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face id security

M

Muscle

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 15, 2010
170
3
Say you don't want someone unlocking your phone or making an applepay / touchid payment, at least with touchID said someone had to physically force your hand / finger onto the home button.

What is there to stop anyone from unlocking your phone / making payments if they can just pick up your phone and scan your face?
 
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"What is there to stop anyone who just picks up your phone ... "
As your "face" would also have to be there, then you would be the one that actively prevents the situation in the first place.
If someone ties you up, so you can't move, then unlocking your phone is likely the least of your problems.
 
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99.999999999% of the time an iPhone is lost or stolen, what occurs is the person who gets ahold of it is immediately declined access and would never be able to get into the phone. That's the reality. No one is taking phones and using someone's fingerprint and no one is going to be taking phones and holding them to someone's face to unlock the device either. Moreover, for all you know the device could scan for a face every 1min or per app, or every 10 seconds or constantly (unlikely due to battery).

You're talking about non-issues. And by the way, anything you've thought of, the security teams at Apple have thought of around 2-3 years ago and about 1,000 other possibilities.
 
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DeltaMac said:
"What is there to stop anyone who just picks up your phone ... "
As your "face" would also have to be there, then you would be the one that actively prevents the situation in the first place.
If someone ties you up, so you can't move, then unlocking your phone is likely the least of your problems.
Click to expand...

If the FaceID is as easy to unlock your phone as the media is hyping it up to be (ie: can be unlocked when placed flat on a table, don't need you to face your camera at a certain angle, scanning / unlocking your phone in miliseconds), whats to stop anyone from unlocking your phone as long as you're physically present?
 
No one is going to steal your phone and point it at you in real world use. This reminds me of the people who were worried that someone might cut off their finger in order to use the finger print reader when Touch ID was first rumoured/then later announced.

Apple are not new to the game when it comes to security and privacy, in fact they are very good at creating devices that are more secure than others in the market. Apple have been working on "Face ID" for around 10 years, during which time I'm sure they have thought about all of this stuff.

http://bgr.com/2017/07/13/iphone-8-features-3d-facial-recognition/
 
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Muscle said:
If the FaceID is as easy to unlock your phone as the media is hyping it up to be (ie: can be unlocked when placed flat on a table, don't need you to face your camera at a certain angle, scanning / unlocking your phone in miliseconds), whats to stop anyone from unlocking your phone as long as you're physically present?
Click to expand...
My solution for you is to:

A. Not buy the phone
B. Go live in a hut in the woods
 
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While it's unlikely to be a concern, I guess it's feasible that Face ID has the potential to be less "secure" than Touch ID. I think it would be easier to point a phone towards a persons face rather than take hold of their hand to place their finger on a small sensor. Imagine you're out and about and someone swipes your phone. Would it be possible for them to walk past you holding the phone at eye level to unlock it? And all the while you'll just be thinking that it was another annoying person with no regard for your personal bubble of solitude? We don't know the details of "Face ID", and I'll bet security experts will be fiddling with it immediately. Just one more week!
 
Yep, identical twins may be identical in appearance, but perhaps will not disturb a facial recognition scanner at all.
I think it would make an interesting experiment. Come back with results after you let your twin try to unlock your new iPhone.
 
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It's normal for doubters to exist, but remember, Apple has a solid reputation with security and encryption. Plenty of Apple people probably paid attention to Samsung's security flaws and worked harder to avoid a similar pitfall. Just wait to see how FaceID works before coming up with realistic and unrealistic circumstances.
 
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nviz22 said:
It's normal for doubters to exist, but remember, Apple has a solid reputation with security and encryption. Plenty of Apple people probably paid attention to Samsung's security flaws and worked harder to avoid a similar pitfall. Just wait to see how FaceID works before coming up with realistic and unrealistic circumstances.
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I was only throwing a point in there for discussion, not kicking a Granny in the shins.
 
Zxxv said:
Just pull a strange face when you set it up.
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I'd rather not pull a strange face in the office every time I want to unlock my phone.

Closing one eye may be more acceptable and have the same effect.
 
T'was the night before Christmas, and all was dark. I decided upon a walk, through the famed Central Park.

I skipped and jumped, spun and turned. That's when a random man approached, his face was burned.

He grabbed my beloved iPhone, the one I purchased just now. It had FaceID and everything, a definite wow.

As he rushed off, I let out a scream. "Help me, Help me, that man just stole my dream!"

A few minutes later, I collapsed in distress. None had come to my aid, oh the unkindness!

That's when I heard footsteps, was it my savior? No! It was the rotten man with the rude behavior!

He stood a few distance away, holding my phone in the air. What was he doing, care to share?

And that's when it clicked, he was trying to use my face. Sucks for him that I had a bottle of mace.

I sprayed that sh.it all over his eyes, and hit him on the head for good measure. That assh0le had taken my beloved, my dream, my treasure.

Guess Apple really thought things through with FaceID after all. Otherwise, the thief wouldn't have come back to stand like a wall.

So the story ends now, but the moral is real. FaceID is frickin' awesome, it's definitely worth the zeal.
 
The-Real-Deal82 said:
I wonder if my identical twin brother will be able to unlock my phone? If you haven't got to look directly into the camera and can unlock in pitch black, I doubt it matters if my iris is slightly different. Interesting stuff.
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Identical twins are identical in genes, but after birth they split in numerous ways due to epigenetics. Your faces are different, whether you can really tell or not.
 
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The-Real-Deal82 said:
I was only throwing a point in there for discussion, not kicking a Granny in the shins.
Click to expand...

Wasn't directly at you. Rather it's a general comment because people are pointing out would be scenarios that facial detection could be compromised or rendered ineffective. I think we should just give FaceID a chance because Apple is normally superb with biometrics and a secured OS.
 
nviz22 said:
Wasn't directly at you. Rather it's a general comment because people are pointing out would be scenarios that facial detection could be compromised or rendered ineffective. I think we should just give FaceID a chance because Apple is normally superb with biometrics and a secured OS.
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I agree I'm sure they'll implement it better than anybody else. We'll find out soon enough but threads get very boring if we don't throw a few assumptions and 'what ifs' in there. Plus Apple have cocked up once or twice in the past with iPhone features so we know they don't get things right every time.
 
The-Real-Deal82 said:
I agree I'm sure they'll implement it better than anybody else. We'll find out soon enough but threads get very boring if we don't throw a few assumptions and 'what ifs' in there. Plus Apple have cocked up once or twice in the past with iPhone features so we know they don't get things right every time.
Click to expand...

Oh in that case, then yeah you could have fun with what ifs.
 
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nviz22 said:
It's normal for doubters to exist, but remember, Apple has a solid reputation with security and encryption. Plenty of Apple people probably paid attention to Samsung's security flaws and worked harder to avoid a similar pitfall. Just wait to see how FaceID works before coming up with realistic and unrealistic circumstances.
Click to expand...

I think consumers doubt this Company's security methods because of two reasons:

1.) They don't have a full understanding of how this technology operates and they continue to speculate the worst possible scenarios until Apple debuts the technology, which the consumer will later have the opportunity to test and evaluate themselves.

2.) Some Consumers don't trust Apple because they don't like the fact that Apple is removing touch ID and replacing it with face ID, therefore their negativity affects their mindset of how this technology could actually be possible.
 
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Relentless Power said:
I think consumers doubt this Company's security methods because of two reasons:

1.) They don't have a full understanding of how this technology operates and they continue to speculate the worst possible scenarios until Apple debuts the technology, which the consumer will later have the opportunity to test and evaluate themselves.

2.) Some Consumers don't trust Apple because they don't like the fact that Apple is removing touch ID and replacing it with face ID, therefore their negativity affects their mindset of how this technology could actually be possible.
Click to expand...

Agreed. One week and change to go until people are proven wrong.
 
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Relentless Power said:
I think consumers doubt this Company's security methods because of two reasons:

1.) They don't have a full understanding of how this technology operates and they continue to speculate the worst possible scenarios until Apple debuts the technology, which the consumer will later have the opportunity to test and evaluate themselves.

2.) Some Consumers don't trust Apple because they don't like the fact that Apple is removing touch ID and replacing it with face ID, therefore their negativity affects their mindset of how this technology could actually be possible.
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Never assume. I don't fit either of those narratives and I seem to have stirred the hornets nest by adding a couple of questions here purely for discussion purposes.
 
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The-Real-Deal82 said:
Never assume. I don't fit either of those narratives and I seem to have stirred the hornets nest by adding a couple of questions here purely for discussion purposes.
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Actually, I stated think, which translates into my belief, not a fact that applies to everyone. It's my theory of two generalizations based off my readings Over the past few weeks on the iPhone forum . And if anyone chooses to discuss mySub-points, "Stirring" the hornets nest is not my goal, civilized and cordial discussion is.
 
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