HomePod Struggling to Gain Market Share Alongside Cheaper Amazon Echo and Google Home Speakers

[Meandmunch]

This product category has essentially already been commoditized.

Google and Amazon's products are cutting edge at crazy cheap pricing. Apple is kidding themselves at $250. They bring nothing new or unique to the experience other than the logo. You could argue the quality of the speaker but if consumers can't "see" the difference in the store or online they just see and inflated price.

 

[MauiPa]

Exactly what purpose is an article like this? There is absolutely no one who took a basic business class who would lump all the products into one category and claim equivalence. Agree or disagree, but Apple has obviously segmented this market into actual speakers that sound awesome (like the Google Home Max at $399, and all those Sonos thingies, and Bose, and....), and little toys to play silly games on. I have a HomePod and absolutely love it, the sound quality is actually as good as those audio labs that measured its performance have stated.

 

[Pepe4life]

The problem with the HomePod is that it's a great speaker, but not a smart one.

As for google home and amazon alexa, I'd never put an always-on microphone made by companies with no respect for privacy in my house

 

[Shalev Lazarof]

my 2 cents...

299$

Spotify integration with Siri voice requests and not those shortcuts hacks

voice recognition with multiple iCloud users (one HomePod for entire family) maybe face detection with TrueDepth camera

full display on top with apps, home control, music app(Spotify, apple music etc..), timers

volume control is by spinning metal ring on top surrounding the display(something like dj׳s mix plate)

all the users homePods controlled and configured thought a HomePod app in iPhone, like watch app

videos that show the build of it and the improvement in the users life... (like macs, iPhone etc...)

 

[dominiongamma]

ive bought four homepods so far. dont regret it except wish i had gotten the first two at $250. i think they're priced fairly since i dont have to buy a receiver, wire cables and other gear. it's simple, it plays the vast majority of what i want to hear clearly without distortion. the days when i used to blast my 120W subwoofer in a small dorm room are over - i just want clear, full sound. it even plays television well.

I still think even at 250 it’s way too much, I return mine even at 250 because I couldn’t justify the price for what it does, Siri only working with Apple Music only was a deal killer

 

[dwsolberg]

Siri's reputation is letting it down. It used to be terrible.

Now, Siri can answer questions better than Alexa, but people assume it's worse.

I don’t know about that, but Siri is much better. It will take a long time for Siri’s reputation to turn around though. When something disappoints over and over for years, it takes a lot for people to trust again.

Also, Apple decided to create a speaker with Siri instead of a smart home device with a speaker. I think that was their biggest mistake. Part of what makes Alexa so useful is that you can put an Echo in every room for less than the price of a single HomePod. And it’s not just price; it’s flexibility. I can connect Alexa to an expensive stereo system, and get much better sound than even the very good HomePod in stereo pair. And size, too. The Echo dot is so small, there are attachments to connect it directly to a wall.

If you want great (but not wonderful) sound in a room, and you want to listen to Apple Music, then the HomePod will make you very happy. That market, though, seems to be relatively much smaller than the smart speaker market as a whole.

 

[CreepyAF]

Of course Siri is better than it was, but comparing across platforms is never that easy. For MY USE CASE ONLY, Alexa does a far better job. It's more than answering questions though. It's the integration with smart-home capabilities. It's the ability to create a routine. It's the entire Alexa Eco-System. Siri may be better at answering questions but it's still no where near on par with what customers are wiling to pay for!

siri doesn't send your privacy for $$$.
[doublepost=1549379118][/doublepost]i mean apple spent millions of dollars building a research facility for the homepod. and as a result, the sound that comes out of this little speaker is nothing short of amazing.

 

[cmaier]

Since when is market share apple’s goal?

 

[Abazigal]

I personally find sales of 4 million units of the HomePod to be a very respectable number for a product which has out for about a year, given its limited distribution, price and purpose. I believe Sonos solid about 3.9 million speakers at $250 each in 2017.

I think that once again, people are falling into the trap of declaring that Apple has lost simply because they aren’t competing in a product market which hardly brings in any profits. What I see is the market bifurcating just like many other markets Apple competes in.

On one hand, you have companies like Google and Amazon using low-cost hardware to push their digital voice assistants. On the other hand, you have Apple competing in the high-end accessory market, which makes sense.

Unlike Apple, Amazon has no smartphone presence, so the echo device is really the only way they can get a foothold in one’s home. As such, Amazon has to give away their product at cost if it is to gain any traction. Conversely, Apple already has Siri in (and outside) the home by way of the iPhone, ipad and Apple Watch. Thus, it makes sense for Apple to not go the route that Amazon has taken, but instead choose to compete on superior sound quality and target consumers willing to pay a premium for such a benefit.

To put it another way, Apple doesn’t need to release a cheap home speaker because that purpose (ie: voice assistants) is already answered by other products they have (especially the Apple Watch, which literally puts Siri on your wrist).

Lastly, it seems a little premature to write off the speaker wars as a forgone conclusion, given the recent emphasis on privacy (or rather, the lack thereof when it comes to companies such as Google and Facebook). Who is to say that in due time, the public might become more cautious when it comes to giving up their privacy, and this translates to them favouring companies who promise to respect their privacy more (ie: Apple) over those who don’t?

 

[deannnnn]

It's the entry level price point that gets people in to the environment. I didn't think I needed an Alexa or a Google Home... but then bought a Google Home Mini anyway when it was $25 and now I'm obsessed with the damn thing!

 

[LordVic]

siri doesn't send your privacy for $$$.
[doublepost=1549379118][/doublepost]i mean apple spent millions of dollars building a research facility for the homepod. and as a result, the sound that comes out of this little speaker is nothing short of amazing.

Right, but was this a case of Apple letting perfection get in the way of "good enough" for what the product is intending to do.

 

[nburwell]

If Apple Executives are surprised, they really shouldn't be. The price for the HomePod is simply outrageous. Especially when I'm not a current Apple Music subscriber. Heck, I can get one of the "higher end" Echos for $80 and I can stream Spotify, Apple Music, SiriusXM, etc. and re-order dog food if we are running out.

But I'm not a big smart speaker fan. We have a Google Home that we barely even use, except to stream Spotify on occasion.

 

[theluggage]

I’ll never understand what Apple was thinking with their approach to the smart speaker market. It’s almost like they thought “how can we make this thing more expensive?”.

I'm not necessary defending Apple here, so bear with me:

An acquaintance of mine paid over £500 for one of these: https://www.whathifi.com/naim/mu-so-qb/review

Here's another £500 bluetooth speaker: https://www.whathifi.com/bw/zeppelin-wireless/review

Another example: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07GBR9HG4/ref=asc_df_B07GBR9HG458353556

You don't need to look too far to find "audiophile" wireless speakers priced at anything from $300 to infinity.

Now look at the HomePod page on the Apple site - first, its under the Music tab. Then the first 3/4 of the page is about music and sound quality. Then about using Siri to play music - the "smart home assistant" bit about getting weather forecasts, checking your calendar etc. is literally at the bottom of the list.

What Apple have done is produced - and marketed - a wireless audiophile speaker, designed primarily for music, at a price that is (was) highly competitive with the likes of Bose, Naim, B&W etc.

The "smart speakers" from Google and Amazon do offer music as a selling point, yes, but the marketing gives equal emphasis to the 'smart assistant' side and (in Amazon's case) a lot more emphasis on the shopping side. Looking at the reviews, seems like the audio quality of the HomePod thrashes everything from Amazon/Google except the Google Home Max... which costs more than the HomePod!

Its common knowledge that Amazon and Google's main businesses are shopping, data mining and advertising rather than hardware sales so it is very plausible that their cheaper smart speakers are subsidised loss-leaders - whereas Apple still make nearly 90% of their money from hardware (and their services tend to be designed to promote their hardware rather than vice versa) so its likely that they're looking to make money selling HomePods (sorry - you can tell nothing by trying to guess the cost of the components - Apple doesn't buy its parts in quantities of 10 from the RS catalogue).

Apple's problem is the industry and customers are comparing the HomePod with Amazon and Google's (probably subsidised) cash register/living-room-spy products - but as long as they're making money, they might not care.

Personally, the deal-breakers for me are not the price but :
(a) you need two of them for stereo - and both need to be plugged in to the mains.
(b) As I understand it, won't just play your iTunes library from a Mac - you have to Airplay from an iDevice
(c) No audio input - If I ever feel the urge to play a real CD or old cassette tape - and what do hipsters do if they have an irrational craving for vinyl?
(d) Everybody says that the sound is incredible... but is that incredible in absolute terms, or just incredibly impressive from a tiny speaker? I know my iPad and Mac have astonishing sound quality - for minute speakers apparently sealed in ultra-thin devices with no obvious grilles - but that doesn't mean that my $100 Behringer studio monitors (themselves hardly the acme of audiophillic perfection) don't blow them away.

 

[ipponrg]

What Apple have done is produced - and marketed - a wireless audiophile speaker, designed primarily for music, at a price that is (was) highly competitive with the likes of Bose, Naim, B&W etc.

Most serious audiophiles would not associate some of those brands as high fidelity. Bose is not an audiophile speaker.

 

[genovelle]

Simple - the Echo Dot, and the Home Mini are impulse purchases when they are on sale. I’d buy for sure 4-5 HomePod minis in that price range. Also I still find it ironic I can control my Apple TV with my Google Home Mini but not with my HomePod (unless I change the setup I have and use the HomePod as the audio output for my Apple TV which doesn’t make sense in my setup)

Apple actually makes a profit from their high quality products. 36% profit margin is not high. Clothing and furniture generally have a list price the is over 400% profit. Apple looks to the big picture and long term. The dots are sold at a huge loss because they are loss leaders. Their purpose is to drive purchases on Amazon. That is not happening at this point. The same goes for Google products to drive ads. Just like Google plus the they are closing and even Android that they have begun to depreciate to focus on chrome, when they can no longer justify investing in it they will drop support or severely reduce investment.

 

[I7guy]

CIRP like everyone else is playing a guessing game. We will never know the real numbers.

It’s true Apple gimped the HomePod by not allowing Bluetooth connections. However, I have an echo dot that is sitting in the closet nor would I get a goggle speaker. But that’s me.

If I had Apple Music I would get the HomePod in a NY minute or if it supported Bluetooth connections.

 

[macduke]

Most people, when it comes down to it, don’t really give a crap about audio quality past a certain point. If it sounds awful then yeah, but if it sounds decent then most people will buy it. The price is too high for something that most people use their Apple Watch, iPhone, iPad or Mac for.

For the people who would use something like this but aren’t audiophiles, using AirPlay or Bluetooth with their sound bar is more than enough. It works for me.

You see, I get the whole audio snobbery thing. I’m the same way when it comes to display technology, cameras, and printers in wanting the best picture quality and fiddling with calibrating everything. But many people just don’t have the ear for this and don’t care about the absolute best audio quality. Getting 80-90% there is fine. They’d rather save a buck. It’s why despite my Apple product obsession I still haven’t bought one, and I doubt I’m alone. Maybe if it were more useful.

 

[Obi Wan Kenobi]

I almost bought a HomePod, but when I was asking the Apple Store person about its features, it became clear that it really needed Apple Music to make it worthwhile, and I don't have that, or consider it good value - I just don't spend £120 a year on music. Also it is entirely dependent on Siri, which significantly falls behind Alexa in many respects.

Months later, I bought an Echo Dot during Black Friday, I think it was £25. It has proved fantastic for what it is, and is far more interactive and useful than Siri. However, the 'always on' microphone is a worry.

Here's an example why.

I asked Alexa to play 'We Will Rock You', and it played a recent version mixing Queen's track with a different band overlaying vocals and music in places. I told Alexa to stop, and said it was the wrong version, and I tried to request the song again, more specifically. No matter how I tried it always played the mix version.

About 5 minutes later, I tried Siri. "Hey Siri, play we will rock you", and it played the correct track (I have a number of Queen Albums on iTunes). I'd been trying to play the track for my kids. This was now the correct version, so I said "that's the right one" to my kids. A day or so later, one of my kids asked for 'we will rock you'. Alexa now played the correct version.

This is a small example of the way it eavesdrops on us. In this instance it was clearly intended to provide a better user experience. But it makes you realise that even when apparently dormant and not in use, it is listening and processing all that you say within range of its microphones.

But here's the thing. The rest of our experience with the device is very positive. I'm thinking of getting an Echo speaker as well as the Dot. What I intend to do with it though, is have it switched off at the plug, and only switch it on when I positively want to use it.

The other thing about the Amazon Dot, or Echo speaker, is that if you have Amazon Prime, it has a form of Amazon music included in the price. It may not have the latest songs, but it has a huge catalogue that's more than enough for me. I'm sure the price of Apple music is a part of the reason for HomePod's poor sales as well.

 

[theluggage]

Most serious audiophiles would not associate some of those brands as high fidelity. Bose is not an audiophile speaker.

Maybe - but Bose would like to think it is, as would the people who've forked out the money for them.

No true Scotsm... sorry, audiophile would buy any fancy wireless speaker (or even think of using Bluetooth) with audio-mangling beam-forming, AI-based sound processing gimmickry that corrupted the vision of the musician and obscured the subtle hints of hollyhocks and vermillion that were revealed by their $100-per-foot de-ionised gold speaker cables.

 

[ipponrg]

Everybody says that the sound is incredible... but is that incredible in absolute terms, or just incredibly impressive from a tiny speaker?

This is subjective but I find a lot of people who own Bose or similar brands will say how incredible it is. If you have the ears for it, you can tell some of the areas in sound that the HomePod is missing.

I would totally buy a HomePod for a casual speaker, but I wouldn’t lump that into fidelity. Those that keep preaching this and who don’t have the ears to tell the sonal differences are who Apple is targeting

 

[Sabelonada]

Apple execs never talk about HomePod. I don’t think Cook mentioned it once on the most recent earnings call. If Apple really wants to be in the speaker business I wish they’d make a premium sound bar that can connect to TVs.

If it were an Apple TV/sound bar, it would define a new category of device and Apple could own that market space.

 

[warpdrive]

At least in the US. Retailers are attempting to discount it a bit to move units. 250 or 279 is a lot more palatable. I might have given one a shot for 250 USD

But in Canada, it’s still selling for $450 CAD everywhere which is pretty absurd. Nobody is even trying.

I bought a Paradigm PW600 speaker which sounds terrific and can stream Alexa amazon music and be used with line sources. Not as user friendly but is more versatile for me

 

[vmistery]

If Siri was going somewhere I would be more likely to buy one, as it stands Alexa is far more advanced (although I wont get an Alexa powered one due to data slurping). Couple poor Siri and high price and you get lower sales

 

[ipponrg]

Maybe - but Bose would like to think it is, as would the people who've forked out the money for them.

No true Scotsm... sorry, audiophile would buy any fancy wireless speaker (or even think of using Bluetooth) with audio-mangling beam-forming, AI-based sound processing gimmickry that corrupted the vision of the musician and obscured the subtle hints of hollyhocks and vermillion that were revealed by their $100-per-foot de-ionised gold speaker cables.

It’s not just that though. Some people want their sound more pure and want to control it. My ears can’t tell too much with gold plated plugs/cables unless I do a direct comparison, but I can tell the difference between highs/mods/lows and some of the sonal balances.

Bose has a very good marketing team. I remember bringing home their satellite setup from Fry’s to try out. The rooms they setup to demo those were misleading. Ended up returning them the next day

 

[MacHiavelli]

6% of the smart-speaker market.

98% of all smart-speaker profits.