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Discussion in 'Current Events' started by oldhifi, Jan 30, 2018.
Exactly. You can be deaf and get a license. Blind, not so much.
Most Motorcycle Sales are soft.
They have been for the last eight years, go figure.
Nothing to do with noise, cage drivers, meth, clothing, etc.
Even harder for Harley to remain a true American Manufacture as most
American companies are only assembling out of Mostly Foreign and Domestic components.
Honda, Toyota, VW, GM. etc
Motorcycles overall are in decline I think. I road (not a Harley) for 15 years. But with increasing congestion and inattentive texting drivers, it is too easy to die or be seriously injured. I’ll take some metal around me, belts and airbags on today’s highways. I have never had a close call as a result of my driving a bike. It was always a driver not seeing me, a semi’s retread surprising me or similar road debris. I wouldn’t ride now unless I lived rurally or for recreation on remote roads, like on the Cascade Loop, etc. And millennials just aren’t riding. My college daughter has zero friends that ride bikes or, nor do their friends.
But Harley still rules, by far, sales in US.
Harley-Davidson accounted for 29.3% of all new motorcycle sales in the U.S. in 2015, followed by Honda Motors at 14%, and Yamaha at 13%.
But: The median age of the typical motorcycle owner is 47, up from 32 in 1990 and 40 in 2009. And although its sales are slipping, Harley maintains a 55.1% share of the 35 and older male rider demographic. However, more troubling for the industry is the decline in riders under 18, which has fallen from 8% in 1990 to 2%, and those between 18 and 24 from 16% of the total down to 6%.
I read about this story last week and then yesterday I happen to see a story on Yahoo News talking about the Kansas Harley Davidson plant closing. The funny thing is the plant isn't in Kansas, it is in Missouri.
Yeah because with my windows up, air conditioner on, music playing and wife nagging the Harley noise is pretty prominent.
I vote of tall orange flags
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Friends with Harley’s always seem to complain about the shop time.
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I didn't even know there was a demographic of riders under the age of 18. It's legal in my state at 16, but not a single person I knew or in my high school did so.
We had a couple when I was in HS but one nearly cut a car in half when he got into an accident on 41 doing a bit over a hundred.
I feel for the workers who are losing their jobs - that's always a bad thing. Harley do need to review the market and find out what people want to buy. Triumph died years ago by producing bikes they wanted to make, rather than bikes people wanted to buy. They bounced back by listening to the market, diversifying into sports, touring and adventure bikes, and relentlessly improving and refining their range. Their modern classics (the Bonneville range) may have stolen some of the Harley market. They offer classic cool at a lower price, lower cost of ownership and superior handling. Their sales have gone from strength to strength.
As the partner of a former Harley upper management employee, I can tell you this has been coming for years.
Much has already been addressed in previous posts, however, the internal mindset and values that were espoused by the owners and management in the 1990s have pretty much been abandoned. The core customers allowed H-D to surf along, fat dumb and happy for many years, and was largely ignored. The price point wasn't a concern, either, as customers clamored for anything with the H-D logo on it.
For example, we would buy an employee purchase bike for a reduced price. We had to own it for a year, after which we were free to do as we pleased with it. Because of the huge demand and stupid prices, we would sell the bike at a profit and use the proceeds to buy another. Wash, rinse, repeat. After five years we had a free bike. Nice.
That notwithstanding, the inability of the Company to attract younger riders has been much of its demise. It's not a preferred means of transportation, it's not the "experience" or "lifestyle" that is attractive to younger people.
I had to chuckle when I saw that H-D was selling "trikes". I figured this was a direct result of the aging of its core demographic....
It was great place and amazing environment to be a part of at the time. Sadly, they've failed to gauge the market and demographics that they need to stay afloat. I could go on about decisions regarding Buell and other aspects, but enough has been said at this point. Sorry to see this happen, glad we sold the stock off years ago and invested it in Apple...
I wonder if the street series is done for the US or if they're going to import them from India
Last week...the EC decided to put a nice tariff on Harley to make it more expensive to EC people plus closing this plant shows that trump's MAGA is really working?
...and they would wear the best helmet.....this is why Geico and others limit medical payments to about $20K maximum....not sure if they pay for funerals.
Never felt the need to take part in the HD “lifestyle”. I rode for many years, but never HD. My brother recently purchased one. My Dad gives him crap all the time about it. My brother gives my Dad crap about his Honda. I stay out of those dust ups. Sold my bike this year after having a heart attack last year. No need to be on one with morons not paying attention and measing with their phones while they drive.
I wonder how many people messing with phones lead to the death of people on the road. Maybe we can ban those while we are banning things?
The struggle is that Harley is known for their beefy sound. Electric isn't going to give them the same thing.
There are also lots of younger more nimble competitors out there. I'd much rather get a nice Victory if I want to stick with muscle & gas, or look at Zero if I'm going for scary fast electric.
The Harley lifestyle is so aggressive and so obnoxious, that they've made their own problems with this. If you go into a Harley store, you're not welcome unless you're ready to be committed to the cult. If you just want to buy and ride a bone stock Harley, the riders will give you **** about it. It's a bike which is expected to modified, added on to, and ridden by hobbyists.
They realized long ago what yacht makers realized. "This isn't a vehicle for the average person. The people who buy our products are douches with something to prove. Let us serve that market!" Granted, Harley buyers are not as rich as yacht owners, but they are very expensive bikes nonetheless.
They are not vehicles with much practical use. i lived in Chicago where motorbikes were used as commuter vehicles here and there. And they were always old Hondas, cafe racers, a Ninja or two, and lots of variations of scooters. Harleys just aren't good for that. Never mind that stupid open chain that can and will rip your foot off. They're hardly all that space saving when putting them in a parking spot over a small car.
Other than weekenders, Harley's are used by people who like the open road. You see a lot of them, with an occasional Goldwing, driving hundreds of miles at a stretch across the country. Godspeed if that's your bag. But after 200 miles of bugs in my mouth, I'd be begging for a Ford Fiesta. (Note, my Dad is a tour enthusiast, and rode a BMW across Europe for his honeymoon. Maybe it's that bias, but as a touring bike, everything about the BMW bikes looks superior to Harleys to my observation.)
Personally, if I'm going to drop money on a vehicle just to have fun on, I'd rather get a jet ski or a snowmobile, because I won't instantly be killed if I lose control for a second.
Harley has made effortless money from their brand. I wonder how much they make from branded T-shirts, restaurants (seriously!), and whatever contribution they make to the Ford F-150 "Harley" model. (Commence massive eye-rolling.) They've done well for themselves. But bubbles don't last.
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To them I say: Speederbike or GTFO!
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That's the part of the Company known internally as "P&A", or parts and accessories. A good friend was head of P&A and it was a brutal, grueling job. It was a major cash cow for the Company, and everyone who made anything that could potentially be branded with the bar and shield wanted in. Standards were extremely high, and to become a supplier or company who sold trademarked items was a very difficult thing to achieve.
My favorite was when they were considering making and selling Harley Davidson cigarettes. Yup, they were going to get into the cigarette market. To give you an idea of demographics, one of their test markets was Terre Haute, Indiana. Smarter heads prevailed, and with the concerns over the Company promoting cigarettes as a part of the lifestyle this idea was quickly abandoned.
Those were heady times, for sure.
Harley's are known to be obnoxious, loud, form-over-function, over-priced, tending to break down a lot bikes. They use a gallon of locktite for the bolts on every twin they sell. Why anyone pays $40,000 for a motorcycle still using 1930's technology is beyond me; But then again, you have people that buy Alpha-Romeo's and Jag's knowing full well the car will break about 2 seconds after they leave the car lot.
More American jobs lost..
Perhaps they are tired of "winning"? Actually this saved lives....many of these riders are in danger of death on the road.
They need to build something like this:
Don't worry, it will be the new fancy toppic for masses... Make Harly Great Again!
Not to worry...Trump assures workers that this is how he is making America Great again.
Yeah, and no more wall to Mexico a fence will do the same but not so Great. Kovfefe!
Typical barking from someone who really has no clue what he’s talking about. This is how stereotypes continue to get reinforced over the ages.
I was prepared to respond but it’s just not worth my time and effort trying to bring some factual information to an otherwise insipid thread.
You pretty much lost me at Harley’s. It should have read, Harleys.