First Hand with Mac OS X on Toshiba Intel (x86)

[stelriah]

this is just wrong

Apple presently receives most of its supply of flash chips from Samsung and Toshiba

 

[Music_Producer]

For all those that think OS X on a PC is the bets thing since sliced bread, here's my thinking...

We are all hear because we like Apple, no? And there is more to an Apple computer than just the OS, no?

Part of what makes Apple computers so much "fun" is the appearance. There is no other company out there than can match the look and feel of the iMac, this is what makes Apple so special.

This is part of the reason why I went to Apple, I liked the fact that they had complete control, which may sound like a bad thing, but think about it, why don't Apple's have a lot of the problems windows do? It's because Apple has a better hold on their product than Microsoft.

Why would Apple want to give this up?

Exactly. This also goes out to all the morons who keep on with the "I'm a consumer.. i s hould have a choice" and make stupid comparisons with buying tires at a tire shop for your car.

Uh, anyone can change a car tire.. anyone can fill it up with air. Does the average user know how to change a friggin motherboard? Will he/she know how to resolve conflicts if OS X is installed on a Dell and it doesn't work??

So chill with the freedom of choice bit.. I for one, love the fact that Apple hardware runs apple software.. no third party crap. I hate it when my Palm treo hangs because of third party software. Give me a computer company that makes the hardware, software and the accessories.. oh wait, thats Apple

 

[contoursvt]

Hey nobody is saying you shouldnt be happy that apple hardware runs apple software and things like that, people here are saying that *IF* some people are able to get OSX to run on their PCs and if it can be done fairly reliably with certain hardware, then its good for them or anyone who really wants to run OSX but cannot afford the top of the line apple hardware and doesnt want to buy super restrictive and slow computers such as the Mac Mini. Apple would never support those users but if those users are techie enough, then they can make it work anyway. Nobody said you have to swap out motherboard and things. If you are not good at that stuff, then you will pay full price for the hardware, thats all.

Also you all say '3rd party hardware' like its a bad thing. Heck when ATI first put a video card in your computers, it was non apple made and everyone gasped that some non apple made item was in there. Apple doesnt actually make anything anyway. They pick and choose what goes in. They will have boards made for them in the same way that HP and Dell may have some boards custom made for some of their servers/workstations.

 

[matix]

part of this whole initiative to get OS X working on custom boxes is powered by the fact that apple has such a strict product tiering, such that there is no Consumer Desktop in a traditional sense. that sense being a $399 dell celeron ATX case cd-rom integrated graphics type of system. Sure, we can buy a mac mini, but like the previous poster suggested we can't DO anything to one, at least economically. they are slow by design: laptop and low-power components.

and an iMac, as beautiful as it is, is NOT a computer 'for the rest of us'. No student i know can justify buying any apple than maybe their portables. they ARE too expensive for what they are. This is where 'form over function' is apple shooting themselves in the foot.

until copyright infringement laws and "piracy" laws are more effective i doubt there is much apple can do about a parellel, community supported, copy-protection stripped version os OS x in the wild.

 

[BenRoethig]

"ive installed tiger on an inspiron 6000

no wifi, no scrolling, no power managemnt, no external mouse, overall pretty bad and useless.

as for osx itself, totally not worth the hassle of getting it installed. functionally provides nothing over xp, and wont be compatible with many of your apps."

This was a post at a message board I frequent from a PC user. This is exactly why Apple needs to provide a stable supported version for non-Apple computers. An unstable pirated version is exactly what the PC industry will see. They will tell everyone they know about their experiences with the hacked version and expect it to work just as badly on Apple's own computers. Casual Mac buyers will hear this and not buy the Mactels as a result. Apple cannot enjoy the same proprietary advantages on x86. They either need to go all the way or stay with an ISA where this is not a problem.

 

[ioinc]

Exactly. This also goes out to all the morons who keep on with the "I'm a consumer.. i s hould have a choice" and make stupid comparisons with buying tires at a tire shop for your car.

Uh, anyone can change a car tire.. anyone can fill it up with air. Does the average user know how to change a friggin motherboard? Will he/she know how to resolve conflicts if OS X is installed on a Dell and it doesn't work??

So chill with the freedom of choice bit.. I for one, love the fact that Apple hardware runs apple software.. no third party crap. I hate it when my Palm treo hangs because of third party software. Give me a computer company that makes the hardware, software and the accessories.. oh wait, thats Apple

Amazing how much you are missing the point.

You are also not making a lot of sense.

I for one, love the fact that Apple hardware runs apple software.. no third party crap.

Apple hardware does run 3rd party software (and some of it is crap )

I hate it when my Palm treo hangs because of third party software.

Then don't buy software that does not work with your treo. Simple solutions for simple problems.

Bottom line is that if you like apple software and hardware then continue to buy it... that simple.

Nobody wants to stop you from buying apple products. In fact you can buy everything you want from apple.

Why are you so anxious to place limitations on what other people want to buy? Why does your world end if someone else wants the option to buy OS X on a PC? Why do you care if people other than you want to have some different options without limiting yours.

Uh, anyone can change a car tire.. anyone can fill it up with air. Does the average user know how to change a friggin motherboard? Will he/she know how to resolve conflicts if OS X is installed on a Dell and it doesn't work??

Not withstanding that the average person can not put a new tire onto a wheel (which is what happens when you buy new tires), what difference does technical ability have when it comes to choice? Are you suggesting that people that don't know how to change motherboards should not be able to buy the computer they want? If I am not clever enough (or don't have the equipment) to put a tire on a wheel, should my tire choice then be limited?

In the end this would probably also be great for Apple. The real beauty of apple is the elegance of there software. If they could make the leap from generating their profits from a hardware/software combination to software only they could crush the competition on whatever field they want. Nobody makes software like Apple!

 

[mdavey]

In the end this would probably also be great for Apple. The real beauty of apple is the elegance of there software. If they could make the leap from generating their profits from a hardware/software combination to software only they could crush the competition on whatever field they want. Nobody makes software like Apple!

I wholeheartedly agree with your arguments and point of view regarding the OS but would like to take it a step further. Many here think that Apple's hardware is above average, the best value-for-money in the industry or simply the best in the industry. I believe that Apple's haredware is very good, too. But I also recognise that unbundling the software from the hardware would be a good thing for Apple, and here is why:

When the hardware and the software is provided together, there is a temptation to let one or the other sell both. You can get away with not-quite-perfect hardware if the OS is amazing; conversely the OS could be lacking in some places, but that's okay because the hardware is fantastic.

While the current Apple hardware is pleasing to the eye, it isn't as amazing as it could be - sure, most of the mainstream manufacturers don't come close to Apple, but anyone that follows the PC modding scene knows that there are niche players (businesses such as SilentPC, Hush and Silicon Acoustics) with technically superior aspects to their products; homebrew PCs that look simply amazing remind us that there is still scope for improvement.

By unbundling the OS, Apple would have to try harder with the hardware - perhaps we would see totally silent Mac minis (radiator instead of fan, compact flash instead of harddrive), more inventions like the recent patent for , and a sub-$500 laptop as a sister product to the Mac mini.

Sun Microsystems makes a big deal out of the fact that for best reliability and performance, you want to be running Sun's software on Sun's hardware - and sysadmins take that on board. Apple could do the same. If Apple hardware really is as good as people say (and I think it is), let them buy it without an OS or with Windows - maybe they'll like it so much they'll try OS X later. Let the halo effect work between OS X and Apple hardware just as it currently does between the iPod and Mac ranges.

 

[DeathChill]

For the non-believers, the (2nd) newest Mac OS X x86 release (10.4.3 8F1099) has been patched to work on normal computers. Apple seriously stepped up their security with it but apparently it was still patched in about a weeks time.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Yeah! No company could just survive on software profits alone!

Do you know why sales of Microsoft's OS's are starting to tank? Because they have an OS that for many is stable enough and good enough. (Windows 2000 or XP.)

There is one undeniable fact that people who think Apple can subsist on their software wares alone are missing - The rest of the market isn't as ravenous to upgrade to Apple's latest and greatest OS's like Mac fans are.
If you released OS X 10.4 Tiger for X86 to any old computer the average consumer will install the OS and be done with it until the computer craps out or until they decide to upgrade there hardware. Something that Mac fans still don't get: most people couldn't give a rat's *** about Expose or spotlight or other "minor" updates to the OS. Esp at a price point of $120-ish. Simply: if it runs, doesn't crash, and is fairly secure it's good enough.
If Apple makes an OS that is good enough for most users they will initially make a massive killing in sales. This could last for years. But at some point Apple will saturate the market with OS X and at that time they have to convince Joe average to shell out $120-ish. And let's be honest here. Dashboard, Expose, spotlight won't do that for most.

Right now Apple is in a situation where they are bringing in sales from both software AND hardware. I'm 110% sure that Microsoft wishes to God that they could be sitting where Apple is right now in terms of how they generate cash.

 

[TBi]

Do you know why sales of Microsoft's OS's are starting to tank? Because they have an OS that for many is stable enough and good enough. (Windows 2000 or XP.)

I agree that most people won't upgrade from a good stable operating system. Change means effort and most people are lazy. Personally i'm bored of reinstalling Windows or any OS and only do so when i need to. I won't use Linux because XP works for me and learning Linux is too steep a learning curve. I don't have enough free time or will to learn it.

OSX was easy to learn though and that's why i use it so much.

Right now Apple is in a situation where they are bringing in sales from both software AND hardware. I'm 110% sure that Microsoft wishes to God that they could be sitting where Apple is right now in terms of how they generate cash.

I don't think MS want to be where Apple is, they could be by making their own MS branded computers but making software is cheaper than making hardware. With software you only have to pay for the designers and programming design software, with hardware you have to pay for the designers, the hardware design software and the hardware. They are sitting pretty with their global monopoly which will go on for years to come. It will not be easy to topple MS, there is too much collective investment in microsoft products. Not many companies are going to be willing to pay the massive initial investment to move over to mac's even if it makes better financial sense in the long run.

All we can hope is that companies who can easily switch do so as much as possible when they are buying new computers.