Germany Urges EU to Require 7 Years of Updates and Repairs for iOS Devices

[velocityg4]

Personally, I like the idea. There's too much ewaste as is. This could reduce it. Over all I believe this would a big win for consumers, right to repair and the environment. The ones this would hurt most are manufacturers of cheap, spyware laden, disposable junk phones. Which I won't cry much over.

Hardware

I doubt this would affect innovation. As innovation occurs in flagship phones then filters down to cheaper models. Those generally sell to people who want the latest tech. I doubt this law would affect these much. As the average flagship buyer would still keep buying every one or two years.

Parts (especially batteries) and OS updates may even improve sales of flagship phones. As users who avoid these phones due to loss of longevity may show more interest. Plus they'd have an improved used market (higher prices). So, regular upgraders may update more frequently.

As for cheap phones. The biggest issues for seven years of OS updates is RAM and Storage. Both of which are cheap. It might add $30-$40 to the junk models for lets say a minimum 8/64 setup. So, there'd be an upward shift in the base price of new phones.

With seven years of OS and Parts. There'd be a huge market for used phones. Phones with three to five years of OS updates and parts availability remaining. At really cheap prices.

OS

The model for getting a new OS with functional drivers already works in Windows and Linux. There's absolutely no reason why this couldn't work with smartphones. They're just small computers.

The model would just need to work more like computers. Where there's a standardized BIOS like startup. Plus a generic driver system for basic hardware functionality. Then a repository of hardware drivers. Which the Android device could scan for proper drivers after setup. Allowing the user to also manually install drivers if they want. The Android ROMs could also contain an array of drivers for common hardware. As already works with Linux/Windows.

Easy Android distro (ROM) install. Could also bring about a new era of consumer choice. Not only could anyone easily install a de-Googled ROM. Big players like MS and Amazon may also be incentivized to make their own easy to install distros. Plus they'd probably court Android manufacturers to use their distro instead. This could lead to an era of competition for the best Android distro. Separate from the best phone hardware.

 

[amaze1499]

Nowadays renewal cycles are way too short. One year for new releases is just ridiculous. 7 years sounds reasonable. 10 years would be spot on.

Just look at the aftermarket prices for used iPhones for instance. After 4 years they lost usually up to 70% of its purchase value. iPhone 4 still works reasonably well, if it would not be for the software / features that made usage obsolete.

I refuse to get a new phone or MacBook each year just because of new emojis or a nice looking (granted) UI or a minor speed bump in performance. Still Apple is best when it comes to consumer software and hardware products.

 

[citysnaps]

Not German, but EU wide.

That's fine. If put into place, those extra costs Apple incurs (plus margin) would be passed on to purchasers.

 

[ruka.snow]

I can appreciate the need for enviromentability but at what point does the concerns point to sustainability of the companies making the product? If the idea is that spare parts are to be made available for 7 years, many people will hold onto their current device because they know they will able to get parts for it and get it repaired. So what happens to the companies making these devices? If people keep having their old devices repaired, they will not buy new and if they do not buy new it does not make it cost effective for the manufacturing to carry on production thus meaning the plant closes down.

People need jobs to survive and all this enviromental initiative will do is cause the close down of manufacturing plants because not enough new products are being bought because too many old products are being kept alive and when millions of people lose their jobs, governments will be thinking 'what have we done!!'

People will still buy things and/or prices will adjust. Prices adjusted when the yearly upgraders switch to 36months. Just because you can get parts and security updates for your six/seven year old phone doesn't mean it is going to work with the latest replacement for Facebook/MySpace, the latest video codec required by Youtube.

As for peoples jobs, look to Europe were we are trialing standard basic incomes, four day work weeks, and the world where people don't need to work 40+ hours a week there is still a income and you can top that up with more interesting work than assembling a phone.

 

[w5jck]

Only if Europe pays the US back every penny they got from the Marshall Plan in the equivalent of 2021 dollars. They would still be huddled around campfires in bombed out shells of buildings with very little industry and taking revenge on one another if we hadn't funded the rebuilding of Europe, yet they always want to unfairly restrict American companies these days. Go figure...

 

[bill38]

Very good

 

[profets]

Why? This is not new, AFAIK domestic appliances need to have 10 guarantee years of reparability

I think repairability and longevity would be excellent.

But I don’t think it should be forced.

do all electronics and companies who manufacture them do the same? Will they all be held to the same standard?

I think it’s already evident that Apple leads the market in this regard and people should vote with their wallet.

 

[beanbaguk]

Some of you are hilarious. These rights protect YOU. The consumer.

Having said that, the UK Consumer Rights Law of 2015, actually demands that manufacturers repair their devices for up to 6 years. (I think you get just one measly year in the US???), in the EU we get 2 years, but the UK....you get 6 years.

Apple even have it in their own terms!

Legal - Apple Products and Consumer Laws in the United Kingdom - Apple

www.apple.com

#JustSaying 🤣

@Objectivist how can you possibly disagree with something written into Apple's own terms!!!

You're so funny... 😂

 

[axantas]

They pretend to do something for the environment, by not including the power brick anymore, but force users to change the device itself because of lack of security and expired support of new operating systems. Microsoft is excluding a lot of "old" computers from Updates to Windows 11. Apple is on a similar path with Mac OS doing quite well with iOS.
I had to throw away a working 3 year old scanner from Canon due to lack of Windows 10 drivers.

A good idea to start somewhere, because it is feasible...

...and consumers get criticized for not using toilet paper on both sides.

 

[0924487]

Security, yes. Repair parts, maybe not so much. Apple could probably do it, but android makers don’t build in the same quantity that Apple does.

I really dislike the EU dictating to American companies.

American companies have the full freedom to exit EU markets. Just like Google exited China‘s consumer search market.

 

[Shasterball]

Great proposal! Environmental sustainability should really be one of our highest collective societal priorities.

We can't keep going with this annual phone upgrade madness and overpriced repair prices forever. It's not sustainable.

The FaceID camera on my iPhone XS stopped working the other day. I went to the Apple store and they told me they generally don't do repairs on any sensors on the front array, so all they could do is offer me a replacement phone for like 700 dollars or something crazy.

This is madness. If Apple would just repair the FaceID camera, I would gladly use this phone for another few years.

Totally agree. Everything we throw away, sticks around. Even if it is recycled. Remember, it's [1] REDUCE; [2] REUSE; and then last [3] RECYCLE.

Let's work on [1] and [2]. It's ok if your toy isn't as shiny as a new one if you are helping everyone out.

 

[Madhatter32]

American companies have the full freedom to exit EU markets. Just like Google exited China‘s consumer search market.

Well, comparing the EU with the CCP is not exactly what the EU was hoping to achieve ... or was it?

 

[saudor]

Nowadays renewal cycles are way too short. One year for new releases is just ridiculous. 7 years sounds reasonable. 10 years would be spot on.

Just look at the aftermarket prices for used iPhones for instance. After 4 years they lost usually up to 70% of its purchase value. iPhone 4 still works reasonably well, if it would not be for the software / features that made usage obsolete.

I refuse to get a new phone or MacBook each year just because of new emojis or a nice looking (granted) UI or a minor speed bump in performance. Still Apple is best when it comes to consumer software and hardware products.

Not sure where you live but even in Canada, they’re starting to phase out 3G networks and the CPU/GPU/RAM of the iPhone 4 simply cannot handle today‘s massive web pages. Even on my ipad 2 with 9x GPU and 2x CPU, it’s almost unusable. It may work as a dumb phone for texting/email though.

A6/A7 is probably the minimum for acceptable use right now.

Personally i want 2-3 year Cycles. Things like snow leopard was super stable

 

[visualseed]

Software updates for 7 years doesn’t necessarily mean that the device has to be on the latest version. I would imagine that having regular updates to older iOS versions for security patches would still be sufficient for devices that can’t handle the latest and greatest.

I agree that support for updates don't have to be the current release and can be bug fixes and security patches to whatever the last supported version was for that device, but I just had to toss two otherwise good smart TVs because Google and Sony couldn't even manage to do that. I think there is some balance that can be struck that allows hardware to stay viable as long a users are willing to deal with features not keeping up with shipping devices. Now that more things are cloud centric and new content types are dependent on new hardware for creating (VR, HDR Video, 3D modeling, etc) Older devices start to age even faster not because of their performance of baseline capabilities, but because of their inability to create, utilize and share new content types. As I said before I think 5 years is about the outside edge of viability for both Apple and the consumer. Even that is an extreme. In the history of the iPhone there have been 5 year windows that saw devices that did and didn't support iMessage or even have front facing cameras. The ecosystem and users benefit most from new features (or even old ones) when the greatest number of people have access to them. Those that just want a camera phone that can send messages and browse the web are probably not worried about feature updates and, sadly, not even security patches. Those that are hanging on to an old phone because it is all their budget will allow and need to access to feature parity with new devices will welcome any update they can get but will probably be frustrated as time goes on.

 

[rpt777]

Security, yes. Repair parts, maybe not so much. Apple could probably do it, but android makers don’t build in the same quantity that Apple does.

I really dislike the EU dictating to American companies.

I would like to see laws that make German cars more reasonable to repair and maintain.

 

[profets]

Why? The law tells car manufacturers they must install seat belts too.

That’s why I said ‘to a certain extent’.

Of course regulation should exist, especially to protect consumers. But a bigger more nuanced conversation should take place around it.

Something like a vehicle should have stricter regulations compared to a smaller less important commodity item.

I’m not saying electronics aren’t important, but if Apple will have to maintain 7 years of software updates and repairs for iOS devices I think a lot more discussion needs to occur. How did we arrive at 7 years? Should Macs be included? Watches? How about smartphones from all other manufacturers (I know google was mentioned)?

 

[c5z]

Security, yes. Repair parts, maybe not so much. Apple could probably do it, but android makers don’t build in the same quantity that Apple does.

I really dislike the EU dictating to American companies.

i mean if you want to sell to the EU market, they can request it. But dictate, not always.

I rather see a ruling dictate that TVs need software support for 5 years, similar to Apple. And not just security, but features too. I’m tired of them dropping support after 1 year.

I think 5 years is a healthy lifetime for both software and repairability.

 

[c5z]

I would like to see laws that make German cars more reasonable to repair and maintain.

This. And get 7 years of software updates too!

 

[4492865]

Only if Europe pays the US back every penny they got from the Marshall Plan in the equivalent of 2021 dollars. They would still be huddled around campfires in bombed out shells of buildings with very little industry and taking revenge on one another if we hadn't funded the rebuilding of Europe, yet they always want to unfairly restrict American companies these days. Go figure...

We will pay you back as soon as you pay reparations for 350 years of forced labour.

 

[grjj]

Apple already has a five year tail for all products. They are provided support and repair options for five years from when they were discontinued. In two locations: California and Turkey that tail is legally required to be seven years. Apple calls the period between five and seven years "Vintage" and over seven years "Obsolete".

Obtaining service for your Apple product after an expired warranty - Apple Support

Learn about your options for getting service and parts for Apple devices that are past their warranty period.

support.apple.com

For iPhones that means at least six years of repair options from release in most places. In some cases models are held over for a model year at a lower tier price.

So if Apple's already doing 5-6 (7-8 in a few areas) years for hardware and software support and Google is doing like two at most, why is Apple's name in this press release other than click-bait?

 

[Xtir]

Security, yes. Repair parts, maybe not so much. Apple could probably do it, but android makers don’t build in the same quantity that Apple does.

I really dislike the EU dictating to American companies.

Which are selling products in the EU you mean, yeah, really irritating, where do they get the nerve to.. o wait, these rules apply to EU companies as well? That's stupid indeed.. 😜

 

[0924487]

Well, comparing the EU with the CCP is not exactly what the EU was hoping to achieve ... or was it?

I’m not talking about politics, I’m talking about sovereignty. Companies should have no say in foreign nations’ policies, or just about any nations’ polices, including American.

The Companies’ job is to confirm to, not to influence, the policies. When money can buy politics, you cease to have a country.

 

[macpot]

I'm okay with this, but it seems unfair that Apple is forced to do this, while Samsung gets away with just 2-3 years of support...

 

[dwaltwhit]

7 years of updates would require a second version of ios, maybe ios legacy or iOS air. The rate at which hardware technology and internet demands are such that trying to run new apps or even surf the web on an older device would be untenable

 

[Madhatter32]

I’m not talking about politics, I’m talking about sovereignty. Companies should have no say in foreign nation’s policies, or just about any nations’ polices, including American’s.

Companies’ job is to confirm, not to influence, the policies. When money can buy politics, you cease to have a country.

Money (coprporate or otherwise) buys influence in politics and business and everything else from time immemorial. What you describe does not exist in the world. Also, it has nothing to do with a governing body arbitrarily selecting a foreign company to regulatory excess especially when comanpanies within its border engage in far more suspect anti-competitive and anti-consumer practices. See BMW et al.