faroZ06
macrumors 68040
Yeah I laughed when I read that. Also, remember Windshield Gadgets on Vista Home Premium? I almost paid for XP to get rid of that on a PC we had. Actually I ended up pirating it because MS discontinued it.
Google Claims a 'Hostile, Organized Campaign Against Android'
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Yeah I laughed when I read that. Also, remember Windshield Gadgets on Vista Home Premium? I almost paid for XP to get rid of that on a PC we had. Actually I ended up pirating it because MS discontinued it.
Your cool in my books scruff!
Text is a PITA sometimes since I think the context gets misread. Normal forum stuff.
NoStopN
macrumors 6502
Permissions system? Let's see, you want an app, but it does something that you don't like or understand. You either download it & install it or you don't. The same goes for an iOS app. The only difference is Android shows you what an app will spy on. With either OS, you play by their rules or you don't use the app.
The widget system? Some are helpful, some are just cluttering up the screen. Apple hasn't technically competed with these, but jailbreak developers have. It's called SBSettings.
The Intents system? I don't even know what that is.
The cloud to device messaging system? We can make this a broad subject. If you think about it, any website is on a server, so the entire Internet is a cloud server.
And live wallpapers? Again, Apple doesn't compete here, but the jailbreakers do. If you like live wallpaper, fine. It isn't all that spectacular or attractive to me.
Before the hate messages come my way, I have owned an iPhone, still own an iPad, and I have an Android Phone as well as an Android tablet. I know a lot about the advantages & disadvantages of all of them. Android was a necessary evil because I really wanted 4G data service. It's great. The phone that's attatched to it however, is not. The Android tablet is new enough to runthe latest versoin of Android 3.1. I was hoping that it would be everything that the phone's OS was & then some. In reality, some aspects of the tablet have gone BACKWARDS in capability to the phone. At least Steve Jobs & company have made people comfortable with iOS by being (for the most part) consistant no matter which device you use. Until Android gets into this same mode of thinking (would that be copying?), they will see more rollercoaster opinions about it.
parapup
macrumors 65816
I can only laugh at that and conclude that you've never used Android! Hint: My contacts, music, addresses, notes, photos, purchase history on Android market, list of apps, their settings (even Wifi system settings) are all in cloud and synced on each one of my Android device using single user id and password. And I don't even need to connect any of my Android devices to my computer - ever!
AppleScruff1
macrumors G4
Would you advocate piracy from Apple too? Just curious.
parapup
macrumors 65816
You don't seem to know a lot of the other things as well - believe me on that one!
faroZ06
macrumors 68040
Your cool in my books scruff!
Text is a PITA sometimes since I think the context gets misread. Normal forum stuff.
Sorry about that; I don't hate him, but I hate it when people call people who like Apple and dislike Google sheep.
AppleScruff1
macrumors G4
Your cool in my books scruff!
Text is a PITA sometimes since I think the context gets misread. Normal forum stuff.
Thank you!
It's good to see that some have a sense of humor.
LeoCastillo
macrumors member
And now something from Microsoft
Microsoft responds to the Google conspiracy theory...
Basically, Microsoft said we wanted to partner with Google to buy these patents.
Google said NO.
And Microsoft has the email to prove it -> http://twitter.com/#!/fxshaw/status/98932077327691776/photo/1
Got the update from this story here....
http://www.engadget.com/2011/08/03/google-slams-apple-and-microsoft-claims-hostile-organized-cam/
(remember, this is a Google-shouts-conspiracy story, not a Google-is-better-than-Apple-or-vice-versa story)
Microsoft responds to the Google conspiracy theory...
Basically, Microsoft said we wanted to partner with Google to buy these patents.
Google said NO.
And Microsoft has the email to prove it -> http://twitter.com/#!/fxshaw/status/98932077327691776/photo/1
Got the update from this story here....
http://www.engadget.com/2011/08/03/google-slams-apple-and-microsoft-claims-hostile-organized-cam/
(remember, this is a Google-shouts-conspiracy story, not a Google-is-better-than-Apple-or-vice-versa story)
No reason to be sorry. I didnt see him use the word sheep, he might have. If he did though I would picture it being very casual in a speaking manner. People see that or troll whatever.. and think its a callout. Like if I was talking to a friend and said "Don't be an Apple sheep." but said it with a smile and in a sarcastic/light tone.
Thank you!
Werd! It would suck if everyone just accepted everything apple does. Google and MS etc.. for that manner.
On topic, I dont think this will do much to overall marketshare for Android. It will be the Windows of phones, just not a 90% share. They will have to pay more fees and such I am sure. Why people argue between the phones is anyones guess, go back ten years. Yeah phones have come a long way. Anyone remmeber cell phones in those large bags.? LOL
charlituna
macrumors G3
My question is this: What were the license fees when Nortel held the patents. If they were the same or more than Google really has no grounds to balk. Unless they want to argue that Apple (who has full control of the patents) allowed the other groups to make a single bulk payment regardless of the unit issue and didn't offer Google the same opportunity. Having different terms is not viewed well under patent law, especially if the terms for one group are or could potentially be higher
Oh I don't know, I was rather amused by the Blackberry ad that popped up in one of my iPhone apps
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MattInOz
macrumors 68030
Given it's very much expected that the important Patents from this group for 3G and above will be added to a Patent Pool and be all willing to pay FRAND then this seems like it's just a bunch of chest beating by Google. So when the expected does happen Google can stand up a say they forced the group into doing something it had spent the last 6months with teams of lawyers working out the terms for.
Their fans will Lap it up.
AppleScruff1
macrumors G4
I had a bag phone and also one of the early "portable hand helds" that was quite large, much bigger than a cordless phone and as heavy as a brick. I also had a Motorola DPC 550 that would last almost 8 hrs on a charge!
Because suggesting a grid pattern is Apple's is ridiculous.
Zounds a rectangular grid to fit a rectangular screen! How did Apple come up with that one?
charlituna
macrumors G3
YOu mean the $150 million in non voting stock that was part legal penalty (for trade dress violations) and part getting Office onto Apple machines.
Ah yes, numerous Apple fanboys jumping on the Google-hating bandwagon and completely ignoring the facts of the case because they like shiny Apple products. You guys are as bad as religious zealots.
I can't say for sure if this is a coordinated effort against Android, but it's pretty obvious that a lot of players are trying to grab a piece of the Android pie. MS has already managed to squeeze licensing fees out of handset holders with their patents. Apple is using some absurdly broad ones to sue others. The problem is that the US patent system is hideously convoluted and has been warped to hell well beyond its original purpose.
Are you the little guy with a nifty invention? Patents won't help you. You could patent yours, but odds are you somehow stepped on someone else's stupidly broad patent and they will sue you. If you're successful, another company will hire a horde of lawyers to write a hundred patents a day to box yours in and completely keep you from staying on the market. This is almost exactly what the guys who discovered graphene were told when they asked a corporate clown if they would be interested in licensing a patent for graphene. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
Patent trolls run amok. Why? Because anyone can write an absurdly broad patent and sue with it. Prior art is so damned narrow that it's virtually useless. The SLIGHTEST change in a product is enough to invalidate prior art these days. Patent trolls are nothing but despicable little parasites. They produce nothing and their only business is suing others with patents they probably bought thirdhand. Then we come to software patents, something that should never had existed in the first place. You may as well try to patent a math formula. They're also much worse than physical patents because you're only patenting a method of doing something, and they usually involve slapping two items together, ie, the patent on garbage collection when iterating through a linked list, which is nothing more than mashing two existing ideas together. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
Then you have big guys with patents galore. These are not meant to protect jack squat. They're meant to be strategic assets. If a competitor is encroaching on your turf, is more successful than you, or is just making tons of money (among many other things), use your patent war chest to sue. If someone else sues you, use your patent war chest to retaliate, or use it as a deterrent to prevent suits in the first place. That's how it works. This is why Apple specifically sued HTC, because HTC is relatively small and cannot retaliate with patents of their own, at least not enough to put more hurt on Apple than Apple is putting on them. This is why Nortel's patents went at such a high price and were bid on by so many parties. It's not that companies necessarily think the patents are worth that much strictly so they can use them to make products. They're also incredibly useful for extorting licensing fees and settlements out of everyone else. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
The patent system is hideously abused, and guess who is right in there abusing it with everyone else? Apple. They're using stupidly broad patents to sue others so they can make even more money from those products. Apple is hedging their bets. If Android takes the bulk of the smartphone market, then Apple can still make bank in licensing fees for every Android phone sold.
Now look at Google's track record regarding patents. How many times have they sued others over this kind of crap? Very little, if at all. Don't mention how many times they've been sued. With today's patent system, that means nothing other than they were successful enough to be a juicy target. Google has been an outspoken proponent of patent reform for years, and you know what? They are absolutely right for the reasons I've mentioned and many, many more.
Google has far cleaner hands on the patent abuse front than Apple. To deny this is to be a raging fanboy without independent thinking skills. I like Apple products. I own many Apple products. But I'm not going to pretend that they're somehow a glowing example of the perfect company and that they can do no wrong, because they aren't, and they do. A lot.
I can't say for sure if this is a coordinated effort against Android, but it's pretty obvious that a lot of players are trying to grab a piece of the Android pie. MS has already managed to squeeze licensing fees out of handset holders with their patents. Apple is using some absurdly broad ones to sue others. The problem is that the US patent system is hideously convoluted and has been warped to hell well beyond its original purpose.
Are you the little guy with a nifty invention? Patents won't help you. You could patent yours, but odds are you somehow stepped on someone else's stupidly broad patent and they will sue you. If you're successful, another company will hire a horde of lawyers to write a hundred patents a day to box yours in and completely keep you from staying on the market. This is almost exactly what the guys who discovered graphene were told when they asked a corporate clown if they would be interested in licensing a patent for graphene. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
Patent trolls run amok. Why? Because anyone can write an absurdly broad patent and sue with it. Prior art is so damned narrow that it's virtually useless. The SLIGHTEST change in a product is enough to invalidate prior art these days. Patent trolls are nothing but despicable little parasites. They produce nothing and their only business is suing others with patents they probably bought thirdhand. Then we come to software patents, something that should never had existed in the first place. You may as well try to patent a math formula. They're also much worse than physical patents because you're only patenting a method of doing something, and they usually involve slapping two items together, ie, the patent on garbage collection when iterating through a linked list, which is nothing more than mashing two existing ideas together. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
Then you have big guys with patents galore. These are not meant to protect jack squat. They're meant to be strategic assets. If a competitor is encroaching on your turf, is more successful than you, or is just making tons of money (among many other things), use your patent war chest to sue. If someone else sues you, use your patent war chest to retaliate, or use it as a deterrent to prevent suits in the first place. That's how it works. This is why Apple specifically sued HTC, because HTC is relatively small and cannot retaliate with patents of their own, at least not enough to put more hurt on Apple than Apple is putting on them. This is why Nortel's patents went at such a high price and were bid on by so many parties. It's not that companies necessarily think the patents are worth that much strictly so they can use them to make products. They're also incredibly useful for extorting licensing fees and settlements out of everyone else. This does not encourage innovation. This destroys it.
The patent system is hideously abused, and guess who is right in there abusing it with everyone else? Apple. They're using stupidly broad patents to sue others so they can make even more money from those products. Apple is hedging their bets. If Android takes the bulk of the smartphone market, then Apple can still make bank in licensing fees for every Android phone sold.
Now look at Google's track record regarding patents. How many times have they sued others over this kind of crap? Very little, if at all. Don't mention how many times they've been sued. With today's patent system, that means nothing other than they were successful enough to be a juicy target. Google has been an outspoken proponent of patent reform for years, and you know what? They are absolutely right for the reasons I've mentioned and many, many more.
Google has far cleaner hands on the patent abuse front than Apple. To deny this is to be a raging fanboy without independent thinking skills. I like Apple products. I own many Apple products. But I'm not going to pretend that they're somehow a glowing example of the perfect company and that they can do no wrong, because they aren't, and they do. A lot.
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_5 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8L1 Safari/6533.18.5)
Oh dear God, no please. I hope Apple stops defending, acquiring and securing new patents so you don't stop buying Apple products. Steve Jobs, Apple's legal department and I won't be able to sleep worrying about you threatening to stop buying Apple products.
Give me a break with the drama and the empty self-threat. That would be like saying that you are going to stop using any of your favourite brands because the happen to rock so hard that the competition is haven trouble keeping up without infringing the law. Let me remind you that Apple has also find themselves in a position where they have had to shell out hard cash to buy or license other companies products.
Show consideration for anyone else?? This is a business not a charity.
Oh dear God, no please. I hope Apple stops defending, acquiring and securing new patents so you don't stop buying Apple products. Steve Jobs, Apple's legal department and I won't be able to sleep worrying about you threatening to stop buying Apple products.
Give me a break with the drama and the empty self-threat. That would be like saying that you are going to stop using any of your favourite brands because the happen to rock so hard that the competition is haven trouble keeping up without infringing the law. Let me remind you that Apple has also find themselves in a position where they have had to shell out hard cash to buy or license other companies products.
Show consideration for anyone else?? This is a business not a charity.
Lord Appleseed
macrumors 6502a
Apple and MS just want to finally reach their goal, which is wold dominion.
boss.king
Suspended
Whoops, I had quoted my own post
Ok, I guess I misunderstood your post, I took the fact you didn't mention Apple to mean that they were a better company in terms of inventing tech.
They improved the touchscreen phone. That's a far cry from inventing it. They built on technology from companies such as Fingerworks. Again not inventing.
There were many tablets that came long before the iPad. They were limited by technology of the time, but were still tablet-like devices. Apple used the experience they had from building the iPhone to improve their tablet (still not an invention: it's an improvement).
Pretty much.
Ok, I guess I misunderstood your post, I took the fact you didn't mention Apple to mean that they were a better company in terms of inventing tech.
They improved the touchscreen phone. That's a far cry from inventing it. They built on technology from companies such as Fingerworks. Again not inventing.
There were many tablets that came long before the iPad. They were limited by technology of the time, but were still tablet-like devices. Apple used the experience they had from building the iPhone to improve their tablet (still not an invention: it's an improvement).
Pretty much.
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Forcing a $15 de facto license fee per installed copy of Android is a good thing. Free software is a bad thing for the market and ultimately a bad thing for consumers. A 'free' software based market will eventually degenerate to complete stagnation and lack of service. Skilled developers have to earn a living and have to be given sufficient profit motive to continuously support and improve their wares. The best way to ensure this for the long run is for the end users of the software to simply pay for it. The 'free' software schemes are mostly a load of crap and result in crap products.
It is a goo thing that all the traditional software vendors banning together and forcing Google to effectively charge a fair price for their software before Google runs everyone else out of business and monopolizes the entire market to force all consumers to become part of their advertising market monopoly. Much better to do it this way than try to drag in some form of government intervention after it is too late and nothing but a stagnated Android is left.
It is a goo thing that all the traditional software vendors banning together and forcing Google to effectively charge a fair price for their software before Google runs everyone else out of business and monopolizes the entire market to force all consumers to become part of their advertising market monopoly. Much better to do it this way than try to drag in some form of government intervention after it is too late and nothing but a stagnated Android is left.
For somebody sucked into the Google hive mind as completely as you are, it's pretty ridiculous for you to go off ranting about fanboys.
Folks not so blinded by 'free'ware fandroidism as you can pretty plainly see that Google's game is to use their huge money pile to drive everyone else out of the market by giving it all away for free and forcing all consumers to fully join the Google collective where we will all be good little captive consumers of Google's advertising monopoly that makes their real money.
Apple, MS, HP, RIM, etc. will be doing the world a massive favor if they can force reasonable fees on Android and blunt Google's plans for total domination of the world's consumers.
godrifle
macrumors 6502
Microsoft's response
Microsoft PR chief Frank Shaw tweets a response to Drummond's post by including an email where Google turns down an offer to partner on the patent bid:
http://twitter.com/#!/fxshaw/status/98932077327691776/photo/1
Microsoft PR chief Frank Shaw tweets a response to Drummond's post by including an email where Google turns down an offer to partner on the patent bid:
http://twitter.com/#!/fxshaw/status/98932077327691776/photo/1
faroZ06
macrumors 68040
I'm not saying that Apple has the rights to app grids, but I'm just trying to describe their GUI. I guess a picture is worth a thousand words, so you can compare pictures of Droid and iPhone GUIs if you want...
faroZ06
macrumors 68040
It's a bit hypocritical to say that. First of all, you're ignoring the fact that people like Apple products for reasons other than shininess. Then you are going on the extreme side to call them religious...
The truth is, there are Apple fanboys, but most people here like Apple for legitimate reasons and don't like Google because of how little innovation they make. I'll admit, a lot of people tend to overlook Apple's faults, though.
Personally, I don't doubt that Google infringed some patents, but even if they didn't, I wouldn't mind since they are not an innovative company. They're not that bad, though. Microsoft is by far the least innovative big company (the least innovative overall would be those Chinese knockoff-ers). I do not want to see them benefit from this, but they might. And the only reason I want Apple to be successful is because I use their products because they are almost always the best, so I want them to be the primary producer. It's like how my Mac would have more software available for it natively if Apple defeated MS a long time ago. Ah well, I'll use VirtualBox and WINE.
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