Help with Hard Drive solutions!

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by TheTraveller, Mar 17, 2011.

  1. TheTraveller macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    #1
    Hey everyone

    I need some help in deciding on what I should do in regards to hard drives for my edit system. I have read a couple of threads, but would still like some help.

    I am currently thinking of going with two 2-3 tb internal drives. Of course the second one would be a mirror as a backup. I currently have a 500Gb external for my time machine, and a 1tb drive I am currently using to keep my P2 data from my camera.

    Would my proposed solution be a good idea? I would be using the drive as an edit for FCP and a storage of the raw P2 data off the camera.

    I have an 07 model Mac Pro.

    Thanks
     
  2. dbhopkins macrumors newbie

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    USA
    #2
  3. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

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    #3
    IMO you would be better off with e.g. two or three 1TB HDs in RAID 0 and then at least one high-capacity drive for backups (NO RAID 1, since it is not a backup). RAID 0 provides much greater performance than any single HD can so it would noticeably increase your read and write speeds, for pretty much the same cost as one big drive would.
     
  4. philipma1957, Mar 17, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2011

    philipma1957 macrumors 603

    philipma1957

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    Apr 13, 2010
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    Howell, New Jersey
    #4
    this seller on ebay has sold 20 to 30 3tb drives to me.. i made at least 5 purchases from him.



    http://cgi.ebay.com/Western-Digital...ltDomain_0&hash=item4157b6a836#ht_1352wt_1141


    if you offer 160 to 170 he will take the offer. they come sealed and work great. 3 yr warranties. I HAVE LEFT HIM A LOT OF GOOD REVIEWS. My review name is philipma1957.

    I sold a few on ebay my self and I built a few mac pros with 10 tb setups. So for the 3tb hdds he is a good source. here is a photo of what comes in the sealed box
     

    Attached Files:

  5. TheTraveller thread starter macrumors newbie

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    Mar 17, 2011
    #5
    Ok so your saying just use a raid 0 for speed, and then buy externals for backups?
     
  6. TheTraveller thread starter macrumors newbie

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    Mar 17, 2011
    #6
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    If I did mirror, is it easy to setup a third hot swappable drive?

    With the previous suggestion, if I take up my internal bays with 3 1 tb drives. What if later I decide I need more space? Should I just install separate drives for different things? One for storage of master files and one for edit? Then I can replace the storage drive easily when I fill it? I'd then Require more externals though.
     
  7. gglockner macrumors 6502

    gglockner

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    Nov 25, 2007
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    Bellevue, WA
    #7
    I have three drives: 2 for RAID-0 (performance) plus another for Time Machine backups. My Time Machine is solely used for files, not system info - it's to protect me from myself. For drive failure, I have two external drives I use for a bootable backup. I rotate those backups, keeping one offsite at all times. That covers virtually any and every scenario.
     
  8. TheTraveller thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #8
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    For your external backups do u use a program, or simply copy files from the raid?
     
  9. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

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    #9
    Basically yeah. If you have spare HD slots, then the backup can be in an internal HD as well (e.g. 3x1TB RAID 0 + 3TB for backups).

    You cannot add a drive to existing RAID 0 array, at least not with software RAID. With 3x1TB, you would still have one HD bay and the second ODD bay free (assuming you have only one SuperDrive). That would give you up to 6TB (2x3TB) if you need that much.

    It's much easier if you use an application such as Time Machine, Carbon Copy Cloner or SuperDuper.

    All in all, if you are worried about filling your HD bays and hassling with externals, you could go with 2x2TB in RAID 0. It would probably be a bit slower than 3x1TB in RAID 0 but the difference isn't that dramatic. If you don't need that much space, then 2x1TB might be sufficient. Just remember to have a good backup plan.

    In case you run out of internal HD bays, get an eSATA PCIe card. It provides the same performance as the internal SATA 3Gb/s ports, as long as you get a decent card.
     
  10. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #10
    • Are you earning a living with this system?
    • What software are you using besides FCP?
    • How big are your files?
    • How fast to you consume storage capacity?
    I ask, as your initial post indicates a very low end solution, but what's been mentioned may not be the right way to go (based on sufficient time on your hands to deal with recovery). And as mentioned, RAID of any form is not a backup. RAID is for speed and redundancy. Backups need to be on completely separate storage locations (never the same disks as the primary data it's meant to backup), and data transfers handled by some sort of backup software, never a mirror (RAID 1). The reason for this, is that a mirror duplicates any mistakes (i.e. initiated by the user, such as an accidental file deletion).

    I wouldn't recommend following DigiLloyd's storage advice. He's placed backups on the same drives as the primary locations, which are configured in stripe sets (RAID 0). Really bad configuration, and is begging for data loss.
     
  11. gglockner macrumors 6502

    gglockner

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    Bellevue, WA
    #11
    I use SuperDuper. Carbon Copy Cloner is also good, but I find it to be much slower, even using incremental backups with both.
     
  12. TheTraveller, Mar 18, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2011

    TheTraveller thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    #12
    Ok thanks for the replies so far everyone.

    I am going to be using the system mainly for FCP. Some friends and I have started a company and we are going to be starting off doing wedding videos and some corporate stuff etc. We are also going to be doing some short films.

    We are using HVX200 cameras, so we dont have physical master tapes. What I want is to be able to store any master files that I may need/want. Plus I want to have an edit drive to store all my FCP stuff.

    The material can take up room quite quickly, though after the edit is done I can delete the FCP media. And if its a wedding could proberly delete all of it after the client is happy. We use DVCPRO HD at 720p.

    The only hard drive in my system at the moment is a 320Gb drive that came with the mac. I'd rather leave that alone, and start off by using the remaining three slots in the system.
     
  13. nanofrog macrumors G4

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    #13
    I would strongly urge you not to use stripe sets for your primary working data, and opt for a redundant level of RAID. Unfortunately, the Mac Pro is only capable of 0/1/10 and JBOD.
    • A mirror (RAID 1) is only the capacity of the smallest disk in the array, which is likely too small.
    • A level 10 offers ~2x the speed of a single disk (4x disk set) with a redundancy of n = 2 (2x disks can fail before the data is gone). But it has the penalty of half the total capacity available to you (i.e. 8TB total, but only 4TB is usable).
    For cache, you would likely benefit from a separate drive.

    So you'd be better off using a parity based array (i.e. 5 or 6) for your primary array. But this also means you'll need a proper RAID card (meaning hardware based, not software, as software implementations cannot deal with the write hole issue associated with parity arrays). Such cards also mean using enterprise grade disks which are a bit more expensive (but worth it, as they're stable on RAID cards, and have improved specifications in order to take the abuse RAID causes to drives).

    Beyond redundancy, either a 10 or 5 will offer you additional speed and capacity, which will be more conducive to good workflow, which can translate into shorter editing time and more jobs taken on in a given period of time (helps the bottom line).

    I'm not sure of your workload or budgetary requirements, but this is something I'd strongly suggest you consider.

    Past that, file sizes and capacity requirements would be a good place to start. As well as budget, and capacity consumption (need to make sure the storage system can keep up with your needs for 3 years without the need to replace everything; just add drives until you fill all the ports on the card).

    As per backup/archival storage, eSATA based Port Multiplier enclosures are an inexpensive means to get mass storage on the cheap (example).
     

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