First HomePod Pre-Order Customers Get Charged as Speakers Prepare for Shipment

[CarlJ]

So you're buying an almost $400 speaker to act as your alarm clock? LoL perfect customer for apple!

When you finish laughing... do you really think he's going to use it only as an alarm clock? That's not what he said. Why would you jump to that conclusion?
[doublepost=1517810361][/doublepost]

Also, I've got plenty of speakers. 5.1 surround in the living room and bedroom, stereo on the porch, and I've got a spare 5.1 system that I've not even installed anywhere yet, it'll probably eventually end up in the guest bedroom. All the TVs are hooked up to Macs, the living room TV has a Mac Pro, one of the good ones, a cheesegrater. The porch audio system has its own AirPort Express.

What exactly is the point of giving an entire paragraph detailing the many bits of tech that you have that make it quite clear that you aren't in the target market for a HomePod? That much was obvious from the first half sentence. The HomePod is aimed at people ensconced in the Apple ecosystem who are dissatisfied with the current state of their ability to play music at home. If you're happy with what you've got, great - but what does listing what's in every room bring to the conversation?

 

[lordofthereef]

That's great if you have supported products. But so very few are supported. Rather than replacing bulbs, which is significantly more expensive, I went with smart switches that control many lights. Those, my cameras, thermostat and smart smoke/c02 alarm are not supported by homekit. Nor are the smart locks, doorbells and garage opener i'm looking at.

Maybe not the place to ask, but can you link me to these switches? Or give me a name so I can look them up? We are looking at controlling a few lights and I too am not too keen on buying entirely new bulbs for everywhere I need them. I imagine its essentially a means of controlling lights that already exist. Are there dimming capabilities?

 

[vipergts2207]

Maybe not the place to ask, but can you link me to these switches? Or give me a name so I can look them up? We are looking at controlling a few lights and I too am not too keen on buying entirely new bulbs for everywhere I need them. I imagine its essentially a means of controlling lights that already exist. Are there dimming capabilities?

Lutron Caseta is really good.

 

[Dave245]

So you're buying an almost $400 speaker to act as your alarm clock? LoL perfect customer for apple!

And for listening to music, i brought the AirPods when they came out and they are great, i expect the HomePod will sound great.

 

[ersan191]

Maybe not the place to ask, but can you link me to these switches? Or give me a name so I can look them up? We are looking at controlling a few lights and I too am not too keen on buying entirely new bulbs for everywhere I need them. I imagine its essentially a means of controlling lights that already exist. Are there dimming capabilities?

I second Lutron Caseta - there are others but Caseta also works with other platforms like Alexa and it has a huge catalog of different dimmers and switches.

 

[gnomeisland]

EDIT: Off topic. Deleted.

 

[The Martian]

Mine also. Got tracking. If it gets to UPS tomorrow, I wonder if we get it earlier than Friday.

No. UPS will hold it until the date of delivery.

 

[legacyb4]

Maybe not the place to ask, but can you link me to these switches? Or give me a name so I can look them up? We are looking at controlling a few lights and I too am not too keen on buying entirely new bulbs for everywhere I need them. I imagine its essentially a means of controlling lights that already exist. Are there dimming capabilities?

If you are willing to dabble in a little code, Homebridge helps enable lots of non-Homekit gear to be usable with Homekit...

 

[ersan191]

No luck needed. Good luck continuing to believe misinformation about how it works.

Me, I’ll enjoy true stereo sound from a single HomePod. Which is what it is designed to produce.

Hey look, the review embargoes are lifted and now we know that you can't get "true stereo" (whatever that is) from even two HomePods, let alone one.

 

[deanthedev]

Hey look, the review embargoes are lifted and now we know that you can't get "true stereo" (whatever that is) from even two HomePods, let alone one.

No.

 

[ersan191]

No.

Fantastic, keep living the dream, Dean.

 

[deanthedev]

Fantastic, keep living the dream, Dean.

Not a dream, reality.

As I mentioned previously, if you want to have an in-depth discussion on audio and the theory/math behind it, then I'm game. Just let me know.

 

[ersan191]

If you are willing to dabble in a little code, Homebridge helps enable lots of non-Homekit gear to be usable with Homekit...

You can but if you're building a new HA system you should absolutely use switches that are already compatible with HomeKit natively - as much as I love and promote homebridge, there's no reason to add another software layer that could potentially have problems.
[doublepost=1517940239][/doublepost]

Not a dream, reality.

As I mentioned previously, if you want to have an in-depth discussion on audio and the theory/math behind it, then I'm game. Just let me know.

Not with you I don't, you've already lost all credibility on the matter.

 

[deanthedev]

Not with you I don't, you've already lost all credibility on the matter.

So you're not interested at all in learning anything? Or perhaps you don't know enough about the topic to be able to discuss it?

 

[KrispE00]

No. UPS will hold it until the date of delivery.

Unless UPS makes a mistake and delivers it early. I got my iPhone 4 one day early.

 

[The Martian]

It's possible but that was a long time ago. UPS is used to this by now.

If you get it early we will all be jealous.

 

[vipergts2207]

Not a dream, reality.

As I mentioned previously, if you want to have an in-depth discussion on audio and the theory/math behind it, then I'm game. Just let me know.

Your bluster about your knowledge of audio theory is completely irrelevant here.

“This should be solved once Apple ships FullRoom — its support for two HomePods to be used in tandem but not in stereo.”
-TechCrunch

“Emphasis should be placed on stereo-like sound, as HomePod reviews published today confirm that users won't be able to set one speaker as the right channel and another as the left channel. Instead, as Apple notes, HomePods will use advanced beamforming capabilities to create a more immersive soundstage.”
-Macrumors

So tell us, how does your knowledge of audio theory change those statements?

 

[deanthedev]

Your bluster about your knowledge of audio theory is completely irrelevant here.

“This should be solved once Apple ships FullRoom — its support for two HomePods to be used in tandem but not in stereo.”
-TechCrunch

“Emphasis should be placed on stereo-like sound, as HomePod reviews published today confirm that users won't be able to set one speaker as the right channel and another as the left channel. Instead, as Apple notes, HomePods will use advanced beamforming capabilities to create a more immersive soundstage.”
-Macrumors

So tell us, how does your knowledge of audio theory change those statements?

Easy. Because my understanding of audio isn't limited to simple terms such as "stereo".

For years people have always associated audio with left & right. You have two ears. Your headphones have a L & R side. Your "stereo" has two speakers, also a L & R. Your CD player has two channels of output (L & R). However, people have absolutely no idea why this is. They just think "left ear left channel, right ear right channel".

Sound is actually mono by nature. When that sound is bounced off multiple surfaces and arrives at our ears at different levels and different phase our brain puts it all together to create a location. This is why we have two ears - to allow us to localize sounds, not to listen to "stereo sound".

You can't create a soundstage (have localized sounds that let people pick out where instruments or vocalists are, for example) with a mono speaker. It's literally impossible. Which is why we have stereo systems with two speakers (to simulate localization). But there are limits to what can be done with a pair of speakers (which is why we now have 5.1 and 7.1 systems - to allow even more precise localization).

It's true Apple isn't defining two HomePods as a left and right speaker. But people are taking this to mean there isn't going to be stereo sound without comprehending what's actually going on. They're still stuck thinking that you need an actual L & R speaker being fed by L & R channels in order to hear "stereo" sound.

The reviewer you linked to stated:

As far as separation goes, the Sonos One was quite crisp and definitely louder overall, because there are two of them (for roughly the same price as a HomePod).

But no matter how solid, they could still not create the expansive sound stage that the HomePod did. This was just as evident in tracks like Bodak Yellow as it was in La Grange. But it really kicked ass in live performances, where it felt that the vocals were sitting out in the air between you and HomePod, no matter where you were standing, and the applause and high hats were coming from some place above and behind the speaker — being projected outwards and around. It’s one of the most three-dimensional sounds I’ve heard from any music setup and absolutely the deepest stage from a “single speaker”.

Clearly a single HomePod is creating a wide soundstage and the listener is able to localize sounds. Again, this is not possible with a mono speaker.

I think what Apple is doing is the same as their Retina term for displays. They consider their beamforming technology to be superior to traditional speakers in stereo (they even mention this on their website). So they created a new term called "FullRoom" to distinguish it from regular stereo speakers. They want to avoid calling two HomePods "a stereo pair" as they want people to think it's something new and better. It's just Apple being Apple.

I predict when two HomePods are connected together and you play a track with a well-defined audio portion in either the left or right that it will actually come from the left or right HomePod (just like it would if you're listening to headphones or regular stereo speakers). I also think Apple avoids defining a left and right HomePod because they won't be emitting ONLY left & right audio. I'm convinced a left HomePod will also emit some audio from the right channel through specific tweeters in order to affect the overall soundstage.

We'll have to wait and see when people get to try two of them together. People were already wrong about the soundstage of the HomePod.

 

[KrispE00]

Easy. Because my understanding of audio isn't limited to simple terms such as "stereo".

For years people have always associated audio with left & right. You have two ears. Your headphones have a L & R side. Your "stereo" has two speakers, also a L & R. Your CD player has two channels of output (L & R). However, people have absolutely no idea why this is. They just think "left ear left channel, right ear right channel".

Sound is actually mono by nature. When that sound is bounced off multiple surfaces and arrives at our ears at different levels and different phase our brain puts it all together to create a location. This is why we have two ears - to allow us to localize sounds, not to listen to "stereo sound".

You can't create a soundstage (have localized sounds that let people pick out where instruments or vocalists are, for example) with a mono speaker. It's literally impossible. Which is why we have stereo systems with two speakers (to simulate localization). But there are limits to what can be done with a pair of speakers (which is why we now have 5.1 and 7.1 systems - to allow even more precise localization).

It's true Apple isn't defining two HomePods as a left and right speaker. But people are taking this to mean there isn't going to be stereo sound without comprehending what's actually going on. They're still stuck thinking that you need an actual L & R speaker being fed by L & R channels in order to hear "stereo" sound.

The reviewer you linked to stated:



Clearly a single HomePod is creating a wide soundstage and the listener is able to localize sounds. Again, this is not possible with a mono speaker.

I think what Apple is doing is the same as their Retina term for displays. They consider their beamforming technology to be superior to traditional speakers in stereo (they even mention this on their website). So they created a new term called "FullRoom" to distinguish it from regular stereo speakers. They want to avoid calling two HomePods "a stereo pair" as they want people to think it's something new and better. It's just Apple being Apple.

I predict when two HomePods are connected together and you play a track with a well-defined audio portion in either the left or right that it will actually come from the left or right HomePod (just like it would if you're listening to headphones or regular stereo speakers). I also think Apple avoids defining a left and right HomePod because they won't be emitting ONLY left & right audio. I'm convinced a left HomePod will also emit some audio from the right channel through specific tweeters in order to affect the overall soundstage.

We'll have to wait and see when people get to try two of them together. People were already wrong about the soundstage of the HomePod.

Thank you! This guy knows what he’s talking about. We’ve grown accustomed to mono=1 and stereo=2, but the prefix stereo in no way refers to the number 2. A single sound wave originates from a single origin. The brain processes the sound wave and interprets the origin of the sound. This origin can essentially be from an infinite number of directions.
“Stereo” actually refers to the three-dimensional effect that is produced.

 

[ErikGrim]

Hey look, the review embargoes are lifted and now we know that you can't get "true stereo" (whatever that is) from even two HomePods, let alone one.

LOL no. Not a single review said that. However:

(That doesn't mean HomePod is currently limited to "mono" audio. One HomePod can still project a full 3D soundstage throughout a room. It simply means you can't pair HomePods to create a richer, bigger 3D soundstage — not until AirPlay 2 ships.) - iMore​

[doublepost=1517961977][/doublepost]

Your bluster about your knowledge of audio theory is completely irrelevant here.

“This should be solved once Apple ships FullRoom — its support for two HomePods to be used in tandem but not in stereo.”
-TechCrunch

“Emphasis should be placed on stereo-like sound, as HomePod reviews published today confirm that users won't be able to set one speaker as the right channel and another as the left channel. Instead, as Apple notes, HomePods will use advanced beamforming capabilities to create a more immersive soundstage.”
-Macrumors

So tell us, how does your knowledge of audio theory change those statements?

Wait. You quoted TechCrunch and Macrumours to refute his audio theory? You know appeal to authority only works if you appeal to ACTUAL authority. Of which TC and MR most definitely are not.

Stereo does not mean what you, or TC or MR, think it means.

Stereophonic sound or, more commonly, stereo, is a method of sound reproduction that creates an illusion of multi-directional audible perspective. This is usually achieved by using two or more independent audio channels through a configuration of two or more loudspeakers (or stereo headphones) in such a way as to create the impression of sound heard from various directions, as in natural hearing.[1] Thus the term "stereophonic" applies to so-called "quadraphonic" and "surround-sound" systems as well as the more common two-channel, two-speaker systems. It is often contrasted with monophonic, or "mono" sound, where audio is heard as coming from one position, often ahead in the sound field (analogous to a visual field). In the 2000s, stereo sound is common in entertainment systems such as broadcast radio, TV, recorded music, and cinema.​

 

[ersan191]

LOL no. Not a single review said that. However:

(That doesn't mean HomePod is currently limited to "mono" audio. One HomePod can still project a full 3D soundstage throughout a room. It simply means you can't pair HomePods to create a richer, bigger 3D soundstage — not until AirPlay 2 ships.) - iMore​

[doublepost=1517961977][/doublepost]Wait. You quoted TechCrunch and Macrumours to refute his audio theory? You know appeal to authority only works if you appeal to ACTUAL authority. Of which TC and MR most definitely are not.

Stereo does not mean what you, or TC or MR, think it means.

Stereophonic sound or, more commonly, stereo, is a method of sound reproduction that creates an illusion of multi-directional audible perspective. This is usually achieved by using two or more independent audio channels through a configuration of two or more loudspeakers (or stereo headphones) in such a way as to create the impression of sound heard from various directions, as in natural hearing.[1] Thus the term "stereophonic" applies to so-called "quadraphonic" and "surround-sound" systems as well as the more common two-channel, two-speaker systems. It is often contrasted with monophonic, or "mono" sound, where audio is heard as coming from one position, often ahead in the sound field (analogous to a visual field). In the 2000s, stereo sound is common in entertainment systems such as broadcast radio, TV, recorded music, and cinema.​

Never once said it was mono. Have said since the beginning that it won’t have left and right stereo separation, and it doesn’t.

I don’t think anyone is claiming it is a mono speaker - you’re both arguing with thin air.

 

[ErikGrim]

Never once said it was mono. Have said since the beginning that it won’t have left and right stereo separation, and it doesn’t.

Left / right stereo separation isn’t stereo. It is simply a form of creating a stereo illusion.

 

[ersan191]

Left / right stereo separation isn’t stereo. It is simply a form of creating a stereo illusion.

It matters when there is visual content attached (watching movies and TV with a HomePod as the speaker). That’s been my only point since the beginning - it isn’t an adequate Apple TV speaker.

It will play music fantastically, I have no doubt. Just wanted people to temper their expectations when it comes to home cinema.

The shocking part is that 2 of them will still be an awful home theater setup because it still won’t be able to distinguish left and right.

 

[ErikGrim]

It matters when there is visual content attached (watching movies and TV with a HomePod as the speaker). That’s been my only point since the beginning - it isn’t an adequate Apple TV speaker.

This is an interesting point and I certainly hope Apple sets its sights on precise positioning with visual medium. I imagine two of these could be used in tandem with say, an ATMOS signal, to create a very believable surround simulation.

It will most likely be far too imprecise to achieve with a single unit.

Right now however it seems that they’ve focused on creating a pleasing multi-dimensional soundstage for music only.

 

[Wxchaser]

UPS shows 8.80 pounds in transit to my residence

Scheduled delivery date is still Friday, February 9th.

The past couple weeks I have been researching smart switches & lights so I can use HomeKit enabled accessories. Discovered I have some weird wiring to my home switches but just about ready to order either Leviton or Lutron equipment.