EU Antitrust Ruling Says Google Abusing Patent Position in German Lawsuit Against Apple

[hydr]

Instead of punishing people for working the system, why don't they fix the system?

The system is working perfectly fine as it is.

Android ripped IOS off. Apple was certain it had a good case, and took OEMs who were making money off Android devices to court. They have since scored several wins, and OEMs like HTC have entered licensing agreements with Apple.

The problem arose when Google/Samsung decided to fight Apple with dirty tricks like trying to inflict injunction on Apple products using FRAND patents.

This is nothing short of criminal behavior and it has now backfired tremendously for all of them.

The right thing for Google would have been to let the courts decide if Apple had a case or not. Instead they bought Motorola to try muscle Apple from obtaining rightfully licensing for their work.

What really amazes me is they & their lawyers really thought this would work in the first place.. Using FRAND patents to obtain injunctions is as anti-trust and abusive as you can possibly get.

What all the Android players should do now is pony up the licensing deals for past work, and come up with a "next generation" android that is fresh and original much like how Microsoft did.

Apple had a case, a very good case and they have scored several wins against OEMs. They have not been playing dirty, they have simply let the courts decide.

And as for the system? It appears to be working, bad people get caught.

 

[Mr.damien]

This is a joke post right?

I think you can't use a phone without those /sarcasm

 

[Azurael]

Everybody saying "nobody cares" is too ignorant to understand the issues here, I'm afraid to say.

This is a fundamental ruling. It is crucial to the development of technology across the entire freaking industry. It's impossible to overstate the importance of this ruling.

If all companies were allowed to act like Motorola has been acting with its essential patents, there would be no industry standards in the future. It would be impossible for anybody to implement them.

Industry standards like 802.11 WiFi, h.264 MP4 video, all telecommunications protocols (GSM, UMTS 3G, LTE, CDMA, whatever) and many, many, many more depend on the system that Motorola was trying to litigate around. If they had been allowed to continue, it's probable that none of those technologies would be usable anymore by any company and that improved technologies would never exist.

Samsung have been following basically the same strategy. They are allowed to bring these kinds of actions in Court - it's their right to do so. However, the courts will rule against them every single time. And they have.

There is only one case where a patent essential to one of these standards has led to an injunction (Motorola got one against Apple in Germany), but only due to a technicality that Apple fixed the same day (and got the injunction lifted).

This EU antitrust thing basically says that that one case was a bit of a legal bug, and that things like that shouldn't happen again. Too right!

And yet Apple are allowed to screw Samsung over a slab with rounded corners in the US? And allowed to bundle Safari and iTunes with OS X in Europe while Microsoft got screwed in an EU antitrust ruling over the same behaviour?

Let's face it. The whole world's legal system is f**ed. If such a thing were possible, I'd just like to see an outright ban on Apple vs Android OEM lawsuits and visa versa. This has got ridiculous now. I'm going to go and buy an Openmoko device just so I'm not supporting any of these idiots.

 

[apolloa]

Seriously, GOOGLE IS abusing IT'S position and patents??? Yeah, Apple NEVER does that right EU courts????

I get sick when I see patent story's now, especially on this website as they post the reports in a twisted and obscured way to make Apple look like a frigging victim!

 

[hydr]

Seriously, GOOGLE IS abusing IT'S position and patents??? Yeah, Apple NEVER does that right EU courts????

I get sick when I see patent story's now, especially on this website.

That is exactly right.

----------

And yet Apple are allowed to screw Samsung over a slab with rounded corners in the US? And allowed to bundle Safari and iTunes with OS X in Europe while Microsoft got screwed in an EU antitrust ruling over the same behaviour?

Let's face it. The whole world's legal system is f**ed. If such a thing were possible, I'd just like to see an outright ban on Apple vs Android OEM lawsuits and visa versa. This has got ridiculous now. I'm going to go and buy an Openmoko device just so I'm not supporting any of these idiots.

The legal system is working just fine. You just have no idea what is going on. I suggest you start reading.

 

[Apfeldirektsaft]

Seriously, GOOGLE IS abusing IT'S position and patents??? Yeah, Apple NEVER does that right EU courts????

I get sick when I see patent story's now, especially on this website as they post the reports in a twisted and obscured way to make Apple look like a frigging victim!

Yes, google is because they tried to use patents required for standards against Apple. Why are there so many people who argue about patents but have no idea what FRAND means?

 

[Azurael]

Yes, google is because they tried to use patents required for standards against Apple. Why are there so many people who argue about patents but have no idea what FRAND means?

I don't think anybody has an issue with fair and reasonable use of essential patents like this... But what's so fair and reasonable about being able to patent a rectangle in the first place?!

 

[apolloa]

Yes, google is because they tried to use patents required for standards against Apple. Why are there so many people who argue about patents but have no idea what FRAND means?

Erm, I was being sarcastic. And please for the love of God don't you or anyone else DARE try to tell me how bad Google is and how wonderful Apple are because you'll only make yourself look like an idiot to me. I've read so many BAD story's about Apple's behaviour on all this, it is way way way way way pass that road to being anything resembling a saint in it's patent wars, in fact it left that road several years ago.

 

[Azurael]

Erm, I was being sarcastic. And please for the love of God don't you or anyone else DARE try to tell me how bad Google is and how wonderful Apple are because you'll only make yourself look like an idiot to me. I've read so many BAD story's about Apple's behaviour on all this, it is way way way way way pass that road to being anything resembling a saint in it's patent wars, in fact it left that road several years ago.

To be fair, this is MacRumors - you weren't expecting an anti-Apple slant, were you?

 

[hydr]

I don't think anybody has an issue with fair and reasonable use of essential patents like this... But what's so fair and reasonable about being able to patent a rectangle in the first place?!

I´m starting to think you are a paid samsung PR stuntman. Apple never tried to patent a rectangle, everyone knows that.

 

[KALLT]

And allowed to bundle Safari and iTunes with OS X in Europe while Microsoft got screwed in an EU antitrust ruling over the same behaviour?

This has nothing to do with favouring one company over another, but with enforcement of competition law, specifically abuse of dominance. The European Commission targeted Microsoft in those cases for the sole reason that Windows is the dominant OS for PCs. When Windows ties in other software it essentially abuses its dominance in the primary market to enter another (secondary) market and thereby distorts competition there as well.

 

[apolloa]

To be fair, this is MacRumors - you weren't expecting an anti-Apple slant, were you?

Nope, because most on here are biased and refuse to see the truth. But it was just a friendly warning before someone started to 'try' and tell me all about the patents wars...
No doubt this thread will reach 400 posts of endless pointless bickering by armchair patent lawyers by the end of the night, they usually do.

 

[HenryDJP]

No one cares anymore.

But you posted to the article so obviously you do.

 

[Apfeldirektsaft]

Erm, I was being sarcastic. And please for the love of God don't you or anyone else DARE try to tell me how bad Google is and how wonderful Apple are because you'll only make yourself look like an idiot to me. I've read so many BAD story's about Apple's behaviour on all this, it is way way way way way pass that road to being anything resembling a saint in it's patent wars, in fact it left that road several years ago.

I'm pretty sure that people don't care how you see them but never mind

 

[HenryDJP]

These lawsuits are getting kinda annoying. They really should just have a page dedicated to lawsuits.

No, they should really just leave the lawsuits behind closed doors. Honestly it's not the public's business. We as consumers don't have any control over lawsuits and it just makes one company look bad to the one that's suing them.

 

[hydr]

Nope, because most on here are biased and refuse to see the truth. But it was just a friendly warning before someone started to 'try' and tell me all about the patents wars...
No doubt this thread will reach 400 posts of endless pointless bickering by armchair patent lawyers by the end of the night, they usually do.

Biased? How about we all just let the courts decide who are right and wrong, and who abuse the system? It is as simple as that. EU has hit Google, Samsung and today Motorola with abusing patents. Fact. Apple? Not a single time. Fact.

Let us just sit back and watch all the paid android scammers come here and flood the forum with "trying to patent rectangle" "apple are the real abusers" etc. Samsung might think its money well spent having these commenters spam all sites with this useless junk, but I find it nothing but hilarious.

 

[Apfeldirektsaft]

I don't think anybody has an issue with fair and reasonable use of essential patents like this... But what's so fair and reasonable about being able to patent a rectangle in the first place?!

1. Read: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_and_non-discriminatory_licensing
2. Read it again maybe
3. Come back to the forums

 

[oliversl]

Motorolla was evil when they blackmailed Apple using FRANDS, and yet Google buys them and keep the same policy. Don't be evil my ...

 

[iGrip]

When you're right, you're right!

"This don’t be evil mantra is ********."

 

[ufwa]

An iPhone (or really any modern phone today) is a combination of many, many products into one. An iPhone is a telephone, a music player, video player, ebook reader, GPS, satnav, camera, video camera, and we could probably add a dozen more things.

Now if I build a camera, and use someone's patent, I might expect to pay X% of the camera price to use the patent. But you wouldn't expect a "phone" that is 20 different products to pay X% of the phone price for a camera patent, plus X% for a video camera patent, plus X% for a GPS patent, plus X% for an ebook reader patent, and so on, for 20X% of the total price.

Why not? The price you pay for the patent is whatever the holder feels is fair. They are not obligated to give you a license. (We'll leave out the issue of standard essentials it makes the water muddy.)

If you hold a patent that I need are you going to come down from your asking price solely because I happen to need to license a bunch of other patents in my final product? Paying you and everyone else would leave me with little to no money. Why would should you care?

Now obviously its going to be a negotiation between you and I on how to bring that price down to something we can both live with. But its absurd to think you would lower the the price simply because I have to pay others.

 

[the8thark]

Another slap in the face of Google. If they thought purchasing patents via Motorola was a good idea to bolster their patent portfolio then they are sorely mistaken. Motorola patents are worth jack ****.

Google is such a hypocritical company. On the one hand they talk to the press about openness and how they want peace with Apple. On the other hand they try to enforce FRAND patents against other companies.

I didn't think of this. But now I do think about it, that is yet another reason why I don't like google.

 

[LagunaSol]

And yet Apple are allowed to screw Samsung over a slab with rounded corners in the US?

Wow, it took 29 posts before the rounded-rectangle chestnut surfaced? A new record!

 

[jsolares]

Everybody saying "nobody cares" is too ignorant to understand the issues here, I'm afraid to say.

This is a fundamental ruling. It is crucial to the development of technology across the entire freaking industry. It's impossible to overstate the importance of this ruling.

If all companies were allowed to act like Motorola has been acting with its essential patents, there would be no industry standards in the future. It would be impossible for anybody to implement them.

Industry standards like 802.11 WiFi, h.264 MP4 video, all telecommunications protocols (GSM, UMTS 3G, LTE, CDMA, whatever) and many, many, many more depend on the system that Motorola was trying to litigate around. If they had been allowed to continue, it's probable that none of those technologies would be usable anymore by any company and that improved technologies would never exist.

Samsung have been following basically the same strategy. They are allowed to bring these kinds of actions in Court - it's their right to do so. However, the courts will rule against them every single time. And they have.

There is only one case where a patent essential to one of these standards has led to an injunction (Motorola got one against Apple in Germany), but only due to a technicality that Apple fixed the same day (and got the injunction lifted).

This EU antitrust thing basically says that that one case was a bit of a legal bug, and that things like that shouldn't happen again. Too right!

What you fail to notice is that this makes it more likely that corporations will not take part in standards, why offer their patents for a standard so they cannot use them defensively at all, better keep them to yourself and then sue for billions like apple.

 

[Internaut]

Has Google won a single patent battle though it's recently acquired proxy?

 

[Oletros]

Everybody saying "nobody cares" is too ignorant to understand the issues here, I'm afraid to say.

This is a fundamental ruling. It is crucial to the development of technology across the entire freaking industry. It's impossible to overstate the importance of this ruling.

If all companies were allowed to act like Motorola has been acting with its essential patents, there would be no industry standards in the future. It would be impossible for anybody to implement them.

Industry standards like 802.11 WiFi, h.264 MP4 video, all telecommunications protocols (GSM, UMTS 3G, LTE, CDMA, whatever) and many, many, many more depend on the system that Motorola was trying to litigate around. If they had been allowed to continue, it's probable that none of those technologies would be usable anymore by any company and that improved technologies would never exist.

Samsung have been following basically the same strategy. They are allowed to bring these kinds of actions in Court - it's their right to do so. However, the courts will rule against them every single time. And they have.

There is only one case where a patent essential to one of these standards has led to an injunction (Motorola got one against Apple in Germany), but only due to a technicality that Apple fixed the same day (and got the injunction lifted).

This EU antitrust thing basically says that that one case was a bit of a legal bug, and that things like that shouldn't happen again. Too right!

Have you actually read the EC text?

Apart that it is not a final thing he clearly states that it only applies to this single case so no, it is not a fundamental case and it doesn't forbides injunctions with FRAND patents and before calling others ignorants you have to read the text