How well is iPhone selling in the UK

Discussion in 'iPhone' started by Philsy, Dec 18, 2007.

  1. Philsy macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    Considering the high price of the phone and monthly contract, combined with the lack of 3G, MMS and video, the iPhone isn't (yet) a good deal in my book.

    However, are other people buying it in the UK? Anyone got any figures?

    Phil
     
  2. MacsAttack macrumors 6502a

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    #2
    Well... I know I've bought 100% more iPhones than any other brand... In fact i've used far more iPhones than any other mobile phone.

    So from my point of view - it is doing quite well.
     
  3. Hudzilla macrumors 6502a

    Hudzilla

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    #3
    I think full figures are on wikipedia if you search for iPhone.

    I would imagine their sales are excellent, and yes it does lack some pretty standard functions, but nothing that can't be fixed in future software updates that will happen. (apart from 3g) which I don't really rate too much anyway having used it before.
     
  4. seedster2 macrumors 6502a

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    #4
    Until hard figures are released its basically all speculation.

    I doubt they are selling as briskly as they did in the US. Several variables such as marketing, functionality, price and unlocking may be to blame.
     
  5. stevearm macrumors 6502a

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    #5
    I thought iPhone did very badly in the UK? Most likely due to the delayed launch and lack of 3G/MMS/good camera which are all huge over here.
     
  6. speakerwizard macrumors 68000

    speakerwizard

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    #6
    all we know officially is that o2 said its the biggest phone launch theve ever done, and its probably the biggest selling smartphone, impressive but bear in mind other makes have more than one smart phone and cheap phones will always outsell more expensive feature rich ones. Im sure from the amount ive seen they are doing ok, the uk market is a strange one, they think of insignificant features as more important than groundbreaking new ones, we are a very pessimistic nation lol, once people see it in use though they will want it, thats the beauty of the iphone is it sells itself like a mac, all you need is to actually use one.
     
  7. macinfojunkie macrumors regular

    macinfojunkie

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    #8
    over priced, over hyped and over here! ;)

    (but just not selling that well)
     
  8. Project macrumors 68020

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    #9
    Heres me thinking Apple is aiming for 1% of the market. I'm pretty sure Apple is making that in the UK. But its seen as a failure? Weird.

    Does anybody really expect a £269 phone with an 18 month contract to be selling huge volumes?
     
  9. TXCraig macrumors 6502a

    TXCraig

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    #10
    Its funney that some people in the UK say the iPhone sold well and others say it didn't. Some articles out there say how well the first week of sales went and others do not.

    I read one article saying there were no queues for the iPhone but then I see pictures of the queues at the Apple Store in London. A friend of mine in Reading told me the there were at least 40 people in the queue at the CPW in Reading- he was standing in it for hours.

    I think O2 was able to move a good bit of business to their side by selling the iPhone and it was well worth it. The type of customer Apple is going for does not blink an eye at 260 pounds for a phone with a contract.
     
  10. alFR macrumors 68020

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    Aug 10, 2006
    #11
    The Register talks such crap. "3G, a standard feature on handsets this side of the pond". Yeah, that's why all the phones you see in CPW are 3G. Oh, hang on, they aren't are they? It's a common feature but not by any means standard....
     
  11. stevearm macrumors 6502a

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    #12
    95% of phones these days in the UK are 3G. It is standard.

    Just because phones don't have a camera on the face of the phone doesn't mean it's not 3G.
     
  12. Manic Mouse macrumors 6502a

    Manic Mouse

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    #13
    Compared to how well it could have done had they not shackled it with the horrible contracts it is doing badly. Pretty much everyone wants an iPhone, but very few are willing to pay the ludicrous contract + phone price you end up paying.

    I saw my first one in the wild today, only took a month and a half. And this is at a University, where it should be selling the best (ie rich and tech-savy kids).

    My friend who works at Carphone Warehouse says they're having a hard time selling them once they explain the price and contract. No problem with interest however, people are all over the demo models.

    The iPhone could have been the iPod of the mobile phone world, but instead it's going to be the Mac (high price, low market share).
     
  13. speakerwizard macrumors 68000

    speakerwizard

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    #14
    "95% of phones these days in the UK are 3G. It is standard."

    hahahahahahahahahahaha
     
  14. alFR macrumors 68020

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    #15
    Actually, only 12 of the 46 phones in the Orange online shop are 3G. Only 27 of the 53 models that Nokia list on their UK website are 3G. Not exactly 95%, is it?
     
  15. Manic Mouse macrumors 6502a

    Manic Mouse

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    #16
    How many of them cost £270? If you pay more than £200 for a phone today it's 3G.
     
  16. Project macrumors 68020

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    #17
    1. Badly as opposed to what? You have zero insight on Apples goals or targeting outside of the 1% figure. You have no insight into price sensitivity in this market - if Apple reduced the price by half, would sales double and profit increase? You also have zero insight into Apples long term strategy in the phone market. What we have now seems to be like a classic case of price skimming. Almost like a games console model. Who is to say this will not change 12-18 months down the line?

    2. Rich kids at university? A couple at mine with sugar daddies but by and large the minute minority.

    3. By iPod of the mobile world, you are talking about market share right? Well, it doesn't quite translate to that market. Its a very different business model. The ultra low end Nokias hold the most market share for any individual handset because the phone is a commodity item. Little money to be had on the low end. On the contrary, the iPhones market share by $ will be more sizable than any % they have by volume. The MP3 player (HDD based) is not yet commoditised, so you can't compare the two. If you would have said to Apple last year that they can come in with the most valuable 5% of the market (as they have with Macs as you allude to), they would snap your hands off because that's damn near $50bn. People are showing naivety by suggesting that such market share is a bad thing. Its a completely different market to MP3 players and the yardstick for success is by default completely different.

    4. As for the CPW anecdote, when Apple wants 1% share and prices the iPhone the way it does, are you really surprised that most people cant afford it or do not want to pay that much for a phone? It is not targeted at them right now. Its the elite product. The high end, premium phone. People will lust for it but can't afford it. Its entirely expected. The last thing they want is a free iPhone on contract like everything else and devalue the proposition at launch. Honestly, this is basic business strategy. What makes you think you are better qualified to position the iPhone in this marketplace than Apple? Do you not think they have experts from the mobile industry working with them to dictate a pricing strategy in the UK and other countries? Do you not think they thought about what people on average pay per month for contract phones? Rather, the line of thinking would be "what can we get away with". Now to you and many others, it does not present good value. But then they know this already.
     
  17. alFR macrumors 68020

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    #18
    With respect, that has precisely nothing to do with the point I was rebutting, which was stevearm's assertion that 95% of phones sold in the UK now have 3G.
     
  18. Project macrumors 68020

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    #19
    Also amazed that the consensus on value proposition appears to be whether a phone is 3G or not. Taking no account of the screen size, PPI, built in flash, CPU and RAM.
     
  19. samab macrumors 6502a

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    Mar 27, 2006
    #20
    Apple wants 1% of the world's market share.

    But the problem is the vast majority of the mobile phones sold in the world are sold in the developing world. So Apple needs something like 5% (complete guess from me) of the market share in the first world.
     
  20. emotion macrumors 68040

    emotion

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    #21
    Well observed. The UK market is obsessed with bells and whistles and less with actual function of the device.

    This is genuinely like the PC vs. Mac divide. Same pricing policy, same kinds of people arguing on both sides etc. Same kind of insecurity about going with the wrong platform etc.

    I suspect, in the absence of real figures, that the iPhone isn't selling that well here. I bought one but it ain't cheap but blimey this is like no other phone I've used.

    As for "this should have been the iPod of phones" type comments. Just wait, the iPod was laughed at for it's silly price tag when it came out but gradually over time that dropped. The same will happen to the iPhone.

    Let's face it despite it's technological limitations the iPhone has turned the phone business on it's head. It's made everyone expect flat rate data plans and is already the most used phone on the internet (http://marketshare.hitslink.com/rep...ame=M&qpsp=106&qpmr=14&qpdt=1&qpct=0&sample=4).

    This revision, at this point in time hasn't really grabbed the UK market. The next one might though.
     
  21. stevearm macrumors 6502a

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    #22
    Exactly. You can get free 3G phones these days.

    My point was that 95% of all phones that are being released every week these days is 3G. Obviously the two year old models in an Orange shop or on the Nokia site aren't going to have 3G, but the technology is now standard in the sense that with every new phone that comes out... around 95% of them come with 3G chips.
     
  22. Manic Mouse macrumors 6502a

    Manic Mouse

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    #23
    I wouldn't say that, it's just that 3G is seen as a "standard" feature, so buying an expensive phone without it is like buying an expensive car that doesn't come with alloys or electric windows. Especially since the mobile internet is the iPhone's main selling point.

    I'm just going to say that I, personally, don't really care about 2.5 vs. 3G issue. However I can see why people are criticising the iPhone over it.

    I never said it wasn't meeting Apple's goals, just that it could have a much better market penetration if it wasn't shackled to poor-value contracts. The price of the phone itself is great, I'd quite happily buy one if I could use my current SIM in it personally.

    My insight comes from the people one here and the people I know. All of whom think the iPhone is a wonderful product and all of whom would like to own one. They nearly all, however, agree that the contracts that the iPhone is shackled to aren't worth it. The mass media agrees as well, Phil had to terminate and interview on the UK iPhone launch with Channel 4 news when they started asking him tough questions.

    My insight also comes from the fact that I know a person who works at Carphone Warehouse who was involved with the launch and can tell me exactly how well or not well the iPhone is selling and what the people they're selling it to think about the price.

    It is just my opinion that if the iPhone had competitive contracts it would sell better, but it's not a baseless one. Whether this would make more money for Apple, however, is something we can't comment on as none of us know how much money they're getting from the monthly contracts.

    I'm simply talking about absolute sales and market penetration, you're taking a more pragmatic view of the industry in terms of profit and influence.

    People at mine spend more than an iPhone contract would cost in a month on a night out drinking. Also everyone I know at Uni has a contract phone and most have iPods. So if they aren't the target for the iPhone (people who can afford it and are interested in it) I don't know who is.

    It's not a bad thing, I'm sure Apple are doing very well from the iPhone. After all they're charging customers twice for it, once when they buy it and then every month. Apple probably make many times over what each iPhone costs to make back in the long run.

    For consumers it isn't a good thing but I'm sure Apple are more than happy with the revenue generated by the iPhone.

    I think you misunderstand where I'm coming from, I totally agree with you that Apple are trying to make as much money as possible and are probably going the best way about doing that.

    But at the end of the day the iPhone isn't doing that well in terms of pure sales, which is my point, and I've already pointed out that it's raking them in the dosh. Mostly from the raping of their few customers, but how they earn their money is their prerogative.

    I look at the iPhone, as a product and how much it costs, as a consumer. Which is what I am. If you're an Apple stock holder then well and good for you. If you're a consumer getting gouged then it's not so good. For Apple the iPhone is a huge success, for the consumer it's rip-off. And I guess this is why people say it isn't "doing well", it isn't dominating the mobile market (in terms of phones sold) when it has the potential to do so. For £269 it's an amazing phone and it's without a doubt the best "device" on the market overall. So people expect it to do an iPod rather than a Mac, and the way Apple talked about it initially (being the iPod for the phone market, revolutionising the industry etc) people thought it would rule. You are right to point out that they also said they'd be going after 1% of the market, but people assumed that this would be because of competition and not because Apple would price the iPhone out of the market (in the UK at least).

    And I don't mean it's an expensive phone, I mean it's overpriced for what it is. The iPhone isn't an elite phone. It lacks many of what are standard features on even mid-range phones. It has a 2MP camera, which is the bottom end as far as cameras go and it can't even take video. It can't do MMS, it doesn't have 3G all of which are standard on any kind of decent phone. You can't make video calls (useless feature I know), you can't run JAVA applications, ringtones are limited. Yes the iPhone can do other things, but most of those things the iPod touch can do and so don't validate it's relatively high price-tag.

    The iPhone is an iPod touch with a low-end phone tacked on. Yet it costs way more than what a touch costs in the long run (with the contract in the equation). The sums simply don't add up.

    If only Apple hadn't gotten greedy and demanded a cut of the monthly contract. As you say, I'm sure they're entire strategy is "what can they get away with".

    It seems we agree that Apple are undoubtedly doing what's best for them, and that none of us could do a better job in that respect. I guess the thing that bothers me about the entire iPhone issue is that Apple seem quite happy to screw over their customers for money. I know they're a company and making money is their raison d'être, but it still leaves a sour taste in my mouth for them to be so anti-consumer.
     
  23. emotion macrumors 68040

    emotion

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    #24
    How is selling a premium product at a premium price "anti-consumer"?
     
  24. seedster2 macrumors 6502a

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    #25
    1.) What makes you more qualified? What insight do you have that the rest of the posters on this forum dont? Only the market will dictate what happens next but everyone here is speculating to some degree. Why are you getting so excited:p

    2) Younger people make up a large proportion of the impulse buyers. The iphone doesnt cater to the business user so I can see how college students who like music and communicating with friends are a target audience.

    3.) Agreed, but they are missing a large pop of buyers who would plunk down the money if it werent for some of the ridiculous tarriffs which they are indirectly responsible for. They are making great margins but again they are not bang & olfusen of cell phones where people will justify the cost because its Apple. There are Vertus for that.

    4) you are correct. But there is a possibility that "what they thought they could get away with" may have been miscalculated. And that could have easily happened with the resounding welcome iphone received from the US market. Why isn't that feasible for you?

    Regardless of its limitations and implimentation, 3G will hurt iPhone sales overseas. Domestically it hasnt taken root, but it is true that business and high end phones overseas have 3G standard. It sort of reminds me of people shopping LCD's now are always looking for 1080P. Effective marketing will devalue things like screen size and CPU and tout 3G. Limit the amount of retailers carrying the product and it becomes a major deficiency to the uninformed consumer.

    Again we are all speculating sales could range from great to dismal but do you think you will ever know what their internal expectations were?
     

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