iPod touch How the hell can Apple CHARGE for firmware?

[Happy Meal]

How the hell can Apple charge for firmware on the ipod touch? It proves to me they must think their customer base are a complete load of idiots to me.

This is completely unheard of on all other platforms:

Windows: Free updates / Service packs
Windows Mobile: Free updates. Free Apps and added functionality
Xbox Live: Free firmware for more functionality
Playstation 3: Free firmware for more functionality

I am seriously losing patience with Apple and the way they treat their customer base.

 

[edesignuk]

For example....

Will Microsoft really upgrade you from WinMo 5 to 6 free of charge?

Free "service packs" for the iPhone/Touch come in the form of .1 releases (1.0.1, 1.0.2 etc).

Your games consoles comparisons are meaningless.

It proves to me they must think their customer base are a complete load of idiots to me.

What can I say.

 

[mr360]

How the hell can Apple charge for firmware on the ipod touch? It proves to me they must think their customer base are a complete load of idiots to me.

This is completely unheard of on all other platforms:

Windows: Free updates / Service packs
Windows Mobile: Free updates. Free Apps and added functionality
Xbox Live: Free firmware for more functionality
Playstation 3: Free firmware for more functionality

I am seriously losing patience with Apple and the way they treat their customer base.

I completely agree - the argument in another thread stating something like "its an OS upgrade, what did you expect" is just not valid.

some of these updates like landscape keyboard when texting, cut/paste etc are obvious and should have been there in the first place.

though i will probably pay for the update!!

 

[Happy Meal]

Will Microsoft really upgrade you from WinMo 5 to 6 free of charge?

Free "service packs" for the iPhone/Touch come in the form of .1 releases (1.0.1, 1.0.2 etc).

Your games consoles comparisons are meaningless.

Winmo 5 to 6 isn't a firmware update - It's a different OS.

How are my games consoles comparisons meaningless? It's a platform like any other. But if that's not good enough for you, then let me use the platform as an example - I've upgraded the firmware in my Nokia N82 twice for FREE.

 

[mr360]

...and having to pay mid-game for extra levels??? maybe in the case of 360 and PS3 games when the levels are a bit more complex, but not for something like the iphone, no matter how good the game is

 

[edesignuk]

Winmo 5 to 6 isn't a firmware update - It's a different OS.

It being called "firmware" is a naming technicality. iPhone/Touch OS 2.0 -> OS 3.0 is an OS upgrade. Same as WinMo 5 -> 6, and the same as 6 -> 7 will be.

How are my games consoles comparisons meaningless? It's a platform like any other. But if that's not good enough for you, then let me use the platform as an example - I've upgraded the firmware in my Nokia N82 twice for FREE.

Games consoles are an entirely different business.

What brilliance did your Nokia N82 update bring? Was it an OS upgrade, or "service pack" equivalent?

 

[BaldiMac]

Great first post!

It would help to search the forums.

iPhone OS 3.0 is considered a major OS update. Just like going from Windows XP to Vista or Mac OS X Tiger to Leopard. It isn't a simple firmware update or service pack.

A good explanation of why Apple charges for the iPod touch and not the iPhone is provided by iGarth.

https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/7294157/

 

[edesignuk]

...and having to pay mid-game for extra levels??? maybe in the case of 360 and PS3 games when the levels are a bit more complex, but not for something like the iphone, no matter how good the game is

You don't have to pay for them.

This allows a dev to produce a game and publish it at a lower cost. Those that like the game can then spend a little more for extra levels that have cost the dev in time and money to produce.

 

[mr360]

Great first post!

It would help to search the forums.

iPhone OS 3.0 is considered a major OS update. Just like going from Windows XP to Vista or Mac OS X Tiger to Leopard. It isn't a simple firmware update or service pack.

A good explanation of why Apple charges for the iPod touch and not the iPhone is provided by iGarth.

https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/7294157/

just to correct you, XP to Vista was a DOWNGRADE (not an upgrade!!)

 

[edesignuk]

just to correct you, XP to Vista was a DOWNGRADE (not an upgrade!!)

Have to assume you're being "funny" here.

 

[mr360]

Have to assume you're being "funny" here.

apologies if humour isn't allowed in the forum then! you 'assumed' correctly.

 

[Happy Meal]

Great first post!

It would help to search the forums.

iPhone OS 3.0 is considered a major OS update. Just like going from Windows XP to Vista or Mac OS X Tiger to Leopard. It isn't a simple firmware update or service pack.

A good explanation of why Apple charges for the iPod touch and not the iPhone is provided by iGarth.

https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/7294157/

Well Apple can call it whatever they like, but it's clearly just a minor firmware upgrade to me. What worries me the most is that a lot of the Apple customer base are actively defending Apple, and evangelising about 'the apple way' like some kind of cult!

Have to assume you're being "funny" here.

I think that's a safe assumption! Perhaps the gave it away?!

 

[edesignuk]

Well Apple can call it whatever they like, but it's clearly just a minor firmware upgrade to me.

How you can call it minor is beyond me. If that's how you view it then I can understand your upset.

Unfortunately for you it's your perception that's out of touch. There are a lot of big changes in this release. It does constitute an OS upgrade rather than just bug fixes (although bug fixes are in there), and that's why it'll cost you.

 

[Happy Meal]

You don't have to pay for them.

This allows a dev to produce a game and publish it at a lower cost. Those that like the game can then spend a little more for extra levels that have cost the dev in time and money to produce.

Maybe if apple didn't spank the developer for 30% of revenue they make for each app, then this wouldn't be an issue!! Honestly, making a developer give away 30% of revenue for an app they make themselves is counter productive and doesn't have the consumers best interests in mind...

 

[aristobrat]

How the hell can Apple charge for firmware on the ipod touch?

You're about a year late to this discussion, but for what it's worth:
http://www.macworld.com/article/131991/2008/02/ipodtouch.html

 

[Happy Meal]

How you can call it minor is beyond me. If that's how you view it then I can understand your upset.

Unfortunately for you it's your perception that's out of touch. There are a lot of big changes in this release. It does constitute an OS upgrade rather than just bug fixes (although bug fixes are in there), and that's why it'll cost you.

Please clarify what these "big changes" are that you want to pay apple for??

It's more than just big fixes yes, but seeing as you get added functionality on Nokia Symbian devices, Windows platforms, PS3, Xbox and Winmo devices when doing a free firmware update - So using your logic, we'll call them free "major" OS upgrades too

 

[edesignuk]

Maybe if apple didn't spank the developer for 30% of revenue they make for each app, then this wouldn't be an issue!! Honestly, making a developer give away 30% of revenue for an app they make themselves is counter productive and doesn't have the consumers best interests in mind...

Bandwidth, developers, support, app approvers, and so on, and so on. You think they're all paid for out of thin air? Of course Apple takes a cut.

70% of the takings or not, there will still be devs that want to sell a game for say $5 to make it look attractive, then beef up their earnings down the road when customers decide they like whatever it may be and want more.


meh, this is pointless. Enjoy your anger and ranting. If you want the new features, cough up. If not, stick with what you have, you're not actually losing functionality.

 

[firestarter]

Maybe if apple didn't spank the developer for 30% of revenue they make for each app, then this wouldn't be an issue!! Honestly, making a developer give away 30% of revenue for an app they make themselves is counter productive and doesn't have the consumers best interests in mind...

How much do you think distribution, marketing, invoicing etc. costs for a normal developer?

30% to Apple is a bargain.

How old are you (if you don't mind me asking). Your postings suggest <15. Am I right?

 

[BaldiMac]

Well Apple can call it whatever they like, but it's clearly just a minor firmware upgrade to me.

If you just consider it a minor firmware upgrade, than you don't need to purchase it. All of your current features will continue to work. Don't give it a second thought!

What worries me the most is that a lot of the Apple customer base are actively defending Apple, and evangelising about 'the apple way' like some kind of cult!

Every fanbase has its extremists. Though it does sound like you are hitting on all the anti-Apple buzzwords.

 

[aristobrat]

Maybe if apple didn't spank the developer for 30% of revenue they make for each app, then this wouldn't be an issue!! Honestly, making a developer give away 30% of revenue for an app they make themselves is counter productive and doesn't have the consumers best interests in mind...

Really? Because before Apple started spanking people for 30%, the other online stores (like Handango) were charging them 50%+

For 30%, Apple markets a developers app (by listing it in a central place, so the user doesn't have to search high and low over the Internet to find it), Apple handles all payments (so the developer doesn't have to get a merchant account with a payment processor that would take 10% of the revenue anyway), and Apple hosts the developers work, so the developer doesn't have to pay for bandwidth.

 

[Zedsdead185]

I don't like the fact that apple are charging extra (and always do) to upgrade the touch's OS, but i don't disagree with them. At the end of the day everyone just wants everything to be as cheap as possible, or free. Once again, its a bigger update than the N95 would ever have!

Over the past year, apple have been paying their developers to make a new OS for the iphone and touch, and then they charge you to use it. They have to get there money to benefit doing this from somewhere. They could just leave the OS how it was originally. Then people would moan. Give apple a break, they're a bussiness, bussiness' make money.

If you don't wanna buy the upgrade, then don't.

 

[Happy Meal]

Bandwidth, developers, support, app approvers, and so on, and so on. You think they're all paid for out of thin air? Of course Apple takes a cut.

70% of the takings or not, there will still be devs that want to sell a game for say $5 to make it look attractive, then beef up their earnings down the road when customers decide they like whatever it may be and want more.


meh, this is pointless. Enjoy your anger and ranting. If you want the new features, cough up. If not, stick with what you have, you're not actually losing functionality.

Forgive me, but you do seem rather blinkered in your 'beliefs' toward this company!

 

[edesignuk]

Forgive me, but you do seem rather blinkered in your 'beliefs' toward this company!

If you'd been around here more than 5 minutes you'd know I'm not. Still, not about to start defending myself to you.

Your demands and expectations have no basis in reality, so there's not really much that can be said to appease you.

 

[Happy Meal]

Bandwidth, developers, support, app approvers, and so on, and so on. You think they're all paid for out of thin air? Of course Apple takes a cut.

Er, are you actually reading my posts? I'm not sure you understand.

Bandwidth - How does that make sense? I think you'll find the networks make the end user pay for that with their phone tariffs.

Developers - In my argument, I am the developer! Apple don't need to pay me!

Support - I don't want Apple to support my app thank you very much.

App Approvers - Let me get this straight. You think I should be ok giving Apple 30% revenue of my application to pay for their "App Approvers"? Are you for real?

 

[mr360]

i'm backing out of this one - could get violent!

...I also need to do some work!