how hard ?

Discussion in 'iOS Programming' started by hemagoku, Apr 20, 2012.

  1. hemagoku macrumors member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2012
    #1
    I am thinking of getting a mbp 13" ,mainly for iphone dev. ,so was wondering how does simple/beginner/bad apps do in the app store ?
    do they at least get back what they paid for, for the dev. subscription ?

    i already searched but got old answers, before android became this popular i believe.

    thanks in advance.
     
  2. 1458279 Suspended

    1458279

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    #2
    Someone did a study on this, I think it was late last year, and posted on another forum.

    The breakdown was that 80% of the apps shared 3% of the money, or 20% shared 97% of the money.

    Over 50% didn't break even.

    I don't remember how many took part in the study.

    The bottom line seems to be that you'd be better off at a min wage job.
     
  3. ArtOfWarfare macrumors 604

    ArtOfWarfare

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    Nov 26, 2007
    #3
    Do it because you want to, not because you want money.

    It's taken me three shots at the App store to finally get an app that actually brings in over $100/year (it brings in ~$3000/year, I estimate. It's only been up for two months so far.

    I feel like those who don't break even just don't try enough times.
     
  4. hemagoku thread starter macrumors member

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    Apr 19, 2012
    #4
    well i do want to ,but i also want to at least get back what i paid xD, also i want to make a game ya, but atm i don't really like obj-c, which is a must for i-devices dev. so the money could been a good motivation, since i feel windows phone maybe easier to dev. on for me.

    break even ? u mean didn't get up to their 100$ ?
     
  5. Tander macrumors 6502a

    Tander

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    #5
    Also I think if you can get into a company that does app development - you would be better off there. On your own, I can imagine it's going to be a tough couple of years for you, though.
     
  6. ArtOfWarfare macrumors 604

    ArtOfWarfare

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    Nov 26, 2007
    #6
    That's what I personally mean. The story about how 50% of dev's don't break even might be including other costs (IE, to hire someone to provide graphics, or sounds, or buy a Mac. Personally, I already had a Mac, and I did graphics and sounds myself. Although sounds came out terrible and I'm strongly considering hiring a professional sound person for my next game.)
     
  7. hemagoku thread starter macrumors member

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    Apr 19, 2012
    #7
    i see, i was planning on doing everything myself too, and ya i am scared of sounds too xD.
    but i am cool with at least getting back that 100$ ^^, i kinda wanted to try mbp anyway xD.

    anyway i think i ll try it ^^. :challenge accepted:

    thanks guys ^^, if anyone got any tips feel free to post them ^^.
     
  8. larswik macrumors 68000

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    Sep 8, 2006
    #8
    I am getting ready to submit my first app. I think people that quit their jobs to become a developer can still charge there laptops via solar power when they are homeless. (small joke).

    I started to develop 18 months ago because,

    A - I like a challenge and its fun, always learn something new.
    B - I only make things that I use day to day. If people like them too, great!
    C - Siting in front of my TV 5 hours a day was a waste of my time on this Earth.
     
  9. Tander macrumors 6502a

    Tander

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    #9
    I agree with you there.

    However I am taking a different approach.

    I am keeping my day job and will be learning to develop in iOS - to maybe be able to get another job as a developer. As I said in earlier - a lot of companies here are crying for developers and are paying big money for them, too.

    Also, on top of that - I love a challenge and I enjoy programming. :cool:
     
  10. larswik macrumors 68000

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    Sep 8, 2006
    #10
    I agree with you too.

    In my case I am 41 and have those bills I did not have as a kid. I enjoy taking 1 class at my local city collage every semester in the evenings to learn programming.

    But I wonder if people are scrambling to find app developers, what qualifications they are looking for? Do I need a degree or just show them my apps I have created? By taking a programming class every semester I might have a degree in 5 years in programming :)

    I love it and it is fun. I think it is something you never master but just keep getting better and better at.

    Good Luck to ya.
     
  11. Tander macrumors 6502a

    Tander

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    #11
    Well all of the places I have looked here - their requirements are a few months of developing and they want you to show them apps you've made.

    I am having hard time figuring out where to start now.

    All the books I read are on Xcode 3. Xcode 4 is completely different. Then I see other books that say using an IDE is bad and doing it wrong and is for lazy people.

    I get where they are coming from - as I hate looking at code and not knowing what it is doing.

    So my question is this: Do I ditch the IDE for now to get a better understanding of C - or do I find Xcode 3 - download it and use Learn C for Mac book?
     
  12. Vizin, Apr 22, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2013
  13. Tander macrumors 6502a

    Tander

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    #13
    Thank you for the advise.

    What I have decided to do is read the book, "Learn C on Mac". It has helped me understand the language a lot better - while using Xcode 4.X. It's all still manual typing and no real IDE work involved.

    I wanted to understand exactly what the code is doing - then move to IDE full time.

    So my current path will be this:

    Learn C --> Learn Objective C --> Standford's online courses for iOS development.

    I think that would help a lot. Then from there I can also learn more about GUI development and getting more advanced.

    I am going to take my time with the first two objectives - as I think that will help me become a better developer later on down the road. :cool:
     
  14. firewood macrumors 604

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    Silicon Valley
    #14
    The vast majority of iOS apps do not make any significant money (as in they don't sell even one app per day). The top couple percent are essentially lottery winners (or companies with major marketing budgets or expertise), and pay off by a large multiple.

    A lot of companies primarily look at the quality and breadth of the apps that a developer has in the App store. A general programming background such that the developer can prove that they knew what they were doing when they created those apps is also important.
     
  15. larswik macrumors 68000

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    Sep 8, 2006
    #15
    What is scary for me in writing code is that the internet has become a tool that I need to use quite a bit to find or research code. There are so many Classes that can help me in a project that I have no idea they even exist. So I try and write code to do something that already exists.

    I would love to find a tutorial site that pushes you in to exploring new Classes. Just last month I found out about NSThread. Now I am reading about GCD which seems to do the something NSThread does.

    Back to my point though. Without the internet I would be hard pressed to write an app, so much to know. I started to create a Method database using Nisus writer pro. So when I need things like NSString Method 'writeToFile' Once I have written it one time for a project, I add it to my database for future projects.

    Copy and pasting is not writing code though, so you forget a lot too.
     
  16. JonMcDonald macrumors member

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    Jan 18, 2009
    #16
    The majority of apps aren't successful. If we're being honest, the majority of apps suck though. A lot of them serve no purpose or utility, and just aren't that entertaining.

    That being said, I don't think the description that you're a lottery winner or a loser is accurate. There are middle ground apps that make good money and would supplement your income nicely, but you wouldn't want to quit your day job.

    I think the challenge is that people expect a lot. An app that looks bad, has limited function, or is laggy is quickly going to get down rated and forgotten. An application that is fun or useful, engaging, and well designed (decent UI, no lag, not a resource hog) will generally do alright if you plug it around a bit.
     
  17. 1458279 Suspended

    1458279

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    #17
    Actually what most of them are looking for is about 2 years of development in the language. This will change over time... two years from now, they'll be asking for 3 to 4 years...

    Do a search for C programmers... some ask for 10 years, do a search for anything new, they ask for 1 year. It changes as the platform ages.

    Right now, a few months would get you an unpaid intern position.

    A degree is NOT required all the time, most will say BS + 2 years OR 4 years without the BS.

    You can exchange time for the degree in some cases, however, it can be a roadblock later if you want to advance in the company.
     
  18. firewood macrumors 604

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    #18
    Cutting and pasting is fine, as long as one studies why the code was written that way, and looks up and understands all the APIs used.

    Somewhere between around the top 20% and the top 2%, one might make more than their development costs and earn more than coffee money. But you still might earn more waiting tables. That still makes the vast majority of developers either "lottery" winners or losers.

    This depends quite a bit on the level of apps that one has in the App store. Some new app developers do a lot better than an unpaid consulting or internship position.
     
  19. larswik macrumors 68000

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    Sep 8, 2006
    #19
    Another problem that I see in the app store is people will have apps that are close in nature and charge money for them. But as soon as someone releases a good app just like your, and it is FREE, then everyone gravitates to the free version. All of your hard work is gone.

    I might get backlash here but before I started coding and saw how time consuming it is to learn and write, I thoughts apps should be free too. Now unless they are for a business like Home Depot or Disneyland they should start at .99 cents. This is totally my opinion though and people will differ I am sure.
     
  20. 1458279 Suspended

    1458279

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    #20
    You make a good point, it kinda boils down to how good you are at app development. Many of the apps aren't much more that sample code with a few mods.
    Over time, we're likely to see improvements in quality and overall raising of the standard for apps.
     
  21. oxcug macrumors newbie

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    Oct 3, 2011
    #21
    Right now I have a couple of apps (each @ .99$) with free/lite versions. I make about 100$/month. One of them is a Mastermind game. And the other is a StarCraft 2 fan application. Most of my 100$ comes from that fan app. So yes, you can break even but I would suggest the first thing you do is make a simple application like a SC2 Fan app. That way you at least make a return on your dev license. Then you can proceed to do more fun stuff. Like building games.
     
  22. thewitt macrumors 68020

    thewitt

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    Sep 13, 2011
    #22
    If you write a quality app, support it, fill a need, you can make a good living on apps.

    If you write yet another shoot em up game, expect what you deserve....squat.
     
  23. Tander macrumors 6502a

    Tander

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    #23
    Hmmmm..

    A lot of very useful information here. :cool:

    I am looking at becoming a developer full time. Now, I know this won't happen within the next two years. But what I want to do, is eventually work towards that. I enjoy coding and I find it fascinating creating apps. :cool:

    But having said that - I believe doing it properly and learning C + Objective-C properly and learning to write clean code will help a lot.

    I am certainly not going to quite my day job any time soon. But I am young and I think if I can get a couple of years of development behind me - I will definitely be in a better position to finding that good development job.
     
  24. firewood macrumors 604

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    #24
    Either this, or it's just that the people who get lucky and end up with an app high in the rankings claim that what they wrote was a quality app.

    In actuality, I sometimes find junk and copycat apps in the money making part of the app popularity listings, and clearly better apps way down in the rankings where the dev is probably making nearly nothing from that app.
     
  25. larswik macrumors 68000

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    Sep 8, 2006
    #25
    I have heard of companies out there that you can hire to do nothing but promote your app and get it onto that list, no matter how bad it is. I think they should divided the app store in to 3 parts. Useful or good apps, apps that are extensions to businesses (ie Sears, Disneyland) and crAPPS.

    I was looking for an app the other day to resize images and crop them. Almost all the free ones belonged in the crAPPS category.
     

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