Future Shop Experience

[kixsand]

Dude thats just plain mean...

It's understandable if you tell someone that "That video game isnt worth buying" but when you start getting in the $1000 range your just ruining it for the salesperson.

Your assertion is assinine. The consumer is parting with $1000 after tax dollars. The salesperson is making a commission of perhaps $50 pre tax. These two things are not equal!

The transaction is infinitely more important to the consumer. I don't see how you can so easily fall in step with the sales person.

Tell me I'm wrong.

Darren

 

[emac82]

Again...I think that this is an assumption that you shouldn't make...there are people that would tell you that they don't believe in extended warranties or that they feel it isn't required in their case...

Darren

I have no problem with someone who does not buy a warranty. However, I do want to make sure that the customer is educated on it before they say yes or no. In my opinion, when someone is investing $2249 into a computer, then I feel that AppleCare is a great product for them to buy. I am not trying to sell them AppleCare to "make money". Those who sell it will tell you that the margin on AppleCare is very low..If I wanted to make money I would sell them our regular extended warranty. Most warranties are 30+% of the selling price, where AppleCare is less than 10%. I have seen a lot of people not buy it then 6 months after their warranty is expired their logicboard goes and it costs them about $700+ for a replacement. Some people have money, and will just buy a new computer..Others do not, and sometimes they can't afford to fix it. I have seen people spend $6000+ on a Mac Pro and declined the $299 AppleCare that also covers an Cinema Display...My point is that it is a very low cost way to give you peace of mind for the 3 years that most people want to keep their computer.

As far as you thinking that I made "assumptions", I wasn't "assuming" anything, but in my years experience in selling computers, most people never use their computers to their full potential. I see many people buy a computer that comes with a 250GB hard drive, 2GB's of ram, and all they do is check email and talk on msn. It's not that they are overbuying a system, it's just that computers come that way now. There are many people who wouldn't even fill a 40GB drive........

I don't disagree that you stepped in because you felt it was "best" for the potential customer, and in this case, it sounds like the sales person wasn't that knowlegeable, so it's hard to say..I see both sides of the story, but I guess if it were me, I would be insulted, but then again, I wouldn't tell a customer that a customer can't upgrade an iMac...

It is my experience, that for a person to be comfortable with selling a mac, then they should use one. I find it is the best way to learn product knowledge.

 

[emac82]

Originally Posted by emac82
The 24" iMac is $2249CAD, and AppleCare is $199CAD, anyone who wouldn't buy it is stupid, because it's such an inexpensive warranty.

You know, I was agreeing with a lot of what you said up until you said this. But that statement is the biggest steaming pile I've heard from almost all sales people. I have NEVER ONCE purchased an extended warranty plan... There was ONE occasion where it would have benefited me to have it... Instead I had to pay $35 to have it shipped to the manufacture to have it repaired under the manufacturers warrenty... I have purchased a heck of a lot of expensive gadgets in my time, and a 4 year extended warrenty would have cost $200+ on a lot of them.
Let's say I spent $2249 on a 24" iMac, and it went kaput 1 day after the warranty ended... The cost of repairing it, heck, even the cost of buying a brand new one... I'd still not have spent as much as I would have on your precious juice, er, warranties. (Yes, the sales people at Future Shop (at least from my city) call extended warranties 'juice'...)
So by your statement, I'm stupid for saving money in the long run... Good show!

I guess I shouldn't have used the word stupid. I know that a lot of people don't buy warranty, but a lot still do. Sometimes it works for them, sometimes it doesn't. It's a chance you take.

I am a very honest sales person, and I don't suggest warranty on something I don't believe they should have it on. Personally, I feel laptops and Macs should have warranty because they are expensive to fix. Years of working in the computer industry, I have seen many people benefit. I have also seen people nearly in tears (some in tears) because their machine has died and they cannot afford to pay to fix it and they don't have an extended warranty (some are students, or they are just financially strapped). Maybe they had originally said no to the warranty, or maybe it was never offered to them.

I really like AppleCare. It gives the customer great phone support, and no matter what hardware fails, it's covered (except physical and liquid damage), and it is International Warranty. What I really like about it is that, no matter what iMac they buy, no matter how much they customize it, it is still only $199. It will pay for itself the first time it requires a repair (generally). Other AppleCares can cost more (MBP is $399, MB and MP are $299)...Hardware is hardware, and it breaks down.

Again, I probably shouldn't have used the word "stupid" but I was venting. I just don't like it when I hear one customer say to another potential customer "Don't buy the warranty, you won't need it". The customer should be presented with the features and benefits, and then that customer should make up his or her mind, no one else. I also tell them "You don't need to buy it today, you can buy it anytime in the first year"..

 

[tristan]

I think you did the right thing. The salesperson had more information than the customers and was using that to push them into making a bad purchasing choice. Economists call that asymmetric information advantage. I call it cheating someone.

If the salesperson can only make a living by withholding crucial information from people, then he doesn't deserve to be in business, and the fact that he is in business and is profiting is bad for the industry as a whole.

At some point, the customers would have gotten the additional information you provided from another source and would have regretted their buying decision. You saved them that regret. You did the right thing.

 

[GoKyu]

This has been a great thread, and I'd like to add my thoughts as a non-commission salesman:

I can totally understand the salesman's reaction - if I were on commission, I'd be pretty ticked that someone came out of the blue and basically sent my customer home to think more about it.

But as a salesman who generally doesn't work on commission (I make well under 10% commission, only on the product protection plans, and unless it's a high-priced item, it's honestly not really worth the trouble), it *still* ticks me off when someone who thinks he knows everything just butts into a conversation I'm having with a customer because he thinks he knows better than I do. He may very well know more about the subject, but it's like coming in halfway through a movie - you've missed a lot of backstory - what's the point?

At our store (I work for a national chain) we sell replacement plans which actually replace an item should it become defective. I took advantage of this when I bought a laser printer last year. It refused to feed paper, I received a refund, and was able to buy the Epson R1800 that I've been wanting for a long time. Yes, I use that story when I sell my plans, and even though commission selling isn't my main money earner, I find it hard to believe that there are still people who are just so distrusting of *any* salesperson that even mentioning a plan is an automatic "Oh no, I never get those" without even thinking about it.

I'm not one of those cheating, lying salespeople that people on here have been talking about. When I don't have what the customer wants, I'd rather send them somewhere else to buy what they *really* want, than to buy it from me. Example: I'm about to buy a Mac Pro (my first Mac), and I've sent 2 people out of my store who came in wanting PCs, but given what they told me, it sounded like a midrange iMac would suit their needs better, so I said so: "Go over to CompUSA and check out their 20" iMacs, I think it would be a better fit for the graphic work you want to do, than the HP PC you're looking at here."

If I were solely on commission, I seriously doubt I'd do that, because I'd *need* to make a sale. In my position, however, I can afford to really help my customers get exactly what they need and/or want.

-Bryan

 

[The Stig]

I agree with him. He did the right thing. I bet those people will be happier with a better video card if the really need 3 gb of ram. I've correct futureshop about apple thing before to. They should really have a apple salesperson if they want to sell apple products.

The Stig

 

[epicwelshman]

I'm not judging either side of the argument, mainly because I don't know enough to be able to contribute to the debate one way or another.

I did however just want to say that I admire the civility evident in this thread. While obviously people are disagreeing with the actions of the OP, they are doing so in a mature, educated way, which is a far cry from the immature little brats on most forums. Bravo MacRumors, bravo.

 

[kixsand]

I agree with him. He did the right thing. I bet those people will be happier with a better video card if the really need 3 gb of ram. I've correct futureshop about apple thing before to. They should really have a apple salesperson if they want to sell apple products.

The Stig

Yes...I think my preconceived notions of FS and their level of knowledge with Apple Computers certainly contributed to me doing what I did. Had I been in an Apple Store or at CPUsed or another store of the like, I don't think I would have ever thought of jumping into a situation like this. In those stores I expect the staff to know much more than I do.

My own experiences in Future Shop trying to get help with Apple related products have contributed to my impression of a sales staff that clearly do not have the necessary training to speak confidently or capably about all things Apple.

I wonder if Apple shouldn't be taking greater care to ensure that their products are properly represented at retail. Whether that means having a dedicated Apple specialist on the floor at FS or simply better training for all I'm not sure.

I"m not certain that having an single iMac as an island within a sea of bargain PC's with no one to explain why the cool looking white one is twice the price of the eMachines system next to it is a good idea. At the same time though we all have a vested interest for Apple to increase market share.

It's an interesting conundrum.

darren

 

[Raid]

Economists call that asymmetric information advantage. I call it cheating someone.

I was going to introduce some economic theroy around the assumptions of perfect information and rational consumer behavor in my first post to this thread... but it's been awhile since I pulled that out of my brain. While I know what your getting at, asymmetric information is not quite the same as cheating. If the sales person was not truly aware of all the information or had wrong information they were not 'cheating' as you put it.

But in light of the events that occured it's pretty safe to assume that both the consumer and the salesperson were basing their decisions on 'imperfect information' and were therefore at risk for making / recommending sub optimal descisons for the purchase. (gotta love consumer theory eh?) Kixsand was trying to correct the situation, and I don't blame him for it. I just feel the salesperson could have handled the situation much better.

Yes...I think my preconceived notions of FS and their level of knowledge with Apple Computers certainly contributed to me doing what I did. Had I been in an Apple Store or at CPUsed or another store of the like, I don't think I would have ever thought of jumping into a situation like this.

... but you would never jump in to those conversations because that situation rarely arises at those stores! It's all about the knowledge base of the sales staff. The closest comparison to FS is CPUsed (as they sell both PCs and Macs), but thier staff is typically very educated on Macs. Maybe it's their training methods, the people they hire, or less products to keep track of... who knows?

 

[tristan]

I was going to introduce some economic theroy around the assumptions of perfect information and rational consumer behavor in my first post to this thread... but it's been awhile since I pulled that out of my brain. While I know what your getting at, asymmetric information is not quite the same as cheating. If the sales person was not truly aware of all the information or had wrong information they were not 'cheating' as you put it.

Then the salesperson was either ignorant or cheating the customers... either way the OP did the right thing.

I've dealt with lots of salespeople in both IT and financial services, both knowledge-heavy industries, and in my experience the information they volunteer always seems to suit them and their product. They use their expertise to either promote their product or prevent the customer from buying another product. (Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt.)

Then what happens is that the industry as a whole gets a bad reputation. Now pretty much everyone assumes that most people who sell financial or IT services is just out to enrich themselves and well tell you whatever they can to make the sale. People avoid the industries altogether, even though there are likely decent people selling decent services in those industries which could help them.

It's a market failure. It's used cars, crooked contractors, etc etc all over again. Who wants to live in that world? Not me.