Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Future iPhones Could Have Apple-Designed Cellular Modems, But Possibly Not Until 2021
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Unless they've been working on it for the past 10 years, like they did with intel builds of OSX (and they probably are doing with Arm builds of MacOS). It's not a bad strategy to have their own ready to go incase something where to happen.
I have a Xs Max, a new iPad Pro and a new MB Pro.
I won’t be able to afford a new phone until whenever Apple releases these chips, anyway.
I won’t be able to afford a new phone until whenever Apple releases these chips, anyway.
If any of you are holding Qualcomm stock, I would start selling them now if I were you.
Oh really! Like Siri and MAPS?
Already Quolcomm not supplying modems, Apple is not paying royalty, Apple even stopped their dues of the past for Apple. What difference it makes when Apple making its own modems just for iPhones ?
Apple is trying to undermine Qualcomm's entire business model.
Apple doesn't think a company like Qualcomm should be able to use its market power to charge royalties for standards-essential patents based on a percentage of a device's selling price. Apple wants things to change as it's easy to see how this will only get worse in the future.
Qualcomm is in a position to reap a lot of money from connected cars, homes, and plenty of other smart gadgets which all require their modems. Apple doesn't think Qualcomm deserves that money as Qualcomm is not responsible for the additional innovation found in such products.
Apple wants a more competitive chipset market with lower standard-essential patent royalties and chipset prices. Along with benefiting Apple, this will also benefit Apple's competitors, thereby benefiting all consumers.
The party with the most to lose here is Qualcomm.
its so funny apple
i pick you ... because ... every test states that the qualcom modem is far superior. and you should write more about where you use your brick. in a major city never leaving it? or more a traveller on the countryside too?
[doublepost=1544685075][/doublepost]
if it was meant funny - it isnt (really)
if its true it is not funny even more!
Nice fantasy.
[doublepost=1544686347][/doublepost]
Probably 0
By 2021 Qualcomm will sell chips with 5G modems that OEM's will be able to incorporate in ~200$ phones.
[doublepost=1544686606][/doublepost]
Yeah right.
It doesn't seem like Qualcomm will lose. Not only that but they are getting into new markets building computer and server ARM chips.
It looks like Qualcomm's potential of making more money is just getting bigger and bigger.
Last edited:
Apple can make all its modems but rest of the non-iOS communities which is essentially 85% + of the mobile (& associated markets) will buy Qualcomm modems or competing modems in the open market. And, btw, Qualcomm not going to sit until Apple coming up with its modems.
It can only reduce the dependency for Apple but overall capital investment, managing the portfolio of various communication standards will add to its overhead on the longrunl.
Qualcomm stocks probably already factored it's world without Apple
Again, we are forgetting that market share =/= profits.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/qualcomm-posts-loss-as-revenue-slips-1541628716
Thanks to the ongoing lawsuit, Qualcomm's profits fell from 168 million a year ago to a loss of 493 million this quarter. In one fell swoop, Apple wiped out Qualcomm's profitability (both present and future), by moving to intel, and by depriving Qualcomm the opportunity to charge Apple a percentage of the overall price of the iPhone, which incidentally, Apple dramatically increased the price of.
I am no lawyer, and I won't pretend that I can tell the future, but I believe Apple is in a very strong position here.
What will change is Qualcomm's overall profitability. I am sure that the rest of the world will still continue to buy Qualcomm chips for lack of a better alternative. However, margins are slim enough as is when your royalties are based off a percentage of the price of an already very cheap phone made in China. Imagine what could happen if the FTC could rule that Qualcomm had to reduce that even further or force Qualcomm to essentially licence it out for mere peanuts.
Second, Qualcomm has been falling behind in the innovation front. Their snapdragon processors pale in comparison to Apple's own custom A-series processors, and its current contribution is pretty only 5g.
And with declining revenue, how much resources do you think Qualcomm will have left to reinvest in further improving their own processors and related products? It's not hard to see how this can potentially lead to a vicious downward spiral, where the good get better (Apple, because they have the profits to keep reinvesting in improving their chip design) and the not-so-good get even worse (less money means slower improvements, which means poorer sales, which means less money and so on).
Are we seeing the beginning of the end for Qualcomm?
I think that's their goal and I can totally see why they would make that transition.
Their main products are mobile and require cellular connectivity, controlling that part would allow them to optimise even further performances and power consumption.
Their main products are mobile and require cellular connectivity, controlling that part would allow them to optimise even further performances and power consumption.
I support this Mr. Cook. Please give us radios that destroy the competition, with fantastic connections even if the signal is very weak, and great throughput. You did it with Airport (why did you cancel it?), do it again with 4GLTE and upcoming 5G.
I find Apples phones run really hot and could do with better cooling designed in. Not sure what chip(s) is doing it be it CPU or Modem or mix of both
Apple needs to play nicer with other tech companies now that they are no longer at the top of their game. The legal battle is hardly worth it when they could have bought Qualcomm in better days. A brief opportunity after Jobs died to really own the legacy of Bell was passed up for some stock manipulation by Carl Icahn.
Other tech companies need to learn to play nicer with Apple.
Nothing about your statement makes any sense.
You are aware Apple is making more money than ever before, right?
Even Apple was there before in much worse conditions. Qualcomm is not a fly-by-night-make-quick-bucks like operators. They have VERY HUGE amount of PATIENTS (than Apple) and 100% more (compared to Apple) R&D spending.
Their Snapdragon processors are mostly popular in Android world. The performance is good enough with RAMs 10 GB etc..very attractive in Android world. They have mid-range 600,400,700 series etc...to cater to varying segments.
They need to definitely step up their innovations
Certainly. Not having to pay to license SEPs hasn't been the goal. Qualcomm not being able to unilaterally impose onerous licensing terms has been the goal. At this point, and for all intents and purposes, that goal has been achieved - whether or not Apple designs its own modems.
And... the ship has already sailed on that last issue. Apple has effectively won that fight.
Qualcomm employed a number of tactics which needed to work together to allow it to unilaterally impose terms. Qualcomm can no longer employ many of those tactics, because regulatory bodies have told them they can't and for other reasons. And with Judge Koh's order from early November in the case that FTC brought against Qualcomm, the deal is all but sealed when it comes to Apple having to pay licensing fees (on Qualcomm modem SEPs) based on the cost (to it) of iPhones.
Even if the court hearing the Apple v Qualcomm case doesn't find that the entire market value isn't the proper basis for such royalties, Apple can - if it wants - avoid paying royalties on that basis. That's because it can now buy licensed modems, where the patent rights in question are exhausted. Qualcomm has been ordered to license to other modem suppliers, e.g. Intel or, in theory, a contract fabricator which Apple might buy Apple-designed modems from. Qualcomm should have - based on its FRAND commitments - been doing that all along, but it had previously refused to.
That may be the case now. But for all intents and purposes it wasn't the case previously. Indeed, according to various regulatory bodies and industry participants (to include Apple), it was in part the effective monopoly that Qualcomm had on certain modems which allowed it to unilaterally impose onerous licensing terms. Qualcomm has now been told by some regulatory bodies that it can't employ the so-called no-license-no-chips scheme it previously had.
Huawei is the worlds largest mobile infrastructure manufacturer as of 2018, so they already have vast knowledge in the area and probably far ahead of most other phone makers.
Apple has no such prior expertise at all (with regards to the subject of the thread).
They could do it, but it's an uphill battle for sure. Competition is always good, so I'm hoping Apple makes something really good!
Last edited: