Dutch Officials Set to Open 11 iPad-Only 'Steve Jobs Schools' for Children

[phandam]

Son is accepted to this school

I am a long time reader of MacRumors but had to finally sign up to respond to this thread.

I am an American who has been living in Amsterdam for almost 10 years. My son is accepted to one of the "Steve Job's schools" which is just a nickname given to them. They ARE Montesori schools and follow the same Montesori principles as many Dutch Montesori schools. They are very popular here and are usually the first schools to fill up. It is a proven system here and it works very well.

There are of course some kids that do not thrive in such an environment, but a long track record here shows the vast majority do.

The article that is posted only highlights the iPad part of the story because that will draw the most views and interest the internet. The schools have in place a very structured system to track and mentor the children's development and address issues as they happen with the involvement of the parents, teachers, and children. The children's progress is tracked via a website so all parties are aware of the progress or lack of progress in almost real time.

The school aims to find individual children's talent and allow the children to explore that talent. They focus on music, numbers, image, social, nature, word, numbers, etc. If a child excels in any of the various categories they have additional programs in that subject they can pursue.

Finally there are paper and pens, paint brushes, physical toys, play grounds, musical instruments, etc. The iPad is one of the tools used.

I am very excited for my son to attend this school.

 

[needfx]

Will they ever learn how to write with pen on paper?

 

[thekev]

(Except for the whole iPad/technology thing) This sounds a lot like how Thomas Jefferson envisioned the University of Virginia when he founded it. Just sayin, it's both revolutionary in that it's different (and probably better on a smaller scale) than what we're doing now with public education, but an older idea from another American genius.

Bleh. You thought of something cool. I immediately thought of zoolander.

Exactly.

Would Steve Jobs, who loved calligraphy and beautifully written books have those skills be lost by a generation of zombie kids who can use an iPad but can't even write in cursive?

Handwriting is essential to young children, so the fact that they don't have notebooks makes this "school" sound like a joke.

It's not bold or forward to deprive children of that. It's a step back.

A stylus might help. I don't mean a cheap stylus. I mean something comparable to the pens wacom bundles with their tablets. Even then it's not the same friction as paper. I always had trouble with keeping my hand steady while writing. Oddly I can draw fine as an adult.

 

[pineapple216]

Funny to read that this subject even made it to MacRumors.
There's been a lot of criticism on Maurice de Hond's plan.

In the Volkskrant, one of the bigger quality newspapers here in the Netherlands, a German psychologist even argued that it is a very bad idea to let young children learn with the iPads and computers.

For those of you who are interested, I've translated the article with google translate;

http://translate.google.com/transla...Pad-voor-kleuters-is-kindermishandeling.dhtml

 

[28monkeys]

These kids would probably grow up having neck problem.

 

[Happybunny]

Maurice de Hond is about as reliable as Jerry Springer or Geraldo Rivera, he is a self publist, a preparer of crap.


http://www.krapuul.nl/overig/nieuws/108258/maurice-hond-alweer-man-plan/#sthash.ZEHTVP4s.dpbs

http://www.bnr.nl/opinie/gerard-drosterij/549468-1306/zijn-ipad-scholen-een-duivels-plan


http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4556/Onde.../Kind-is-proefkonijn-op-een-iPad-school.dhtml

 

[pineapple216]

Maurice de Hond is about as reliable as Jerry Springer or Geraldo Rivera, he is a self publist, a preparer of crap.


http://www.krapuul.nl/overig/nieuws/108258/maurice-hond-alweer-man-plan/#sthash.ZEHTVP4s.dpbs

http://www.bnr.nl/opinie/gerard-drosterij/549468-1306/zijn-ipad-scholen-een-duivels-plan


http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4556/Onde.../Kind-is-proefkonijn-op-een-iPad-school.dhtml

Probably true, he is no scientist, shrink, or whatsoever.

And it's kind of strange that almost many people (including almost everyone in the Tweede kamer (our house of representatives)) approves this plan, even though there's no scientific evidence that children learn better when they're using tablets.

 

[Timur]

Using tablets to replace heavy books seems like a good idea, though.

 

[redAPPLE]

And they will never be able to write legibly on paper or do math, likewise?

There's an app for that.

 

[gctwnl]

The concept of students learning on their own and teachers becoming learning 'coaches' is not new. There have been many experiments in The Netherlands with so called 'free schools' but the schools generally performed pretty poorly on actually teaching the kids good skills. In other words: the concept (but without iPad) has performed pretty badly. It is questionable if a mere tool (however nice) is going to change that. And it is roughly toying with kids as guinea pigs to start something like this without knowing what you're doing.

Secondly, certainly in the Netherlands, 'sitting in rows doing stuff they intensely dislike' is not as it is. At the elementary school where my kids go, there are 5 levels inside each class, both the faster and the slower students get personal attention. There are remedial teaching opportunities and across the school, the few super-brights are doing special projects together (a group of smart 8-12 year olds working together). Measured internationally, the Dutch system works pretty well, underfunded as it is. Only at the top (the brightest kids), the system does not perform very well, but the amount of attention here is changing.

Of what I know of edu research, the major factor in relative performance for a child is the quality of the teacher. In terms of absolute performance it is child talents combined with teacher quality. There are many things a digital computer cannot do at all, even a nice one like an iPad, but it won't be 'teaching'.

The guy who is behind all this (Maurice de Hond) has been along advocating all kinds of extreme utopian futures based on his beliefs in computers. He is a very public figure. He published books about it (as I recall, written by a ghost writer and I also recall that it kind of reminded me a lot of 'being digital' by Negroponte, except that the guy did think that in the end 'beam me up, Scotty' as an extrapolation of 'travelling senses' would become real). Taking his beliefs in this direction is I think typical. Facts will only stand in the way.

But I read earlier in this thread they are just 'Montessori' schools, which is an accepted school form in The Netherlands (where people are free to found a school and if that school operates within certain legal boundaries (e.g. they need to show that the children achieve certain standardised levels ate certain age levels) they are entitled to government subsidies for education). Montessori schools are accepted in The Netherlands, though in a small minority. They do not perform so exceptionally that it is proven that the mechanism works. It must be said though that general elementary schools in The Netherlands have taken some aspects of Montessori into their basic curriculum, especially some individual attention, individual levels and looking at each child as an individual. You'll find that in many elementary schools in The Netherlands.

It is (in my opinion) more likely that only children of a certain select group of parents end up there. I would not be surprised if these children and their parents are atypical. That the schools then perform acceptably, does not say much.

----------

Using tablets to replace heavy books seems like a good idea, though.

Elementary school children generally do not carry a lot of heavy books around

 

[PracticalMac]

It comes from the "letting the kids do whatever they want" syndrome.

Plus, it's hard enough to talk to people without getting disturbed by some sort of message/call on a mobile device.

I was at a seminar over the weekend and, I swear, every 10 minutes someone's phone was ringing and they left the room to take it, or had an alert and people pulled their phone out to get the message (text, FB, Twitter, whatever). Even on vibrate a person getting up to leave to take the call or check the message was a bit distracting.

Now they want a classroom full of kids and the main interaction is with a mobile device?

Really?

It's kids LEARNING whatever they want, yet guided in such a way they go over selected subjects.

It is much more complex then couple of sentences can describe.

And I doubt the devices will be ringing alerts every 10 minuets too.


Why are so many applying adult, business style use of devices to children's teaching?

 

[Earendil]

I am a long time reader of MacRumors but had to finally sign up to respond to this thread.
[...]
I am very excited for my son to attend this school.

I greatly appreciate you taking the time to do so! Your post was enlightening and added greatly to a conversation that was getting a little petty and dull

 

[PracticalMac]

The concept of students learning on their own and teachers becoming learning 'coaches' is not new. There have been many experiments in The Netherlands with so called 'free schools' but the schools generally performed pretty poorly on actually teaching the kids good skills. In other words: the concept (but without iPad) has performed pretty badly. It is questionable if a mere tool (however nice) is going to change that. And it is roughly toying with kids as guinea pigs to start something like this without knowing what you're doing.

...

Well written piece.

I would counter the versatile and personable nature of the iPad can provide benefits to learning, at the least to data management. Also, an iPad course can be created to subversively guide the curriculum, but keep attention of student.

Yes, a lot of questions on advantages, but the consequences of not trying could be worse.

 

[dragje]

Don't believe everything you read, the initiative is from private people, Dutch authorities are strongly against this.

Nope, some have doubts, others object and some do like the idea. Typical for Holland as well because in our country we talk about consensus politics. So, it will be allowed.

It's radical but not 'that' radical. Just like the Montessori system or the "Vrije" school, (Free school) system. The consensus is that politicians allow new type of schools as long (!!) no signs will show up of youngsters not being able to successfully complete the Dutch state-exams, which are the same for all type of school systems.

I've my doubts on this all as well, but I do understand that it will go on. Time will tell if this is a breakthrough in the system in a positive way or just an ordinary hype.

 

[gkarris]

It's kids LEARNING whatever they want, yet guided in such a way they go over selected subjects.

It is much more complex then couple of sentences can describe.

And I doubt the devices will be ringing alerts every 10 minuets too.


Why are so many applying adult, business style use of devices to children's teaching?

My point is - if adults are making mobile devices a major priority over classroom lecture and teaching, applying it development learning will make things worse and irreversible...

 

[dragje]

But I read earlier in this thread they are just 'Montessori' schools, which is an accepted school form in The Netherlands (where people are free to found a school and if that school operates within certain legal boundaries (e.g. they need to show that the children achieve certain standardised levels ate certain age levels) they are entitled to government subsidies for education). Montessori schools are accepted in The Netherlands, though in a small minority.

In Amsterdam it's hard NOT to go to a Montessori system I may add.

They do not perform so exceptionally that it is proven that the mechanism works.

I can actually state the opposite. When I think of my old schoolmates, we all have been to a Montessori system, I can honestly state that we all became quite successful in life and even more, we are all doing exactly what we like to to. I've my own successful company in media and most of my friends have been highly successful being an artist and in one case even became famous in Holland.

It's also 'known' that Montessori students perform better at universities according to some scientist, which is not that odd because at Montessori you learn to deal with responsibility along with planning. Students need to read books on there own initiative. It's quite the same how university works. You can, as a Montessori student, decide to take extra classes in biology if you grades showing that you could do better. In universities also students need to take responsibility to show up at classes. It's just in the last several years that students are "forced" to show up in order to 'earn' points'.

Again, it's in the eye of the beholder. Read this article http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-500368_162-2050676.html

You'll be surprised with the outcome. I've seen people succeed after graduate from Montessori lyceum and and I've seen failures. But you'll see the same on elementary schools. Show me facts, not just your personal opinion, which proof that Montessori system doesn't work.

My guess is that this is your personal view, but not based on facts. Again, it's in the eye of the beholder, I've seen students fail big time on elementary school and succeed. The same with the Montessori system.

It must be said though that general elementary schools in The Netherlands have taken some aspects of Montessori into their basic curriculum, especially some individual attention, individual levels and looking at each child as an individual.

Sorry, but that's just not the case. You've clearly no know-how on how Montessori system works. It's not about giving the individual some attention, quite the opposite, the system is all about: let the students decide themselves what attention they like to get. Quite the opposite. And teachers on elementary schools in Holland are quite frustrated not being able to give their students enough attention to start with.

Don't you read the newspapers? 80 % of the teachers complaining about to much pressure, not being able to do what they would like to do: teaching.

http://www.vosabb.nl/veel-leraren-klagen-over-te-hoge-werkdruk/

http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4556/Onde.../Enquete-leraren-willen-gewoon-lesgeven.dhtml

http://www.stand.nl/stellingen/Binnenland/De-werkdruk-voor-leraren-het-basisonderwijs-moet-omlaag

Etc.

 

[ChrisA]

Handwriting is essential to young children, so the fact that they don't have notebooks makes this "school" sound like a joke.

It's not bold or forward to deprive children of that. It's a step back.

First off how do you know they don't teach handwriting? THey might. It certainly can do done on an iPad

But today we hold schools "accountable" with standardized tests. Cursive writing is not on the test. That's true, few schools teach cursive writing anymore.

 

[Xeperu]

This is NOT a government initiative but a private initiative. If this were an official government initiative they would be bound to EU regulations for tender processes. Meaning they would have to tender for a "tablet computer fit for functionality XYZ". In the end they'd have to choose the cheapest fit for function option. Not going to happen unless Apple provides the iPad at a special price.

 

[phandam]

In Amsterdam it's hard NOT to go to a Montessori system I may add.



I can actually state the opposite. When I think of my old schoolmates, we all have been to a Montessori system, I can honestly state that we all became quite successful in life and even more, we are all doing exactly what we like to to. I've my own successful company in media and most of my friends have been highly successful being an artist and in one case even became famous in Holland.

It's also 'known' that Montessori students perform better at universities according to some scientist, which is not that odd because at Montessori you learn to deal with responsibility along with planning. Students need to read books on there own initiative. It's quite the same how university works. You can, as a Montessori student, decide to take extra classes in biology if you grades showing that you could do better. In universities also students need to take responsibility to show up at classes. It's just in the last several years that students are "forced" to show up in order to 'earn' points'.

Again, it's in the eye of the beholder. Read this article http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-500368_162-2050676.html

You'll be surprised with the outcome. I've seen people succeed after graduate from Montessori lyceum and and I've seen failures. But you'll see the same on elementary schools. Show me facts, not just your personal opinion, which proof that Montessori system doesn't work.

My guess is that this is your personal view, but not based on facts. Again, it's in the eye of the beholder, I've seen students fail big time on elementary school and succeed. The same with the Montessori system.




Sorry, but that's just not the case. You've clearly no know-how on how Montessori system works. It's not about giving the individual some attention, quite the opposite, the system is all about: let the students decide themselves what attention they like to get. Quite the opposite. And teachers on elementary schools in Holland are quite frustrated not being able to give their students enough attention to start with.

Don't you read the newspapers? 80 % of the teachers complaining about to much pressure, not being able to do what they would like to do: teaching.

http://www.vosabb.nl/veel-leraren-klagen-over-te-hoge-werkdruk/

http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4556/Onde.../Enquete-leraren-willen-gewoon-lesgeven.dhtml

http://www.stand.nl/stellingen/Binnenland/De-werkdruk-voor-leraren-het-basisonderwijs-moet-omlaag

Etc.

Great post, and from what I have seen here the last 10 years I completely agree.

 

[rGiskard]

From the original article:

"Debbie Hengeveld, 41, found the concept so convincing that she promptly enrolled [...] her seven-year-old daughter Freeke"

Sounds like a perfect name for a student at those schools...

I was thinking along the lines of "Vidiots". A whole generation of them.

 

[cwwilson]

I am a long time reader of MacRumors but had to finally sign up to respond to this thread.

I am an American who has been living in Amsterdam for almost 10 years. My son is accepted to one of the "Steve Job's schools" which is just a nickname given to them. They ARE Montesori schools and follow the same Montesori principles as many Dutch Montesori schools. They are very popular here and are usually the first schools to fill up. It is a proven system here and it works very well.

There are of course some kids that do not thrive in such an environment, but a long track record here shows the vast majority do.

The article that is posted only highlights the iPad part of the story because that will draw the most views and interest the internet. The schools have in place a very structured system to track and mentor the children's development and address issues as they happen with the involvement of the parents, teachers, and children. The children's progress is tracked via a website so all parties are aware of the progress or lack of progress in almost real time.

The school aims to find individual children's talent and allow the children to explore that talent. They focus on music, numbers, image, social, nature, word, numbers, etc. If a child excels in any of the various categories they have additional programs in that subject they can pursue.

Finally there are paper and pens, paint brushes, physical toys, play grounds, musical instruments, etc. The iPad is one of the tools used.

I am very excited for my son to attend this school.

Thank you for giving me some insight on this, I now feel foolish about my previous statement in this thread. Congratulations to your son by the way.

 

[ijohn.8.80]

Well, why even bother? Just go all out and let the kids grade themselves. This WOULD NOT work over hear BTW. Just saying.

Having used a natural learning approach with three boys that we homeschooled, I can say it actually works. The eldest is in University, the other two are 14 and one has won numerous awards for his fiction writing, the other is well on his way to becoming an Ornithologist. The hardest part is delivering the information tailored to how each child thinks and learns, that requires observation and participation from observant adults, an iPad is not up to that task just yet. I'm sure that one day soon there will be an app for it.

 

[hafr]

I am a long time reader of MacRumors but had to finally sign up to respond to this thread.

I am an American who has been living in Amsterdam for almost 10 years. My son is accepted to one of the "Steve Job's schools" which is just a nickname given to them. They ARE Montesori schools and follow the same Montesori principles as many Dutch Montesori schools. They are very popular here and are usually the first schools to fill up. It is a proven system here and it works very well.

There are of course some kids that do not thrive in such an environment, but a long track record here shows the vast majority do.

The article that is posted only highlights the iPad part of the story because that will draw the most views and interest the internet. The schools have in place a very structured system to track and mentor the children's development and address issues as they happen with the involvement of the parents, teachers, and children. The children's progress is tracked via a website so all parties are aware of the progress or lack of progress in almost real time.

The school aims to find individual children's talent and allow the children to explore that talent. They focus on music, numbers, image, social, nature, word, numbers, etc. If a child excels in any of the various categories they have additional programs in that subject they can pursue.

Finally there are paper and pens, paint brushes, physical toys, play grounds, musical instruments, etc. The iPad is one of the tools used.

I am very excited for my son to attend this school.

The article states there won't be pens and paper in these schools, you say there will be. Is this information you have been given by the school (i.e. is the article wrong), or are you basing it on knowledge of other Montessori schools?

If the kids don't have to do anything they don't want to, how do you make sure they get even the basics in subjects they don't want to explore? And what do you do if they don't reach the goals set up?

I know a few people who attended Montessori schools, and the common denominator is that they all had problems adapting when they started a normal high school (voortgezet onderwijs for you, secundair onderwijs for me ). Have you taken this transition into consideration, and if so, how do you reason around it?

----------

Maurice de Hond is about as reliable as Jerry Springer or Geraldo Rivera, he is a self publist, a preparer of crap.


http://www.krapuul.nl/overig/nieuws/108258/maurice-hond-alweer-man-plan/#sthash.ZEHTVP4s.dpbs

http://www.bnr.nl/opinie/gerard-drosterij/549468-1306/zijn-ipad-scholen-een-duivels-plan


http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4556/Onde.../Kind-is-proefkonijn-op-een-iPad-school.dhtml

Probably true, he is no scientist, shrink, or whatsoever.

And it's kind of strange that almost many people (including almost everyone in the Tweede kamer (our house of representatives)) approves this plan, even though there's no scientific evidence that children learn better when they're using tablets.

http://de.rechtzetting.be/2012/02/21/ipad-maakt-kinderen-dom/

Just sayin'

----------

Elementary school children generally do not carry a lot of heavy books around

For you it might be light and easy to carry around, for elementary school children even a small weight is heavy.

As you write a lot about the Netherlands, I assume you don't need this article translated: http://www.klasse.be/archief/de-boekentassen-zijn-te-zwaar/

It's an old article that I used for its graphic, but just google boekentassen te zwaar (schoolbags too heavy, for the others reading) and you'll find quite a lot...

 

[phandam]

The article states there won't be pens and paper in these schools, you say there will be. Is this information you have been given by the school (i.e. is the article wrong), or are you basing it on knowledge of other Montessori schools?

If the kids don't have to do anything they don't want to, how do you make sure they get even the basics in subjects they don't want to explore? And what do you do if they don't reach the goals set up?

I know a few people who attended Montessori schools, and the common denominator is that they all had problems adapting when they started a normal high school (voortgezet onderwijs for you, secundair onderwijs for me ). Have you taken this transition into consideration, and if so, how do you reason around it?

My wife (who is dutch) went to the school for an intake with my son. Granted it is in a temporary building at the moment, but there were all he normal tools/toys/supplies you expect to see in a school. So I believe this is a talking point for the press. They will do most of their assignments on the iPads but there are many paths the children can choose or be lead (based on showing interest).

My wife who is actually against almost any that requires electricity did not see anything strange or abnormal at the school and was very excited about it. She was not even aware it was a "Steve Jobs school" until the press from this article came out. She is a big fan of the Montessori system and went to one herself.

Regarding your point about kids not showing interest or reaching goals. They cover almost all of the possible interests a young child can have, so if there is a child that is falling behind, that is where the teacher/parents need to step in and figure out why. And since this information should be easily detected via the real time progress reports, I think it will be visible sooner than in a "standard" school.

I have met many people who have graduated from a Montessori school and have not heard of any transition issues or problems. They actually tell me they are more prepared for college/university. However they would probably not know the difference since they grew up in the Montessori system. I would be curious to hear about the transition issues you mention.

On a more selfish note, I really like that the school will not enforce the typical holiday period. For those not aware, the system here forces parents to go on holiday at the same time depending on the zone of the country you live in. The means the holiday/vacation businesses know there is a huge number of Dutch people looking for holidays at a specific period of time so they can raise the prices if they want. If you take your child on holiday outside of this period you get fined 50 euros per day (I think it is 50 euros).

----------

Thank you for giving me some insight on this, I now feel foolish about my previous statement in this thread. Congratulations to your son by the way.

Thank you, no need to feel foolish, the articles are misleading according to my interaction with the school. We are still deciding if this is the best option, but only because it is a bit further away. Amsterdam currently has an issue where there are not enough spaces for all the kids. So as I mention in a previous post, we found this school accidentally. It was mentioned as an alternative for us since our neighborhood school is filled.

 

[hafr]

My wife (who is dutch) went to the school for an intake with my son. Granted it is in a temporary building at the moment, but there were all he normal tools/toys/supplies you expect to see in a school. So I believe this is a talking point for the press. They will do most of their assignments on the iPads but there are many paths the children can choose or be lead (based on showing interest).

Okay, so the description given in the article, that the iPad is the only tool, is simply not true? That's a relief

Regarding your point about kids not showing interest or reaching goals. They cover almost all of the possible interests a young child can have, so if there is a child that is falling behind, that is where the teacher/parents need to step in and figure out why. And since this information should be easily detected via the real time progress reports, I think it will be visible sooner than in a "standard" school.

I read a bit about Montessori after having written my questions to you, and apparently the freedom described is very far from absolute. Kids who don't want to explore maths for instance will be "forced" into it in order to reach the goals.

I have met many people who have graduated from a Montessori school and have not heard of any transition issues or problems. They actually tell me they are more prepared for college/university. However they would probably not know the difference since they grew up in the Montessori system. I would be curious to hear about the transition issues you mention.

I wasn't talking about Montessori -> uni, but Montessori -> normal high school. Where I'm from, there aren't (at least there didn't use to be) any Montessori schools for kids older than 12, meaning everyone had to go to a regular school. Those of my friends that came from a Montessori school all had more or less problems with adapting to the structured form of learning. Everything from being on time to constantly questioning the teachers' rules.

But if you have the possibility to let your child(ren?) attend Montessori school(s) until it's time for uni, I guess the question is moot

On a more selfish note, I really like that the school will not enforce the typical holiday period. For those not aware, the system here forces parents to go on holiday at the same time depending on the zone of the country you live in. The means the holiday/vacation businesses know there is a huge number of Dutch people looking for holidays at a specific period of time so they can raise the prices if they want. If you take your child on holiday outside of this period you get fined 50 euros per day (I think it is 50 euros).

Peak season pricing according to school holidays isn't a Dutch speciality though But the fine really surprised me. Do you have any more information regarding that? In Dutch or in English, either language is fine (no pun intended). I can't find anything, but I might be worthless at using google...