Exchange Support for the iPhone: Q3 2007

[Zadillo]

I was of the impression that the iPhone was running a "lite" version of Mac OS X, which gets its stability because of Unix's protected memory and kernel. It's exceedingly rare to have a misbehaving app kill the entire OS on Mac, so I'm not sure how or why the Apple people are so concerned about stability on the iPhone (if indeed they are - i'm just going based on several replies to this thread that apparently "Apple" is concerned). Mac OS X is inherently FAR more stable than PalmOS ever was, so I don't think this is a fair comparison at all.

From at least what Jobs and Apple have claimed, the concern wasn't about third party apps affecting the stability of the iPhone itself. They claim the concern is what unsigned apps, etc. might be able to do to the network they run on.

Personally I'm not sure how justified this is. It has always struck me more as an excuse until they do sort out how to handle third party development.

But at the same time, Symbian for example does have something similar with the concept of "signed" apps that have gone through some certification process, so it perhaps isn't unheard of.

The thing is, Palm OS and Windows Mobile do not have any limitations like this, and I don't think I've heard of any rogue Palm OS or Windows Mobile apps bringing down a mobile phone network or something.

-Zadillo

 

[phatspider]

Thats interesting - Vodafones email service (Vodafone Business Email) is powered by Visto - could be something to do with a certain network tie up and launch in around about q3

 

[safXmal]

Why on the iPhone

Why would Visto need to have an application on the iPhone itself? Wouldn't it be enough to have a translator on the exchange server?

Personally I think Apple should not give in to the pressure to make the iPhone exchange compatible. Here again, as with flash, they have the opportunity to force the industry to use open standards iso proprietary systems.

When they can sell the iPhone to CEO's, those CEO's will make sure that the IT department makes the system work with iPhone.

 

[elgruga]

I am tired of naysayers - EVERYONE will want an iPhone.
Business users happen to be consumers, in fact 'business' types are rabid consumers, they invented consumerism!

Enough of this 'business users wont buy the iPhone because blah blah' - YES THEY WILL, BABY!

The iPhone is so far ahead of all the crap out there that only a few wont be completely hypnotised by this thing.

Give in - the iPhone has won, and its only day two!

I will give my Razr away and get an iPhone the day they arrive in Canada......and thats a promise.

Oh, I'm a business user - run all my sales from my phone, BTW.

 

[svento]

cisco vpn

Given that the iPhone supports VPN, I wonder if sys-admins will just set up IMAP through a VPN to access Exchange?

Now if only Apple could support a Cisco VPN in their built-in software! It seems like every company I know of uses the Cisco VPN... this was never an issue on the Mac since Cisco has a 3rd part client...

The kicker for me is that my company actually supports IMAP mail via their exchange server... unfortunately I can't get to the server!!!

 

[loudog40]

Given that the iPhone supports VPN, I wonder if sys-admins will just set up IMAP through a VPN to access Exchange?

Yes, but they you have to be on VPN all the time. Accessing webpages via EDGE is slow enough, but doing everything through a VPN will only make things more painful. Also, corporate users with RSA keys will have to type in their password every time.

AAAAND, there's no calender or contact syncing via ActiveSync.

 

[macintel4me]

???

Tell me if I'm understanding this correctly...

1) Apple's iPhone Exchange Support (IMAP) = unencrypted, pull
2) Visto's iPhone Exchange Support = encrypted, pull
3) Blackberry Exchange Support = encrypted, push

Is that right?

 

[patrickr135]

Has anyone tried using OWA? (not that it is a long-term solution but may get me through a couple of months)

 

[Yankees 4 Life]

hey naysayers... lets wait until the thing comes out for iphone(like for my iPhone) and we can judge it...

 

[manu chao]

1) Apple's iPhone Exchange Support (IMAP) = unencrypted, pull
2) Visto's iPhone Exchange Support = encrypted, pull
3) Blackberry Exchange Support = encrypted, push

Standard IMAP is certainly unencrypted (except for the username and password) and pull. My impression is also that Visto is encrypted (whether it is pull or push, I don't know) and Blackberry as well (in addition to being push).

Where Yahoo's push e-mail fits in, I am not sure. I think it is an extension of IMAP, therefore push but unencrypted.

(And I guess it is going to take quite a while until we see PGP encrypted e-mail on the iPhone, but maybe IMAP push (Yahoo?) over VPN will happen in the not too distant future.)

 

[macguitarman]

Visto Exchange solution for iPhone

dupe, sorry

 

[macguitarman]

Visto Exchange solution for iPhone

This sounds like good news. But its not clear what this gives us.

1) I have already tested OWA (Outlook Web Access) and it does work.
It connects to our Exchange server (OWA), which is the Exchange server's info presented publically via webmail.

You have to login on the Safari webpage, and typing in webmail on the iphone is not great,

Oh, yeah this is of course over Wi-Fi, any web action over Edge, as we all know, is jokingly slooow, practically unusable.

2) Putting software on your Win PC computer at work in order to use this as a conduit, is usually not sanctioned in most IT depts (actually stupid and unnecessary).

We strongly do not recommend it, in fact all personal file sharing to individual machines is turned off if we see, there is no reason for it, users save their work to servers and users can get to all of their data anywhere / anytime via VPN.

(By the way we use a hardware based VPN solution by Juniper, SSL VPN. Access via a web browser, no VPN client).

So this web browser / webmail access is not a solution at all, not on the iPhone.

And this desktop as a conduit, is not going to happen. It can and should just be at the server level, that is what servers are for. Not to mention many of my users, don't have a Win PC for a desktop, only a Mac. So what good does that do.

3) Software installed on the iPhone, not sure about this, SJ has already said, only AJAX apps for third parties, perhaps this will be how it is done.

4) This is not a replacement for Mac Mail app on the iPhone, just a way to connect. I don't know about you but iPhone Mail App is just awesome, kicking butt, better than 10.4 Mail app.

I want no other interface / GUI for doing Mail on the iPhone, it is the best looking / functioning Mail app I have ever seen.

5) I have always said, it would be great if Mac Mail app (on OS X) could be pointed to the OWA server (which is a public address, not the actual Exchange server), input all your info and we la, you can get mail that way.

6) Installing Visto's software on the Exchange server. I don't even know about this. OWA server, yes a better chance. Even if it is Windows software and works flawlessly, Win IT guys are usually unwilling to do this, and if / when the OWA / Exchange server acts up, oh, it's that Mac software (even though it is really Windows software) you installed on the server for the iPhone.

7) What is the cost, all I know is, it needs to be cheap, easy and not a big deal for the Exchange admins, if it is not, it won't get installed.

Perhaps this is ActiveSync, or activesync like functionality, ported to the ARM processor / iPhone OS X.

Daniel Eran has made a good point, Active Sync does not exist for OS X, much less ARM / iPhone OS X, MS has little incentive to port this, either does Apple to perpetuate MS / Active Sync.

What will it be, as I said, cheap, easy, rock solid, and stays totally out of the way or no go.

macguitaman@mac.com

 

[Compufix]

It's both. It involves a client you install as an app on your phone, and a desktop redirector.

Originally my Nextel Blackberry needed a desktop app to redirect email...and although a PITA...it worked....

Now we have a Blackberry Enterprise Server which talks to Exchange and pushes the mail to the phone....so why wouldn't Apple add a similar function to OSX Server to push mail and calander events to iPhone. Would make sense...and give OSX server a Enterprise function that would help get it in the door.

Although it SHOULD come from MS, Apples needs a decent mail/calander/contacts/to do app that talks to Exchange along par with Outlook on Windows.

We use Entourage which gets the job done....but still nowhere near perfect.

Why not build in a "Crossover" style system in OSX Server and run a Windows developed MAPI client that talks directly to Exchange (or a OSX Naitive app) that can have users added to it, then a code entered on an app on the phone to set up secure communications and authorization (like how Blackberry currently works).

What is so hard about implementing MAPI on OSX? If PALM and Nextel and others can implement MAPI on Windows...why can't someone on OSX do it?

-Compufix

 

[macguitarman]

>>>>>Although it SHOULD come from MS, Apples needs a decent mail/calander/contacts/to do app that talks to Exchange along par with Outlook on Windows.


Exactly, this architecture is in Leopard server, to hook into the Exchange server and present calendar events to Macs in iCal. But this costs an OS X server. A Win IT director wont justify the cost of it. Most do not want Macs (servers) in the data center, it pisses them off. (good).

For Calendar functionality get Snerdware's GroupCal

But it helps to have at least one OS X server in your data center if you have Macs.

Check out Daniel Erans articles on this at roughlydrafted.com, he breaks this whole Active Sync, etc, stuff down nicely.

Also, most companies will not support Both an OWA / Active Sync mobile solution (not sure of the cost but if you are already an MS shop, IT guys dont mind, AND another separate Blackberry server.

Not going to happen. Not in a widespread way anyway. Many IT depts. will say we only support Windows Mobile / Active Sync and if you have a Blackberry, you are not supported, SOL.

Of course depends how many Blackberry carrying VIP's put pressure on the IT dept to support both, but it is not usual, it is one or the other.

 

[gerogev]

AT&T is Positively Hostile Toward Corporate Use

Check out this from the AT&T website

http://www.wireless.att.com/businesssupport/knowledgeBase.do?content=KB80815.html

Plus, you need to re-activate your international access.

Sorry. No push email from exchange. EDGE instead of 3G.

I know the interface is cool but people need to work on these things rather than just show them to their awestruck friends.

Frankly, I would assume anyone with one of these must not really have any business existence at all.

 

[newamiga]

Corporate Use and Steve Jobs

Actually as a corporate executive for an IT company, I can tell you there is a great deal of interest on our part to be able to move our execs over the the iPhone. There is considerable disappointment on our side that we cannot, because of ATT's activation policies. I sent Steve Jobs an email. Who knows if he will answer or even read it, but I think they need to be aware of the tons of corporate users out here who would love to switch from our Treos to iPhones. Guess I will see if he or someone from Apple responds.

 

[Cybbe]

Yahoo! and Google are third parties too...

Yes, but mail.app, Safari and Google Maps are all applications designed and programmed by Apple (yes, even Google Maps). Google delivers the backend network service, Apple designed the application. Actually, at the D5 interview, Jobs went on about how not being restricted to a web environment allowed Apple to design a magnificent application superior of Google's online version. I certainly see the irony in this considering which environment they're offering to third party programmers..

 

[catdog02481]

Has anyone tried using OWA? (not that it is a long-term solution but may get me through a couple of months)

YES!
OWA works perfectly using safari and is superfast over wifi and acceptable over edge. In fact i am using it now and am planning on chucking my BB (already returned my 8830 to verizon and went back to old 7250 until i have full confidence in iphone/coverage then it's bye bye verizon and BB/was great until iphone showed up)

 

[macguitarman]

I remind everyone of this, it is coming, this just is one announcement, of the several SJ hinted at.

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/techinvestor/corporatenews/2007-06-28-jobs-stephenson-qa_N.htm

Q: What about corporate e-mail? I understand that's an issue for many consumers, who may not be able to hook up to their company networks?

Jobs: You'll be hearing more about this in the coming weeks. We have some pilots going with companies with names you'll recognize. This won't be a big issue.

This asssured me that there is as I said a viable, innocuous solution coming, perhaps several options.

newamiga e-mail / call me on my iPhone, I am a Mac IT professional, would be glad to bounce ideas off you, be rest assured this will all be possible, despite what is ATT saying to the contrary, just be assured by what SJ has said, it says it all.

He and Apple have anticipated this and have plans.

macguitarman@mac.com

 

[voicegy]

Owa

Has anyone tried using OWA? (not that it is a long-term solution but may get me through a couple of months)

Yes, I have to for now, as Exchange is our system in one of the largest school districts in the country - fortunately, I work in IT and am close to the email admins, and we've been discussing Exchange and the iPhone for a number of weeks. It would be SO MUCH BETTER for my Exchange email to work like my .mac account does on the iPhone - and the OWA on anything-other-than-IE experience is about as lame as you can get.

Something good will happen with the relationship between Exchange and the iPhone eventually - for now, as with all IT departments, we hesitate to simply turn on POP or IMAP for security reasons - we're mostly a cautious group. (By the way, MANY folks in my IT dept. use and love Macs.)

 

[macguitarman]

Simply turning on IMAP on an Exchange server, is not a security risk.

The Exchnage server is not available to anyone outside the company network, only inside / on the company network.

And one must autheticate via AD.

I wish people would stop spreading this that turning on IMAP is an automatic security risk.

We have it on, Macs use Mac Mai app internally.

 

[rob@robburns.co]

I have always said, it would be great if Mac Mail app (on OS X) could be pointed to the OWA server (which is a public address, not the actual Exchange server), input all your info and we la, you can get mail that way.

This is how Entourage accesses the Exchange server. This would be the next teir of client support for Exchange (after IMAP). Unfortunately, some IT Admins are afraid to even make Outlook Web Access available to clients.

I think there will be big news about Exchange and, more importantly, broad adoption of non-proprietary alternatives to Exchange. Someone mentioned Leopard server and calendar server, but that project is completely open source and available at:

http://www.calendarserver.org/

There are many excieting projects that related to Darwin Calendar server and the CalDAV standard: including ActiveSync open source clients.

 

[rob@robburns.co]

Simply turning on IMAP on an Exchange server, is not a security risk.

My understanding is the only thing missing from Exchange's implementation of IMAP is quotas. If IT wants to impose quotas and use IMAP you have to use a different IMAP solution (i.e, drop Exchange).

Someone else has mentioned that the Mail client on iPhone does not have SSL/TLS. I think this has to be a short-term software issue. I haven't verified that's iPhone doesn't support IMAP and POP over SSL, but if it is I'm sure it will be addressed soon.

Finally, push mail definitely seems like the right way to do things, but how much does it matter to the end-user. Set your client to every minute. You have unlimited data and the communication with the server sill not bog down other operations. If anything this is a very small problem for AT&T and their network: not for anyone using an iPhone.

 

[theb3freak]

iPod games wouldn't work on the iPhone.

Besides, iPod games are mostly designed around the presence and use of the scrollwheel.

I would not be surprised to see games made available for the iPhone, but I think they would be games specifically made for it.

Simple enough - Apple edits the software to provide a touchscreen scrollwheel, and now the iPhone plays with iPod games!

 

[Zadillo]

Simple enough - Apple edits the software to provide a touchscreen scrollwheel, and now the iPhone plays with iPod games!

Yeah, not saying that couldn't be done, but it seems like it would be kind of a half-assed solution that Apple wouldn't normally do. It seems more likely they'd have people create updated iPhone specific games.