Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
EU Regulators Accept Apple Commitments to Open NFC Access to Rivals
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
dontwalkhand
macrumors 604
Hopefully this will open up more transit agencies to switch from QR codes to NFC based passes!
.wojtek
macrumors 6502
awww, bless your soul. you are aware that those points is that those extra 2-3% that you pay (which is included in your shopping as it has to be accounted for)? and you cheerfully accept that while being tied tonq circus 'which card should I use for this transaction ti get the most benefits' xD
Reason077
macrumors 601
Not only that, some UK banks have a promotion where they’ll pay you up to £200 to switch to them, as well as giving you extra perks like 12 months of free Disney+!
BaldiMac
macrumors G3
Sure, I think most people agree with that. The problem is "too big" is arbitrary. And how to "fix it" is subject to disagreement.
dwaite
macrumors 65816
It committed to be free of charge for 10 years, the first version of the API is already shipped in iOS 17, you have to meet relevant EU banking regulations to get the API entitlement.
Reason077
macrumors 601
Many years ago, UK banks had their own debit card network called “Switch” which sounds similar. Switch was bought out by MC and rolled into Maestro, which itself was phased out and just became Mastercard debit. I wonder why EC sticks around in Germany if it’s owned by MC…?
This is surprising from the UK perspective, where most banks jumped on Apple Pay pretty much immediately when it came out (the UK was still an EU member at that time).
I even remember my bank having promotions though their loyalty scheme offering cash back at certain retailers to encourage you to start using it!
dwaite
macrumors 65816
Financially it would be hard for a bank justify building a wallet to save Apple's processing fee. You'd need a consortium to all push an alternative wallet forward. Now whether it is any good...
The other issue is that customers may feel they loose far more by disabling Apple Wallet integration than they'd get from this alternative wallet - especially if the bank isn't greasing the wheels with some sort of financial kick-back, further wrecking the business justification for replacing wallet.
Where the money gets more tempting is a consortium pushing an entirely different payment system - say, one that forgoes consumer protections and charges a dramatically lower processing fee (especially in the US where it is 2-3%). However, we already have the debit networks which do both, and which already has integration with Apple Pay.
We've had this for five years I believe. The roll-out is non-existent because you don't typically integrate your loyalty system into the backend of your payment processor.
It would certainly make a lot more sense why there is so much pressure to open things up internationally if Apple is charging 0.15% on top of a 0.3% interchange, in a market where deployed chip-and-PIN means they also aren't reducing fraud substantially.
Why is America so behind the rest of the worlds on contactless payments?
So ubiquitous is contactless in Australia that when hapless visitors from the US visit there is inevitable confusion as taxi drivers and…
Ugh the EU is ****.
Now watch banks pulling their cards from Apple Pay to force us to use their own sh!tty apps.
Same for ID cards, I want my ID card in Apple Wallet not in Germany ID Wallet App that was actually coded for Android and then wrapped for iOS and looks like crap. All German companies first code for Android and then just use the same design for iOS and all of the apps are ****.
I'm calling this is going to be a disaster.
Now watch banks pulling their cards from Apple Pay to force us to use their own sh!tty apps.
Same for ID cards, I want my ID card in Apple Wallet not in Germany ID Wallet App that was actually coded for Android and then wrapped for iOS and looks like crap. All German companies first code for Android and then just use the same design for iOS and all of the apps are ****.
I'm calling this is going to be a disaster.
Reason077
macrumors 601
I don't think Apple can charge anything on top of the capped interchange fee. They will effectively be getting a small slice of the 0.2-0.3%. If retailers had to pay more to accept Apple Pay then many of them would just refuse to do so, but we don't see that in Europe/the UK.
chip-and-PIN is actually significantly higher risk because of the possibility of PIN disclosure. ie: if you're typing in your PIN for each small transaction/purchase you make, then someone can "shoulder surf" for your PIN (or record it using hidden cameras, terminal skimming device, etc).
Contactless (and especially, contactless with device-based authentication) is much more secure.
Reason077
macrumors 601
Opening up NFC access would mean it wouldn't need to have anything to do with the payment processor.
wbeasley
Suspended
The EU can force as many changes as they want BUT they can't change user behaviour.
When iPhone users continue to use the official app store and wallet how will the EU respond?
I see very few users gaining anything from an alt app store. You get a few extra apps at the same cost? The addition of game emulators to the official app store is the one thing that could have swayed casual installation of an alt app store. Now you can doing officially, there's not much point.
Paying a different way? Having long used Apple Pay, it is quick, safe and proven.
Any bank that tried to force me to use their system instead wont be getting my money.
And the dev costs and support hopefully make it too much of a hassle.
IF there was one NFC function that opening the hardware would allow, perhaps Bluetooth pairing of speakers just with a tap? It usually works on Android devices and Sony speakers. Not 100% but often just works. And then Apple could add LDAC codec as well? But that's hoping too much...
When iPhone users continue to use the official app store and wallet how will the EU respond?
I see very few users gaining anything from an alt app store. You get a few extra apps at the same cost? The addition of game emulators to the official app store is the one thing that could have swayed casual installation of an alt app store. Now you can doing officially, there's not much point.
Paying a different way? Having long used Apple Pay, it is quick, safe and proven.
Any bank that tried to force me to use their system instead wont be getting my money.
And the dev costs and support hopefully make it too much of a hassle.
IF there was one NFC function that opening the hardware would allow, perhaps Bluetooth pairing of speakers just with a tap? It usually works on Android devices and Sony speakers. Not 100% but often just works. And then Apple could add LDAC codec as well? But that's hoping too much...
tim_apple
macrumors regular
By routing everyone thru the Apple Wallet app it makes things hugely convenient and simple for the end user. Now it is going to be inconvenient and confusing. EU legislating how iPhone features work is ridiculous.
Not at all, I'd imagine. The general idea behind all of these reforms seems to be to create an environment in which competition can exist, but I doubt the European Commission sits in their offices monitoring the uptake of alternative wallets closely.
If Apple prevails on a level playing field through a better service then good for Apple.
That could be true. We will have to wait and see, but if there is no movement against Apple, then their measures haven’t worked and they may tweak it 🤷🏻♂️
Six years ago and no source. Last year 34% of just VISA’s transactions were contactless. The claim that only 1% of all US transactions are contactless is preposterous.Why is America so behind the rest of the worlds on contactless payments?
So ubiquitous is contactless in Australia that when hapless visitors from the US visit there is inevitable confusion as taxi drivers and…medium.com
lovehateapple
macrumors 6502a
wbeasley
Suspended
it's not making a "level playing field".
it's about forcing changes that stop making Apple do things that many customers buy their products for.
if i wanted a device i could install anything, i had a choice. i would buy an android device.
many like the fact Apple vet apps and have more control to stop spyware and bad actor code getting onto devices.
the EU forced that change without regard to those who wanted this feature.
will the EU accept all responsibility (and costs) when people start having issues because bad apps get onto their phones and tablets?
the banks only want access to NTF hardware because while they love charging their customers fees in as many ways as possible, they dont want to pay a fee to Apple for using their hardware and software that is secure and anonymous.
Reason077
macrumors 601
This sort of thing is already possible on iPhones using Ultra Wideband (UWB). This can give precise locations of objects accurate down to an inch or so. Tesla (and other carmakers?) use it to implement their phone-as-a-key functionality, Apple uses it to locate AirTags and other devices in "Find My".
wbeasley
Suspended
expect the usual rant responses to that 😉
oddly a few have been quiet... have they gone away?
Reason077
macrumors 601
Or they could just accept EMV contactless payments at the fare gate (like London and many other cities do), and do away with the expense of maintaining their own fare cards and all the administration and maintenance costs that go along with them.
Certainly in Europe, with its low interchange fees, this is a reasonable option. (But of course, you do need to keep an alternative available for people who don't have credit/debit cards).
Reason077
macrumors 601
This is what I don't understand. Everyone assumes that this will mean alternative wallets. Why not make the APIs available to add alternative NFC cards into the existing wallet? This is what it was designed for. After all, developers can add their own barcode cards into wallet, why not NFC cards?