Has anyone e-mailed Tim Cook about...

[fischersd]

It would cost Apple more to perform those tests than it would to replace your watch, so from a financial point of view it makes more sense to them to replace the watch.

Also, do you REALLY think they will have the equipment and certified personell to do that in-store? After 6 months when stores start keeping stock of "white box" watches like they do with phones, they will be replacing on the spot like they do with phones.

It takes too much time and effort to do what you've just said. A lot longer than any "genius" (I hate that term) appointment.

You say the seals will be "well above" the IPX7 rating so if water gets in it shouldn't be replaced under warranty....you do realise that Apple is not perfect and there is such a thing as defective seals/manufacturing defects. There was a thread on here by a guy who had a gap at the top of his screen and from the picture it looked like there was a section along the top that had the seal missing. These kinds of defects will let water in and will be covered under warranty.

Heh, they don't do the analysis in store, obviously. They have an RMA department where these get shipped back to and technicians pull them apart to determine root cause. Now, the cost-of-materials at $84 sport watches, they may just toss, but the watch and editions, they're more likely going to want root cause on.

If the watches are designed well above IPX7 and there's water ingress, you've almost certainly done something over and above what they've warranted. (barring anomalies of component failure - which will get found out when/if investigated).

Me, I'd expect the warranty policies to be similar to those of the phone...but those that want to gamble, sure, go ahead.

 

[H3rman]

Heh, they don't do the analysis in store, obviously. They have an RMA department where these get shipped back to and technicians pull them apart to determine root cause. Now, the cost-of-materials at $84 sport watches, they may just toss, but the watch and editions, they're more likely going to want root cause on.

If the watches are designed well above IPX7 and there's water ingress, you've almost certainly done something over and above what they've warranted. (barring anomalies of component failure - which will get found out when/if investigated).

Me, I'd expect the warranty policies to be similar to those of the phone...but those that want to gamble, sure, go ahead.

Yes, they do get returned like the phones for inspection.....AFTER they have been replaced in store.

I know that right now supply is limited and in store exchanges are very rare, but in a few months when the dust settles and Apple Stores across the globe have the ability to repair them and hand out "white box" version they are not going to to a RCA in store!

By the time it gets back to the facility which performs RCA you have long gone with your nice new watch. What are they going to do? Come to your door and say "can we please have our watch back, because after doing a RCA it looks like the water damage was not due to defective parts".

Bearing in mind that it will be a good month or so down the line before the results of the RCA return. They are not just going to have 1 or 2 to look at, they will have plenty of them that have gone back for various reasons. Even with a 1% failure rate (which is low for consumer goods), with approx 2.3 million watches sold in the first weekend alone that is about 23,000 failures that will need to be looked at. They can't look at them all overnight. With each passing day there are more being manufactured and that means more defective ones hitting the shelves, so more being returned as well.

It's not realistic or practical to do what you are claiming. The watch is rated to IPX7, so if it gets water damage, they can't void a warranty claim, because they have no way to prove if you had it at 30cm below water for 10 seconds (within IPX7 rating) or at 100m below water for 2 hours when looking at it in store.

 

[fischersd]

Yes, they do get returned like the phones for inspection.....AFTER they have been replaced in store.

I know that right now supply is limited and in store exchanges are very rare, but in a few months when the dust settles and Apple Stores across the globe have the ability to repair them and hand out "white box" version they are not going to to a RCA in store!

By the time it gets back to the facility which performs RCA you have long gone with your nice new watch. What are they going to do? Come to your door and say "can we please have our watch back, because after doing a RCA it looks like the water damage was not due to defective parts".

Bearing in mind that it will be a good month or so down the line before the results of the RCA return. They are not just going to have 1 or 2 to look at, they will have plenty of them that have gone back for various reasons. Even with a 1% failure rate (which is low for consumer goods), with approx 2.3 million watches sold in the first weekend alone that is about 23,000 failures that will need to be looked at. They can't look at them all overnight. With each passing day there are more being manufactured and that means more defective ones hitting the shelves, so more being returned as well.

It's not realistic or practical to do what you are claiming.

Heh, I was going to update my post - you're too quick!

I was going to say "What do they do right now for phones?" - because it's going to be the same. There's "tattletale tags" inside the phones - little white squares of tape that turn red when they get wet. So, when you get them to swap your phone and it's been for a swim and you play innocent, what's the end-game? Do they charge you for it?

 

[jwball]

You're really going to email the CEO of a $775B company to ask about showering with the watch?

No he's going to send it to the public relations department to an email address Tim Cook doesn't actually read.

 

[H3rman]

Heh, I was going to update my post - you're too quick!

I was going to say "What do they do right now for phones?" - because it's going to be the same. There's "tattletale tags" inside the phones - little white squares of tape that turn red when they get wet. So, when you get them to swap your phone and it's been for a swim and you play innocent, what's the end-game? Do they charge you for it?

You can't compare the phone to the watch. The phone is sold as NOT water resistant in any way shape or form!

The watch is sold as rated to IPX7! If it gets water damaged (due to a failed seal or your own fault) they can't refuse a claim, because they CAN'T PROVE that you had it in an enviroment that exceeds IPX7 ratings.

If you have the watch submerged at 50CM for 10 minutes and it breaks then obviously any water "telltale" stickers will show its water damage, but 50CM for 10 minutes is WELL within IPX7 ratings so they are obliged to replace it. No ifs, buts or maybes. You can't sell a product rated to IPX7 if it fails when testing it within its rating.

On the other hand, how can they PROVE if you had it submerged at 100m for 2 hours?? During the iFixIt teardown there was no signs of water "telltale" indicators anyway. So they can't prove anything.

 

[fischersd]

You can't compare the phone to the watch. The phone is sold as NOT water resistant in any way shape or form!

The watch is sold as rated to IPX7! If it gets water damaged (due to a failed seal or your own fault) they can't refuse a claim, because they CAN'T PROVE that you had it in an enviroment that exceeds IPX7 ratings.

If you have the watch submerged at 50CM for 10 minutes and it breaks then obviously any water "telltale" stickers will show its water damage, but 50CM for 10 minutes is WELL within IPX7 ratings so they are obliged to replace it. No ifs, buts or maybes. You can't sell a product rated to IPX7 if it fails when testing it within its rating.

On the other hand, how can they PROVE if you had it submerged at 100m for 2 hours?? During the iFixIt teardown there was no signs of water "telltale" indicators anyway. So they can't prove anything.

Last post on this...repeating myself.

If the watch is designed to be significantly higher than IPX7, but attains water damage, then you've submitted it to higher stresses than the IPX7 rating (barring corner case component failures), correct?

By that token, the initial reaction should be - not covered - until investigated further by the RMA department. They'll determine if there was a defective component or not. And, hey, you could put it somewhere that the labour is really cheap, so it's feasible to recover the cost of the watch.

 

[grenhall]

I'm not sure about the original question here. Are you seriously going to email Tim Cook when the regulations of the watch clearly state IPX7?

IPX7. Protected against the effects of immersion in up to 3.29 feet of water for 30 minutes.

For more information about IP standards, refer to document number 60529 issued by the International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC).

Shower with it if you want. It's not going to break.

 

[H3rman]

Last post on this...repeating myself.

If the watch is designed to be significantly higher than IPX7, but attains water damage, then you've submitted it to higher stresses than the IPX7 rating (barring corner case component failures), correct?

By that token, the initial reaction should be - not covered - until investigated further by the RMA department. They'll determine if there was a defective component or not. And, hey, you could put it somewhere that the labour is really cheap, so it's feasible to recover the cost of the watch.

Not going to waste any more of my breath either. You honestly think Apple will make you wait 1 month to hear what the RCA is? Working in an industry where our kit costs hundreds of thousands, running into the millions at times I know that doesn't happen for a fact.

I'll go with my own experience over what someone on a forum says. However it doesnt even affect me as I dont shower with my watch anyway.

Let alone with something as (relatively) cheap as an Apple Watch.

 

[fischersd]

Not going to waste any more of my breath either. You honestly think Apple will make you wait 1 month to hear what the RCA is? Working in an industry where our kit costs hundreds of thousands, running into the millions at times I know that doesn't happen for a fact.

I'll go with my own experience over what someone on a forum says. However it doesnt even affect me as I dont shower with my watch anyway.

Let alone with something as (relatively) cheap as an Apple Watch.

Ok, last, last message on this. Simple. They give you a replacement watch, but get a pre-authorized charge on your credit card - if it comes back with water damage beyond the rating, you're charged for the replacement watch.

There, done.