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Do you notice a difference in sharpness between 3840x2160 and the resolution you mentioned? The first post also mentioned 3360x1890. Have you tried that?

I really hope that either Apple or BetterDisplay finds a Solution for this. Thats really sad for now 😭😭
In terms of sharpness drop off? No, not at all, esp if you "downscale" the resolution to the more HiDPI appropriate resolution, in this case for me, being 3008x1692. Remember, the M4 Mac mini is still outputting a 4K resolution...what we're talking about is the scaling of the UI at that resolution because the native 4K resolution at 1:1 makes your desktop look tiny.

If you're not a professional video and photo editor (I use mine to edit digital photos and I'm fine with it) that need 1:1 resolution, none of this really applies to the "layman" as you describe yourself.
 
In terms of sharpness drop off? No, not at all, esp if you "downscale" the resolution to the more HiDPI appropriate resolution, in this case for me, being 3008x1692. Remember, the M4 Mac mini is still outputting a 4K resolution...what we're talking about is the scaling of the UI at that resolution because the native 4K resolution at 1:1 makes your desktop look tiny.

If you're not a professional video and photo editor (I use mine to edit digital photos and I'm fine with it) that need 1:1 resolution, none of this really applies to the "layman" as you describe yourself.
I am completely new to this topic and to Mac in general. So if I play a 4K video for example, will I also get the correct resolution as the RAW video (3840 x 2160), even if this 3008x1692 resoultion is chosen for scaling?

Thanks :)
 
I am completely new to this topic and to Mac in general. So if I play a 4K video for example, will I also get the correct resolution displayed at the TV as the RAW video (3840 x 2160), even if this 3008x1692 resoultion is chosen for scaling?
Or will it be played as a "downscaled" 4K Video?

Thanks :)
 
Okay, stop panicking and yelling that nothing is working. I'll fix it now :) If it will help you on M4 chip, then let it be called “HiDPI by Mr. Fox method” . I've already this method has worked with my acquaintance, only on M1.
We will not prescribe and create manually mention HiDPI through third-party software and the first lines of which look like this and then you need to dance with a tambourine. It is complicated, it requires programming knowledge, attention.

| grep -B 2 resolution

screen #0:
dimensions: 3840x2160 pixels (621x341 millimeters)
resolution: 157x161 dots per inch
Step 1) brew coffee, tea, take out whiskey, beer, wine, dominoes, sunflower seeds and whatever else anyone likes to do when they are stressed and want to go faster!

So, open safari browser, chrome, tor or whatever you have installed. Click on the buttons and type in the following “ I want everything to work!”. The browser will give random answers.

Step 2) download the free program BetterDummy. It's free! Free! As everyone likes to do - for free :)

Step 3) After you download and install it, do the following:

At the top of the screen, open the program options list, click on “Create new dummy” and create a virtual monitor with the same aspect ratio as your connected monitor. After that, you will see a notification that the creation was successful.

Step 4) After that, open “Settings”, “Monitors”, enable monitor video replay (if not enabled) and select the external Dummy display.

Step 5) The scale of the interface may become very small, or on the contrary, too large. To choose the optimal ratio, you can either press Option and click on “Scale” here in the screen settings

Step 6) Or you can select Set Resolution in the Dummy settings. And here you can customize it to your taste

That's it!

BetterDummy = the old name for BetterDisplay.
So for anyone wondering, this method does not work on M4.
 
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FYI: I'm using Samsung's 27" 5K monitor with my M4-Pro mini; it's $790 with my company's discount(which works for personal purchases) and $1000 normally. I have the Samsung 27" and my ancient LG 5K 27" I got in 2019 hooked up to my Mac mini m4-Pro and both seem to be working well.

The LG does have a small amount of ghosting that the Samsung doesn't have, but 99% of the time it doesn't make a difference. The Thunderbolt cruft in the Samsung seems to be half-baked, it seems to work better with a USB-C cable that doesn't support Thunderbolt forcing the Samsung monitor back to USB3. The LG has been pretty awesome for the last 5 years and am super happy I got it from Apple when it was first announced for $1000.

HiDPI of course works on both the 5K monitors I use on the M4-Pro mini.
 
So, right now I am using a 27” 4k LG 60Hz monitor. If I am wanting to stay at 60Hz, can I run 1440p at 60Hz the same way I do now from my M1 MBP 13”? It isn’t HiDPI (as it isn’t a 2 to 1 ratio—that would have to be 1080p) but it looks fantastic. Is this not possible with the M4 if I want to keep it at 60Hz 1440p?
 
As old as it is, I'm starting to feel really spoiled by my iMac 5K. The display is one of the things I love about it.
That’s why I converted mine into a screen I can use with anything, even my Linux PC. Everything looks fantastic on it.

May as well reuse what I have until we get some actual innovation in the display space. Or at least more third-party options for a 5120x2880 screen.
 
Hello, very first post here…

My new full-fledged M4 Pro Mac Mini is sitting in my studio unopened since yesterday, as I have yet to choose a proper monitor for it. I’m ready to retire my beloved iMac 27” 5K that is running since 2014…

I’m bashing myself for not buying a Samsung Viewfinity S90PC with a 50% discount on the Single’s Day (I live in Italy) and now the offer’s gone. So I decided to wait for the rumored next year ASD update with a cheaper option.

So I was considering both the Dell U4025QW 5K120(still quite expensive) and LG 32GS95UE, the latter a gaming monitor with a dual mode option.
Both were awarded by CES this year and both have a 150 pixel pitch.

Now I read that with the M4 Mac Mini I could have issues with resolutions different from the 5K… I’m not an avid gamer, but the OLED LG is intriguing… what are the risks to choose the 4K gaming OLED and drive it thru HDMI as nowadays? And could I manage the variable frequency feature that - as I read - is achieved with integer scaling?

Thank you in advance,

- Matteo
 
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Could someone explain the problem to me better? Because I'm using a Dell S2721Q native 4K display over HDMI to the new Mac mini M4 Pro, and my resolution is set to 1920x1080, and it's scaled properly, and using the full 3840x2160 resolution to do the scaling. Like, I can take a screenshot of the screen, zoom in, and there's no doubt it's using the full 3840x2160 resolution and scaling 2x, it's not pixelated at all, and there's good anti-aliasing in there as well. So, I don't understand what the problem is?
 
I don't understand this thread. For me it seems to work with my LG CX65 OLED just fine. 4K444120fps HDR displayed as HiDPI. So everything looks like 1080p. I have the base M4 model (macOS 15.1). Just connected a good (certified) HDMI 2.1 cable directly to the HDMI port of the Mac mini.
 

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Could someone explain the problem to me better? Because I'm using a Dell S2721Q native 4K display over HDMI to the new Mac mini M4 Pro, and my resolution is set to 1920x1080, and it's scaled properly, and using the full 3840x2160 resolution to do the scaling. Like, I can take a screenshot of the screen, zoom in, and there's no doubt it's using the full 3840x2160 resolution and scaling 2x, it's not pixelated at all, and there's good anti-aliasing in there as well. So, I don't understand what the problem is?
I don't understand this thread. For me it seems to work with my LG CX65 OLED just fine. 4K444120fps HDR displayed as HiDPI. So everything looks like 1080p. I have the base M4 model (macOS 15.1). Just connected a good (certified) HDMI 2.1 cable directly to the HDMI port of the Mac mini.

Both of you are using scaling that "looks like" 1080p (or 2x scaling), which is fine. I believe the issue comes into play when you use the full/native resolution that "looks like" 4K (or 1x scaling).
 
Both of you are using scaling that "looks like" 1080p (or 2x scaling), which is fine. I believe the issue comes into play when you use the full/native resolution that "looks like" 4K (or 1x scaling).
No. It's the same 4K444120 HDR for "looks like 4K". Its just not very usable with the small UI
 

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No. It's the same 4K444120 HDR for "looks like 4K". Its just not very usable with the small UI
You are running 1x scaling, which looks bad. We want 2x scaling, which is still possible on older Macs.
We want 7680x4320 base resolution, that "looks like" 3840x2160.

If you're not interested in running native 4k @ HiDPI, then you're all set and there is no need to post in this thread.
 
BetterDummy = the old name for BetterDisplay.
So for anyone wondering, this method does not work on M4.

Just to clarify, the virtual screen mirroring method does work on the M4 just fine and you can get any resolution even beyond 3840px HiDPI (with the latest Sequoia betas, as these support better 8K+ resolutions due to the AVP's new ultra-wide modes), but it is a workaround and has its drawbacks.

---

There are now indications that the 3072px+ HiDPI support of the M4 and M4 Pro minis are indeed somewhat broken/inconsistent (see this strange finding for example: #235 - which feels more like a bug). So I think (or hope) there is a good chance that Apple will look into this issue and improve things - especially for Pro level chips where the current state of things is clearly an unexpected step back.
 
Thanks, I’ll add a definition to the OP!

That’s right, you can run native 4K but only at 1x scale, which looks very pixelated. Text looks especially bad due to the lack of subpixel antialiasing in macOS. I will update the OP later with some pics of how it looks, compared to my M1 MBP at 2x scale.

I can’t confirm that DisplayPort fully works as I don’t have a monitor to test with, but reports seem to indicate better support.

As to why this limitation, we don’t know, it may be for performance reasons. Waydabber indicated this may be to reserve bandwidth to support 3 displays as they advertise. But considering that they allow full 8k, it doesn’t make sense to me. A few of us assumed that Apple does this to push people to buy Apple displays, however the Pro Display XDR is reported to have similar limitations (even with thunderbolt connection).

The smaller scaled resolutions look sharp, and some people even prefer them. But for me it’s just not enough space, I like to have 4 windows on screen at a time and need as much space as possible.
I am sorry but a monitor can not display pixels that are not there.

HiDPI is actually rendering a higher resolution image to emulate the scaling of a lower resolution, so to make this easy; rendering at 3840x2160 and displaying "GUI elements" at 1920x1080 is going to look sharper to the eye; the monitor is 3840x2160 but also has a higher pixel per inch value.

For many non-Apple monitors this does not make sense because the pixel per inch value isn't high enough to make it worth it.

Apple probably should have kept sub-pixel rendering as an option for those with "normal" monitors.
 
I am sorry that my terminology has triggered so many of you.

Here's my MBP M1 Pro connected to LG C2 with flashed USB-C adapter.
Screenshot 2024-11-14 at 3.51.47 PM.png

An here's the M4 Pro mini:
Screenshot 2024-11-14 at 3.47.52 PM.png



I want the M4 to do what the M1 does. Whatever you want to call that, I don't care.

The point of the thread is to warn others considering purchasing the mini who want to run this setting.
Apple's specs do not make it clear that the M4 chip cannot do what an M1 can.
I would like to raise awareness and get others to contact Apple about this, so they hopefully fix it.

If you enjoy using "looks like" 1920x1080 or any other resolution, then great. I don't.
Thanks!
 
What OP failed to communicate, I think, is how niche it is what he wants to do. Because „looks like 4K“ UI on a 4k display will make all screen elements way too small on regular display sizes (i.e. not big-ass TVs used as monitors).
 
I am sorry that my terminology has triggered so many of you.

Here's my MBP M1 Pro connected to LG C2 with flashed USB-C adapter.
View attachment 2451377

If I understand what you are doing there is sending 8K to a 4K monitor with the UI set to 4K? So that basically the Mac renders at 8K and then lets the monitor blend down to 4K while keeping source pixels 1:1 with the screen?

P.S.Remind us -- do both your MacBook Pro M1 and your Mac Mini M4 run the same version of the OS?
 
Potentially silly question/observation

When the OP uses his M1 machine the LG is connected as a 2nd display. When connecting to the M4 Mini he is using just one display. Would it make any difference if he had another display connected as main and then used his original cable and LG screen as extended display.

Just looking for other differences than the M1/M4 chip that may impact the observed behaviour.
 
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Glad we cleared that up. This affects almost no one. Those of us that do the normal things will be just fine it appears. I will update this thread when I have mine, but it may still be a month or two.
 
Made an account to post on this thread.

I also just bought an M4 Mini base model.

I have an 8k Samsung TV and the Mini will output HiDPI @ 4k (8k signal shows on TV) but only at 30hz. In other words, 4k scaling with Mac mini m4 outputting an 8k resolution.

My TV should be able to accept a 60hz @ 8k signal. Currently unsure if the issue with only outputting 30hz is the Mac or my TV / HDMI 2.1 cable.

But my experience here is different to OP who I think is advising they are unable to get 4k scaling for an 8k native resolution.

I own a Samsung QN700B 55in 8K TV that I have been using with a MacBook Pro 16in M2 Max in 4K HiDPI mode for about 18 months now. Recently bought base Mac mini M4. Both work very well, but it helps if the TV is set in both PC (less image manipulation, at least in theory) and Game (VRR, or variable rate refresh) modes.

When set up, System Information > Hardware > Graphics/Displays should look like the enclosed screenshot. Note UI Looks like: 3840 x 2160 @ 60.00Hz line.

To confirm the TV is in the correct mode, press the large middle select button on the remote. It should read 7680x4320 VRR 60Hz Input Signal Plus at top right.

Also, as you suggested, the quality of the HDMI cable is paramount, as it is pushing 48Gbps. I recommend the Belkin 8K HDMI cable that Apple sells. When buying this cable online, be certain it is being sold by the seller itself (i.e. Amazon or Newegg) instead of a random seller that may see the profit in attempting to sell a $2 cable for $40.

Someone made some additional observations on Reddit:


Bummer one can no longer buy a 55in 8K TV in the US.
 

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What OP failed to communicate, I think, is how niche it is what he wants to do. Because „looks like 4K“ UI on a 4k display will make all screen elements way too small on regular display sizes (i.e. not big-ass TVs used as monitors).
The title of this post is much too vague and will scare many novice users. For 99% of us, this is not a problem. I would suggest that the OP modify the title to be more specific to his situation.
 
I am sorry that my terminology has triggered so many of you.

Here's my MBP M1 Pro connected to LG C2 with flashed USB-C adapter.
View attachment 2451377
An here's the M4 Pro mini:
View attachment 2451372


I want the M4 to do what the M1 does. Whatever you want to call that, I don't care.

The point of the thread is to warn others considering purchasing the mini who want to run this setting.
Apple's specs do not make it clear that the M4 chip cannot do what an M1 can.
I would like to raise awareness and get others to contact Apple about this, so they hopefully fix it.

If you enjoy using "looks like" 1920x1080 or any other resolution, then great. I don't.
Thanks!
I'm going to fire up my iMac 5K and see what it reports.

I, too, want to see 4K drawn as HiDPI (i.e., scaled from 8K).
 
This is a problem just with HDMI? If you're using USB-C to Displayport this isn't a problem?

I'm not a monitor but my plan is some kind of M4 device + 4K 120/144hz monitor and this worries me a bit :)
 
I am sorry that my terminology has triggered so many of you.

Here's my MBP M1 Pro connected to LG C2 with flashed USB-C adapter.
View attachment 2451377
An here's the M4 Pro mini:
View attachment 2451372


I want the M4 to do what the M1 does. Whatever you want to call that, I don't care.

The point of the thread is to warn others considering purchasing the mini who want to run this setting.
Apple's specs do not make it clear that the M4 chip cannot do what an M1 can.
I would like to raise awareness and get others to contact Apple about this, so they hopefully fix it.

If you enjoy using "looks like" 1920x1080 or any other resolution, then great. I don't.
Thanks!
You should update the OP with this info to make the issue clear. There's a lot of people on this forum clearly without the technical understanding to figure out what you are after. All they see is "does not support HiDPI on 4K".

What size LG OLED TV are you using? I'm curious because I ran a LG CX 48" for a few years and felt that at the 1+ meter viewing distance I needed to make the screen size comfortable in the first place, I needed to use 120% ("looks like 3200x1800") scaling to make UI/text a comfortable size. Native res was just too small.
 
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