Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
jared's mom is foolish

gwangung said:
No, it isn't.

http://isc.sans.org/survivalhistory.php

Wanna argue it? Talk to them.
Good page.

Note that it discusses the significance of the network that you're on - if Jared's mom is on a network where every other PC is well protected, she won't be hit.

It's kind of like "if everyone you've ever slept with has always used condoms, you don't need to use one to avoid AIDS".

If anyone in the neighborhood has ever lapsed, though, you'd better slap some antivirus on and turn on the firewall.

When I install a new windows system I burn a CD of SP2 before I start. I disconnect the network cable, install XP, install SP2, then connect the network and run Windows Update. (Actually, now that I have the XP kit with SP2 merged I just install.)
 
Dr. Dastardly said:
This raises a question I have been running around in my head for a while. A pointless question but one I want answeared none the less. Will the new boards be green or remain blue. I know no one knows but do all boards HAVE to be green. I had no idea how sick I am of green boards until I saw the inside of a Powermac for the first time with lucious blue boards *drool*.


Red PCBs are definitely the coolest.
 
Raven VII said:
Actually, the thinking goes like this, if you boot into Windows, and Windows has read/write access to the OS X partition/drive, and access to the hardware, then the virus does as well. So if it's the kind of virus that goes havoc on your HD... OS X won't be exempt, since it's Windows that's running the virus, not OS X. If the virus decides to goes for the neck and kill the hardware, then OS X will be defenseless since it's Windows that's running the virus.

This cannot happen in Virtual PC because Windows has no access to the hardware, and because it's being run in a sort of a quarantine, in it's own "world" on the HD. It cannot access the OS X drive as a whole.

That's why dual-booting is much less attractive than running Windows in an compatibility layer like WINE.
 
XForge said:
We buy Macs because we don't want to have to do these things.

My Winbox at home runs great until I install all the things on it that are needed to keep it from being eaten alive by viruses and spyware.

Ah, the wonders of the superiority complex. Aren't you wonderful? And then Mac users wonder why Windows fans regard them with such contempt.

As for your box running slow, perhaps you need to invest in better virus and spyware software. Or just buy a faster computer. Running Symantec Antivirus and Adware on a 1.8Ghz Intel box (hardly fast, nowadays), I notice no slowdown whatsoever.
 
did you misspeak, or are you clueless?

savar said:
That's why dual-booting is much less attractive than running Windows in an compatibility layer like WINE.
You don't run Windows in WINE - your statement reads like you don't understand what WINE actually is.
 
AidenShaw said:
It might be just a big PR stunt by the Prime Ego that's engineered to pressure IBM into speeding up the schedule for delivering POWER5-based PPC 9xx chips.

Can't you see it? WWDC 2006, when you expect the Lord God Jobs to announce the Intel-based PowerMacs - you hear:

"Just kidding, here are the wonderful PowerMac G6 systems on the new PPC980 IBM chip"

Apple's roadmap is so up-in-the air at this point that it could happen....

Ah, now Aidenshaw, I don't think you believe that. No amount of Steve's hubris could justify sending the Mac Development community on what would largely amount to a wild goose chase if he pulls the plug on the intel switch.

And if we are all presented with some sort of choice of PPC or Intel boxes two years from now, by then, once the pragmatic advantages of using the Intel platform, like the potential to also run windows apps/games in near realtime speed, have filtered down though the forums and got past the PPC kool-aid, most of the Mac community, other than those running the most specialised scientific or video wares, would probably be prefering Intel.

Can't believe I typed that.

:eek:
 
Tealeaf said:
Ah, the wonders of the superiority complex. Aren't you wonderful? And then Mac users wonder why Windows fans regard them with such contempt.

As for your box running slow, perhaps you need to invest in better virus and spyware software. Or just buy a faster computer. Running Symantec Antivirus and Adware on a 1.8Ghz Intel box (hardly fast, nowadays), I notice no slowdown whatsoever.

Don't know. All I know is that I feel good that my 400Mhz G4 runs a LOT faster than my Grandmothers brand new ~2Ghz Dell with virus protection. And when I do put virus protection so this computer in still isn't that slow...
 
gwangung said:
No, it isn't.

http://isc.sans.org/survivalhistory.php

Wanna argue it? Talk to them.
Ya I don't see any chi-squared argument. ;) Seriously, I don't see how that really applies that much, if you're on a dirty network then you've got your work cut out for you, but if nothing else all this proves is that you patch your system (just like we do already) it doesn't seem to warrant any problems.
 
"The question is, will microsoft make it somehow inpossible to install windows on these machines in the future?"

They have no reason to... that would be their dream (for Apple to make computers people are running Windows on).

Apple needs to get with the clone game and all MacOS X to install on all computers and at least sell a retail box version, if not sell it to Dell (the only PC company who's publicly said they want to license OS X)
 
jared_kipe said:
BS, I have a PC for games, and my mom is using it now. NO viruses and she uses it for internet and email and I don't have anything installed except windows. Thats a stupid old wives tale like "if you masturbate too much you'll go sterile."

I neglected to say it has been connected to non firewalled comcast cable internet since day one.

I don't know, no amount of using your PC in a sensible and careful manner will protect you against worms. The only thing that helps against them is a fully patched system, a firewall and to some degree a virus/worm scanner. Although that seems easy enough to do, the worm-writers will always stay ahead a littte bit of the 'anti-worm-writers', by definition, and occasionally they are ahead of the patch-writers at Microsoft.

Another problem is that when you re-install Windows it can take quite a while until you have downloaded all patches (incl. virus definitions); a friend of mine got infected during that period (lesson: download the patches on a patched computer and burn them on CD).

These are the real, undenyable risks of Windows. They might be quite small but they are there. On top of that come all these scary reports of people connecting fully patched, firewalled, and virus-scanned PCs to the internet, leaving them alone, and discovering days or weeks later that they had been infected by a lot of stuff. Not that I would understand at all how this is possible, i.e. how can one find the virus/worms/spyware if the virus-scanner did not find in the first place (or did the virus-scanner find them, but was unable to kill them?).
 
mvc said:
Ah, now Aidenshaw, I don't think you believe that. No amount of Steve's hubris could justify sending the Mac Development community on what would largely amount to a wild goose chase if he pulls the plug on the intel switch.
I was kidding about the "just kidding" quip, but do have a serious point that new PPC systems will be coming out even during the transition to x64/x86.

Will the plug be pulled on PPC just to meet an arbitrary deadline, if in fact new versions of the PPC chips are equal or better than x64 at some tasks?

If fat binaries are successful, then selling both types of chips for many years is possible.
 
AidenShaw said:
I was kidding about the "just kidding" quip, but do have a serious point that new PPC systems will be coming out even during the transition to x64/x86.

Will the plug be pulled on PPC just to meet an arbitrary deadline, if in fact new versions of the PPC chips are equal or better than x64 at some tasks?

If fat binaries are successful, then selling both types of chips for many years is possible.
This would be nice - I would like to get at least "one more" PPC-based machine before they pull the plug; merely as an end-user, I prefer my G5 to my Dell, noisy power supply fans and all - for three weeks I have been trying to use the WinTel box for video and vinyl audio restoration; between the lousy software (either it's amature kid stuff or difficult to use and expensive pro-apps, no easy-to-use "semi-pro" stuff at all) and the built-in limitations of the file system (really can't do video - even an empty physical drive fragments before a project's done causing dropped frames all over the place), I really couldn't get a thing done. While it's a quiet little machine, this Dell is just a toy, nothing more.

It will be interesting if Apple can eliminate these limitations within the x86 architecture...
 
mklos said:
Well I seriously doubt that is what the final new Mactel PowerMac will look like. It will probably be totally redesigned. In fact, I know it will be totally redesigned. They might still use an aluminum enclosure, but it won't be nearly that tall.

or may be it will be that tall but you'll be able to put more than 2 HD as the current PM (which is quite pathetic in that sense really)
 
Gabhlan said:
Assuming Apple are going with BIOS instead of OperFirmware (as stated in the universal binary guide pdf Apple distributed), then how many partitions per disk can you have? As I understand things, in a standard BIOS a disk can only have a maximum of four partitions. Can anyone with experience of BIOS confirm or deny?

If true, that'd really suck... A standard OS X install on a blank disk yields three partitions already, (the partition table, OS9 drivers and the OS), meaning you could only have two other partitions on a disk (the OS9 driver partition won't be there I assume). I for one was hoping to be able to boot OS X, Windows XP, Linux and Zeta from different partitions on the same disk on a new Macintel PowerBook......


No one has appeared to answer this so I will....


The standard PC partitioning scheme is NOT defined by the BIOS. The BIOS itself has no clue what is on the hardrive and could care less how this data is laid out. Was does define the partitioning scheme is the standard that everyone has adhered to over the years. The only thing the BIOS does concerning data on the hardrisk is to start executing the first sector of the disk. Also known as the MBR, or Master Boot Record. It contains the partition table which defines the partitions on the disk. The MBR is where "boot loaders" for running multiple operating systems is placed. This is the nice little menu you get when you have multiple OSes installed. When you select a OS to boot, yet another jump happens. The partitions themselves contain what is know as a PBR or Partition Boot Loader. When you select a OS the code in the MBR jumps to the appropriate partition and starts executing its PBR. The PBR contains the OS specific code that actually starts booting the operating system. (in the case of a single OS like Windows XP, the MBR boot code simply jumps to the PBR of the Windows partition which then starts loading the actual OS)

OK, now that I have explained that...

The partitioning scheme itself was pretty much defined by Microsoft with the introduction of MS-DOS. It supported 4 partitions originally. When the IBM PC clones arrived and the market took off we got stuck with this layout. Changing it would have required major changes to DOS and most software. The partition limit eventually became a problem and Microsoft figured out a scheme to add addtional partitions while maintaining compatibility with older software. This scheme consisted of nesting addtional partitions inside one of the 4 main partitions.

The 4 main partitions from that point on where called "Primary" partitions. If you want more than 4 partitions you would change one of the Primary partitions into a "Extended" partition, and then inside of that you would create a "Logical" partition that would actually contain your data. When old software looked at the partition table they would ignore the "extended" partitions, Only newer software would recognize them.

The extended partition is nothing but a container to hold all of your logical partitions. You can only have ONE extended partition on a hardisk and that extended partition can contain up to 24 logical partitions.

This gives you a maximum of 27 partitions possible using the scheme. The 3 "primary" partitions and then the 24 logical partitions.

Microsoft, with the advent of Windows 2000, developed a new partitioning scheme know as Dynamic Volumes. It is completely different from the current scheme and only Windows 2000 and up can read them. (and I think Linux has some beta support for them as well) Its not used in the mainstream however and probably never will be.

But or course it remains to be seen if Apple will stick with the PC partitioning scheme. If they want to allow people to install other OSes on their hardware then they definately will have to. But otherwise they can design any scheme they want and still continue to use the ol' PC BIOS.
 
Think UNIX folks...

...you should be able to partition a disk any which way you want. Remember, to partition a disk is one thing. To format it is another. Create two or three "Unallocated" partitions. Once you've partitioned, format for- and install with- your choice of OS. But you'll need some sort of bootloader app or mechanism, though. Someone will cough one up sooner or later, if not Apple (don't hold your breath on the latter).

Any devs out there try to boot their InteliMac to any flavor of Linux or Solaris 10 yet?
 
How much are these new intel macs gonna cost?
you know what I'm getting at ;)

------------------------------------------------------
The Final Countdown - RIP Richard Whiteley
 
Mass Hysteria said:
How much are these new intel macs gonna cost?
you know what I'm getting at ;)

------------------------------------------------------
The Final Countdown - RIP Richard Whiteley

I would expect the Apple will make improvements other that just an Intel inside. So I would imagine that the price will stay about the same. We can always hope that there might be a decrease though.
 
OS X + INTEL IS COOL

Voilà je travail sur les deux platformes depuis 7 ans et vraiment même sur du G5 c'est pas ça, franchement ! Il y a encore des gros "goulot détrenglement"!!! Pour moi l'OS X est une vrai bombe, simple, puissant, sans virus ou presque, de vraies applications internes au système qui tournent vite, ne plantent jamais, c'est le meilleur système d'exploitation au monde , et de loin (surtout Tiger, impressionnant). Je pense vraiment que cela va apporter beaucoup de pouvoir foutre un OSX sur PC (a base de bonne carte graphique, bien évidament). Quand j'ai vu sur la toile le projet cherry OS, j'étais au ange quand je me suis aperçu qu' enfin l'utilisateur de "base" aller pouvoir mettre un OS X sur son PC. Voilà Cherry OS était, par contre, assez lent sur p4 2.8 cela vous offrai un g3 700 c'était déja cool. Mais la si on arrive a une puissance sur un pc osx, la donne va changer radicalement c'est la fin de windows (ma mère va être fan sérieux !!!), et c'est donc aussi la fin de beaucoup d'emmerdes.


www.zigmoon.net
 
zigmoon said:
Voilà je travail sur les deux platformes depuis 7 ans et vraiment même sur du G5 c'est pas ça, franchement ! Il y a encore des gros "goulot détrenglement"!!! Pour moi l'OS X est une vrai bombe, simple, puissant, sans virus ou presque, de vraies applications internes au système qui tournent vite, ne plantent jamais, c'est le meilleur système d'exploitation au monde , et de loin (surtout Tiger, impressionnant). Je pense vraiment que cela va apporter beaucoup de pouvoir foutre un OSX sur PC (a base de bonne carte graphique, bien évidament). Quand j'ai vu sur la toile le projet cherry OS, j'étais au ange quand je me suis aperçu qu' enfin l'utilisateur de "base" aller pouvoir mettre un OS X sur son PC. Voilà Cherry OS était, par contre, assez lent sur p4 2.8 cela vous offrai un g3 700 c'était déja cool. Mais la si on arrive a une puissance sur un pc osx, la donne va changer radicalement c'est la fin de windows (ma mère va être fan sérieux !!!), et c'est donc aussi la fin de beaucoup d'emmerdes.

www.zigmoon.net

Lucky for me I can read French! Regardless, I can honestly say that in all my time on MR, I have never seen someone post entirely in another language - this is kinda, um, cool.... ;) :)
 
~Shard~ said:
Lucky for me I can read French! Regardless, I can honestly say that in all my time on MR, I have never seen someone post entirely in another language - this is kinda, um, cool.... ;) :)
Uhm, well my french ain't what it used to be
:rolleyes: I think we can better stick to english, otherwise before you know it there will be posts in 70+ languages all over the place here :eek:
Probably including mine (dutch): lijkt me niet al te best :p
 
Mac-Xpert said:
Uhm, well my french ain't what it used to be
:rolleyes: I think we can better stick to english, otherwise before you know it there will be posts in 70+ languages all over the place here :eek:
Probably including mine (dutch): lijkt me niet al te best :p

Heh heh - your Dutch seems fine to me. ;) Yes, I think the majority of MR members could probably communicate in different languages on the Forums if we really wanted to, but that might get a bit confusing and frustrating for the other members. English it is. Bien? :cool:
 
We've had other threads/posts in different languages - but I think in general, keep it in english - and profanity in any language is not a good idea, even if most people don't get it.

D
 
~Shard~ said:
Lucky for me I can read French! Regardless, I can honestly say that in all my time on MR, I have never seen someone post entirely in another language - this is kinda, um, cool.... ;) :)

I not it as my first experience also. The link is of no help either. Slow to respond, but I liked the graphics.
 
AidenShaw said:
I was kidding about the "just kidding" quip, but do have a serious point that new PPC systems will be coming out even during the transition to x64/x86.

Will the plug be pulled on PPC just to meet an arbitrary deadline, if in fact new versions of the PPC chips are equal or better than x64 at some tasks?

If fat binaries are successful, then selling both types of chips for many years is possible.

I agree that it is, however I don't believe it is advantageous. I think it is somewhat of a pipe dream to feel that "new versions of PPC chips will equal or better x86".

Lets put it this way: PPC is behind the curve as it is, and Apple has signifigant problems, which brings this move about in the first place. What all the sudden would precipitate any sort of a turn around on IBM or Motorola's part to suddenly improve performance and yeilds?

And I don't want to hear one word about three certain "Video Game" manufacturers. These are much closer to low performance embedded chips than a real one, and secondly, IBM is not producing them. They are all being made by outside fabs at this point.
 
Psst... Steve... The future is "plastic" OSX DVD's. Better jump on it!

Like the movie, "The Graduate" tells us, the future is one word - "plastic".

Plastic, as in 25 cent OSX DVD's that ring up $129 at the register. It doesn't matter what the Intel parts inside look like. It's what is on the plastic disc that counts. ;)
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.