Help! They're brainwashing my kid . . . !

[nhcowboy1]

the easiest solution (and the one that everyone in this thread missed) is to simply buy a windows desktop.

Yep, in the end, I couldn't bring myself to spend $300 for another laptop. A friend offered me a desktop, and that's what we'll likely do. The kid needs a laptop for the several hours a week that he's at the public library - but he can make do with his iBook, and finish stuff up on the PC when he gets home.

Thanks, cherry su, for the "netbook" suggestion - that's something I'll look into for the future.

I'm also feeling a bit less frustrated now than I was on Sunday. I've found out we're not the only Mac owners in the school, and all the others are suffering through - and coming up with solutions to - the same problems that's we're facing. The PC owners are not all that happy either (unless they've invested in Word '07). Despite the objective of teaching the students technology, the school clearly didn't think through its own technology choices very well!

Which is something that can be addressed in the future . . . . (so I'll be going to that parent-teacher meeting tonight!)

 

[thejadedmonkey]

I just skimmed the first page, so apologies of the 3rd page discussion is much different.

Don't get an acer. All I've heard is bad things about their laptops. Go to your local walmart and get the $700 Dell 1318. It's a nice 13" portable PC that's moderately equipped (think Vista home premium and 2gigs of RAM).

erm.. nevermind.

 

[Plutonius]

It sounds like you could get a Mac that would do everything your son needs but why bother ? Buy the $300.00 windows laptop for your 12 year old son and save the money for college.

edit: Congrats on the desktop purchase

 

[notjustjay]

Again I'd just like to say that it really is a good idea for people to "broaden their horizons", so to speak, and learn to use -- properly! -- both Windows and Macs. We're laughing at the gross misinformation that these teachers have about Macs, yet the OP is proposing to shelter his kid from having to use Windows if at all possible -- aren't these two statements completely at odds?

I know a lot of Mac users who refuse to use Windows, and if they do, they take a very close-minded approach to it -- they grudgingly click somewhere, and when it doesn't do exactly what the Mac does, they give up and say "See? It sucks, give me my Mac back." You've all seen it, and you all know how annoying that is. If it was a Windows user that did that on a Mac, you'd be fuming.

Windows desktops are dirt cheap (I know I can get one used, fully configured with XP Pro and a 19" CRT monitor for less than $100!). Learn to use it properly. It's not as bad as you think (just like the PC-using teachers realize the Macs are not as bad as they think, once they've taken a proper look). And OK, you might still hate it, but at least you'll know how to deal with it.

Trust me, someone who can properly use any platform (Windows, Mac, Linux) with a reasonable learning curve, is MUCH more useful/employable/pleasant to deal with than someone who insists that THEIR platform is the best and everything else must be avoided or switched at all costs.

 

[chill.]

Just don't tell the posters that wrote posts #2, #3, #8 and #16. I doubt that they will agree that your solution was missed since they all mentioned the same thing...

i thought they all mentioned a windows laptop, whereas i suggested a desktop. i might not have read carefully enough though, i apologize

 

[applebum]

Again I'd just like to say that it really is a good idea for people to "broaden their horizons", so to speak, and learn to use -- properly! -- both Windows and Macs. We're laughing at the gross misinformation that these teachers have about Macs, yet the OP is proposing to shelter his kid from having to use Windows if at all possible -- aren't these two statements completely at odds?

I know a lot of Mac users who refuse to use Windows, and if they do, they take a very close-minded approach to it -- they grudgingly click somewhere, and when it doesn't do exactly what the Mac does, they give up and say "See? It sucks, give me my Mac back." You've all seen it, and you all know how annoying that is. If it was a Windows user that did that on a Mac, you'd be fuming.

Windows desktops are dirt cheap (I know I can get one used, fully configured with XP Pro and a 19" CRT monitor for less than $100!). Learn to use it properly. It's not as bad as you think (just like the PC-using teachers realize the Macs are not as bad as they think, once they've taken a proper look). And OK, you might still hate it, but at least you'll know how to deal with it.

Trust me, someone who can properly use any platform (Windows, Mac, Linux) with a reasonable learning curve, is MUCH more useful/employable/pleasant to deal with than someone who insists that THEIR platform is the best and everything else must be avoided or switched at all costs.

1. If you would read the original post thoroughly, the OP was actually looking for solutions that would allow the son to use the iBook he already has, and hopefully not spend any more money. I really don't think that is trying to shelter the kid from using Windows.

2. There are very few Mac users who haven't used Windows. There are a whole lot of Windows users that haven't used Macs, so most of us Mac users certainly know how to use both platforms. Most of us use Macs because it works the way we want it to - and no we don't want to use another OS that doesn't work that way. Doesn't mean we don't know how to use it - we just don't like to.

 

[sickmacdoc]

i thought they all mentioned a windows laptop, whereas i suggested a desktop. i might not have read carefully enough though, i apologize

Hey, I will give you that one! It appears that the first three did actually suggest laptops and only the last one left it open to "cheap PC" which could be either way! No biggie either way since apparently the desktop is going to wind up being the answer!

 

[munson]

You situation angers me. The fact that schools are not willing to accommodate for your kid is absolutely ludicrous!

First, .docx is stupid, and makes no sense - .doc works perfectly fine. You could ask whomever sends out the attachments to send them as .dco rather than .docx files (not really much work, it's a simple change in the preferences menu).

Second, you might have been able to find a converter for the audio files, or find a program that can play them (VLC perhaps?).

I'm glad you found a decent solution to your woes, however.

(I do realize that these things most likely have been said, but I needed to vent after reading the OP)

 

[sabre364]

Is it just me or does anyone else find this thread absolutely ridiculous?

I grew up using macs in school and PCs for most programming/DDP/electrical etc classes. I now use a MBP, but prefer a PC. I like a lot of features in this MBP, but thats about it.

You are complaining about what computers the school uses? :ugh: 90% of schools use Apple products, should I complain when my children go to their public school and are using apple products just because I prefer PCs?

I feel exactly the opposite you do. I thought they tried to brainwash us in grade school by making us use macs.

I don't even know what to say about this.

 

[munson]

Is it just me or does anyone else find this thread absolutely ridiculous?

I grew up using macs in school and PCs for most programming/DDP/electrical etc classes. I now use a MBP, but prefer a PC. I like a lot of features in this MBP, but thats about it.

You are complaining about what computers the school uses? :ugh: 90% of schools use Apple products, should I complain when my children go to their public school and are using apple products just because I prefer PCs?

I feel exactly the opposite you do. I thought they tried to brainwash us in grade school by making us use macs.

I don't even know what to say about this.

Regardless of whether or not you feel that you're being brainwashed to the "other side" or whatnot, you should not be excluded in school because of the OS you use. They should at least be able to do a small amount to accommodate for you/them/us/etc. especially since they are using their own equipment, meaning that the school gets to save costs. If you were using a PC in High School, wouldn't you want the files sent to you in a windows-friendly filetype, rather than say, a .pages file?

 

[Doctor Q]

Is it just me or does anyone else find this thread absolutely ridiculous?

I don't.

I think it is a disservice to our children to make decisions about school equipment without doing a comparison based on facts. When either anti-Mac myths or anti-PC myths (not to mention people's lack of knowledge about Linux) produce a "we'll consider only one choice" mentality, I think we should speak up. When it happens where I volunteer, I provide teachers and administrators with a more fair-minded evaluation of the tradeoffs. That usually involves countering anti-Mac propaganda.

In schools I'm familiar with, where an appropriate evaluation has been made, some classes are found to be best off with Macs, and others with PCs. Either platform may get the edge because of the particular material being taught or software being used. Examples: Macs in a class focused on image editing, illustration, web design, and multimedia; Windows PCs in a class that relies specifically on AutoCAD.

Sometimes, Macs also get the edge because of Apple's support for education (help from Apple staff in planning use of classroom computers, and Apple's resources for teachers), the iLife suite, because the teacher is more familiar with Macs, or because assistance with Macs (from people like me) is more readily available. Other times, PCs get the edge, such as when the teacher will rely solely on support from the school district, and the district treats Macs as second-class citizens in the support they provide.

When we look at the true costs and benefits in a particular case, Macs come out ahead more often than not.

 

[Chandler Adaway]

I now use a MBP, but prefer a PC. I like a lot of features in this MBP, but thats about it.

I think what's ridiculous is the fact that you spent $2000 plus on a Mac when you prefer a PC.

I think your being a little dramatic, because anyone that spends that much money on a computer has to PREFER it, or NEED it.

If you PREFER a PC, then spend half of what you spent on your MacBook Pro and get a PC with better specs.

It doesn't make since to talk down a product that you bought for $2000+ knowing that you prefer PC's.

 

[msheldrick]

by using .docx instead of .doc is ridiculous. It's not like all of the parent's wallets are bottomless pits where they can fork out money just because the school can't export the documents in "Compatibility Mode" I would recommend getting your Son a MacBook it's well worth it (I'm 14 and bought my own) especially if he's doing programming, he can boot into Windows and explore Visual Basic and in OS X he can explore around Xcode (on Restore Disk #2) and when doing anything processor intensive the MacBook runs rings around the iBook.

 

[ebel3003]

To be completely honest, I didn't take the time to read through every response. But I'm going to have to say, as a die hard Mac user and an IT Pro in this industry: If computers is what he loves and if he's going to compete in this industry, he's going to need to know both sides of the spectrum. That means, not only knowing Windows, but being confident in Windows. It's best to just concede this time. Either way, he'll probably realize that it's much more comfortable to work on a Mac, anyways.

If you want to shell out the dough, go for a MacBook and go the dual boot route, otherwise just get a cheap Windows-based laptop.

Also, Office Home and Student is only $85 right now (with free shipping): http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Off...sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=software&qid=1215723814&sr=8-1

 

[Doctor Q]

If computers is what he loves and if he's going to compete in this industry, he's going to need to know both sides of the spectrum.

Agreed, but I'd like to make some comments about the students I help, who are middle school age:

* Exposing young students to multiple experiences is a good way to keep their eyes open and their brains working, but the job market should not be a concern at this age. The jobs they take someday will very likely involve computers in some way, but they won't be the computers of today. They will reflect the state of technology in a decade. Skills with any specific software that we teach them today are unlikely to help or hinder their skills then.

* The goal to give them variety should apply to more than the operating system. They should experience multiple word processors, multiple web browsers, multiple image editors, and so on. For hardware, the vendor (Apple vs. PC vendors) is less important than giving students a variety of experiences with peripheral devices, e.g., have them use a mouse, a trackpad, a drawing tablet, a microphone, connect scientific instruments, display their work projected on a big screen, etc.

* If students have a home computer, it's most often a PC. To give them variety, you'd therefore have them use a Mac at school. There is a minor disadvantage, in that they will be more facile on day one with a computer at school just like the one they use at home, but kids learn fast and the exposure to something different benefits them on day two. Since some students have Macs at home, the argument works both ways, and we don't actually consider this factor.

* Some kids need an extra boost of enthusiasm at this age, when some start thinking it's not cool to work hard at school. The Apple coolness factor excites them. I've seen it every year since we re-equipped our computer classroom with Macs. Even parents who use PCs themselves are glad to have their kids in this Mac environment. It's not a deciding factor when we equip classroom, but getting a boost to student motivation is a nice bonus.

 

[TEG]

Just a note - .docx will operate just fine if you get Office 2008. You can also run Windows on an iBook with Virtual PC, which should be cheaply available on eBay.

TEG

 

[seashellz]

yeah-when the others see the irony that Windows runs BETTER, smoother, faster on a MAC than it does on a PC (properly installed)....no BSOD, no freezing-no viruses to worry about-theyll be green with envy
You might mention that Mac has had only 1-2 in the wild (meaning alert type bugs)in the last 10 years whereas Windows has had thousands.
You might mention that Secunica, computer security company puts out an annual index of virus-Mac is 1-2 pages--99% are THEORETICAL-wheras Windows usually has 20 pages-MOST of them out in the wild real world.

Windows has been on Mac now for-at least 2 years-and no virues bugs trojans
to speak of-if any.
Anyone who was going to mess with Macs on a national basis-would have dones so by now...IF they had been able to...but becasue of the UNIX foundation-its either very hard or impossible to do

 

[nhcowboy1]

A response and an update.

First, in response to sabre364, who wrote . . .

90% of schools use Apple products, should I complain when my children go to their public school and are using apple products just because I prefer PCs?

I feel exactly the opposite you do. I thought they tried to brainwash us in grade school by making us use macs.

The reason for using macs in schools is that they are more cost-effective. There are multiple other reasons, but in the end, it's got to get down to money - and macs, over the long haul, end up costing less.

There are two - no, actually three - issues here that I was concerned about: first, the unfortunate situation that my son's small charter school has invested in a large number of PCs that will probably not be cost-effective in the long run; second, that the school administrators invested in various software systems that were not mac-compatible, thereby creating problems for any students who have macs as their home computers; and third, that someone, in the midst of this, had convinced my son that macs were no good and he should just dump his mac and switch to a pc (which would, of course, eliminate the problems he was having downloading and submitting homework assignments).

Now, the update . . .

First, the software system that has caused us the most frustration (a rather nifty program called GoCourse) was donated to the school, and GoCourse is staying in touch with the school and attempting to fix the problems we've encountered. So, I am optimistic that some, if not all, of the problems will be resolved.

Second, the school administrators have realized that .docx files are a nightmare for a lot of people, and not just mac users - so I believe that they will avoid using this format from now on.

Third, it appears unavoidable that my son will need to have access to a windows platform once he starts programming classes. The good news is that he didn't get into the programming class this semester, and by the time he does get in, the prices on used macs with dual platform capabilities will have dropped significantly. (He better not hear me say this, but with any luck, he won't get into programming for another year - and by then we should be able to get a used macbook for a very good price!)

And, lastly, he has now taken to carrying his iBook back and forth to school with him. Yes, they do have PCs at school with access to all the school software. But, according to the kid, the PCs are "nothing but problems" and he'd just as soon have his iBook to work with!

 

[sra. Aguirre]

the best joke ever!

but the teachers didn't at first....

The major complaints from the staff were:
- There are no virus scans on a Mac.
- You can't get disk defrag on a Mac.
- Vista is more secure.
- There is no Aero theme for Mac.
- Powerpoint doesn't work on a Mac.
- There is a different internet for Macs and it has less content (yes they were serious and I couldn't stop laughing).
- Adobe doesn't make software for Mac.
- Apple sells less than 10,000 computers world wide each year so it will go out of business and we wont be able to support our equipment. (kind of funny because they are leasing the stuff, so it wouldn't make any difference).
- Macs don't have M$ Moive Maker.

This is the best list of "objections to buy a Mac" i ever read in my life!
I LMAO!!!! thanks...

and it is scay to read in what Windows obscured world we live....

 

[Chandler Adaway]

And, lastly, he has now taken to carrying his iBook back and forth to school with him. Yes, they do have PCs at school with access to all the school software. But, according to the kid, the PCs are "nothing but problems" and he'd just as soon have his iBook to work with!

You raised him good, dad.

 

[voxnj]

Funny, I just helped my mum's school update their IT.

The school ended up with 25 Macbooks in a portable lab, so they are a part of a trolley that cant be moved from room to room it has a built in airport hub and 1 TB RAID 1/0 disk for a network back up. It means that every class could get a whole lab without having to build a purpose built centre. It's really cool the student love it but the teachers didn't at first....

The major complaints from the staff were:
- There are no virus scans on a Mac.
- You can't get disk defrag on a Mac.
- Vista is more secure.
- There is no Aero theme for Mac.
- Powerpoint doesn't work on a Mac.
- There is a different internet for Macs and it has less content (yes they were serious and I couldn't stop laughing).
- Adobe doesn't make software for Mac.
- Apple sells less than 10,000 computers world wide each year so it will go out of business and we wont be able to support our equipment. (kind of funny because they are leasing the stuff, so it wouldn't make any difference).
- Macs don't have M$ Moive Maker.

The thing was that the teachers were so misinformed about Apple and what they can offer, the worst bit was convincing them. Most long term users of any system get a mindset and it is very hard to change even if there is a far better system.

Sounds like the teachers in Wasilla

 

[benthewraith]

My 12-year old started 7th grade last week - at a new charter school specializing in science and technology.

Despite all the wonderful things I'd heard about the school when it opened last year, I was appalled to discover, when I visited, that the school's laptops are all PCs - either because of an unfortunate decision by the school's original director (who's no longer there) or because that's what someone was willing to donate.

Now that classes have started, I'm realizing all the ramifications of their in-house PC-use. Homework is accessed through a program called "GoCourse" - which has only a partially functional online interface - and a fully functional downloadable interface accessible only to Windows users! Homework assignments - as well as email attachments sent out to students and/or parents - are generally in .docx format - also not readily accessible to MAC users. And the worst of it is that they've convinced my kid that his computer (a very nice little 14" iBook) is inferior to their Pieces of C*** because it can't readily deal with the stuff they're sending him. (Someone has also convinced him that his MAC is inferior because it doesn't have all the nifty virus protection their PCs have!!! )

The school's programming courses also seem to be Windows-based . . .

I know I'm not going to be able to get the school to switch to MACs - unless someone is willing to donate 5 dozen of them to the school! But I would like to have a coherent response when my son comes home and tells me he wants to toss his iBook and get a PC laptop instead.

I could also use whatever shortcuts anyone might be able to suggest to make accessing my son's homework a bit easier. I've already downloaded a program to convert the .docx files to .rtf format - but audio files remain a problem. The kid needs to record words for his Chinese class - and the best I can come up with is to record in garageband, save to iTunes, and then convert to a Mp3 (or similar). Anybody got a better idea?

I can, if I have to (and obviously not inexpensively), set up a Windows platform on the iBook . . . Anyone have any thoughts on this? (The iBook is a 1.33 G4, currently running Tiger.)

Homeschooling, by the way, is not an option!

Get him a Macbook with Microsoft Office 2008 (which uses the .docx,.xlsx,.pptx formats).

And you can use Quicktime to record notes/words for his class.

 

[Doctor Q]

If students have a home computer, it's most often a PC. To give them variety, you'd therefore have them use a Mac at school.

I realize that you could flip this argument: See what the school uses, and buy the other kind of computer at home!

 

[ravenvii]

You raised him good, mom.

Fixed that for you

 

[donga]

to OP: mad props to you for being so engaged in your child's educational experience.