HomePod HomePod Discontinued... Discussion.

[The-Real-Deal82]

Prior post, the other one I posted last night.

If you say Apple made $4.5b selling at $300, then the actual profit is less than half that (38%) as that was their rumoured margin back in 2018. Since then they slashed the price by $100 which would mean they were making about $29 for every HomePod sold.

If the $4.5b was pure profit, then they sold much more than 15m units which we can assume they probably didn’t as they discontinued it. By comparison Amazon and Google make 56% and 66% margin on their devices and occupy over 90% of the smart speaker/assistant market.

 

[Td1970]

I paid 199 and 179 for mine. Both NIB

 

[Shanghaichica]

Hopefully they plan on supporting it for a while longer. I‘ve decided to get another OG once my new Apple TV turns up so I can take advantage of the home theatre mode.

 

[boltjames]

If you say Apple made $4.5b selling at $300, then the actual profit is less than half that (38%) as that was their rumoured margin back in 2018. Since then they slashed the price by $100 which would mean they were making about $29 for every HomePod sold.

If the $4.5b was pure profit, then they sold much more than 15m units which we can assume they probably didn’t as they discontinued it. By comparison Amazon and Google make 56% and 66% margin on their devices and occupy over 90% of the smart speaker/assistant market.

Whoa, no one said that $4.5B was profit. I said it was revenue, sales dollars.

And as I’ve said from the beginning, that’s why the HomePod was discontinued. It was designed to sell at $349 and not $299 or lower. Apple sold enough to validate that there is a high end Apple Music streaming speaker market. They just need to redesign it so that it costs them less to produce and makes their traditional profit margins.

 

[boltjames]

Hopefully they plan on supporting it for a while longer. I‘ve decided to get another OG once my new Apple TV turns up so I can take advantage of the home theatre mode.

Nothing to worry about there. The only people who own these devices are Apple Music subscribers who are paying $120 or more per year for the privilege.

Besides, when was the last time Apple rendered one of its products unfunctional? My remote grade schooler just made it through the pandemic on a 10 year old iMac which runs better than some of my modern Windows machines. I’ve got an iPad Air 2 which is 7 years old which runs as well now as it did when it was new. Early Apple TV’s, iPods, they’re all still going strong.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Whoa, no one said that $4.5B was profit. I said it was revenue, sales dollars.

And as I’ve said from the beginning, that’s why the HomePod was discontinued. It was designed to sell at $349 and not $299 or lower. Apple sold enough to validate that there is a high end Apple Music streaming speaker market. They just need to redesign it so that it costs them less to produce and makes their traditional profit margins.

They have done that with the HomePod Mini. If the ‘high end’ Apple Music smart assistant market was lucrative then they’d still be selling the original HomePod while they develop its successor.

 

[boltjames]

They have done that with the HomePod Mini. If the ‘high end’ Apple Music smart assistant market was lucrative then they’d still be selling the original HomePod while they develop its successor.

Two reasons:

Chip shortage and priority given to MacBook line overhaul and other new devices instead of a money-losing niche Apple Music accessory.

Getting the great-sounding HomePod out of Apple and other retail stores helps weak-sounding Mini succeed as there is no ability for consumers to A/B test and be disappointed in the Mini.

 

[boltjames]

HomePod will not support the new Apple Music Lossless Audio tier which, as predicted, means there will be a new HomePod Max or HomePod Pro in the not so distant future that will support it:

HomePod Will Support Spatial Audio for Apple Music, But Not Lossless Audio

Apple Music will be gaining support for two new audio formats in June, including Spatial Audio and Lossless Audio, but MacRumors has received...

www.macrumors.com

Boom.

 

[ouimetnick]

HomePod will not support the new Apple Music Lossless Audio tier which, as predicted, means there will be a new HomePod Max or HomePod Pro in the not so distant future that will support it:

HomePod Will Support Spatial Audio for Apple Music, But Not Lossless Audio

Apple Music will be gaining support for two new audio formats in June, including Spatial Audio and Lossless Audio, but MacRumors has received...

www.macrumors.com

Boom.

What’s to say Apple wants to get back into the smart speaker business? They may just continue to make cheap HomePod minis instead.
I hope they do come out with an even better sounding and capable replacement for the original model, but I’m not sure. Remember their current headphone like (both Apple and Beats branded) can’t even take advantage of lossless.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

HomePod will not support the new Apple Music Lossless Audio tier which, as predicted, means there will be a new HomePod Max or HomePod Pro in the not so distant future that will support it:

HomePod Will Support Spatial Audio for Apple Music, But Not Lossless Audio

Apple Music will be gaining support for two new audio formats in June, including Spatial Audio and Lossless Audio, but MacRumors has received...

www.macrumors.com

Boom.

So all those £349 HomePods are now outdated after such a short time? There’s nothing to solidly suggest a new large HomePod is coming out based on your link but if there is then that is downright lousy of Apple.

 

[ouimetnick]

So all those £349 HomePods are now outdated after such a short time? There’s nothing to solidly suggest a new large HomePod is coming out based on your link but if there is then that is downright lousy of Apple.

Exactly. We made a $350 smart speaker with an already 3 year old underpowered processor, and we have no plans to try and move remaining inventory after we’ve abandoned it.

You can still buy a spanking new white one today for $300. 🤣 Yet they wonder why they aren’t selling. Why not clear remaining inventory at $250 or $199?

 

[Itinj24]

HomePod will not support the new Apple Music Lossless Audio tier which, as predicted, means there will be a new HomePod Max or HomePod Pro in the not so distant future that will support it:

HomePod Will Support Spatial Audio for Apple Music, But Not Lossless Audio

Apple Music will be gaining support for two new audio formats in June, including Spatial Audio and Lossless Audio, but MacRumors has received...

www.macrumors.com

Boom.

HomePod Mini, as new as it is, won’t support it either so how is this evidence that a HomePod Max or Pro or whatever is in the future?

 

[MrTSolar]

What technical reason is there that the HomePod won’t support lossless? The A8 chip is good enough for the iPod touch and its full blown UI. Surely it can handle high bit rate audio with only a few LEDS as a display.

I can only shudder and wonder how bad Siri is on the mini. It’s horrible on the Watch, but great on HomePod.

 

[throAU]

As an owner of 2 minis and 2 regular HomePods.... I can totally see why apple have killed the original.

The sound quality is better, but its not THAT much better that most people will care, especially when it is less than half the price.

The people who care about audio quality will have something better than the HomePod anyway. For what it is, the mini is very impressive audio wise.

Am I said to see it go? Sure. But not devastated by any measure and if had to make the call to keep only one of them the mini will be accessible by far more customers.

 

[throAU]

What technical reason is there that the HomePod won’t support lossless? The A8 chip is good enough for the iPod touch and its full blown UI. Surely it can handle high bit rate audio with only a few LEDS as a display.

I can only shudder and wonder how bad Siri is on the mini. It’s horrible on the Watch, but great on HomePod.

Depends what codec support is embedded into the hardware. The a8 likely has inbuilt acceleration for AAC and other codecs apple were using at the time it was designed, but if it does not have support for whatever lossless codec they're planning to use, performance will be much worse.

Hardware support vs. doing things in software is generally 1 or more orders of magnitude (i.e., 10x plus) slower, depending on how efficient the hardware implementation is.

You may be too young to remember, but an example is software 3d vs. voodoo. Or more recently hardware raytracing vs. non-hardware ray tracing support.

 

[Itinj24]

Well, it seems you need a wired connection for lossless. AirPods ain’t gettin it either. Not even the new AirPods Max. Guess you gotta walk around with your iPhone to your head like an old boom box.

Apple Music Lossless requires wired headphones - 9to5Mac

Apple confirmed that Apple Music Lossless requires wired headphones. However, AirPods will get support for Spatial Audio with Dolby Atmos.

9to5mac.com

 

[boltjames]

So all those £349 HomePods are now outdated after such a short time? There’s nothing to solidly suggest a new large HomePod is coming out based on your link but if there is then that is downright lousy of Apple.

My opinion, there has to be a reason why Apple introduced lossless free of charge. And that's because, typical Apple, it's going to be an important component to drive sales of a future piece of hardware.

Lossless currently requires a wired connection. So one of two things- a HomePod with the ability to handle an optional wired connection, either digital cable or perhaps some sort of iPhone dock. Or a new wireless protocol that Apple is working on that will allow them to jump the market on wireless lossless, AirPlay 5 or whatnot, and a new HomePod that can handle that.

Just an opinion, but lossless can't be here, and given away for free, with so many limitations. I have a feeling that its got to be a new AirPlay protocol for AirPods, HomePods, and CarPlay. Opens up all three for premium priced products, in-car compatible audio systems, etc. Which supports my point from the summer that HomePod is on pause and will make a return supporting new features and allow Apple to do so profitably.

 

[boltjames]

Well, it seems you need a wired connection for lossless. AirPods ain’t gettin it either. Not even the new AirPods Max. Guess you gotta walk around with your iPhone to your head like an old boom box.

Truth be told, I don't need lossless, I think the sound quality from lossy Apple Music is phenomenal.

What I'm excited about is Spatial Audio, and the HomePod does handle Spatial Audio. Which means, in certain rooms, I'm going to have to change my single HomePod setup to two HomePods. And if Apple comes out with some sort of Soundbar, that could mean I need some Mini's for the rears. Could be exciting.

Point being.....Apple will be in the premium speaker business. It makes perfect sense considering today's announcements.

 

[Itinj24]

Truth be told, I don't need lossless, I think the sound quality from lossy Apple Music is phenomenal.

What I'm excited about is Spatial Audio, and the HomePod does handle Spatial Audio. Which means, in certain rooms, I'm going to have to change my single HomePod setup to two HomePods. And if Apple comes out with some sort of Soundbar, that could mean I need some Mini's for the rears. Could be exciting.

Point being.....Apple will be in the premium speaker business. It makes perfect sense considering today's announcements.

I’m with ya on all accounts. Don’t care much for lossless but spatial audio is intriguing and I hope the Minis can be integrated somehow as far as surround and default audio for the AppleTV.

I’m not gonna hold my breath for a soundbar or a new improved HomePod but I’ll be the first one refreshing the website for preorders if it happens. My hope is that I can come on here and say that your were right and I was wrong about this stuff though.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I buy quite a few Apple products but their speakers for me have always seemed overpriced for my use case. I know it’s suggested they want to focus on the low to mid range audiophile market but for many that is super niche. I think the problem Apple have is other manufacturers make devices compatible with iPhones and allow access to Apple Music and other streaming services whereas Apple lock you towards their own proprietary services.

I know a HomePod is less than the price of the basic Apple Watch, but what does it do that a £99 Echo or even a HomePod Mini doesn’t? Most don’t live in vast roomed homes where sound quality is noticeable and that’s even for those people with perfect hearing in the first place. If Apple really aren’t bothered about large scale appeal then I suppose it works for them.

 

[pup]

HomePod will not support the new Apple Music Lossless Audio tier which, as predicted, means there will be a new HomePod Max or HomePod Pro in the not so distant future that will support it:

Boom.

I wish I had the time to go through this guy's old posts to chart the course of his ever changing rationalizations for the HomePod. I'm sure it would mirror sort of delusional logic that has Q anon people believing that Trump is still secretly in control of the US.

 

[throAU]

Well, it seems you need a wired connection for lossless. AirPods ain’t gettin it either. Not even the new AirPods Max. Guess you gotta walk around with your iPhone to your head like an old boom box.

Apple Music Lossless requires wired headphones - 9to5Mac

Apple confirmed that Apple Music Lossless requires wired headphones. However, AirPods will get support for Spatial Audio with Dolby Atmos.

9to5mac.com

I'd say wireless lossless will come eventually (like, soon). 44khz stereo CD quality uncompressed (never mind lossless compressed) audio is less than 2 megabit (around 1.4), which is trivial for even crappy wifi to achieve these days.

 

[Htsi]

I wish I had the time to go through this guy's old posts to chart the course of his ever changing rationalizations for the HomePod. I'm sure it would mirror sort of delusional logic that has Q anon people believing that Trump is still secretly in control of the US.

You mean he isn’t?

 

[Htsi]

I buy quite a few Apple products but their speakers for me have always seemed overpriced for my use case. I know it’s suggested they want to focus on the low to mid range audiophile market but for many that is super niche. I think the problem Apple have is other manufacturers make devices compatible with iPhones and allow access to Apple Music and other streaming services whereas Apple lock you towards their own proprietary services.

I know a HomePod is less than the price of the basic Apple Watch, but what does it do that a £99 Echo or even a HomePod Mini doesn’t? Most don’t live in vast roomed homes where sound quality is noticeable and that’s even for those people with perfect hearing in the first place. If Apple really aren’t bothered about large scale appeal then I suppose it works for them.

My common layman understanding would say it is easier to keep your customers happy with a niche product when you’re a trillion dollar company and your selling point is the ecosystem.
1st Gen owners are burnt in apple land, but even though lossless won’t work I am still satisfied with my HomePods. There is no other product like them. It’s the combination of sound, ecosystem, size, and design that does it for me.

the little things such as the fading effect via the ambient light sensor, and how Siri lowers the volume by leaving only low frequencies are all so lovely (even though Siri isn’t the greatest).

the difference in sound is so vast between the mini & regular I’d wager 9/10 hearing will find it easy to find the difference.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

My common layman understanding would say it is easier to keep your customers happy with a niche product when you’re a trillion dollar company and your selling point is the ecosystem.
1st Gen owners are burnt in apple land, but even though lossless won’t work I am still satisfied with my HomePods. There is no other product like them. It’s the combination of sound, ecosystem, size, and design that does it for me.

the little things such as the fading effect via the ambient light sensor, and how Siri lowers the volume by leaving only low frequencies are all so lovely (even though Siri isn’t the greatest).

the difference in sound is so vast between the mini & regular I’d wager 9/10 hearing will find it easy to find the difference.

Sound quality isn’t the primary concern for me but if I want 5 or 6 devices around my home like I have now, I won’t be paying £350 a time. You’re right though, if Apple are happy with a niche product then i’ll leave that to them. The fact they discontinued the original HomePod and released a £99 Mini would suggest to me they’d like the mass market to buy into it too. Right now though I don’t see the appeal of the Apple option despite being a home of Apple products.