Hazing in my fraternity!!

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by tkepongo, Jan 11, 2008.

  1. tkepongo macrumors regular

    tkepongo

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Location:
    Oregon State University
    #1
    So it's Initiation Week for our freshmen and last night two of them were hazed. Approximately at 10:30, I was reading my business law book and heard someone puking from the bathroom. I went in and saw a freshman on the floor, head resting on the toilet seat and puking like crazy. Downstairs in the basement was another freshman laying on the stripper stage and puking into a trash can.

    Apparently, our president and pledge educator got two freshmen to drink a fifth of alcohol within an hour before a scavenger hunt. So they missed out on the scavenger hunt and I spent the rest of the night feeding them bread and water and trying my best to keep them from passing out. At midnight, I go outside for some fresh air and the president and pledge educator were sitting out at the porch smoking!

    I think it's time for our president to step down from his position. He had taken the position for granted and have violated our fraternity's bylaws, changed our democracy into dictatorship, allocating our money into useless funds and have even forged MY signature into a house lease without my consent.

    So I think I'm going to send a formal letter to our Alumni Board president and ask for impeachment. If he doesn't get impeached, what would you guys recommend?
     
  2. ToddW macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    #2
    you know hazing is pretty bad in frats nowadays. however with that being said, the biggest rule in hazing is you don't do anything that you don't want. when i pledged i got hazed like a mother but i just kept telling them to stick it. i earned respect also. there are some pledges that just will do anything you tell them to. however those two guys should have also shown some restraint as well. be careful with what you are doing, you can get yourself blackballed. remember brothers stick with brothers. handle in the frat with the officers about the pledging activities first. say some restraint needs to be in order and that we need to watch the pledges pretty closely. the last thing frats need in this day and age is more negative press. frats are about brotherhood and getting laid!
     
  3. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2007
    Location:
    Colorado
    #3
    Makes me glad that when I went to college, I ignored the whole frat scene.
     
  4. .JahJahwarrior. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2007
    #4
    1. The biggest rule in hazing is don't do anything that's dangerous or illegal. You can argue this, but the rules of common sense are not on your side. You don't have to break the law or endanger people to earn respect.

    2. Shown restraint? How about respect for the law! And for their own fraternity bylaws!

    3. Brothers stick with brothers? What kind of brother is one that violates the law, your fraternity's bylaws, and the trust people have for each other (forging signatures is a violation of trust in my opinion)

    4. The last thing frats need in this day and age is to be allowed to do illegal and sordid things out of the public eye.

    Report them. Are the two guys who got hazed under 21?




    This is the reason I would never consider joining a fraternity, and often look down on those who do. The goal of life is not "brotherhood and getting laid" in my opinion. All I hear about are the stupid things that frats do, and the only support for it all is "it creates brotherhood!" Screw brotherhood. Brotherhood is not puking in a toilet all night!
     
  5. themadchemist macrumors 68030

    themadchemist

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2003
    Location:
    Chi Town
    #5
    I'm sure this violates multiple university policies and it sounds like your leadership is being pretty irresponsible. The wanton lack of restraint on the part of some frats or some members of some frats is wholly unacceptable. The fraternity system seems like it can be really positive for a lot of people, but there is this huge downside that has to be taken care of. Bad apples like the ones in your frat make people like me, who were never part of the Greek system, really question the value added.

    While I personally think you should report this, I have no investment in the politics of your situation. Remember that blatant violations can get a frat thrown off campus (it has definitely happened at my alma mater) and that you do have to deal with these folks for a while so it is best to have some coalition of support.

    That said, I vehemently disagree with ToddW's argument that because "frats are about brotherhood," you should try to avoid nailing these guys. Brotherhood should also involve looking out for your little brothers, not abusing and exploiting them. And if the "last thing frats need in this day and age is more negative press," then bozos like those that the OP describes should get their acts together.

    But the real question is...Your frat has a stripper stage?!
     
  6. keysersoze macrumors 68000

    keysersoze

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    Location:
    NH
    #6
    Consider discussing with your Chapter Advisor. You will need some high level backup if you proceed on this, and your CA is a good link to fast-tracking this issue up the chain of command. Also, it's a good idea to be firm in your belief of what you want to do, and your CA can help clarify your options.

    Hazing, including forced alcohol consumption, violates TKE's (I assume you are TKE by your post name) bylaws and should be reported. Hazing will likely not just end in an impeachment of officers. It is grounds for expulsion. If you feel unsafe in any way, you should report to your CA immediately.
     
  7. Much Ado macrumors 68000

    Much Ado

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2006
    Location:
    UK
  8. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #8
    To the OP- quite honestly, I think you should report it. What you just described is extremely dangerous behavior. Those two guys could have died. No one should be drinking that much alcohol in that short a period of time.

    Other than reporting it, your other option is to leave. It sounds to me like maybe this particular fraternity may not be a good fit for you.
     
  9. yellow Moderator emeritus

    yellow

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    #9
    Hmm... things sure seem kinder and gentler than when I was a frat boy.
     
  10. BanjoBanker macrumors 6502

    BanjoBanker

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2006
    Location:
    Mt Brook, AL
    #10
    Forced consumption of alcohol is dangerous and should not be allowed. Aside from that, I am a little confused. You say the two pledges were throwing up, but not how much they had. I am not sure I would call this a hazing incident. When I was a pledge, we had hazing. My dad had hazing when he was a pledge. The stunts the colleges and universities call hazing today are ridiculous. My son had to do some crazy things when he was a pledge, but I kept waiting to hear about being hazed. It never occurred. The politically correct police have labeled so many activities as hazing it is absurd. I say take it up with the pledge trainer and the president personally. In the event you are not satisfied with that result, bring it up at a chapter meeting. Do not go running off to the CA and national without handling it internally first, and avoid any getting your school involved at all costs. The last thing any Greek house needs in for the liberal press to get a hold of a "hazing" incident.
     
  11. yellow Moderator emeritus

    yellow

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    #11
    I think convincing someone to do it, and forcing someone to do it are very different things.

    Is this hazing, or 2 freshmen who are unable to make good decisions?
     
  12. themadchemist macrumors 68030

    themadchemist

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2003
    Location:
    Chi Town
    #12
    Even still, shouldn't the frat officers be encouraging positive behavior, not reinforcing bad decision-making? If this is bad judgment on the part of the freshmen, which it certainly is, then it sounds like it is definitely also bad judgment and poor leadership on the part of these officers.
     
  13. tobefirst macrumors 68040

    tobefirst

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2005
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    #13
    Interesting fact:

    You have, in your time at MR, posted enough information for anyone reading to contact your school president and let them know of the events that go on in your fraternity.
     
  14. yellow Moderator emeritus

    yellow

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    #14
    Agreed. I cannot argue that the frat officers also made poor decisions here, but it seems like all were willing participants.

    What I don't see is how the cry of "hazing!" is relevant. Seems like a knee-jerk reactionary phrase to me, and more likely, an excuse to create a power-struggle within the frat's political hierarchy.

    It's far more adult to confront the problem head on by talking to all parties involved and finding out how and why it happened and what the purpose was behind it, before running off to the CA or the HQ to complain about "hazing".
     
  15. tefleming macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Location:
    ATL
    #15
    As a former pledge educator (back the day): QFT
     
  16. jive macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2006
    Location:
    Scotland
    #16
    What on earth is hazing?


    </Scottish>


    Having just read about it in Wikipedia, you're all sick f**ks. Some of that just sounded torturesque.
     
  17. yellow Moderator emeritus

    yellow

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    #17
    Typically:
    "Persecuting or harassing with humiliating tasks, words, or actions."
    or
    "An infliction of physical or mental harassment. Specifically prohibited as a component of pledge education."
     
  18. Osarkon macrumors 68020

    Osarkon

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2006
    Location:
    Wales
    #18
    I've been wondering that as well. I'm guessing it's some American thing?

    EDIT: yellow answered in the same breath as I asked, heh.
     
  19. tefleming macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Location:
    ATL
    #19
    It's a very ill-defined word.

    Some people mean it to encompass even the annoyances that are brought up new members to an organization (need not be greek - sports teams and the military have some pretty intense sorts of hazing.)

    I've always preferred to use it in reference to dangerous or immoral activities (drinking is, per se, neither - being "forced" to drink copious amounts is of course both - therein lies the problem, now we need to define "forced".)

    ///EDIT: not just an American thing, according to Wikipedia:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hazing
     
  20. mduser63 macrumors 68040

    mduser63

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2004
    Location:
    Salt Lake City, UT
    #20
    Me too. The whole thing gets a serious, big :confused: from me. Nothing about the whole idea seems appealing to me at all.
     
  21. RedTomato macrumors 68040

    RedTomato

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2005
    Location:
    .. London ..
    #21
    OK so I know what hazing is. But what are frats? What's the advantage of being in a frat?

    And forging your name on a house lease is a criminal activity and a breach of trust. And it could make you liable to pay any shortfall in the total rent if someone else (or everyone) defaults, as well as paying for any damage caused by anyone in the house. (depends on the lease small print)

    If it was something you should have signed anyway, that's probably overlookable, but if it's a lease for somewhere you're not living in, get it sorted out.
     
  22. tefleming macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Location:
    ATL
    #22
    Social organizations, joining sort of gives you an automatic group of friends.

    Some, it sounds like the OP's is, are residential. You live there, party there, etc.

    My guess is that the OP was supposed to have signed the lease but hadn't - therefore, rather than holding up the whole lot, his house president signed for him.
     
  23. jsgreen macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2007
    Location:
    NH
    #23
    If your fraternity chapter is national, I'd recommend you look to the support of the National governing body on a recommendation of how to handle it.

    If you are a local organization, then you and the rest of the boys need to step up to the plate and get your house under control before 1) someone gets hurt or killed 2) the house gets disbanded 3) Sued by an irate parent 4) brothers get expelled
     
  24. dpaanlka macrumors 601

    dpaanlka

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2004
    Location:
    Illinois
    #24
    I think fraternities are great for anyone that wants to do what it takes to be in them. Me personally... I almost made it but dropped out in the end. Not because of hazing, but I felt too old and disconnected from the rest of the people (I'm about two years older than most).

    If you're going to be complaining about drinking and other sorts of things, then a fraternity isn't really for you.
     
  25. tefleming macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Location:
    ATL
    #25
    If that's what you want.

    Just know, that going to Nationals or the school administration will result in your chapter losing their charter.

    If these guys are/were your friends, you owe it to them and the rest of the house to *try* and resolve this within the house.
     

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