European Commission 'Concerned' About Apple's Streaming Music Plans

[verpeiler]

This is why the EU can't have nice things.

Well, compared to the US we already have much nicer things ;D

Seriously, as I said before: it's just an investigation, nothing more. It's good they keep an eye on big companies. I'd be even more pleased if they'd finally fix those tax avoiding practice with ireland... as everybody knows Amazon, Apple, Google etc. still pay nearly no taxes.

 

[Swift]

In Other Words

Evil American company vs. Wonderful European entrepreneurs selflessly giving people free -- well, almost free -- music and giving artists the shaft.

 

[BigBear14]

If the real motivation is the fear that Apple may use its influence to discourage free streaming music--then the investigation is valid.

However, I do think that in some cases the EU goes too far and over-regulates innovative ideas into ruin. Contrast that with the United States which tends to shy from regulation--and strangely it has the same effect sometimes. . .

There is no over-regulation in the EU whatsoever, and if you ask any EU resident - including me, i'd request tougher regulations on corporation's abuse of their size in order to strong arm competitors. The U.S. doesn't have much regulation because of their economic outlook, free-market capitalism and the partly decentralised state ensures there's no cohesive legal framework under which MNCs operate. In the EU, there's more centralisation and regulation therefore trickles down to member states ensuring these companies, in any of the EU countries they operate in, abide by the rules and regulations.

All of this is to ensure there isn't a monopoly like Time Warner or Comcast, and the EU has still failed even with these measures. So i'd argue more regulation is necessary, there is no thwarting of innovation if that innovation is designed to fleece the consumer and monopolise the industry -- if anything that is what thwarts innovation. A level playing field is necessary, especially when it comes to music streaming services and how Apple is a platform holder who could potentially nerf the functionalities of competing company's apps to make theirs more desirable.

----------

Evil American company vs. Wonderful European entrepreneurs selflessly giving people free -- well, almost free -- music and giving artists the shaft.

The record labels are the ones giving the artist's the shaft in the contracts they draft with the artist's they sign. The record labels are the ones who control which music services to support really.

I don't understand why people are up in arms about such a huge MNC's attempts at entering the music streaming market with scepticism is all of a sudden an issue.

 

[linuxcooldude]

It's good they keep an eye on big companies.

But who keeps an eye on the European Union?

I'd be even more pleased if they'd finally fix those tax avoiding practice with ireland... as everybody knows Amazon, Apple, Google etc. still pay nearly no taxes.

Its the governments who make incentives for foreign companies to bring their business there. Companies take advantage of tax laws the same as any private citizen would.

 

[KALLT]

So, essentially the European Commission is concerned about what a non existent product, that Apple may, or may not release (and therefore have no idea how it will work, or function) will, or won't do other companies.

This isn’t about a future non-existent product, it is about conduct. Apple has market power in online music sales and may abuse that power for its own ends. As such it is on the radar of competition authorities, to make sure that doesn’t happen. Even if Apple is not going to announce a new service, the authorities cannot just turn a blind eye to what is happening behind closed doors in the meantime. This isn’t even a formal investigation. The European Commission enquires about these things all the time, just as they raid headquarters for inspections.

 

[AlecZ]

The EU always complain about the silliest things. That isn't to say that the US doesn't need more regulation of cable and utilities. **** Comcast and Edison.

 

[kettle]

This isn’t about a future non-existent product, it is about conduct. Apple has market power in online music sales and may abuse that power for its own ends. As such it is on the radar of competition authorities, to make sure that doesn’t happen. Even if Apple is not going to announce a new service, the authorities cannot just turn a blind eye to what is happening behind closed doors in the meantime. This isn’t even a formal investigation. The European Commission enquires about these things all the time, just as they raid headquarters for inspections.

And for anyone who can't get their head around these contradictions - I suggest an American book called 'Atlas Shrugged' by Ayn Rand.

 

[mr.bee]

These are the same people that approved the purchase of Beats, correct? What did they think Apple was going to do? Of course Apple is going to release a streaming service. Why is that a concern now and not when they approved the purchase? Seems silly to me, but I am sure there is more to it than I am aware of, or at least I hope so.

Last time I checked buying a company is still something different than creating a new product/service in the music business.

 

[Ray mr]

SDZ -Your Apple is a tax cheat and you hate them for it - is wrong!

Right out of college I worked for the IRS for two years and the first thing they teach you in IRS school is " tax avoidance is legal ...but tax evasion is not". Do you know who said that? Chief Justice Holmes during a Supreme Court tax decision!

Politics aside, the US should set the lowest corporate tax in the western hemisphere. All these corporate offshore earnings would immediatedly be repatriated and companies around the world would set up their HQ's in the US.

The Treasury Department knows exactly what rates for corporate and individual earnings generate the largest revenue streams and lower rates generate more money than higher rates. The government gets more with a smaller piece of a larger pie than with a bigger chunk of of an ever decreasing smaller pie.
It would also stop the new practice of companies buying a smaller foreign company and declaring their foreign HQ the new HQ for both companies.

Companies like people vote with their feet. People move to no tax states like Florida and companies move their profits offshore.

 

[numlock]

This is exactly why Apple never releases anything there first.

oh it is?

how many apple products do not debut in america?

 

[verpeiler]

Its the governments who make incentives for foreign companies to bring their business there. Companies take advantage of tax laws the same as any private citizen would.

Absolutely right, but that's a problem (in this case some agreement with Ireland) that has to be solved.

Apart from that, the behaviour of these companies is morally questionable.

 

[s2mikey]

And our EU forum friends wonder why they don't always get the full suite of Apple features.

----------

Microsoft had 90+% market share.
vs
iOS has a mere 20% market share. They aren't anywhere close to abusing any sort of monopoly position. They don't have anything that looks remotely like a monopoly position.
http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp

The EU going after them, is merely a money grab by corrupt politicians.

It may not look like the same thing as What Microsoft had but it's not fair that Apple gets to run wild with whatever they do and Microsoft has to throttle what they do. Microsoft had such a high market share because they were the best option out there. That's called free markets. Of course, it's only OK when Apple runs the show, not when Microsoft or Samsung do it.

BLEH.

----------

Right out of college I worked for the IRS for two years and the first thing they teach you in IRS school is " tax avoidance is legal ...but tax evasion is not". Do you know who said that? Chief Justice Holmes during a Supreme Court tax decision!

Politics aside, the US should set the lowest corporate tax in the western hemisphere. All these corporate offshore earnings would immediatedly be repatriated and companies around the world would set up their HQ's in the US.

The Treasury Department knows exactly what rates for corporate and individual earnings generate the largest revenue streams and lower rates generate more money than higher rates. The government gets more with a smaller piece of a larger pie than with a bigger chunk of of an ever decreasing smaller pie.
It would also stop the new practice of companies buying a smaller foreign company and declaring their foreign HQ the new HQ for both companies.

Companies like people vote with their feet. People move to no tax states like Florida and companies move their profits offshore.

Yeah, just pack up and move to Florida. Of course, most people cannot just do that to avoid and skirt their taxes. Cmon, these companies are robbing the working class taxpayer by doing this since WE get the bill for the taxes that they are evading. It's that simple. Every nickel they offshore means some poor sap, working class grunt gets a higher property tax bill or whatever. You good with that?

Sure, lowering rates for everyone would be great but until then it's time for these cheats to pay up and stop saddling the little guy with the tax bills. They can afford to pay up. They are making like eleventy trillion dollars a week or something. Just pay. Enough with this crap.

 

[noodlemanc]

It may not look like the same thing as What Microsoft had but it's not fair that Apple gets to run wild with whatever they do and Microsoft has to throttle what they do. Microsoft had such a high market share because they were the best option out there. That's called free markets. Of course, it's only OK when Apple runs the show, not when Microsoft or Samsung do it.

BLEH.

----------



Yeah, just pack up and move to Florida. Of course, most people cannot just do that to avoid and skirt their taxes. Cmon, these companies are robbing the working class taxpayer by doing this since WE get the bill for the taxes that they are evading. It's that simple. Every nickel they offshore means some poor sap, working class grunt gets a higher property tax bill or whatever. You good with that?

Sure, lowering rates for everyone would be great but until then it's time for these cheats to pay up and stop saddling the little guy with the tax bills. They can afford to pay up. They are making like eleventy trillion dollars a week or something. Just pay. Enough with this crap.

I doubt the USA would lower tax rates for lower income people if Companies started paying more tax. They just take as much as they can get away with.

 

[linuxcooldude]

It may not look like the same thing as What Microsoft had but it's not fair that Apple gets to run wild with whatever they do and Microsoft has to throttle what they do. Microsoft had such a high market share because they were the best option out there. That's called free markets. Of course, it's only OK when Apple runs the show, not when Microsoft or Samsung do it.

BLEH.

----------



Yeah, just pack up and move to Florida. Of course, most people cannot just do that to avoid and skirt their taxes. Cmon, these companies are robbing the working class taxpayer by doing this since WE get the bill for the taxes that they are evading. It's that simple. Every nickel they offshore means some poor sap, working class grunt gets a higher property tax bill or whatever. You good with that?

Sure, lowering rates for everyone would be great but until then it's time for these cheats to pay up and stop saddling the little guy with the tax bills. They can afford to pay up. They are making like eleventy trillion dollars a week or something. Just pay. Enough with this crap.

The vast majority of businesses are small businesses who are not going to be banking it overseas.

 

[Ray mr]

Taxes

Small businesses file schedule C or partnership and the income is taxed once as regular income. Corporations pay taxes twice as corporate tax then as tax on the dividends.

Corporations have tax attorneys and will always look to ways to lower their taxes. Carrots ( ie lower taxes) always work better than sticks (higher taxes, disallowing legitimate expenses,and business lunches etc.)

Personal income taxes get rough when your taxable income after deductions and exemptions goes over 46k and income tax over that amount jumps from 15 % to 25% . Under that level it is the social security tax ( FICA) and state tax with less deductions available and property tax that kills you.

Governments nearly never save for rainy days or cut taxes for taxpayers when they are flush. They just find new essentials and needs.

In New Jersey 55k people with higher level people left in the last 3 years. I am sure New York is worse. New immigrants with lower incomes have taken their place. A majority of people I know will move out of state upon retirement to cut their property tax in half and if they pick Florida, Texas, Tenn or New Hampshire will eliminate their state tax burden.

i read that former communist and despotic countries have lower corporate taxes than we do!

If the Government doesn't get their act together even Apple may move its corporate HQ's. Think it is impossible ? In a few years the Chinese and the Indians will be their largest customer base not us.

 

[Glideslope]

Lol

The EU is like a Heard of Sheep stuck in the middle of a road. What a bunch of Insecure Mini States.

 

[D-Dave]

What evidence do we have of this regarding Apple's streaming music plans?

No evidence...hence the investigation...

 

[2457282]

I do wonder sometimes if people post without reading the article. It states quite clearly that the concern is that Apple might put pressure on the record labels to drop support for the free add supported music services.

Last time I checked buying a company is still something different than creating a new product/service in the music business.

It seems funny when people think themselves so smart. Yes I read the article and no mr.bee it is not different. What the hell do you two think Apple baught with Beats. Clearly they baught an existing streaming servivce and it was approved by all the powers including EU. And so, what did the EU think was going to hapen? It was clear from day 1 that apple was going to integrated it somehow with itunes radio and itunes. And they were okay with it then. So my question is simply what has happened that they want to revisit their decision.

I am sure I am being clear and your snobbery is undeserved, unappreciated, and an embarrassment to you.

 

[Cigsm]

Support the artists. Pirate.

This doesn't support the artist at all. It hurts the artist as sales won't be good enough for the, to come out with another album.

Stealing isn't the way to go, but you already know that.

 

[Jmacca]

As a European citizen, this continent's technological advance is crippled by Medieval bureaucratic non-sense. Take the UK for example, with less than 20 banks and yet Apple hasn't managed to overcome all the bureaucratic obstacles to launch apple pay. Yet the same banks are happily pushing contactless payment cards which allow you to pay without any sort of security or authentication.

Rumour has it that Apple is working with NHS to try and modernise the hospital system. Boy, is Apple in for a lifetime of frustration...

As for the UK they have had better bank card security with chip and pin for a lot longer than the US. That's way the rate of card fraud is way down compared to the US. I'm glad that my bank is concerned about security!

Even as a long time Apple user in Europe I really don't see the advantage of using it over here.

 

[holydude]

The EU is like a Heard of Sheep stuck in the middle of a road. What a bunch of Insecure Mini States.

100% agreed. Please marry me and allow me to go to US

 

[alex0002]

Everything that sounds or is too good to be true seems to go down because European Commission is concerned.

But I wonder why they aren't concerned about Tidal, where all new songs from owning artists are exclusive and where Taylor Swift can be listened at?

The difference here is that Tidal do not sell devices, or provide an operating system, or own the App store that allows users to install a music app in their device. Nor do they own the largest digital music download store.

Apple on the other hand, are seeking exclusive deals with artists and labels.
http://appleinsider.com/articles/15...story-as-apple-wants-to-be-the-music-business

Then they can release that music through Beats and Itunes.

The app is controlled by Apple and perhaps there will be an app made for other platforms. But probably not as many platforms as Spotify:
https://www.spotify.com/us/download/other/

It would very difficult to prevent Apple making the app work better on iOS or releasing new features first on iOS or even features integrated into the Apple watch and Beats headphones.

Apple could control the music market all the way from the source to the headphones.

If people don't see a problem with this, try replacing 'Apple' with 'Google' and 'iOS' with 'Android' (and even then it isn't quite the same, as it's much easier to install a non-store provided app with Android).

 

[k995]

And our EU forum friends wonder why they don't always get the full suite of Apple features.

Still the same, apple seems uncapable of dealing with the markets outside USA .

Microsoft had 90+% market share.
vs
iOS has a mere 20% market share. They aren't anywhere close to abusing any sort of monopoly position. They don't have anything that looks remotely like a monopoly position.
http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp

The EU going after them, is merely a money grab by corrupt politicians.

Actually you have to check on hardware platform. So windows had a 90+% marketshare of the PC market . Apple has a 100% iphone market . The issue is that competitors like spotify will face unjust competition .

----------

It seems funny when people think themselves so smart. Yes I read the article and no mr.bee it is not different. What the hell do you two think Apple baught with Beats. Clearly they baught an existing streaming servivce and it was approved by all the powers including EU. And so, what did the EU think was going to hapen? It was clear from day 1 that apple was going to integrated it somehow with itunes radio and itunes. And they were okay with it then.

BS they were ok with apple buying beats. Nobody said anything about integrating.

If you think law works on "they should have know" ... guess again.

----------

The EU is like a Heard of Sheep stuck in the middle of a road. What a bunch of Insecure Mini States.

Because they dont allow big companies to do whatever they want?

 

[Menel]

Still the same, apple seems uncapable of dealing with the markets outside USA .






Actually you have to check on hardware platform. So windows had a 90+% marketshare of the PC market . Apple has a 100% iphone market . The issue is that competitors like spotify will face unjust competition .

----------


BS they were ok with apple buying beats. Nobody said anything about integrating.

If you think law works on "they should have know" ... guess again.

----------



Because they dont allow big companies to do whatever they want?

This makes no sense. By that logic, Google Android has 100% of the Samsung Galaxy market.
100% of the Nexus market.

 

[roadbloc]

Just concerns. Nothing concrete yet.