Fastmac.com cancels order, ships anyway, refuses refund payment for unsolicited goods

[nhcowboy1]

Okay, assume that OP had a legal right to throw the package away as unsolicited.

It would nonetheless have been the gracious thing to do had OP contacted the company & said, "Oops, you sent me a package you weren't supposed to. Would you like me to send it back? Would you mind covering the cost of return shipping?"

I think that what many of us here object to is the fact that by asserting what you perceive to be your legal rights, you are causing a great deal of trouble for a great number of people. True, it may take you only a few minutes to file a complaint with any given agency. But I've no doubt that whoever receives that complaint will have to spend quite a bit more than a few minutes dealing with it. And those are minutes that won't be spent dealing with complaints that might be quite a bit more significant, thus impacting who knows how many other people whom you're not even aware of.

OP, you may indeed have had the right to do what you did. That doesn't mean it was the right thing to do.

 

[notjustjay]

I am picking up all kinds of cues from the OP that suggests to me that this will not have a happy outcome.

 

[cohibadad]

OP, you may indeed have had the right to do what you did. That doesn't mean it was the right thing to do.

well said.

I am picking up all kinds of cues from the OP that suggests to me that this will not have a happy outcome.

I doubt that. I assume she will get her money back and that will be the end of it. If this was a higher cost item it would be more of a problem.

On fastmac.com it says, "For your security, your order will not be delivered without an authorized signature." Was a signature required? I don't see anywhere in OP posts where she said specifically whether she knew what she was throwing away, but it seems obvious that she wouldn't care because in her opinion this is a federal crime and unsolicited. Never the less, it all comes back to nhcowboy's comment.

 

[Buran]

You know as well as I do that you can't read my mind nor do you know what I have been doing every minute of every day. I already said I haven't spent hours on this, and you think you know better? But it doesn't really matter. The time I have spent on it was worth it to me. That's all that matters. Sorry, everyone, that actually fighting back against fraud is so offensive to so many people. If anyone wants to question what the "right thing" is, the "right thing" is to make it right, and that's all I've been asking this whole time, but apparently these people would rather dig their heels in rather than admit their mistakes.

The only thing I'm starting to question now is whether I should just file the followup of my bank dispute early, rather than waiting shortly before the 60 days is up, but I'll probably give it one more day. And you can bet on it that the next outfit that tries to scam me in any way will not get the benefit of the doubt and will go right to my bank, no grace period given.

 

[mr_matalino]

As a business owner myself, I would hope that a customer doesn't assume that ANY problem encountered with an order/product doesn't default to me and me alone. There are things out of my control. I'm willing to work with them if they are willing to work with me. I think the OP has taken a steep course of action by filing so many complaints. She assumes that all fault is with the company. We make mistakes. If someone "demands" something, I'll demand something back. Being patient and nice go a long way to getting what you want.

Read "How to win friends and influence people" by Dale Carnige.

 

[m.jakey]

Let's all just chip in and give her the darn money back-maybe this will end!

 

[cohibadad]

You know as well as I do that you can't read my mind...Sorry, everyone, that actually fighting back against fraud is so offensive to so many people. If anyone wants to question what the "right thing" is, the "right thing" is to make it right, and that's all I've been asking this whole time, but apparently these people would rather dig their heels in rather than admit their mistakes.

No one has a problem with fraud. You should be a politician with this spin. You seem to have dug in your heels as much as or more than them. If they deny that you cancelled the item, but you have proof, you have every right to get your money back. If you threw away away the item, you probably still have the right to get your money back. But it would go a long way to just admit the mistake of throwing away the item. You would have been completely within your rights to have received the item and contacted them to place the burden on them getting it back if it was worth it to them. If you received the item and contacted your credit card company to get a chargeback they would ask you if you received the item and if the company requested it back they would have instructed you to ship it back. I have been through this process more than once and they have done it the same way each time.

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

I already said I haven't spent hours on this, and you think you know better?

Yes, because you are lying. Count the time you've spent crafting this thread, the time you took to actually sift through all the legal codes, the time you spent filing complaints with the BBB, PayPal, and your bank. With someone with the common sense and logic you've displayed in this thread, you're going to have a hard time convincing anyone that this only took you a few minutes.

The time I have spent on it was worth it to me. That's all that matters. Sorry, everyone, that actually fighting back against fraud is so offensive to so many people.

Fighting against fraud? You cancelled a shipping order, they sent it to you. They made a mistake. But then you threw away a package without checking it. Put things in perspective. It costs $22.

If anyone wants to question what the "right thing" is, the "right thing" is to make it right, and that's all I've been asking this whole time, but apparently these people would rather dig their heels in rather than admit their mistakes.

I think nhccowboy hit it right on the head with: OP, you may indeed have had the right to do what you did. That doesn't mean it was the right thing to do.. Just because you feel you got shafted by a legal technicality does not mean it's right for you to cause this much of a ruckus and trouble for individuals. Don't you think the people investigating things at all these agencies have more urgent matters to attend to?

And you can bet on it that the next outfit that tries to scam me in any way will not get the benefit of the doubt and will go right to my bank, no grace period given.

Uh oh. Watch out corporate America. A new breed of consumer is in town. One that will get the BBB all up in your business due to MUTUAL MISUNDERSTANDINGS that resulted in a $22 monetary loss that isn't afraid to throw over double that with the time it takes to follow up.

 

[jemeinc]

whoa!! this is $20 we're talking about here right? if I sent you the cash could I get the time I spent reading that post back?

if $20 gets you worked up enough to get on a forum and spend all that time typing up a few "war & peace" length posts, contact the "Feds", the BBB, the press, Jesse Jackson, the governator, and anyone else you can think of to "shame" them I wonder what you'd do when faced with a real problem. relax man, you can make that $20 back but you'll never get the time your spending chasing this thing down back. it was a mistake on both parts, don't let yourself get so worked up- its bad for your health.

 

[Buran]

Call me a liar if you want. But you're wrong.

I'm through defending and explaining myself to people who think it's OK to stick it to someone else when you make a mistake.

 

[saltyzoo]

Whatever they've done, it isn't fraud.

 

[weckart]

Don't waste time with the Feds or Paypal, just email sjobs@apple.com

You might get a Macbook Air out of it.

 

[skwij]

Call me a liar if you want. But you're wrong.

I'm through defending and explaining myself to people who think it's OK to stick it to someone else when you make a mistake.

Well, actually, there were a couple of mistakes here. They sent something after you'd cancelled the order, but you're the one with the strange Mail practices. I mean, who the heck has a separate mailbox strictly for "junk mail"?? Oh, and of course, parcels ordered over the internet

Yep, you're entitled to your refund, but you may want to examine the way you have things shipped to you, in the future. You may also want to **gasp** actually CHECK the stuff in that mailbox before tossing it out, on the assumption that it's "junk mail". I mean, it's obviously not JUST for "junk mail" any more, is it?

What a lot of bother you've gone to, when it's your own practices that are as much at fault in this.

Oh and yeah, I'm a girl, too. No sympathy here, sista!

 

[Batt]

If it was shipped to an address that was strictly for junk mail, why did you give them that shipping address?
Swallow the loss, it's your fault.

 

[Sannekita]

I think you're pretty much right. It's their mistake so they should refund you. I do think it's very weird that you threw away a package (probably because you were too stubborn to help the company in any way)...
All I know is that having this attitude won't help you what so ever. Of course some people on this forum weren't going to be on your side, what did you expect?

 

[notjustjay]

All I know is that having this attitude won't help you what so ever. Of course some people on this forum weren't going to be on your side, what did you expect?

That's exactly what I meant by my earlier comment. All this attitude of "I am right, you are all wrong, they are wrong, I am entitled, it's no business of yours what I do, I am the victim, they committed fraud..."

Not once has the OP ever suggested that maybe, just maybe, she might have been in error by throwing away that package so quickly.

The huff about "I'm female, by the way, thanks for assuming" just sealed the deal for me.

I've worked in retail, and I've worked with this type before. It's always about you. You are always 100% right, and we're always 100% wrong. It's never a mistake or a misunderstanding or something in between. It's always us trying to defraud you, the poor innocent victim, and you always want to pull every last penny that you think you're entitled to as a result. And when we (the sales person, the manager, the general public on the forum) try to persuade you to see some reason, you insist that everyone else is wrong. You're only a short step away from accusing us all of being in some great conspiracy with the corrupt retailers.

This will not end happily if both parties continue with this attitude.

Remember that I do agree that the facts as represented suggests that they were in the wrong for mailing the package in the first place after you cancelled, and the step I think should happen is they should offer you that refund and swallow their loss. Will that happen? Who knows, by this point.

A friend of mine works at the front desk of a condo office. She regularly gets people who have been ticketed for parking in the visitor parking area overnight without first getting a pass. Those that come in and are polite, have legitimate excuses or even just say "I didn't know, I didn't see the sign, my mistake, can you please help me?" -- she says "sure, no problem" and cancels the ticket. Others walk up, slap the ticket down on the desk, stare at her and say "What the F### is this, man?" To which she responds: "It's a TICKET. And I expect you to PAY IT."

 

[cohibadad]

I had to do a reality check so I ran this all by the chicks at the office and they suggested OP takes some responsibility for this problem and write off the $. But we live in the Midwest where we tend to think that way and not assume everyone is out to get us.

 

[madoka]

I think for most of us, common sense says that someone who would raise hell over a $15 item would also not be the type to just cavalierly throw packages away without opening them.

There's two sides to every story. I'm guessing fastmac may think that she is trying to defraud them with this story of "Oh, I have a separate mailing address where I throw away all my packages without bothering to look at them."

 

[mperkins37]

I suggest that since you've been victim of Fraud, that you Call The Police, & Hire a lawyer immediately! I am sure the AG will also step up as your case is
obviously more important than anything that they could possibly be doing, IE
Rapists, Muggings, Murders, Stolen property, REAL FELONIES!
Talk to 3 or 4 lawyers & I am sure 1 will do this Pro BONO, as they always look for justice to be served against business that actually make the occasional mistake in shipping.
I am 100% positive that they were trying to fraud you out of money by sending you what you wanted. I am also positive that it wasn't the smallest of mistakes & that they planned on splitting the 20.00 amongst themselves, and buy that ivory backscratcher they always wanted.
Why I bet they made 5-6.00 on the merchandise after they screwed you over so blatantly. Must be how they stay in business.
I am also sure that any of us would've also just kept it or thrown it away, instead of returning it on their dime. I bet if you go down to the police station in person and act as you do here, the proper result will have to be seen by all, and justice will indeed be served.
On second thought, after you get laughed at by all of the above, and are told that you should have sent the solicited merchandise back instead of tossing it away, you will be told that you bought it.
YOU SOLICITED IT, THEY MADE A SMALL SHIPPING ERROR.
THERE IS NO FRAUD, Unless you count the fraud you are perpetrating against the shipper by demanding money back on something in your possession (Before it hit the garbage or you gave it to someone else anyway)
I would drop it or you may be on the receiving end of litigation yourself.
Lawyer's aren't cheap, your excuses are.

 

[neiltc13]

You know as well as I do that you can't read my mind nor do you know what I have been doing every minute of every day. I already said I haven't spent hours on this, and you think you know better? But it doesn't really matter. The time I have spent on it was worth it to me. That's all that matters. Sorry, everyone, that actually fighting back against fraud is so offensive to so many people. If anyone wants to question what the "right thing" is, the "right thing" is to make it right, and that's all I've been asking this whole time, but apparently these people would rather dig their heels in rather than admit their mistakes.

The only thing I'm starting to question now is whether I should just file the followup of my bank dispute early, rather than waiting shortly before the 60 days is up, but I'll probably give it one more day. And you can bet on it that the next outfit that tries to scam me in any way will not get the benefit of the doubt and will go right to my bank, no grace period given.

You're being ridiculous. The package was probably sent automatically and mere computer error caused it to be sent out after you cancelled. You put the item in the bin and that alone shows that you were at least as careless as they were.

You are even. Fair?

 

[Cyroceon]

You know as well as I do that you can't read my mind nor do you know what I have been doing every minute of every day. I already said I haven't spent hours on this, and you think you know better? But it doesn't really matter. The time I have spent on it was worth it to me. That's all that matters. Sorry, everyone, that actually fighting back against fraud is so offensive to so many people. If anyone wants to question what the "right thing" is, the "right thing" is to make it right, and that's all I've been asking this whole time, but apparently these people would rather dig their heels in rather than admit their mistakes.

The only thing I'm starting to question now is whether I should just file the followup of my bank dispute early, rather than waiting shortly before the 60 days is up, but I'll probably give it one more day. And you can bet on it that the next outfit that tries to scam me in any way will not get the benefit of the doubt and will go right to my bank, no grace period given.

Solicited or unsolicited, common sensical behavior would be for you to open up a package that is in your name. Once you do that, you can go ahead and discard it or keep it if you desire. Again, there is no law I'm quoting or anything, I'm just saying common sense says you should be opening things unless they can be identified as garbage from the outside. I hope everything worked out for you, but if I was the CEO of fastmac.com I wouldn't give you a dime. I would take it to court and spend more than enough fighting it. You are wrong in that you threw away mail. Any judge will see that.

 

[stainlessliquid]

The lesson here is to stop throwing away everything you get in the mail without checking who its from. You can learn from this lesson and avoid this situation in the future, but it sounds like you would rather not learn from it and continue doing the same thing. Its not like this thing came in a mass mailed envelope, it came in some kind of package like a box or padded envelope from USPS.

 

[GoCubsGo]

I'm female, thanks for all the assumptions.


It is also my business and mine alone whether or not I feel a given amount of money is worth fighting for. And don't forget, mail fraud is a federal crime. I don't feel like becoming a victim.

And as I also already said, my bank has been notified. I only pulled out the big guns of formal complaints and bank notification after I granted an entire month to make it right. I was being lenient. I'm through being lenient now.

Call me a liar if you want. But you're wrong.

I'm through defending and explaining myself to people who think it's OK to stick it to someone else when you make a mistake.

Ok, I read into about 3 pages and then I got sleepy. I'm old. Sorry. Oh and I'm a female (here's to being proactive ) BUT, Buran, first and foremost if you are going to criticize people for making quick assumptions about your gender try not to follow that up with an assumption that the people here think it is OK to stick it to the person who made a mistake. I get that in some cases you can safely assume that is the general theme but in my opinion it is not the case.

Now onto my two cents. The problem with people reading a specific section of the law and attempting to interpret it is that they're often not understanding the true intent of the law. To cite mail fraud is indeed a bit harsh. The law reads rather clear but I do not believe the intent is as you read it. You were wronged and whether it is $10 or $10,000 I would most certainly fight for what you believe in. Not everyone will always agree with you but when you post your story, your actions, and your opinions in a public forum you will undoubtedly receive some feedback that is unexpected, unwarranted, unwanted, and more importantly just plain rude. Keep fighting but do not criticize people for not jumping on your wagon and riding with you.

I am 100% in agreement with you when you say that you should hold people accountable. I am not certain that you used those exact words but my understanding of the intent of your actions is to "stick it to them" which I consider to be a way of holding them accountable. While some are referring to the dollar amount I look at the bigger picture. If I take on the attitude that it is "only" $23.75 then that suggests that I do not personally value my money. To recoup $23.75 I do not have to work a whole lot but I do have to work. To me $23.75 represents more than just the dollar amount.

However much I may agree with you be aware that your understanding of the law may not be spot on with the intent of the law. We can wax poetics for days and I would undoubtedly enjoy the conversation, but just be aware of other people's feelings on the matter as well as other people's value of the dollar amount. I assure you from what I have seen here if the dollar amount had been higher the responses would have been skewed slightly more in your favor. You may have had to endure the few off-putting comments about how you're neurotic and generally cranky, but overall you'd see a slight shift. If you do a search you may get my drift.

I do hope it all works out for you. I'm not sure fastmac.com intended to defraud you or the mail system for that matter, but it appears through a series of poor internal communication they made a mistake and stumbled upon someone who values $23.75. I can say a similar thing happened to me with ToysRUs.com and while I didn't take the same measures you took I did take enough measures that ensured I received full reimbursement for shipping, the price of the product, and an apology.

One final thought on this though. The people at the USPIS are busy and due to the dollar amount your case may not get the attention you think it deserves. Just know they have an undocumented minimum and this just doesn't cut it. Still I say, fight your fight because clearly you value your money as many people should and if it is $23.75 today then what will it be tomorrow? Right?

 

[w8ing4intelmacs]

Do a charge back on your credit card and let the credit card company fight the battle. Simple as pie.

I don't agree with FastMac in this case (although I've done business with them and they seem fine), but "i threw the package away" sounds kind of like "the dog ate my homework".

 

[Hemingray]

Calculate the hours you've spent fighting this thing, and then count how much money you're out: $23. How much is your time worth?

Yeah, I know, it's the principle of the thing. At least you complained to the BBB. I'd leave it at that and accept your losses and make sure you or your friends never buy from them again. That's probably the best you'll get. My humble advice is to put it behind you.