Gps only available on 3g model?

Discussion in 'iPad' started by biscuits99, Apr 15, 2010.

  1. biscuits99 macrumors member

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    #1
  2. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

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    #2
    The iPad isn't like an iPhone. You don't have to activate service to have a usable device. So, it doesn't matter if you do anything with the 3G. A lot of us will be doing exactly that just because the GPS was a factor in purchasing.
     
  3. ZZ Bottom macrumors 6502a

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    #3
    Sorry but your last sentence is a bit confusing. Are you saying that the 3g iPad will perform basic GPS functions without any payment to AT&T for 3g service, or with the 3g turned off? By this I mean will it be able to run an app like Tom Tom and work effectively with the 3g turned off? I'm sure there are in app features that utilize the data network, but for core GPS turn-by-turn map usage, will it work without the 3g on?
     
  4. Telp macrumors 68040

    Telp

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    #4
    It should. The GPS is interdependent of 3G. As long as you can preload the maps onto the iPad, or have them cached after having viewing them on wifi, it should work well.
     
  5. aluren macrumors 65816

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    #5
    This might be a stupid question, but how does my wifi iPad pin point my exact location on Maps? Is it based on where the modem is?
     
  6. Telp macrumors 68040

    Telp

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    #6
    It is based off a triangulation of your wifi network using Skyhook. I'm sure other users here no more about it than me, but that's how.
     
  7. leomac08 macrumors 68020

    leomac08

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    #7
    The GPS WILL work without any 3G data or Wi-Fi data.....

    A blue dot will appear on the screen....and blink

    but pictures of the map will not be in the back.

    You will need to zoom in and zoom out while you have Wi-Fi on the area you're traveling.

    But the pictures of the map will not show, unless you pre-load them, or else all you get is a dot.:rolleyes:
     
  8. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

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    #8
    Yes, as noted, you don't need to 3G service activated. Everything will work fine with the exception of apps requiring a data feed, as you said. For instance, if you had Navigon, the maps are built in and the GPS will work fine but, if you're on the road, you won't be able to get the traffic data without the 3G data service. That's why TomTom and Navigon are 1.6GB. It's all the map data.
     
  9. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

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    #9
    That would only apply to the Maps app. The other GPS navigation apps all have pre-loaded map sets.
     
  10. Travisimo macrumors 6502a

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    #10
    Note too that the GPS will take longer to get your location without 3G activated because the iPad uses assisted GPS. This means it uses the data network to get the initial location first, which then tells your GPS receiver which satellites to track. Without data service, it will be relying solely on the GPS receiver to find your location... which is fine, but just realize that it could take a minute or two to get your location.
     
  11. leomac08 macrumors 68020

    leomac08

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    #11
    Correct, I should have said Google Maps.;)
     
  12. kAoTiX macrumors 6502

    kAoTiX

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    #12
    I'm sure the OP realises that you would need a Wifi connection to use the GPS through google maps as the maps themselves are not and cannot be cached.

    Alternative to that, TomTom on the iPad would not only be awesome but would not require 3G or Wifi as the maps are preloaded and only use GPS for your location.

    If someone could clarify that the 3G model has a separate GPS chip AND a separate radio for 3G then surely you could attach the GPS chip to the Wifi model iPad and get GPS without the need for the 3G iPad.
    I only ask because I do repairs and have already got parts for the Wifi model iPad but obviously I cannot get the 3G model parts yet..emphasis on the yet :D
     
  13. Nash Bridges macrumors regular

    Nash Bridges

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    #13
    You need to be connected to a network that can triangulate your position for the GPS to work. WiFi hotspots will only give the position of IP address where they came from. Unless they build a GPS receiver into the iPad itself, a 3G connection is the only way.
     
  14. qubex macrumors 6502

    qubex

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    #14
    The iPad features A-GPS, which means it uses other location data to boost the GPS's speed and accuracy when resolving locations. So, while by mod measures you will be able to use GPS even without activating 3G services, your performance might be slightly degraded compared to what it might've been if you had used the cues provided by the other systems.
     
  15. biscuits99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #15
    So you are saying if I am not connected to a network (3G), GPS wont work?

    Please could someone put True or False next to these statements?

    - The Wi-Fi only iPad has no GPS feature at all.
    - The 3G/Wi-Fi iPad has a GPS chip which will work with no SIM inserted.
    - If the 3G/Wi-Fi iPad is not in range of Wi-Fi and has no 3G Sim inserted, GPS will work, but map data needs to be pre-loaded, as in the way Offmaps app does it.
    - The GPS function will be quicker to lock on if you have an active 3G SIM inserted, but will work regardless.



    For reference I am in the UK.
     
  16. elfxmilhouse macrumors 6502a

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    #16
    false. you do not need to be connected to a cellular network. the 3G ipad has a gps receiver.


     
  17. nStyle macrumors 65816

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    #17
    where is the freakin 3g?

    Clarification - Google maps will not work unless there is 3G or Wifi available?
     
  18. jtara macrumors 65816

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    #18
    - The GPS receiver in iPhone and iPad 3G is built-in to the same chip that handles the 3G. There's no seperate GPS chip. It does NOT require a 3G or Internet connection to operate, but as others have pointed out above, it will take longer to establish an initial fix without a 3G connection, because the assisted GPS that speeds that up triagulates cell towers.

    Some may wonder why the GPS is in the same chip as 3G. Simple. In the U.S. it's been mandated that every cell phone have GPS. So, chip manufacturers have designed chips that combine these functions.

    - SOME (probably most) GPS applications will require an internet connection (either WiFi or 3G) for full functionality. For example, Google Maps needs an Internet connection in order to get the maps from the server. Navigon has the maps built-in, so will work without an Internet connection, but the real-time traffic feature obviously requires an Internet connection.
     
  19. elfxmilhouse macrumors 6502a

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    #19
    GPS and navigation are two different things

    in order to get a position via GPS you dont need an internet connection.

    in order to get other data, like you mentioned POIs, map data or traffic info, you need an internet connection. which are not part of GPS.
     
  20. biscuits99 thread starter macrumors member

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    #20
    Now the UK pricing has been announced, I think I'll go for a 3G version, but not get the SIM, so I can get GPS Apps working on it.

    http://www.apple.com/uk/ipad/specs/

    I'm presuming I can buy it without a SIM.
     
  21. Boblister macrumors 6502a

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    #21
    Whether or not there is a SIM left in when you buy the iPad is immaterial. The price has been fixed. My guess is it may have a complimentary sim in the iPad which would allow you to activate if you wished similar to the US model I believe. Much the same as a PC when you buy it often has AOL installed. You don't have to use it. It's not like the iPhone which initially was sold subsidised by the providers in return for signing a contract.
     
  22. jaw04005 macrumors 601

    jaw04005

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    #22
    A-GPS (cell triangulation-assisted GPS) works with or without a 3G data plan. Just because you don't have a data plan, doesn't mean you're not still connected to AT&T's towers.

    That's why you can sign up for a data plan directly on the iPad. The sim cards that ship with iPad 3G are pre-activated (at least here in the United States).
     
  23. Hmac macrumors 68020

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    #23
    The GPS works without a sim, but it needs wifi or cellular data access to get maps unless you've bought and downloaded an actual GPS mapping or navigation program.
     
  24. Full of Win macrumors 68030

    Full of Win

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    #24
    For the US models, the SIM comes with it; there is no way to buy one w/o it, at least for the normal distribution channels. However, you do not have to use it once you get it. You could take it out and put a potato chip in there and be fine.

    The only issue you would face is Google maps needs to download the maps. You can always get a GPS app w/ the maps preinstalled.
     
  25. MacRy macrumors 68040

    MacRy

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    #25
    I guess that skyhook is a US only thing as location services doesn't seem to work here in the UK at all. It seems pretty pointless activating it on the wifi only model if it doesn't work here.
     

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