HydraDock

[cfedu]

Ok, posted the question, and the responded right away. Here is their response:

DisplayPort Alternate Mode v1.2 for USB 3.2 only supports 2560x1440, not 4K. You need DisplayPort Alt Mode v1.3 to go to 4K.

Hope this helps.

Kristin
KickShark Team

Which is confusing since reviews have used the MB at 4k @30hz with a displayport adapter. Something does not add up. It's best to take them at their word and hopes things change once available.

 

[ZipZap]

Last week, people were hating on the MacBook for being so stripped-down, and many of us were defending its design as a series of worthwhile trade-offs. Now, someone has introduced an accessory--which is totally optional--and people are reverse-hating on it?

The HydraDock does not take anything away from the MacBook. The MacBook is still a gorgeous, ultra-ultraportable machine, which truly doesn't "need" more ports for many people's use cases. (I'm eagerly looking forward to receiving my own, in a few weeks...)

However, some people would like the *option* to have more ports when they're at a desk. In many ways, a dock like this is perfect, because it allows you to have the elegance of only one port on your machine, while still retaining the ability to connect multiple devices and an external display when at a desk...and leave them there when you're not.

My work laptop is a Lenovo ThinkPad X230. I love its 12.5" size, which I've decided is perfect for me. I appreciate that it's smaller and lighter than my coworkers' laptops when we travel for business, when walking downtown, etc. But, at my desk, I have it in a dock. I have an external (Apple) keyboard, a Logitech mouse, two external displays, my iPhone dock, and various other device cables for charging and data transfer. I appreciate that I can leave that all behind when I'm on the train, when I'm at home, when I'm traveling, when I'm out and about. It's about options!

I wish I could close up most of the ports on my ThinkPad, because I honestly rarely use them--they just fill up with lint and dust most of the time. As a result, I never saw the single USB-C port on the MacBook as a serious liability. But it was also because I knew someone would make something like the HydraDock.

I don't think the makers of the DynaDock intended for people to take it with them everywhere. It's just for that one place where you find yourself working most often, whether it's a desk at your office, home office, dorm room, etc.

And please, people: can we all recognize that laptops are inherently ergonomic nightmares? No health expert would recommend laptop posture as the optimal way to position your body for extended periods of time. Some people will say, "But I feel fine/I'm doing it right/I've never had problems." That may be correct for you, and for right now, but give it time. If you work 8 hours a day on a laptop, and you don't compensate by assuming good posture, doing stretches, and taking breaks, you're going to see long-term problems. Devices like this just make sense: you don't sacrifice portability, but you have the option of convenience/expandability/good health when you want it.

TL;DR: Like some people were saying of the MacBook itself...this product isn't for you, and you don't have to buy it!

There is no reverse hating here. If the rMB is your only machine, then I could see the dock being a nice add-on. The idea, at least from my perspective, is that the rMB is an iPad with a keyboard and bigger screen. Its not a desktop nor is it meant to replace one. I plug my iPad in for 1 thing….recharge. I don't need a dock to do that.

It is a cool dock, no hate from that perspective….I just don't think it fits in with Apple's vision. If you need those ports get a rMBP 13.

 

[tgwaste]

I am trying to reason this out as well. This is not a desktop computer. Its an iPad with a keyboard.

The dock is cool but would you really use it. Pay more for it when its finally available.

Also, how in the world are the going to that build by the end of June? Unless they are already in production or starting soon? The Kickstarter does not even end for 28 more days.

----------

Put thunderbolt in it so it can dock with a rMB and rMBP. They its actually GREAT!

you mean its not a desktop computer for YOU. Its working perfectly fine as one for ME.

ultra-portable when I'm on the go and perfectly fine when I'm stationary at my desk at home/work.

 

[DarwinOSX]

So you buy a beautiful, light and thin laptop only to carry around a giant power strip looking adapter? That will look ridiculous hanging off the end of a MacBook.

Its a dock. You don't carry it around. Not that complicated a concept.

 

[cfedu]

There is no reverse hating here. If the rMB is your only machine, then I could see the dock being a nice add-on. The idea, at least from my perspective, is that the rMB is an iPad with a keyboard and bigger screen. Its not a desktop nor is it meant to replace one. I plug my iPad in for 1 thing….recharge. I don't need a dock to do that.

It is a cool dock, no hate from that perspective….I just don't think it fits in with Apple's vision. If you need those ports get a rMBP 13.

Are you saying that this is a $1300 iPad? Why would someone who wants maximum portability get a rMBP because they want connectivity options at home?

If Apples visions was to make this a 1300$ iPad, they would have used a lightning connector rather than USB-C. This Macbook is more or less as powerfull as my 2012 MBA, I'm I using it wrong when I have it connected to my external display, KB, and mouse? Anyone who thinks this is just an iPad would be better off saving 600$ and just get an iPad IMO.

 

[saifrc]

There is no reverse hating here. If the rMB is your only machine, then I could see the dock being a nice add-on. The idea, at least from my perspective, is that the rMB is an iPad with a keyboard and bigger screen. Its not a desktop nor is it meant to replace one. I plug my iPad in for 1 thing….recharge. I don't need a dock to do that.

It is a cool dock, no hate from that perspective….I just don't think it fits in with Apple's vision. If you need those ports get a rMBP 13.

I agree with your assessment that the HydraDock doesn't fit in with Apple's vision. If it did, they'd surely have created something like. Also, agreed that the new MacBook isn't intended as a desktop replacement. But, it was the kind of thing Apple did once upon a time--anyone remember the PowerBook Duo?

Luckily, third parties are often coming up with ways to supplement Apple's vision. Sometimes they're cheesy and unnecessary, but other times they serve a purpose. My old 15" MBP from 2008 is going to find new life as a server and media center PC, living in a Henge Dock near my TV, connected directly to my router and NAS. The Henge Dock wasn't part of Apple's vision, but I'm glad it was part of *someone's* vision

I'm just ranting because I've heard/read a bunch of hate for the HydraDock. I don't plan to get one, but I see its purpose. I just hate...hate, I guess

 

[DarwinOSX]

The idea, at least from my perspective, is that the rMB is an iPad with a keyboard and bigger screen.

Then you have a very limited perspective. It's pretty obviously a full fledged Mac with OS X that can run Mac apps. Which makes it much more capable than an iPad at many, many things.
Odd that these things have to be explained.

----------

I agree with your assessment that the HydraDock doesn't fit in with Apple's vision.

Mmm no. Apple isn't that in to accessories which is why they haven't made lots of things.

 

[JTToft]

Ok, posted the question, and the responded right away. Here is their response:

DisplayPort Alternate Mode v1.2 for USB 3.2 only supports 2560x1440, not 4K. You need DisplayPort Alt Mode v1.3 to go to 4K.

- Which is utter nonsense. Explain this:

Using a USB Type-C to DisplayPort cable (one of Google's, actually, hooray for standards), we were able to drive a 3840×2160 display at 30Hz. This is likely some limitation of the GPU, since the USB Type-C port supports DisplayPort 1.2.

Also, there is no USB 3.2.
And to my knowledge, DisplayPort 1.3 doesn't yet exist in any products... Yet plenty of 4K monitors exist - using DisplayPort 1.2.
These people are clueless.

Which is confusing since reviews have used the MB at 4k @30hz with a displayport adapter. Something does not add up. It's best to take them at their word and hopes things change once available.

- It's not just confusing. It's completely wrong.

 

[tgwaste]

so confront them about it.

 

[cfedu]

- Which is utter nonsense. Explain this:


Also, there is no USB 3.2.
And to my knowledge, DisplayPort 1.3 doesn't yet exist in any products... Yet plenty of 4K monitors exist - using DisplayPort 1.2.
These people are clueless.


- It's not just confusing. It's completely wrong.

I found this from DP.org
http://www.displayport.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/DP-Alt-Mode-Overview-for-VESA-v1.pdf



DisplayPort Alt Mode capability of USB Type-C connector


• DisplayPort uses two high speed lanes

– For DP 1.2a (HBR2), this provides support for 2560x1600 or 2 each 1080p displays


– For DP 1.3 (HBR3), this will provide support of 4K UHD (3840 x 2160)


Not sure what it is, maybe when connected directly to the MB is is more of a passthrough rather than an alternate mode which might explain the difference. I have to idea whats going on but is they state it only does 1440P, we might not be aware of some of the limitation of this new technology.


Maybe we are confusing Alt mode and native DP

 

[Scott6666]

Hideous

 

[nrubenstein]

For me, this is pretty uninteresting. If I wanted to use the machine in that way, I'd have bought a different one.

As I've noted in another thread, I would, however, not mind a compact USB hub+charger in a similar form factor to my Anker 5-port iPhone/iPad charger.

 

[cfedu]

For me, this is pretty uninteresting. If I wanted to use the machine in that way, I'd have bought a different one.

As I've noted in another thread, I would, however, not mind a compact USB hub+charger in a similar form factor to my Anker 5-port iPhone/iPad charger.

+1

If you want connectivity and use a Mac at a desk, just buy an iMac. Using one device for 2 scenarios is just silly if you can't afford 2 Macs you should just use windows or get a better job.

 

[nrubenstein]

I'm also pleased to say that AirPlay to the 1080p TV in our conference room works great for presentations. Surprisingly, 1080p is even usable mirrored on the local display (which happens automatically - you also get the choice of 720p). That ducks the need for a dongle for that use.

 

[theSeb]

- Which is utter nonsense. Explain this:


Also, there is no USB 3.2.
And to my knowledge, DisplayPort 1.3 doesn't yet exist in any products... Yet plenty of 4K monitors exist - using DisplayPort 1.2.
These people are clueless.


- It's not just confusing. It's completely wrong.

If anyone buys this product after considering the information in this thread, then please PM me about a bridge that I have for sale.

Best Regards,
Sebastian

 

[JTToft]

I found this from DP.org
http://www.displayport.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/DP-Alt-Mode-Overview-for-VESA-v1.pdf



DisplayPort Alt Mode capability of USB Type-C connector


• DisplayPort uses two high speed lanes

– For DP 1.2a (HBR2), this provides support for 2560x1600 or 2 each 1080p displays


– For DP 1.3 (HBR3), this will provide support of 4K UHD (3840 x 2160)


Not sure what it is, maybe when connected directly to the MB is is more of a passthrough rather than an alternate mode which might explain the difference. I have to idea whats going on but is they state it only does 1440P, we might not be aware of some of the limitation of this new technology.

- That page in the PDF describes what you can do via Alt Mode on two of the four available lanes. On two lanes, DP 1.2 can output 2560x1440, while DP 1.3 can output 4K on the same two lanes. If the full four lanes were utilized, DP 1.2 would be able to output 4K (I bet Apple does this or something similar in their Multiport Adapter). It may not be a good solution, though, to use all four lanes on a dock such as theirs, since it needs to support a multitude of different connections at the same time.

Still, none of this explains their erroneous statement that DisplayPort 1.2 cannot transmit a 4K signal. And it certainly doesn't explain their mysterious reference to "USB 3.2" (which was perhaps just a typo, but still...).

Maybe we are confusing Alt mode and native DP

- I doubt it. Alt Mode is native DisplayPort. It's just carried over a USB-C cable.

 

[close2reality]

lets go buy a ferrari and put a bra on it.

 

[ctyrider]

If you want connectivity and use a Mac at a desk, just buy an iMac. Using one device for 2 scenarios is just silly if you can't afford 2 Macs you should just use windows or get a better job.

What an incredibly stupid thing to say.. Just wow.

 

[cfedu]

What an incredibly stupid thing to say.. Just wow.

It was sarcasm, I think the dock it a great idea

 

[ctyrider]

It was sarcasm, I think the dock it a great idea

In that case - apologies! The sarcasm got lost on me, amongst seeing all the people foolishly criticizing the dock.. As if using a MacBook on the desk in addition to using it as a mobile device is such a difficult concept to understand.

 

[Tanax]

Not gonna feed the troll.

If I can have one machine with that simply expands into my desktop setup (clamshell mode) and still be portable for when I'm on the go...why wouldn't I want that?

Don't worry. dexterbell is bit narcissistic. He believes *his* way is the only way. Just a month ago, he was saying how everyone shouldn't get a Macbook because the rMBP is "better" for the same amount of money and even though we tried to explain to him that "better" for him does not equal better for someone else.. he didn't get that.

Now he apparently got the Macbook any way.
Gotta love this place, people are funny

 

[cfedu]

In that case - apologies! The sarcasm got lost on me, amongst seeing all the people foolishly criticizing the dock.. As if using a MacBook on the desk in addition to using it as a mobile device is such a difficult concept to understand.

Thats why I love my 11" MBA and my dell 2408 that I also use with my Mac mini. If there was a thunderbolt with the connectivity of the Hydra dock for the same price, I would have got one right away. Once my MBA dies I might consider the MB.

 

[runforlife]

Well they hit their funding goal, and are promising June shipments. We'll see what happens on delivery timeline, but I personally am looking forward to it.

 

[cfedu]

- That page in the PDF describes what you can do via Alt Mode on two of the four available lanes. On two lanes, DP 1.2 can output 2560x1440, while DP 1.3 can output 4K on the same two lanes. If the full four lanes were utilized, DP 1.2 would be able to output 4K (I bet Apple does this or something similar in their Multiport Adapter). It may not be a good solution, though, to use all four lanes on a dock such as theirs, since it needs to support a multitude of different connections at the same time.

Still, none of this explains their erroneous statement that DisplayPort 1.2 cannot transmit a 4K signal. And it certainly doesn't explain their mysterious reference to "USB 3.2" (which was perhaps just a typo, but still...).


- I doubt it. Alt Mode is native DisplayPort. It's just carried over a USB-C cable.

They updated their FAQ, not sure exactly what they mean. It's not looking too good IMO

"There are three similar-sounding factors at play here with the MacBook + HydraDock video resolution support topic. One is the maximum resolution supported by the DisplayPort 1.2 standard, which is 4K. Another is the video resolution supported by the USB 3.1 Displayport Alternate Mode standard, which is 2560x1440. Another is the resolution supported by the GPU in the Apple MacBook, which is 3840x2160 over HDMI and 2560x1440 over USB 3.1 DisplayPort Alternate Mode.

There are people arguing on the web that we are confused about the specifications of our own product. We are not. The confusion is that the MacBook does not have a native DisplayPort connector — it pipes out video over the USB-C jack using USB 3.1 DisplayPort Alternate Mode.

The DisplayPort v1.2 standard supports 4K video. But, USB 3.1 DisplayPort Alternate Mode v1.2 does not. It only supports 2560x1440 DisplayPort connections. There is an included method for configuring HDMI over Alternate Mode DisplayPort out of the new MacBook that supports either 1920x1080 HDMI video at a 60Hz refresh rate, or 4K (3840x2160) HDMI video at only a 30Hz refresh rate. It is because of this capability of handling a 4K display over HDMI (only) at only a 30Hz refresh rate that Apple has chosen to state in their marketing and specifications for the MacBook that the product supports "4K displays!"

After nearly a year of development and engineering we clearly understand the capabilities of not only USB 3.1 Alternate Mode video, but of our own product. There was a cost-complexity choice we had to make involving one of the video processors in our product that required us to choose whether to support the 30Hz HDMI 4K mode from the MacBook or not. And, we decided to only support the 60Hz refresh rate modes, as this is a desktop computing product and 30Hz flicker is annoying — something we think constitutes "barely supporting" 4K video.

So, all that now said, the HydraDock supports one of the following at a time — not both: one Mini DisplayPort connection at up to 2560x1440 pixels, 60Hz refresh rate; or, one HDMI connection at up to 1920x1080 pixels, 60Hz refresh rate."

https://www.kickstarter.com/project...port-usb-c-dock-for-apple-macbook/description

 

[tgwaste]

Works for me. I don't have a 4K display nor do I plan on getting one anytime soon.