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So when is Adobe going to confront them by withholding CS5 or other versions of the software from the Mac OS. Adobe can easily have Apple by the balls by delaying CS5 for release on the Mac until CS6 or even CS7 is released on Windows. Adobe might even be able make a profit by it from having the product on the market for a longer duration and support fees.
I cry a little on the inside every time I read stupidity like this. I'm not saying that the poster is stupid just that the comment is extremely misinformed and without the facts.

Look at the earnings reports boys... Apple is roughly 40% of platform sales and if you were to cut that amount of revenue Adobe as a company is instantly bankrupt (please don't mention cutting people or downsizing because if you instantly cut 40% of your rev you are dead... that is more than their total profits). You need to realize that Adobe needs Apple, not the other way around.
 
This whole thing is ridiculous. But I know that Apple will win. Adobe can't survive without Apple.

(P.S. Comment 1000!)
 
I really don't think you should be bringing the bolded part into these forums, I do disagree with you on this, but does it matter here? Could get ugly. :p

We shall agree to disagree.

And in the sake of fairness - i will qualify my statement

"There is free choice in faith - but the options are skewed when you have been brought up being told one way is right from before you are able to make a rational choice."

As for Apple Vs Adobe, the crux is simple.

Flash creates free games (eg farmville) and streams free media - both regulated and pirate.

In other words - Flash is a direct competitor to iTunes revenue.

Apple doesn't want it - neither do the media distributors who hate piracy or app developers that like to make money.

The rest is just garnish.
 
What motives are Adobe hiding? That they want business and profits? That's not a hidden motive at all..

Yup. Same as Apple, Google, Microsoft, IBM, etc. There is no business rule these business need to work with each other in any way. They choose to do so only when it is best for them.
 
Apparently everyone here has, but I've never had a problem with Flash on my iMac. I guess :apple: got it right on the 2008 model ;)
 
  • Record Mac sales for over 20 successive quarters
  • iMacs to account for 25% of all desktop sales for 2010
  • Most profitable computer business in the industry.
  • $40 billion in spare cash. No debts. Recession-proof.
  • Total command of the Premium end of the computer market
  • Highest customer satisfaction ratings in the industry for several years running for Macs, iPhones, iPods
  • Highest customer service satisfaction ratings several years running
  • 25% of the US smartphone market in less than three years, while completely reshaping the market almost overnight
  • The most successful App Store with no end to growth in sight
  • A complete hardware-software ecosystem that is the envy of the industry
  • Total dominance of the handheld mediaplayer industry (iPods, iPod Touches)
  • OS X the Gold Standard of operating systems, including the iPhone OS
  • iPad received with excitement and praise, expected to revolutionize the computing industry. Already sold over half a million units. 20 million expected by 2012. The industry squarely behind it, content providers lining up to be a part of it. Developers happy like pigs in ****. Topped all sales of previous tablets combined. Again, Apple either changed a market overnight or created a new one.

How much "better" would you like them to do? Would you like an Apple-branded flying car that serves you tea while rubbing your back? Perhaps an OS X-powered personal mechanical butler that also transforms into a jet? At some point all this infinite progression of "I know Apple can do better" baloney needs to stop. Apple *is* doing better, almost on a monthly basis.
What is "better"?
 
While Apple may not be in danger of becoming Microsoft they are in danger of pulling a Microsoft. From John Gruber:



The result of Google envy for Microsoft was the debacle known as Vista. It sure seems like Apple now has Google envy and is in danger of ignoring one of it's core businesses: OS X, Mac.

All of Apple's products are tied in with each other. They all revolve around some flavor of their core product: OS X. Each new product that comes out and each update improve or build on that core product. They're really not as spread out as it looks. Meanwhile, Google has its hands in a remarkable number of cookie jars that have little to do with each other: video, advertising, desktop software, hardware, mobile phones, mail, web-based office suites, social networking, etc. Those all have little to do with their core business which is search.

So, who is more in danger of pulling a Microsoft here? Doesn't look like Apple to me.
 
I would suggest a good cooling read of this article that brings a lot of unknown information to this discussion.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...list_lashes_out_at_apple_over_iphone_4_0.html

You may come to the conclusion that Adobe is speaking but hidding their motives.

Thanks for the link... This is the only part I thought kind of ironic.....

Adobe vs Flash

But it wasn't too long ago that Adobe was itself trying to kill Flash, back when Flash was owned by Macromedia. Adobe supported SVG as an alternative to doing vector graphics on the web, and promoted SMIL (Synchronized Multimedia Integration Language) as an open specification for presenting multimedia using XML.

Of course, now that Adobe owns Flash, it has dropped all interest in advocating those open standards, because with its acquisition of Macromedia, Adobe also obtained what Brimelow might call "tyrannical control over developers" who create dynamic web content.
 
When will this change?

When your platform is in a trailing position (less developers, lower quality APIs), then you might want to encourage cross-platform tools. You would gain access to more of your competition's developers, and the tools will bring apps down to the lowest common denominator (yours).

If you are in a leadership position, then the number of new developers you might get from the use of cross platform tools is probably less than the number who might start coding for the competition, and some developers may start coding to the cruftier lower quality cross-platform APIs, instead of your cool new (patented?) ones.

Apple is in the leadership position, both in the number of paid mobile apps, and the quality of their SDK APIs. Why would they want to give up that position? Business is war.

So, just maybe Apple will start allowing cross platform tools after Google's Android goes way past them in paid apps being sold, number of professional developers, and better APIs. When Cocoa was a brand new upstart and Java development was hotter, they did support Cocoa Java. Not any more.

This has little to do with Adobe. Adobe is collateral damage. The real potential competition is Android. The ball is now in Google's court. When can Google catch up? (by then, Flash as the cross-platform API of choice may be nearly dead...)

imho
 
When you load all resources into the exe, the OS is forced to load the entire thing into memory at the beginning which means that it takes up a large chunk of ram.

Look up "virtual memory" and "demand paging" in a CS text. Monolithic loads are from the Mac OS (classic) dayes. The phone OS does paging, and can discard pages and load other ones.
 
Nonsense. So *only* xcode tools product good code? Remember that the xcode compilers are all GNU/OSS. What about the C preprocessor? Or perhaps various tools that synthesize code from UI frameworks? Or ...

I'm not saying these *are* better tools, but your interpretation is nonsense.

Don't you dare purposely misrepresent what I wrote like that!

I wrote They also said "we don't have time to do a comprehensive evaluation of every tool out there to see how well it works, so we're specifying some that, when used properly, result in apps which have adequate efficiency (storage, RAM, and CPU cycle usage).

Now, you show me where I said that only the tools that Apple specified were efficient. Or apologize. I'm fine with either.
 
Seeing profits doesn't inspire me.

Are any of your parent's retirement savings in an investment, 401K or IRA mutual fund? Guess how much of the value of that fund are based on somebody's profits.

I would rather more people be inspired by profits related to their savings, and not just depend on our taxes for their retirement survival.
 
apple is going to end up in the same position as Microsoft in the late 1990's... getting too powerful and anti-competative. Brace for ensuing legal action over the coming years
 
I would suggest a good cooling read of this article that brings a lot of unknown information to this discussion.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...list_lashes_out_at_apple_over_iphone_4_0.html

You may come to the conclusion that Adobe is speaking but hidding their motives.

of course adobe has more motivations, he was probably not hiding it, if you read his previous entries.

Adobe just need to stop all products on mac and stick with windows, androids, webos and BB. They will be so much happier and get a better future.
 
apple is going to end up in the same position as Microsoft in the late 1990's... getting too powerful and anti-competative. Brace for ensuing legal action over the coming years

First they have to pass RIM and Nokia in market dominance well before Google catches up.

The race is on.
 
Are any of your parent's retirement savings in an investment, 401K or IRA mutual fund? Guess how much of the value of that fund are based on somebody's profits.
I'm deeply wary of such systems.

I would rather more people be inspired by profits related to their savings, and not just depend on our taxes for their retirement survival.
I have no complaints about that.
 
Just happened to be at a nearby BB store and checked out the iPad. Gosh I am totally not sure why people are talking so much about it. The iPhone apps looked horrible in 1x and 2x horrible in iPad mode. Browsing experience was good but it felt awkward to hold in 2 hands and try to navigate.

Then my 7yr kid wanted to check it out and went straight to couple of kids sites that he regularly uses only to find out Flash won't work. His take on the iPad was stunning - seems to be a stretched out iPod Touch that we have, even that doesn't have flash.

Flash bad! Flash bad!! HTML5!! - Well OK Apple - how about you just freaking throw the Flash plugin in there as a App Store download and let _US USERS_ decide if we want to have it or not. Oh wait it's not about users - is it? At least if it is about revenue - you lost a customer today.

Also why can't Apple build a resolution independent UI in 2010 when they feel entitled to judge Adobe being lazy? Am I missing something in expecting that iPod Touch apps should have automatically looked great on the merely stretched out iPad? It's like Microsoft saying all Windows apps are built for 14" monitors with 1024x768 resolution - if you have a 20" 1680x1050 monitor you need to rebuild the app with our new SDK.
 
Get a Clue, Adobe Had It Coming For A Long Time

What many buffoons who defend Apple cannot seem to understand (and don't know the first thing about programming, so their opinion shouldn't really count anyways), is that the effect of this is far beyond just flash. Phonegap, Unity, eg....are also all gone.


Adobe should "accidentally" release a jailbroken flash and pull ALL mac products off the shelf and restrict support.

Then laugh as Apple sales plummet.


LOL, yea, im sure investors would love that and what if Apple decided to make its OWN photo editing app to compete with photoshop? You think Apple dont have the resources. And even if they did p[ull it we could just run bootcamp, Adobe looses no matter how you see it. And its good for them. They been lazy with the mac for many years. CS5 is just an update that costs 600 dollars. They ben greedy and now they are trying to push an unwanted platform into the app store where the owners dont want it to be. RESPECT the owners rules, stop crying and develop native iphone apps with the sdk or develop for another platform. Stop crying, it dont help.

Purchasing Macromedia was the worst decision that Adobe has made in the past decade or so as it they gobbled up their largest, and almost last, competitor.

At this point I would go as far as saying that Adobe has a monopoly on the design market. This is evidenced by the seemingly pointless upgrade to CS5 less than 24 months from the release of CS4. As others have mentioned it, Adobe is basically charging $600 for bug fixes while discontinuing bug fixes on the previous generation. Even Microsoft is still releasing patches for Windows XP and Windows 2003 7+ years from the release of each product.

Many have stated that Apple is attempting to harm Adobe’s business, but Adobe refuses to make use of many Apple built technologies that could significantly improve performance on the Mac versions of CS, this while optimizing code heavily for Windows and leaving 68k and PPC code in the Mac versions. Adobe has tried to make themselves look better by stating that they released free updates to PPC and a beta for Intel (see John Nack’s blog) but in reality Apple pushed developers to move to Cocoa over 10 years ago and only relented to release Carbon as an effort to appease developers. For every subsequent revision of Mac OS X, Apple systematically deprecated old APIs and as many vestiges of OS 9 that they could, meanwhile trying to produce a solid modern framework for software development.

Adobe is simply trying to make the best out of their previous development, which is a good business decision for them, but to effectively move the platform forward Apple had to make choices like killing 64-bit Carbon. While I understand that Adobe had to make a tough decision in how to move forward, they are still releasing new versions of CS without completing the current versions or fixing bugs with software that was released within the previous 2 years. I would even go as far as to say that Microsoft treats their customers better today. Wow!

Also, for all of those complaining about problems for tools like the Unity game engine, doing a little research you will find that Unity generates an Xcode project for the iPhone. To function properly this would have to generate code that compiles natively with one of the various compilers that Apple has made available as of late. As this is generating native code it will likely not be subject to these restrictions.

And what if Adobe is slow to update and all these flash games are on the app store? What if Apple wants to implement NEW features and they cant because Adobe is slow to update there stupid flash toolkit? Go buy a clue guys, with all that money you saved on buying a pc.

Lastly, will someone please tell me how a mouse-over is going to work on a touch enabled OS? Please someone answer this question and tell us what Flash actually provides beyond HTML5 besides a scripting language that designers can understand. Oh wait, they are both scripting or markup languages that don’t actually require substantial knowledge of a high level programming language to develop applications. All this is going to do is create a lot of shovel ware that will likely run poorly. Why should we believe that Adobe will optimize their code for ARM on Mac OS X any better than they have for Intel or PPC on Mac OS X.
 
Flash bad! Flash bad!! HTML5!! - Well OK Apple - how about you just freaking throw the Flash plugin in there as a App Store download and let _US USERS_ decide if we want to have it or not. Oh wait it's not about users - is it? At least if it is about revenue - you lost a customer today.

Flash creates free games (eg farmville) and streams free media - both regulated and pirate.

In other words - Flash is a direct competitor to iTunes revenue.

Apple doesn't want it - neither do the media distributors who hate piracy or app developers that like to make money.

Its a business decison - and a price I am willing to pay.
Not missing flash as amuch as i am loving everything else about iPhone life.
 
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