3 port for.
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Thank you for the feedback! This is very good to know before I buy a USB-C or Thunderbolt 3 dock. I didn't know there was that big of a difference on the performance between USB-C and Thunderbolt 3. Looks like I will wait and save up a bit for a Thunderbolt 3 dock
If you want a heads-up, the best TB3 dock on the market is the CalDigit "TS3 Plus". It has the most ports on it (inc. a separate non-display use 10Gb USB-C port), optionally can be ordered with a 2m active TB3 cable (host computer<->dock), and is still on early orders discount directly from them. I have one and it's pretty good.
http://www.caldigit.com/worldwide-stores.asp
http://shop.caldigit.com/us
https://shop.caldigit.com/uk
https://shop.caldigit.com/eu
https://shop.caldigit.com/asia
...just gotta wait for 10m+ optical TB3 cables now (active copper max length is 2m), to put loud(-ish) storage away from desk, lol. :-(
You can use long TB1/2 optical cables between two Apple TB1/2-TB3 adapters, but a single cable would be better.
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Very similar to a OWC Thunderbolt 3 Dock, except they replaced FireWire with USB 3.1 Gen 2. The OWC audio port combines headphone and microphone ports. The OWC is just missing a USB port which is strange since internally it appears to have an unused USB port in one of the two FL1100 USB host controllers.
The CalDigit has 85W of charging for the computer (same as MacBook Pro charger). The OWC only has 60W of charging.
Thunderbolt 3 docks only have four PCIe 3.0 lanes to use from the Thunderbolt 3 controller. Typically, the lanes are used for:
1) USB 3.0 controller (4 ports)
2) USB 3.0 controller (4 ports)
3) Ethernet controller
4) FireWire or USB 3.1 gen 2 controller or whatever
Audio and SD Card Reader each use a USB port. A single USB audio controller can support optical and analog input/output. The capabilities of these devices will differ between docks. For example, the CalDigit uses a faster SD Card Reader (SD 4.0 UHS-II) than the OWC (SD 3.0).
The Thunderbolt 3 controller also provides two Thunderbolt 3 ports (can be used for USB 3.1 gen 2 and display) and a DisplayPort 1.2 or HDMI 1.4 port. DisplayPort is preferable because it's easier to convert DisplayPort to HDMI (DP++ includes HDMI 1.4 so passive HDMI adapter can be used - active DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapters are not expensive compared to HDMI 2.0 to DisplayPort 1.2 adapters).
A dock could add more PCIe lanes by including a PCIe switch but that would greatly increase the price (see for example any Thunderbolt 3 PCIe expansion box with more than 1 slot - Sonnet has many examples of single slot and three slot solutions to compare).
A dock could add more USB ports by adding a hub. Does there exist USB xHCI host controllers with more than 4 ports? What USB 3.1 gen 2 controller does CalDigit use? I wonder why they didn't use a two port controller or if they did, then why didn't they use the second port?
(Edit 1: include other differences between OWC and CalDigit docks)
(Edit 2: meant to say 85W for CalDigit TS3 Plus)
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Great analysis.
The OWC unfortunately has had some terrible reports, and what with the limited power, both contributed to making many users skip buying one. While not perfect, the CalDigit has better specs overall – obviously likely as it's the latest, being released recently.
Many would love a switch type thing so they could plug one (or even two) LG 5K displays into two TB3 Macs, and easily flick between them. As the trouble with these displays is they only have the single TB3 input. (Even if you couldn't use the 3 5Gb USB-C ports on the displays back.)
Kanex used to make one for Apple's DP 27" Cinema Displays that had a single press button, to allow switching between two Macs, but never seen such a thing in the Thunderbolt display era (TB1, 2, or now 3). Hrrmpf!
Your last two paragraphs are interesting, love to hear some further (understandable) explanation/examples on those points.
Seems that the only reason to get the OWC is FireWire (without comparing benchmarks, latency measurements, audio capabilities)
The LG 5K display can't have two Thunderbolt 3 ports because one Thunderbolt 3 port connects to the computer, the other Thunderbolt 3 port is for one of the LG's DisplayPort 1.2 inputs and the DisplayPort output of the Thunderbolt 3 controller is for the LG's second DisplayPort 1.2 input. Two DisplayPort 1.2 inputs are required for a 5K display (just like the discontinued Dell 5K display except the LG 5K receives both DisplayPort 1.2 signals over Thunderbolt 3 from the Mac). Basically, The LG 5K is wired like a Thunderbolt 3 Dual DisplayPort adapter (but also uses PCIe tunneling for the USB functions of the display - a PCIe USB Host controller is connect to the PCIe interface of the LG's Thunderbolt 3 controller).
The Thunderbolt 3 controller has a 4 lane PCIe 3.0 interface. In a Mac, the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe interface faces upstream to one of the Mac's PCIe root ports (link width is 4 lanes). the Mac's Thunderbolt 3 controller's Thunderbolt 3 port has a downstream connection to a Thunderbolt 3 dock's Thunderbolt 3 controller's Thunderbolt 3 port.
A Thunderbolt 3 controller includes a built-in PCIe switch.
In a dock, the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe switch uses a Thunderbolt 3 port for a 4 lane upstream connection to the Mac's Thunderbolt 3 port. The PCIe switch divides the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe interface into 4 links, with width of 1 lane each. Downstream to each link is a PCIe device (USB host controller, Ethernet controller, etc.)
The Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe switch can use the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe interface as a 4 lane link to a downstream 4 lane device (such as an NVMe drive) or a 4 lane slot (as in a Thunderbolt 3 expansion box like the Sonnet Echo Express SEL or SE I)
I don't know if there exists a Thunderbolt 3 device that uses the PCIe interface of the Thunderbolt 3 controller as a two lane link to a downstream device (or two 2 lane links to two devices). However, the MacBook Pro 13 inch has one Thunderbolt 3 controller where the PCIe interface is used as a two lane link to an upstream PCIe root port of the Mac.
In a 3 slot Thunderbolt 3 expansion box, the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe switch uses the Thunderbolt 3 controller's PCIe interface as a 4 lane link to a downstream PCIe switch having multiple additional downstream links - one to each slot. The PCIe switch is usually one of the PEX 87xx variants. For example, the Sonnet Echo Express III-D (or the Sonnet Echo Express SE III) uses the PEX 8724 (PCIe 3.0, 24 lanes), configured with one 4 lane link upstream, and 3 links downstream (x8, x8, x4). The PEX 8724 can provide 6 links, so it could be used to provide 5 slots. In a Thunderbolt 3 dock it could allow for 5 PCIe devices.
Another example is the Amfeltec SQUID PCIe Gen 3 Carrier Board for 4 M.2 SSD modules. The x16 version uses a PEX 8732 PCIe switch (x16 upstream slot, x4 for each of the 4 NVMe downstream slots = 32 total lanes). The PEX 8732 can provide 8 links. The PEX 8733 has the same lane count but can provide 18 links.
So with a PCIe switch, you can add many devices (you just need space and power for them). There is a small amount of extra latency (but not as much as with the Thunderbolt 3 connection itself). The devices share the upstream link. There is a limit to the number of PCIe devices that a computer can support (each downstream link is a new PCIe bus - usually up to 128 allowed, or 256 on some computers). Each device takes I/O memory space which is also limited. A computer may reserve a number of buses and some I/O memory for each of the two Thunderbolt 3 ports of a Thunderbolt 3 controller.
As for USB, the OWC Thunderbolt 3 Dock uses two Fresco Logic FL1100 4 port USB 3.0 host controllers. The CalDigit might be similar. I was asking if anyone makes a host controller that provides more than 4 ports. If not, then they could add a USB hub internally which would behave like an external USB hub.
For example, the Anker 10 Port 60W Data Hub is a 7 port external USB hub (3 ports are only for charging), but internally, it uses a 4 port hub connected to another 4 port hub meaning 4 of the ports have slightly more latency than the other 3.
So with a USB hub you can add more USB devices. USB ports of a hub have to share the USB bus.
As for USB 3.1 gen 2, one of the most common host controllers is the Asmedia ASM1142 which provides two USB 3.1 gen 2 ports using a PCIe 2.0 x2 or PCE 3.0 x1 interface (same as can be provided by the Thunderbolt 3 controller). CalDigit uses the ASM1142 in some of their PCIe cards like the FASTA-6GU3 Plus. If they use this in their Thunderbolt 3 Dock, then they could have provided two USB 3.1 gen 2 ports (but may need a larger power supply or more space?).
Anybody tried CalDigit TS3 Plus (2m) and the CalDigit Thunerbolt Station 2 on their MacBook Pro 2017? Which is better? I want to connect to an external Sony 4K TV@60Hz that has HDMI 2.0 port only. It seems that one has Displayport only (What Displayport to HDMI 2 adapter should I use?) and the other has HDMI port (Is it HDMI 2.0) only. I may also want to connect a eGPU to the laptop. Thanks.
You would want only the TS3+ and not the TB2. I had the TS3 and it worked great with my Ultrawide which is basically 4k resolution. Use the displayport.
Thanks. My TV only has HDMI 2.0 port. In this case, should I get a DisplayPort to HDMI 2.0 adapter and then connect to the TV using a HDMI cable or get a DisplayPort to HDMI 2.0 cable? What products do you recommend?
If a Thunderbolt or USB-C dock has a HDMI port then it's probably only HDMI 1.4. Only a Thunderbolt dock can have DisplayPort 1.2 (4K 60Hz). (A USB-C dock could support 4K 60Hz only if it only supported USB 2.0 and not USB 3.0). Therefore, either a Thunderbolt 3 dock or a Thunderbolt 2 dock should work (if it has DisplayPort).
Since the MacBook Pro 2017 supports Thunderbolt 3, then a Thunderbolt 3 dock would be better (it can support two 4K 60 Hz displays or one 5K 60Hz display - a Thunderbolt 2 dock can only support one 4K 60Hz display or two 2560x1600 60Hz displays with an additional adapter).
Since you want a Thunderbolt dock with DisplayPort, you should get a DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 active adapter, then connect a HDMI 2.0 cable to your TV. There are many DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapters. plugable.com and club3d both make one. Get a DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapter for the first TV. If you connect another, then get a USB-C to HDMI 2.0 adapter and connect it to the second Thunderbolt 3 port of the Thunderbolt 3 dock (or a Thunderbolt 3 port of your MacBook Pro).
Thanks. At present, only plan to connect to one 49" 4K TV. Just curious, why a Displayport 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapter is better than a Displayport 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 cable?
What do you think of this adapter and cable? Is the Startech cable better than the AmazonBasics cable?
https://www.startech.com/ca/AV/Displayport-Converters/dp-hdmi-2-adapter-4k~DP2HD4K60S
https://www.startech.com/Cables/Audio-Video/HDMI/premium-high-speed-hdmi-cable-2m~HDMM2MP
In case I connect one more 4K monitor in the future, which of the following do you recommend? How are they compared with each other in terms of performance and stability?
https://www.startech.com/ca/AV/usb-c-video-adapters/usb-c-hdmi-adapter~CDP2HDW
https://www.anker.com/products/variant/usb-c-to-hdmi-adapter/A8306041
http://www.caldigit.com/USB-C-Thunderbolt-3-HDMI-Adapter-Converter/
I cannot find it now but I recall watching a video about the CalDigit TS3 Plus. The reviewer mentioned not to use Apple's Thunderbolat 3 cable. Know any reason? I would prefer to have a white/pink/gold color cable connecting from the MacBook Pro 2017 to the TS3 Plus.
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A DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 cable should work. Make sure it's not a DP++ (DisplayPort dual mode) to HDMI cable because that will only get you HDMI 1.4 (passive adapters depend on DP++ to give HDMI 1.4; active adapters or cables are required for HDMI 2.0).
An adapter separate from the cable means you can choose a different length cable without having to pay for the adapter part each time; or you can replace/update the adapter without buying the cable part again.
Those all seem fine. Just read reviews, compare features and prices, and pick one. Test it, and if it doesn't do what you want, pick another (but you should learn why the first one didn't work so you can better identify one that should work). Maybe pick one from a manufacturer that shows good technical info for their product (not dumbed-down marketing crap) on their website, has good support, and has publicly accessible forums for users to communicate with each other and their support team about issues and solutions.
IF you have an HDR TV, then club3d makes a DisplayPort 1.4 to HDMI2.0b adapter. There may be other similar adapters.
(Edited to clarify cable adapter option; added HDR adapter option)
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Thanks. I think my TV has HDR. https://docs.sony.com/release//specs/XBR49X900E_mksp.pdf
What advantage does a DisportPort 1.4 to HDMI 2.0b adapter has over a DisportPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapter?
The MacBook Pro's Thunderbolt 3 ports don't support DisplayPort 1.4 (need to wait for Mac's with Titan Ridge Thunderbolt 3 controllers) so I don't think you can get HDR from the MacBook Pro with the club3d adapter unless you use an eGPU.
The HDR adapter supports up to 16bpc. I suppose it uses the HDR10 feature of DisplayPort 1.4 to produce a HDR signal for HDMI2.0a or HDMI2.0b.
I guess the adapter should work fine for non-HDR HDMI 2.0 stuff.