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Discussion in 'Console Games' started by bigandy, May 6, 2008.
Didn't see that one coming...
I did. The 360 is only doing well in the US. In Japan and most European countries the PS3 week in, week out sells more than the 360.
Wii DS and PSP take turns in outselling everything constantly but that's another story.
Still haven't bought a PS3 myself though. Still waiting for an official VGA cable since I don't plan on getting a new TV for my room.
Seems almost like a repeat of last gen. XBox does well in the US, Playstation dominates in all other territories. Except by not as wide a margin this time.
The Wii's just reversed. EVERYONE has one instead of no one having a GameCube. (I loved the GameCube but the poor thing didn't do too well over here)
So it looks like the PS3 tops the 360 in every region now except US. Good for it. Nice to see Microsoft failing to monopolize a market. They've been bribing and buying exclusives left and right.
And they're gaining on Microsoft in North America too, especially since the start of this year. With Blu-ray just now beginning to catch on with consumers (not to even mention the lingering effects of the Xbox 360 RROD debacle), it's only a matter of time before the PS3 catches the Xbox 360 in N.A. as well...
Same here. I'll never buy a console that costs more than £200.
No matter how much I want GTA IV and GT5 when it arrives, I'm holding out. Silly me.
+1. I've been rooting for both BD and the PS3 since announced, and I'm glad it's making the inroads I hoped it would. The 360 just isn't what I want out of a console now - and the PS3 ticks all the boxes.
Yay, etc. I'd love it if Microsoft lost in their home market. They've made so many mistakes with the Xbox division, by all rights they should Crash 'n' Burn like the 3DO did*. Hahaha, that's so geeky I can't believe I said it.
* Except more successfully, of course.
I saw it coming too. In Japan, barely anyone has a 360 (well, if you count ~half a million "barely anyone" ) But like has been stated numerous times, the only market the PS3 isn't going amazing in is North America, and the only market the 360 is doing well in is North America. So there ya go.
Yea, even though MS did a huge push for the 360 in Japan prior to launch, snapped up a load of Japanese devs etc. They just can't break Japan.
I don't see the PS3 overtaking the 360 in the US though. I know 360 sales remain constant and PS3 sales are slowly increasing but there are a lot to catch up on.
The PS3 has sold more than the Xbox this year in the US, though the Xbox sold more in March by 10k, it is very neck-and-neck in the US at the moment.
Well the Xbox360 only have a grip on the US now(but its starting to fade)....its basically getting beat in all territories. PS3 is getting closer to the 360 overall numbers.....I think its 19-20 million 360s to 12-13 million PS3...its doing very well.
The way things are going I don't think the 360 will break its older brothers numbers but if they do not by much.
hardly surprising the PS3 was gaining constantly ground on the 360 anyway and now GT5 Prologue pushed it finally massivly in PS3 direction .. from now on it will be hurting time again for microsoft in europe (with the only exception being the UK)
what is it with the popularity of the xbox in english speaking countries (US + UK ) ? are the markets so different across the channel/atlantic ? or is Microsoft marketing department simply so much worse in europe than the other 2 ?
(not that Nintendo had an huge advertising presence before the Wii .. but now the ads seem to run around the clock on some channels ... last time i catched a wii fit ad at 2 am and 360 ads seem to have become somehow absent since the Halo3 launch)
edit: on total numbers i too expect the 360 beating it's old brother .. i think somewhere between 30-35 millions will be the final numbers though more than half of that will be US only again
on PS3 numbers it's perhaps to early but it's safe to say that it won't reach ps2 numbers but it will gain lot's of numbers towards the end of it's lifecycle when price is dropped enough so i suspect 50 millions are achievable
for wii it's also hard to expect since lots of heavy hits have already been released but i think it too will get 50+ millions
The PS3 actually sold more than the 360 last year as well. Pretty amazing and little known fact. The 360 may have had a year start, but after the PS3's slow launch it has done better than the 360.
Oddly, I was actually Pro-PS3 but pro-HD-DVD. Though not VERY pro-HD-DVD, more indifferent but if I had to choose I'd take HD-DVD, because HD-DVD was completely region free and both could easily fit multiple full length HD movies.
Microsoft took a $4 billion loss on the first XBox, and the XBox 360 has taken a consistent loss except for the quarter in which Halo 3 launched and has been beset by consistent hardware quality issues.
Any other company would pull out. Microsoft just keeps sitting with their enormous wallet and buying exclusives and developers left and right. Rare, Bungie, etc...extra content in GTAIV...Japanese developers who otherwise would outright refuse to make anything for the platform...
That's not making a better product, that's buying marketshare and still failing to accomplish much. At some point perhaps Microsoft will finally just give up. Marketshare is still good for the 360 but profits are not.
Its funny you should say that, because I have thought for a long time that the game console industry, which sells you a console for no profit in order to make $$$ off games, is one of those rare industries where you literally have to bankrupt the competition and eliminate them before you start making any serious cash. The clothing market may have 12,345 different competitors, but they could all make a profit. Same with PC games. That's doesn't work with console games. You need to kill everyone else until there's only 1 or 2 consoles on the market. Unlike clothes, food, etc, the console market doesn't seem suited for more than 2 players. It's like when Nintendo beat out Sega, and what.....maybe Neo Geo or whatever. Even after that, I don't think any video game company has ever really made a boatload of profit for itself, especially not for the amount of effort involved in system development, game design, marketing, and initial investment during the first few years, where you're trying to break even. And for all that effort, you'll have 12+ months at the end of the product cycle where you'll make serious $$$. Sony made money when the market was just them and Nintendo, but now we're at 3 consoles.
So if Microsoft is going to "play the game" despite losing billions of dollars the first time, and Sony and Nintendo continue, that means they're all going to continue doing this for 10 to 15 years until the market becomes a two console market again, where both parties will make a bit extra due to less competition. That's persistence. It's like working for free for 10-15 years, in hopes of making money after everyone else gives up. However, I don't see Sony, MS, or Nintendo going bankrupt for awhile, so if I'm right, and the aim is to continue playing until they bankrupt the other 2 companies in order to start making money, this is going to be a LONG battle. Am I right?
my understanding when MS entered into the consul market they untented to be in in for a long haul.
The original Xbox was a success. It was never intended to make a profit but was made to get MS into the market and a get a good foot hold. It did meet its goal. (profiting off the original Xbox was never part of the plan. MS admitted that at the beginning.)
The 360 I think more just to start start reducing the bleed on the project and to starting to head to more profitable set up.
Also the xbox project if you look at the current state MS is starting to tie it in more heavily with windows. It allowing the 360 to be a media center for a house. It connects to the WMP and one can play movies and other items off there home computer on the TV. A very nice feature.
Part of MS's strategy is to get their systems as media centres too. Get their systems into the living room.
Sony are pretty much the same. Nintendo are not, their media centre ability doesn't go much further than displaying photos from an SD card but people are still snapping them up.
If the networking stuff was a bit more friendly (a la the 360) the PS3 would be a pretty great media centre. As it is, it's an awesome DVD player, one of (if not the best) Blu-Ray players and is quiet plus has all the techie bells and whistles (lossless audio, HDMI 1.3, blah blah).
Anyway I'm happy that Sony is doing well and would love to see MS... I dunno go away as a company but since they are in the industry it has helped kick Sony (and Nintendo) in the ass. Live is still the top multiplayer platform out there and honestly, everyone else should just rip it off (or bring Steam ) The competition is good between MS and Sony and helps keep Sony from still charging $600
well the problem on the other side is still the online portion with microsoft.. it still costs money, which on the one side doesn't go well with people who only play online from time to time and it's a further hinderance in those countries where online gaming on the PCs is still heavily wide spread which again includes many european countries where PC still reigns king
another problem is that with having a lack of mascot games with world wide appeal ... sure Halo games sales like hot cakes in the US but in continental europe + japan ? not so much ... nothing of the same caliber as Gran turismo
One thing to consider is that not everyone who buys a PS3 is actually buying one to play games on. I bought mine solely for Blu-Ray, I haven't bought a single game since I got it. That may well give Sony another console to add to the number sold, but it doesn't translate into a gamer actively buying games and using the system for its main purpose.
With the PS3 being one of the best (if not THE best in terms of functionality and price) Blu-Ray player around, I'm surprised if a significant proportion of PS3's sold aren't being used for gaming, whereas every single Wii and 360 has been bought and used exclusively for gaming.
I've heard this as well on forums but there's only so far you can go with this line of reasoning. The original XBox probably WAS intended to only gain marketshare. The thing is, it didn't succeed anywhere near as well as it should have. Microsoft launched with a loss FAR larger than anyone else, with the highest hardware specs. In any other market, doing something like this would usually guarantee a significant marketshare. But Microsoft barely earned beat Nintendo and Sony beat them five times over.
Taking a 4 billion loss to only get ~15% marketshare was probably not the plan. They were probably shooting for something close to double that.
Was it, now? How much of a marketshare is considered to be worth $4 billion in losses?
So you think Microsoft intended to make a consistent loss for over a DECADE?
I think the original XBox was intended to take a loss and capture a majority or at least very large market share. It did well, VERY well in the US (wasn't it tied with the PS2 for top?) but failed miserably outside. It didn't fail, but it was disappointing. The 360 was intended to turn a profit over it's lifetime, but then the hardware failures hit. Losses for the first year, break even second year with maybe even some profit. Red rings left and right just completely destroyed those margins.
I think that Microsoft expected the 360 to be profitable by now.
It's worth noting that Nintendo has ALWAYS made a profit, regardless of whether they got first, second, or last place. Yes, it's true that most companies have to sell at a loss to profit off of the games...but Microsoft's strategy of selling the system at such a massive loss that there's no way to make the money back is a strategy only they could pull off. And it didn't work that well.
Just being pedantic but they should clarify.... 'continental Europe' in the title.
Ireland & UK still have higher ratio of 360's to PS3.
It's still about exclusives. The xbox has some, the ps3 has some, that is all the wii has since no one seems capable of making a decent 3rd party game would you guys please get a clue and make a good game.
I think the continental sales already make up for the xbox uk advantage so one can say that they are ahead in europe
but since there are little numbers for non Uk europe it's hard to validate sonys claim
but jesus the xbox 360 is currently dieing in stores in central europa it's not even funny ... even with the pricedrop.. if it weren't for GTA4 being also available on it they could have written off the whole year straight to christmas season
i just read that Call of Duty 4 _PC Version_ outsold the Xbox 360 version 8:1 in germany .. which is very likely the reverse compared to the US
360's sold quite well in the UK after the price drop. But since the outlook is getting a bit dire now it might be a good idea to drop the Arcade model and bring each system down £50. Live needs to be free too. As the PS3 slowly catches up on the 360 I think MS will be forced to reduce the annual cost or simply make it completely free of charge.
Still think the PS3 needs a UK pricecut as well. It's all very well giving us 2 games and 2 controllers for £300 but how about a £200 one without accessories?
True, but people who buy a PS3 just as a Blu-ray player aren't going to go out and buy a 360 as well.
When MS made the orginal Xbox they stated it was going to be a projected 8 years at best before they broke even. Also they where losing at one point 300 a box. My understanding is it met the goal. They knew it was going to cost them a lot just to get into the market and break Nintendo's and PS strong hold.
I do not expect to see MS leave the market place but instead grow.
Yes I own a 360 because it makes a lot of the games I enjoy.\
Like I said early I can see some in the works some of the plans for the 360. It already pretty clear MS sees the gaming consel being more than just a gaming plateform. It is something they can sell movies and TV on, it hooks into the home computer and plays movies and vidios off that.
Fault MS for what you want they did see the fact that a home computer was quickly being coming something of the media player of a house. It housed everything hook up to a TV for movies and what not. (hence XP media edition. It has the ground works of the future in it). The 360 seems to of pick up around there hooking into the computer over the network.
Hell give MS credit they say what the moders did to the XBox in making it a media box and they put that ablily into the 360.
Now if I could only get it to work on my set up I would be set. Stupid XP networking being hit or miss.