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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
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Have you tried kore recent devices? If you were ok with iPhone X there are good chances you'll be ok with newest devices too...iPhone X and Xs were awful for me
DJTaurus
macrumors 68000
Temporal dithering is just another form of flickering.
It’s the flickering that’s thrashing the nervous system.
14 Pro and Pro Max were the same for me with the 14 slightly better. All were an improvement on the 13s.
Hello folks, I want to share my story.
My wife had iPhones upt to 6s and switched to Samsung after that.
I for myself, had Blackberrys, but switched to Apple with the upcoming 5s and had the following iPhones after it:
6, SE, 7, XR, 12mini (returned due headache right away and learned about PWM), SE2, iPhone 11 (couldnt stand it either), iPhone 13 Pro (returned cause of PWM), SE2, iPhone 14 Pro (PWM), SE2 (thankfully didnt sell it), 13 Pro, 14 Pro, SE2.
If I told someone outside of this forum this journey - they would question my sainity.
My wifes journey: 6s, S9, S10e, 14 Pro
no PWM-Problems at all.
So, this doesnt help you at all. I'm the kind of guy, who instantly can tell if its a PWM-controlled lightbulp lighting a room.
A few days ago, accidentally dropped my SE2 and smashed the screen. I needed a new phone. I needed a new iPhone couse of all the whatsapps and stuff.
Drove to the next T-Mobile to buy a 14 Plus. This time, I hold on it - even when my eyes bleed. 256gb, blue.
The LEDs above the counter where flickering, even the default photo-app flickered.
Thankfully, no blue in store. When I drop so much money and make my eyes bleed, I want a blue one, nothing else.
Ok, I have to order it online, but its already friday and it wont make it till tuesday anyway, so I can order it saturday or sunday, no need to hurry.
The S9 and S10e laying in the drawer. Picked up the S9 since the S10e is the backup phone of my wife.
I knew my eyes would be bloodshot since its 120hz AMOLED. Worse than all the PWM-iPhones i had by far.
After a few seconds I felt - nothing. Even after half an hour setting it up - nothing. I couldnt believe it.
To test it to the max I watched an entire movie in the dark - nothing.
I dont know what to do next really. After a week its still the same. I dont know if I should buy the 14 Plus or not,
but I think I will either stay on the S9 since its surprisingly good beside the battery (main factor for 14 Plus) or a bigger S-Series Samsung.
Thank you for reading this wall of text and please excuse my english, its a foreign language for me I learned 20 years ago.
My wife had iPhones upt to 6s and switched to Samsung after that.
I for myself, had Blackberrys, but switched to Apple with the upcoming 5s and had the following iPhones after it:
6, SE, 7, XR, 12mini (returned due headache right away and learned about PWM), SE2, iPhone 11 (couldnt stand it either), iPhone 13 Pro (returned cause of PWM), SE2, iPhone 14 Pro (PWM), SE2 (thankfully didnt sell it), 13 Pro, 14 Pro, SE2.
If I told someone outside of this forum this journey - they would question my sainity.
My wifes journey: 6s, S9, S10e, 14 Pro
no PWM-Problems at all.
So, this doesnt help you at all. I'm the kind of guy, who instantly can tell if its a PWM-controlled lightbulp lighting a room.
A few days ago, accidentally dropped my SE2 and smashed the screen. I needed a new phone. I needed a new iPhone couse of all the whatsapps and stuff.
Drove to the next T-Mobile to buy a 14 Plus. This time, I hold on it - even when my eyes bleed. 256gb, blue.
The LEDs above the counter where flickering, even the default photo-app flickered.
Thankfully, no blue in store. When I drop so much money and make my eyes bleed, I want a blue one, nothing else.
Ok, I have to order it online, but its already friday and it wont make it till tuesday anyway, so I can order it saturday or sunday, no need to hurry.
The S9 and S10e laying in the drawer. Picked up the S9 since the S10e is the backup phone of my wife.
I knew my eyes would be bloodshot since its 120hz AMOLED. Worse than all the PWM-iPhones i had by far.
After a few seconds I felt - nothing. Even after half an hour setting it up - nothing. I couldnt believe it.
To test it to the max I watched an entire movie in the dark - nothing.
I dont know what to do next really. After a week its still the same. I dont know if I should buy the 14 Plus or not,
but I think I will either stay on the S9 since its surprisingly good beside the battery (main factor for 14 Plus) or a bigger S-Series Samsung.
Thank you for reading this wall of text and please excuse my english, its a foreign language for me I learned 20 years ago.
lawlbringer
macrumors regular
Hey everyone,
So add another person(me) to the potentially PWM/OLED sensitive pile. I wanted to chime in and see if anyone maybe had the similar symptoms and found a solution. I'm currently trying to replace my iPhone 11 due to size(64GB) and issues in my area with crappy service/data speeds most likely due to the modem this model uses. After trying newer/faster devices and switching back to the 11, I can definitely notice that the newer APU's are definitely snappier than the A13 in the 11. Siri functions via CarPlay seem to lag quite a bit on my 11 compared to being super quick to load on the newer models I've tried but had to return.
My main symptom is eye strain/fatigue that feels like pressure in my eyes that typically turns into an annoying dull headache most of the time. Sometimes I'll even get a weird aching sensation towards the back of my eyes...it almost feels like it's towards the back of my head. This has been the case with literally every OLED iPhone I've tried recently (iPhone XS, 13, 14 Pro Max, 13 Mini.) I actually just got an iPhone 13 Mini yesterday to test since I've read this has the highest PWM rate out of any iPhone according to Notebook Review's website but the symptoms seem similar so far.
I'll also note that in my case, I never was able to use these devices for more than the 2 weeks since that's Apple's return policy. I guess I never wanted to be stuck with the device if it caused me that much discomfort but perhaps I do have to "tough it out" to adjust possibly? Previously when I switched from an iPhone 6s to an XR my eyes felt significant discomfort but eventually adjusted in about a month or so. I'm not sure if that will be the same case since I'd be going from IPS to OLED vs IPS to IPS as I did back then.
So add another person(me) to the potentially PWM/OLED sensitive pile. I wanted to chime in and see if anyone maybe had the similar symptoms and found a solution. I'm currently trying to replace my iPhone 11 due to size(64GB) and issues in my area with crappy service/data speeds most likely due to the modem this model uses. After trying newer/faster devices and switching back to the 11, I can definitely notice that the newer APU's are definitely snappier than the A13 in the 11. Siri functions via CarPlay seem to lag quite a bit on my 11 compared to being super quick to load on the newer models I've tried but had to return.
My main symptom is eye strain/fatigue that feels like pressure in my eyes that typically turns into an annoying dull headache most of the time. Sometimes I'll even get a weird aching sensation towards the back of my eyes...it almost feels like it's towards the back of my head. This has been the case with literally every OLED iPhone I've tried recently (iPhone XS, 13, 14 Pro Max, 13 Mini.) I actually just got an iPhone 13 Mini yesterday to test since I've read this has the highest PWM rate out of any iPhone according to Notebook Review's website but the symptoms seem similar so far.
I'll also note that in my case, I never was able to use these devices for more than the 2 weeks since that's Apple's return policy. I guess I never wanted to be stuck with the device if it caused me that much discomfort but perhaps I do have to "tough it out" to adjust possibly? Previously when I switched from an iPhone 6s to an XR my eyes felt significant discomfort but eventually adjusted in about a month or so. I'm not sure if that will be the same case since I'd be going from IPS to OLED vs IPS to IPS as I did back then.
I went from an X (Which I was completely fine with) to a 12 Pro (Immediate headaches/eyeaches the lot)
So I have been scared of trying others.
I may try a 14 just not sure which model.
For those in the UK, if I try a phone is it no quibbles return?
Do you need to give a reason, and if so is PWM issues accepted?
Thanks
Do you need to give a reason, and if so is PWM issues accepted?
Thanks
Within 2 weeks you don't need any reason at all. I've returned a few that gave me issues. You book a courier and they pick it up from your door.
They don’t care why an iPhone is returned and will never ask because there’s probably 100,000 valid reasons why a person wouldn’t want it.
I’m curious what settings you’ve used?
I have a Studio Display for work and it is flicker free, though not perfect either (it’s useable, though particularly long sessions can lead to some eye strain - which I understand is normal, but I’ve had older displays that I could stare at all day with no issue). I’d like to play around with that app though.
I’m not sure if the Studio Display also has some type of temporal dithering effect as it processes the image (can’t find anything this specific online, just that it’s backlight flicker free).
Replying old comments.
I just updated iPhone 11 from 15.7 to 16.2. I like the screen, not really sure what’s the difference. Curious, downgraded back to iOS 15.6 RC. I did see the old look, where the screen didn’t really comfortable for my eyes (but I can still work on it). Finally I update again to 16.2 until now. All settings are the same (I did backup restore).
I know this is subjective. The display looks slightly brighter, text is more crispy, and less “blinking”, not sure how to say this.
I am just wondering if anyone had similar experiences.
Updated from iPadOS 15.7.2 to iPadOS 16.2 on my iPad (6th Gen, 2018) – result: Severe eye strain after a couple of minutes of usage. Went back to iPadOS 15.7.2 and everything is fine again.
Didn't try iOS 16 yet on my iPhone SE (2020) as I'm afraid of eye strain there as well. If I do a local backup of my iPhone (iOS 15.7.1) on my Mac, would it be – after installing iOS 16.2 – possible to downgrade back to iOS 15.7.1 (just in case I want to try the current iOS version on my iPhone)?
Didn't try iOS 16 yet on my iPhone SE (2020) as I'm afraid of eye strain there as well. If I do a local backup of my iPhone (iOS 15.7.1) on my Mac, would it be – after installing iOS 16.2 – possible to downgrade back to iOS 15.7.1 (just in case I want to try the current iOS version on my iPhone)?
Your experience is opposite to mine. I have no idea whether you should try update your iPhone SE or not. But for now, you can only downgrade to 15.6 RC (at least until last night). From there, you can not not update to any other version except 16.2. So, you will loose 15.7.1 version, but may still have the old 15.6 RC (Google or YouTube for detail steps).
The question is: If I do a local backup on my Mac, does the iOS version remain the same? So if I backup my iPhone with iOS 15.7.1 on the Mac and install iOS 16.2 afterwards, the restore of the local backup should put iOS 15.7.1 back on the iPhone, or not?
No. Every iOS install / update require ticket from Apple server. At the moment, Apple only provide ticket for iOS 15.6 RC and 16.2 (and some other versions for very old iPhone). In your case, you couldn’t restore iOS 15.7.1 even though you have the backup of that version, due to Apple is no longer release ticket for 15.7.1 now.
Dejected
macrumors regular
jimmy_uk
macrumors 68030
This thread could really use some stickies so certain info is always up front.
We have asked this question for years and sadly there are several reasons it can't be answered:
1. No two people are the same, so how you physically react to OLED/LCD PWM &/or dithering can't be determined by others experiences.
2. There is a screen lottery with every iPhone due to different manafactuers supplying the display and the difference in tolerances of each device. You could, for example, buy two iphone 14 Pro and each device could have differences in appearance with the display. One looks reddish, one looks yellower. Or one is slightly brighter than the other. This could be a factor on any reaction you may or may not have.
It depends what apple is allowing. Its a sliding permission scale depending on how annoying they want to be.
Example:
If you had an iPhone 6 that shipped with iOS 9 on it and you backed it up on day one, (iOS 9 backup) then 3 years later you decide to install iOS 12 - but find out that iOS 12 slowed the phone down to glacial speeds - you’re screwed. You can’t restore your phone to your iOS 9 backup because Apple says no. (iOS 9 is no longer ‘ ‘blessed’ or what’s officially known as ‘signed’).
While the example above is extreme and from long ago, the concept still remains with current versions of iOS. You can only reinstall an older version of iOS for a short while after a new version comes out until Apple slams the door on that.
This is one of the most hostile aspects about iPhones & apple. Makes a person never want to install new (buggy) software
I went to the local shop to take a look at new 14 pro plus, or how they call it nowadays. I don’t track the versions because I know that iPhone 11 is the best iPhone you can buy these days.
So after 2-3 minutes experienced discomfort.
It’s a pity to understand that Apple no longer best smartphone manufacturer since some xiaomi poco x4 gt is better in screen and charging speed and cell reception quality…
So after 2-3 minutes experienced discomfort.
It’s a pity to understand that Apple no longer best smartphone manufacturer since some xiaomi poco x4 gt is better in screen and charging speed and cell reception quality…
Out of curiousity, what are people’s experiences with the iPads? There seems to be three that have LCDs (standard 10th gen, Air 5, and 11” Pro).
From what I can tell, they’re flicker-free, and the 10th gen one is also free of any dithering, though I don’t know about the other two. It might have to do with the 10th gen’s lack of P3 color support.
From what I can tell, they’re flicker-free, and the 10th gen one is also free of any dithering, though I don’t know about the other two. It might have to do with the 10th gen’s lack of P3 color support.
PWMisSuperSUS
macrumors newbie
10th gen iPad isn't dither free if you ask me. Bought one and returned it due to severe eye strain and a headache. Here is Notebookcheck's video on dithering for the 10th gen iPad. They claim no dither, but I can clearly see some flicker anomaly in the video, explaining why it was unusable for me. My iPad air 2 gives me no such problems on iOS 13, I use it daily. It's a little slow but it gets the job done.