EU Officially Objects to Apple Limiting Third-Party Access to Apple Pay NFC Capabilities

[Alvino]

seems like Apple has been moving in the direction of opening this up, though not at the pace that some folks prefer.

Not a fan of using the force of law to make a company build a product to the specs that some prefer. This should just be a business decision

This is no difference in saying apple is moving to usb C not at the pace some folks prefer.

Today 2022 latest model of iPhone PRO still using lightning connector at usb2.0 bottle neck speed.

Business decision yeah but an ultra greedy one compromising a lot of benefits for users and their environment.

 

[danakin]

Apple has cited security as its rationale for not allowing third-party access to NFC

Apple either thinks we're all idiots, or that we're three-year-olds walking around in circles bumping into furniture.

I lean towards the latter but, in the name of Security (their rationale for maintaining shareholder return), it's likely both.
Their never-ending use of the term "magic" to describe technology and technological achievement is so cloying and, in my opinion, talks down to the audience/consumer.

 

[OkCalis]

As a citizen of Turkey, where international payment services such as Apple Pay and Paypal are banned by the government, I’d really appreciate if Apple opened up the iPhone’s NFC capabilities to banking app developers.

 

[TheRealDrJones]

I fear this and sideloading will destroy Apple's efforts towards data privacy. Apple Pay in its current form would not exist, if banks had free access to NFC.

 

[44267547]

the EU would not know a security risk if it bit them on the @zz.

I wonder why that is.

Glad I don’t live in a country that can’t comprehend basic security concepts.

 

[Appleman3546]

It was a weird move to not provide a nfc kit in Xcode, it probably would avoid or dampen any eventual anti-trust lawsuit

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Isn't that the whole point of this conversation though? That Apple has them, but has restricted it to themselves, in the name of security.

Restrictions are usually a part of security. Like physical keys, and doors, the control of the information related to the location of those are a part of a more secure home and is restricted. Publishing that information publicly doesn’t mean it’ll be exploited, but keeping it private just keeps one more layer of security in place.

 

[AndiG]

The problem with Apple is that it tries to limit standard communication and framework usage. E.G. OOB is a standard protocol for pairing devices (BLE connection initiated through NFC).
Apple uses this internally for applications like GymKit, but doesn't allow developers to use it (at least this was the situation, when I did a research the last time). This relates again to Apples wallet garden approach/business model.

Tims way of creating higher and thicker walls around the garden is starting to fail. The story of Tim and Ive is very interesting.

I'm looking forward to the DMA finally happen. Apple needs to change.

 

[diego.caraballo]

Lets face it, anything is more secure than the waiter of American restaurants storming off with your credit card to pay. Every time that happens I am like wtf. Over here, they are not even allowed to touch your card, not even to place it on the handheld. You have to do it yourself

I share you pain! Also the TIP is added at a later time! By checking my bank account I discovered that when I walked out of the restaurant I was charged only for the bill’s value, but a couple of days later the amount charged increased itself to reflect the tip.

That’s crazy for me. Any other place either the waiter ask for it and enter it on the POS or the POS ask for it and you selected a porcentage or a fixed amount.
When you enter the PIN in the POS or touch your card against it, it’s the final amount that you be charged. You don’t leave with your card “openned” to addictional charges.

 

[ios-dan]

There are other pieces of the hardware that developers don't have direct access to, and no API to get to them. It is not a novel or unusual idea that some parts of the hardware are simply inaccessible to the outside world.

Before there was NFC payment, there was (and continues to be) VISA / MasterCard / Discover / Amex. Why didn't large banks make another card? They could have. But it costs too much.

Apple spent years developing Apple Pay. Yes, I know NFC (as a tech) is a separate thing. But Apple spent years testing it, coming up with how it would work, and making it seamless.

The demands will not stop with "mobile wallet makers" getting access to NFC. They will also demand that any API open to third-parties should operate just as easily as the Apple Wallet. And then some banks will move their cards to their own wallets... then we'll have like half-a-dozen "wallet" apps running on my phone, with varying levels of consumer protection, etc.

Here's the thing... no user is clamoring for a better wallet. Apple Wallet works fine. No user is demanding choice in the wallet arena (and if you say you are, you're lying). This is something completely manufactured by big banks, and if Apple is forced to open it up, it will make the iPhone worse, and less secure. Guaranteed.

 

[JM]

EU have their knickers in a twist with something else Apple does?

Oh look, the sky is blue.

 

[Paul Shields]

If I wanted 15 different apps to pay for things I'd buy an Android phone

 

[JM]

I share you pain! Also the TIP is added at a later time! By checking my bank account I discovered that when I walked out of the restaurant I was charged only for the bill’s value, but a couple of days later the amount charged increased itself to reflect the tip.

That’s crazy for me. Any other place either the waiter ask for it and enter it on the POST or the POST ask for it and you selected a porcentage or a fixed amount.
When you enter the PIN in the POST or touch your card against it, it’s the final amount that you be charged. You don’t leave with your card “openned” to addictional charges.

I’ll add that the US still does not employ a keypad code to authenticate transaction. Maybe I’m still stuck in 15 years ago, but I heard Europe using the pin code and chip to authenticate.

We have the chip, but still no key entry. It’s like credit card companies welcome the skimming and stolen credit card theft. I just don’t get it.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

This is something completely manufactured by big banks

Especially considering most folks (80%+) in the EU don’t even use iPhones.

 

[Mojohanna32]

As the world is shifting towards mobile payment across the world it is only fair t the people has access to the technology on fair terms and not on the cooperates terms. Power to the people.

Really, what you are saying here is not power to the people. What it really is, is power given to other corporations. The people will remain exactly where there are currently, subject to corporate and government say.
I'm on the fence with all of these proposed changes. Part of the reason I enjoy my little slice of the Apple ecosystem is its ease of use, security and less of a headache in dealing with "stuff".
As long as I can keep the other stuff out and the other stuff can't come in on its own, I guess I am ok with it.

 

[Sanme]

Great news 🕺🏾

 

[JM]

If I wanted 15 different apps to pay for things I'd buy an Android phone

No. Shhhhhhh. BUT COMPETITION! And other things.

We must all be the same to be competitive. Consumer must have choice between completely identical products. That’s how it works. Listen to me I’m smart and know things.

 

[sirdir]

NFC is everywhere, and banks can have their card added to Apple Pay, right? And businesses that did not want to use Apple Pay because they wanted to charge higher fees or scrap purchase data created their own QR code-based payment systems, right? I ask because I am trying to figure out why the EU would admit that developing a mobile payment platform is costly, then make a ridiculous claim that companies would not create their own systems when history has show that it has not prevented issuers from either allowing Apple Pay as a processor (the same way my bank uses Visa, and only Visa, as a processor) or coming up with their own systems that utilize QR codes and other competing standards.

That's why people that made a costly paymant system would like iPhone users to be able to use them. I see it from another direction: I, as the OWNER of an iPhone, want to be able to make with that device as much as possible.

 

[azentropy]

you can't use Apple Pay there? does that mean those big chains dont support credit cards since behind every Apple Pay transaction is basically just your visa / Mastercard? ApplePay automatically works anywhere, where there is a "Visa" logo here.

That isn't correct.

 

[44267547]

I, as the OWNER of an iPhone, want to be able to make with that device as much as possible.

If you’re making monthly payments on your iPhone, you don’t OWN it. The difference is, I actually own my iPhones that I purchase, I don’t make monthly payments to a carrier.

 

[FreakinEurekan]

you can't use Apple Pay there? does that mean those big chains dont support credit cards since behind every Apple Pay transaction is basically just your visa / Mastercard? ApplePay automatically works anywhere, where there is a "Visa" logo here.

You can use credit cards. What they don’t support is CONTACTLESS payment (i.e. NFC). They have the hardware, they’ve just not enabled it in their POS. The card has to be inserted for chip, or swiped for mag stripe.

Wal-Mart also has “Wal-Mart Pay” where you use their app to scan a QR code, then complete payment in the app.

Some other “Holdout” stores are finally supporting NFC - e.g. Dollar General I noticed over the weekend has it enabled. Wal-Mart/Sam’s Club, Home Depot, and Lowe’s Hardware are probably the big 3 that I shop at where NFC (of any kind) can’t be used. Wal-Mart has the Wal-Mart pay I mentioned earlier; Sam’s lets you scan items with their app as you put it in your cart & just head straight for the door (which I do really like, but you have to add the card to the app manually). Home Depot and Lowe’s, ya gotta dig out yer wallet :/

 

[I7guy]

As the world is shifting towards mobile payment across the world it is only fair that the people has access to the technology on fair terms and not on the cooperates terms. Power to the people.

Yep, power to the people … in the form of vote with your $$$.

 

[I7guy]

That's why people that made a costly paymant system would like iPhone users to be able to use them. I see it from another direction: I, as the OWNER of an iPhone, want to be able to make with that device as much as possible.

You can do whatever you want with your phone. But apple doesn’t have to help you do what the phone isn’t designed to do.

 

[Orionfox]

Here's the thing... no user is clamoring for a better wallet. Apple Wallet works fine. No user is demanding choice in the wallet arena (and if you say you are, you're lying). This is something completely manufactured by big banks, and if Apple is forced to open it up, it will make the iPhone worse, and less secure.

Yeah I just don't see any huge need for this.It makes no sense to me (or some of the dramatic responses in support of it here)

If I wanted 15 different apps to pay for things I'd buy an Android phone

I had 1st gen Android and tried a Note later. One of the reasons I came to the iPhone and back again is because I can't stand thebloatware on most Android systems. I don't need threee apps (only 1 will be alive in a year) to buy movies from or music to listen to. If I use Apple's it will just work and be there years later.

 

[shplock]

As the world is shifting towards mobile payment across the world it is only fair that the people has access to the technology on fair terms and not on the cooperates terms. Power to the people.

Until some of those people decide to use the open access of NFC to steal all of your money out of your bank account, then it is a case of stupid to the people.