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Freescale Confirms Dual Core G4

SiliconAddict said:
OK. I don't know the specific specs and haven't seen how the architecture is laid out but dual core on a 200Mhz FSB?!?! :eek: Are they insane? Can you say bandwidth starved? If this does somehow make it into a PowerBook here's hoping the memory controller is onboard as well or things are going to get really ugly.
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The MPC8641 and the MPC8641D use a RapidIO and a PCI-E interface to connect to the other peripherials on the motherboard. Now iirc RIO (or RapidIO) comes in two speeds 250Mhz or 500Mhz bi directional. It allso (again iirc), just like Hypertransport , comes in diffrent bandwidths a x1 RIO interface means a 2x16bit connection the MPC8641 and the MPC8641D supports RIO x1 or x4. The PCI-E is a dual x1/x2/x4/x8 interface.

The MPC8641D (D as in Dual core) uses two separate DDR/DDR-2 64bit (128bit tot.) on board memory controllers capable of supporting 667Mhz (166Mhz core clock) DDR-2 EEC memory. [edit] The MPC864, unlike it's big brother, uses a single 64bit memory controller[/edit]

Now the 7448 uses a 200Mhz MPX bus (1.6GB/s), but it's a very diffrent beast indeed from the SoC MPC8641 and the MPC8641D.
 
Corrupted said:
I'll get another powerbook as soon as it move to the G5 processor.
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You'll be waiting a very long time then! Just be happy with whats available. Laptops always lag behind desktops performance wise. The Dual Core G4 is a very powerful processor, not quite as powerful as the G5, but its not that bad.

I'd it will be at least a year before you see a G5 PowerBook. Definitely not anytime soon. The heat sink in the iMac G5 is just as thick as the 17" PowerBook itself so until Apple can figure out a way to get the heat sink to about .5 inch without melting the chip(s) then you'll never see a G5 based PowerBook. Plus the G5 STILL uses wwwwaaayyyyy too much power for a laptop.
 
wow

JoePike said:
Yes, I said I'm miffed, but understanding that there are design complications associated with cramming a big G5 into a little case. And I agree that the dual core G4's would be a step up from the current model processors in PowerBooks, but I'd rather not see the company halt all efforts to put a G5 into a laptop just because this option is available. See, once a large enough percentage of Macs have 64-bit processors in them, then the software that runs on these machines can start to capitalize on that additional processing power and we'll really start to see some amazing things. As of now, as I understand it anyway, most software apps on the Mac are still only 32-bit anyway. Putting this dual core chip in the PowerBook as a quick fix because "putting a G5 in there is hard" is just going to delay that advancement in the software we use every day. And more importantly, as you can see from my signature below I'm stilll running on an older PowerBook, looking to upgrade soon. I just think it would be wiser to hold out on upgrading my machine until I can step up to the next generation of processor - which is the G5. That's my choice as a customer, and I'm sure there are lots and lots of others out there who feel the same. Althought admittedly most of the others on my side of the fence are just waiting to upgrade to the G5 from a G4 because "five is bigger than four, and must be better." So, flame away, kids.

-Joe
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That's all I can say, is "wow"
 
insidedanshead said:
200Mhz FSB? *Yawn* Gonna need to do better than that Freescale.
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And at what point is this info reliable? I'm thinking of the current Motorola G4 chips that offcially max out at 1.3 GHz. I remember some machines Apple sold that were running at 1.42 GHz
 
The specs sure sound good, thumbs up for Freescale. Hope they can get the 90nm fabs working faster than IBM. I'd love to see the 7448 on the 'Books as a speedbump soon, and oh yeah, eMac too. The 8641(and D) will need a completely new motherboard architecture so we won't be seeing them anytime too soon.

But if they get the 7448's in production, they could probably go for PB 1.6-2.0 GHz, iBook and eMac 1.2-1.6 GHz. Just an educated guess, and I assume that with a 200 MHz bus the processor speeds should be in 200(100 possible I guess) MHz steps, right?
 
where on apple's site does it actually say that the kernel is 64 bit??


it will add 64 bit memeory addressing...and be more useful for 64 bit operations...

but where does it say that the kernel will be 64 and downshift to 32, that would be a whole lot of downshifting, and would be ineffecient.
 
whatever

whatever they do.. i hope its soon... the last speed bumb was ridiculous... a 167mhz increase for the top model?

im in the market for a powerbook but they have to tempt me ... at least with another processor.. so bring on the dual core... 2 heads are better than one... so 2 1.5 g4s are better than a single 1.6 g5 anyday

so for the moment... call the dual g4 a g5 and voila your g5 powerbook!
 
IBSNOWEDIN said:
umm... have u ever heard of Mac OS 10.4 "tiger" the kernal is going to be 64 bit.

This Dual core would be great to see in laptops. Can't wait to see Apple's reaction to freescale, if they are going to use these chips.

ibsnowedin
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I'm well aware of Tiger. I'm running it on my PB15 (that's a 32bit G4 in case you're wondering).

Here's some text straight from the Apple website.

"Tiger’s state-of-the-art kernel features improved SMP scalability and 64-bit virtual memory. Add a metadata engine and modernized network services and you’ve got the most powerful and productive way ever to do UNIX.

More Power to Power-Users

The upgraded kernel, based on FreeBSD 5.x, provides optimized resource locking for better scalability across multiple processors, support for 64-bit memory pointers through the System library and standards-based access control lists..."

"64-bit Compatibility

New 64-bit pointers in Tiger enable individual processes to access massive amounts of virtual memory. Tiger’s enhanced kernel, plus a 64-bit version of libSystem, enable command-line programs, background daemons and network services to directly manipulate up to 16 exabytes of virtual memory, more than four billion times the memory addressable by 32-bit applications today."

http://www.apple.com/macosx/tiger/unix.html
 
Another moto roadmap of grand dreams and promises, how long ago was apple selling a dual 1.42 G4? year?year and a half ago and moto is talking of 1.5? well this might be news for lap users but by the time moto gets out the faster cpu Intel and Amd will have walked away the from stagnation king of all cpu makers. thanks for the laugh freescale. :D
 
The Red Wolf said:
Tiger utilizes a 64bit kernel. As I've said before, it downshifts to accommodate 32bit processes.
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huh? A 64bit kernel doesn't have to downshift to accommodate a 32bit process. Did you mean to say downshift to accommodate a 32bit CPU? (since Tiger and its alleged 64bit kernel runs perfectly on a G4 today :))

(I'm not even sure what a downshift is. I assume you mean thunking?)
 
swissmann said:
I just want to see real world what these new chips can do. Here's to hoping that they perform well. Who cares if they are labeled G4 or whatever. If the performance is great the label doesn't matter to me.
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Yes, this will be an innovative PowerBook upgrade. It would certainly stimulate Christmas sales.
 
Are major updates to the powerbook line holding up develepmont of a lot of Apples lineup? iBooks cat get upgraded until the Powerbooks do - they'll get even closer in specs, and I cant see them improving the eMac either - it will end up more powerful than the Powerbooks lol. :eek:
 
Well, here goes. Here are my predictions.

eMac - 1.33Ghz G4, 167Mhz FSB.
12in. iBook G4 - 1.2Ghz G4, 133Mhz FSB.
14in. iBook G4 - 1.2Ghz G4, 133Mhz FSB.
14in. iBook G4(Top Model) - 1.33Ghz G4, 167Mhz FSB.
12in. PowerBook G4 - 1.5Ghz G4, 167Mhz FSB.
15in. PowerBook G4 - 1.5Ghz G4, 167Mhz FSB.
15in. PowerBook G4(Top Model) - 1.5Ghz DualCore G4, 667MHz FSB.
17in. PowerBook G4 - 1.5Ghz DualCore G4, 667MHz FSB.

This doesn't seem to be too shabby to me. I think we'll see a 3Ghz G5 before we ever see a PowerBook G5. And the closest thing we've got to a PowerBook G5 right now is the iMac G5. Apple can do a lot of things but they can't change physics, so that's what we're going to have to live with.
 
@devman

To use those mempointers you'd have to use >4GB of RAM, I doubt that there's a big market market for that, noor one that needs to use software that makes use of 64bit integers.

The avarage consumer/prosumer would IMO benefit much more from a dualcore SoC "G4" solution with an onboard memory controller then any of IBM's current offerings. I say this even though some single threaded aplications may suffer preformance losses as great as 10%-20% from a multi CPU solution (be it dual cpu or dual cores).
 
DWKlink said:
Love your signature. The Amiga 500 rocked. Isn't your avitar from the cover art of an amiga game... shadowbeast - or something like that - that was my favorite game. incredible graphics!
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Yup. My Avatar is from the cover of Shadow of the Beast. Wish the Amiga would have gone somewhere besides into oblivion... I still have my A1200 with an '030 40Mhz upgrade and 10 megs of RAM. :)
 
JoePike said:
just waiting to upgrade to the G5 from a G4 because "five is bigger than four, and must be better."
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So if I get a dual core G4, that's like a G8 and it totally blows away a G5, right? :D

For real, though, I'm really hoping that Apple does something cool with the 'Books around the end of this year or the (early) beginning of next year. I want to switch, I want a PowerBook, G5 or otherwise.

Oh, what's that, PBG5 next tuesday? Sweet! :p

Jonathan
 
Eric_Z said:
@devman

To use those mempointers you'd have to use >4GB of RAM, I doubt that there's a big market market for that, noor one that needs to use software that makes use of 64bit integers.

The avarage consumer/prosumer would IMO benefit much more from a dualcore SoC "G4" solution with an onboard memory controller then any of IBM's current offerings. I say this even though some single threaded aplications may suffer preformance losses as great as 10%-20% from a multi CPU solution (be it dual cpu or dual cores).
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I totally agree with you. Go back and read my first post in this thread. I was making a similar case to someone else who said he had to have 64bits in a PB. It was my reply to him that got others started on their misunderstandings of 64bit.

https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/1057569/
 
itsa said:
That's what I'm thinking too. Anything less makes me feel left behind.
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Why?

Because you're not gonna see a PB G5 for a long time still. If they release an interim G4 update before the G5 it will be the fastest thing available, just as the current crop is the current fastest. How is getting the fastest current processor "being left behind?"

I hear your arguement that a G5 is the future of the Mac platform, but that doesn't mean it's integration into a laptop is any more likely than it was at the introduction of the G5 over 15 months ago.
 
I really don't understand this discussion. Freescale/Motorolla DO NOT have a 90nm fabrication facility. Current G4's are not manufactured @90nm. So we're looking at A LONG TIME until these chips come to consumers. Not to ruin anyone's pipe-dream, but there's just no way we're gonna see these chips any time soon! ...and it sucks for all of us in the market for a decent laptop.

The dual core has PCIe compatibility... it's too bad we're not gonna see this chip until 2005 :( :mad:
 
I know I'm probably in the minority here but I really think apple should not spend money on developing a G5 laptop for at least a year. They should spend their resources on freescale technology.

Look at the best Intel mobile processor right now, the Pentium M. Is it the Big bad power hungry pentium 4 scaled and clocked down and crippled and still sucks up a bunch of power? Or is it an ultra effecient Pentium 3 with added features that performs in mobile environments flawlessly?

Apple should take this approach, FreeScale G4s for mobility, G5s for the true power... its much like the mobile pentium 4 situation.


I wish people would stop buying into the marketing hype of the G5... its not a freaking mobile processor!!!! IT WAS NEVER DESIGNED FOR IT!!!!
 
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