iPad I am being scammed on eBay and I need advice!

[journeyof83]

Heya!

I just sold this iPad on eBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271702729681?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1561.l2649, you can see my account "Journeyof83" and my perfect feedback.

The iPad was received by buyer on Dec 12th, which is a Friday. He waited 3 days, over the weekend, to make a case saying that (1) the touch-screen does not work (2) it's "glitchy" and laggy (3) the settings are messed up and (4) it does not hold a charge. There is a contradiction right there, if the touch-screen does not work, how would he know it's glitchy and laggy. I responded to his accusations, with this obviously being a bait-n-switch.

He responded claiming that he spent a whole day trying to fix it. I'm floored at this point. If your iPad "arrived damaged" as he claimed, would you not be upset and contact me immediately? Why would a person spend a whole day trying to fix it, and another 3 days to make a complaint.

This all sounds like creditable information for eBay to side with me, but they're not. Even though this guy has 2 negative reviews that relate with iPads. I was on the phone with eBay last night and I'm at a lost. The scammer is going to send back the iPad to me and now eBay wants me to prove (somehow) that it's not the same iPad.

With that being said, I'm desperately reaching out for help. How can I prove this? If he replaced the guts of the iPad with a non-working one, is there a way that I can show the innards being different from the case, like, by serial numbers or something? Anything helps. I was going to sell this so that my GF could put some money back into a new iPad for Christmas. Any advice would be much-appreciated!

 

[Closingracer]

eBay tends to be more pro buyer then seller . From what I've understand of eBay your pretty much screwed unless you have proof he tampered with it ....or has a different serial number then what you sent

 

[scaredpoet]

If the innards are changed by a non-Apple-authorized technician, then the serial number the iPad displays in Settings -> About will change, too. Some iPad models (or all of them?) have the serial number etched on the outer casing; if what is displayed on the outside doesn't match with the serial number the iPad claims it has on the inside, then you have proof that an innards switch happened. And if the buyer did a complete swap of a bad iPad for a good one, then obviously the serial numbers will be different both inside AND outside.

The next problem will be proving WHO did the switch. Every time I sell an iDevice on eBay, I take pictures of the exterior of the device, and the device showing its serial number on the About screen, plus a video showing that it's working properly, loading up the eBay page for its own auction, and showing the name of the winning bidder.

If you took pictures like this, then you'll have proof. If not... well, you should've taken pictures.

 

[journeyof83]

From what I read too, this seems to becoming more true. The fact that eBay didn't read what he wrote drives me up the wall. The guy is blatantly lying to me and eBay doesn't bother to look at it. It would be a miracle if he did send back a different iPad, I'm really hoping for that. The iPad I sold has engraving in the back.

I'm hoping somebody here that is knowledgeable about the inner-workings of an iPad could chime in.

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If the innards are changed by a non-Apple-authorized technician, then the serial number the iPad displays in Settings -> About will change, too. Some iPad models (or all of them?) have the serial number etched on the outer casing; if what is displayed on the outside doesn't match with the serial number the iPad claims it has on the inside, then you have proof that an innards switch happened. And if the buyer did a complete swap of a bad iPad for a good one, then obviously the serial numbers will be different both inside AND outside.

The next problem will be proving WHO did the switch. Every time I sell an iDevice on eBay, I take pictures of the exterior of the device, and the device showing its serial number on the About screen, plus a video showing that it's working properly, loading up the eBay page for its own auction, and showing the name of the winning bidder.

If you took pictures like this, then you'll have proof. If not... well, you should've taken pictures.

I have pictures on my auction and one picture of the "Hello" screen after formatting the iPad. As for the when the box comes back to me, I will video record me opening it, with some sort of time stamp, proof, etc., and hopefully that will hold up. But I do understand what you're saying about WHO swapped it. I am working to maintain my calm and logic and I know that it is possible for eBay to see me as the scammer, so I would have to act incredibly fast and respond back to them, unlike waiting 3 days to make a claim, like that guy did. Also, my GF read up that in most cases now, pictures and videos cannot be used as evidence due to Photoshop and other image-altering software. Feels like I'm about to hit a wall.

 

[JTravers]

I know this won't help you now, but isn't there a way to limit your ebay bidders only to those without negative feedback? If not, that's horrible.

Still horrible for you. Hopefully, the guy just has buyers remorse and is trying to weasel out of the purchase and will return the iPad in the condition you shipped it.

 

[newellj]

If the innards are changed by a non-Apple-authorized technician, then the serial number the iPad displays in Settings -> About will change, too. Some iPad models (or all of them?) have the serial number etched on the outer casing; if what is displayed on the outside doesn't match with the serial number the iPad claims it has on the inside, then you have proof that an innards switch happened. And if the buyer did a complete swap of a bad iPad for a good one, then obviously the serial numbers will be different both inside AND outside.

The next problem will be proving WHO did the switch. Every time I sell an iDevice on eBay, I take pictures of the exterior of the device, and the device showing its serial number on the About screen, plus a video showing that it's working properly, loading up the eBay page for its own auction, and showing the name of the winning bidder.

If you took pictures like this, then you'll have proof. If not... well, you should've taken pictures.

One additional suggestion to add to this excellent set of suggestions: I used to host my photos on Photobucket. I don't do that any more, because the buyer could claim that i'd swapped photos. I use eBay so that if the photos ever become important to resolve a claim, there's no question that they are the same photos that were posted when the buyer made his bid.

 

[journeyof83]

I know this won't help you now, but isn't there a way to limit your ebay bidders only to those without negative feedback? If not, that's horrible.

Still horrible for you. Hopefully, the guy just has buyers remorse and is trying to weasel out of the purchase and will return the iPad in the condition you shipped it.

I believe that is somewhere deep in the settings that I need to change. It was sold within hours of posting it. The worst part is that I don't have 'right of refusal' when the guy bought it. I was already concerned about his 2 negative feedbacks, but I didn't have a choice. He bought it and paid, and I was obliged to send it out. I even spent extra on signature confirmation to make sure that it would be received. If anything, I hope everyone here realizes how terrible eBay is at protecting you. Not to mention sellers (me) pay the eBay fees and the buyers don't. Yet, eBay totally sides with the buyers, all they have to do is make a little sneeze about it and the seller (me) is spending all his time figuring out how to combat this. Whether if I win (doubt it) or not, I am done with eBay.

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One additional suggestion to add to this excellent set of suggestions: I used to host my photos on Photobucket. I don't do that any more, because the buyer could claim that i'd swapped photos. I use eBay so that if the photos ever become important to resolve a claim, there's no question that they are the same photos that were posted when the buyer made his bid.

Yes, the photos are hosted by eBay. I have 10-12 photos in that auction I posted so I cannot edit them. There is only 1 photo of the working "hello" screen.

 

[oneMadRssn]

If you go to https://supportprofile.apple.com/ and login with your information, it should show all the Apple devices you've registered. In there should be the serial number of your ipad that you sold. You can compare that with the serial number of what you get back in the return.

 

[journeyof83]

If you go to https://supportprofile.apple.com/ and login with your information, it should show all the Apple devices you've registered. In there should be the serial number of your ipad that you sold. You can compare that with the serial number of what you get back in the return.

This is great info, thank you and noted!

 

[Brian Y]

Just see what happens when you get it back.

There may be pry marks, the serials might not match, etc. There's no point worrying until you get it back. If it's a different iPad, or has been messed with, mention in your note to both the buyer and eBay that you will be contacting the police, too. That should should **** him up a bit.

One question though - sellers can't leave negative feedback for buyers - so how does he have negative feedback from previously bought items?

 

[KdParker]

If the innards are changed by a non-Apple-authorized technician, then the serial number the iPad displays in Settings -> About will change, too. Some iPad models (or all of them?) have the serial number etched on the outer casing; if what is displayed on the outside doesn't match with the serial number the iPad claims it has on the inside, then you have proof that an innards switch happened. And if the buyer did a complete swap of a bad iPad for a good one, then obviously the serial numbers will be different both inside AND outside.

The next problem will be proving WHO did the switch. Every time I sell an iDevice on eBay, I take pictures of the exterior of the device, and the device showing its serial number on the About screen, plus a video showing that it's working properly, loading up the eBay page for its own auction, and showing the name of the winning bidder.

If you took pictures like this, then you'll have proof. If not... well, you should've taken pictures.

Agreed. I did the same thing when selling my iPhones to be sure that no one can claim I sent anything out damaged. This protection comes in handy from scammers trying to rip the sellers off.

 

[journeyof83]

Just see what happens when you get it back.

There may be pry marks, the serials might not match, etc. There's no point worrying until you get it back. If it's a different iPad, or has been messed with, mention in your note to both the buyer and eBay that you will be contacting the police, too. That should should **** him up a bit.

One question though - sellers can't leave negative feedback for buyers - so how does he have negative feedback from previously bought items?

Sellers are not allowed to leave negative feedback but the buyers can leave negative feedback for the seller, which is what happened. He was trying to sell some iPads to other buyers.

 

[jbachandouris]

What is even worse is that the buyer now has 180 days to report an item as significantly not as described and demand a refund. I don't know who thought that was a fair way of doing business.

Good luck. Maybe Apple will have mercy on you when you receive it back. Worst case scenario is to ask for an out of warranty replacement. It's not free, but at least you would have a working iPad.

 

[journeyof83]

What is even worse is that the buyer now has 180 days to report an item as significantly not as described and demand a refund. I don't know who thought that was a fair way of doing business.

Good luck. Maybe Apple will have mercy on you when you receive it back. Worst case scenario is to ask for an out of warranty replacement. It's not free, but at least you would have a working iPad.

That is ridiculous, eBay is completely broken.

 

[journeyof83]

Thank you everyone for chiming in. Based off of what I researched, I'm ready to accept defeat but not without a fight first. I'll post important updates as they happen.

 

[ZipZap]

What is even worse is that the buyer now has 180 days to report an item as significantly not as described and demand a refund. I don't know who thought that was a fair way of doing business.

Good luck. Maybe Apple will have mercy on you when you receive it back. Worst case scenario is to ask for an out of warranty replacement. It's not free, but at least you would have a working iPad.

I think that is 45 days

 

[snorkelman]

Im wondering if find my iphone could actually help in these sort of cases:

leave it enabled ahead of sale
include a note to the buyer asking them to check the device thoroughly e.g.
that it powers on, takes and holds a charge, screen and buttons function OK, preloaded apps all work etc and condition is as described.

They message you to that effect? you deregister the device unlocking it for them to erase and reinitialize.

They claim its arrived in some other condition? No problem, you lock it with message giving address to mail it back to for refund.

They subsequently back track after you've deregistered the device for them, and file a significantly not as described regarding any of the above? Then you have copy of their ebay message accepting it was allin good condition and working order, to argue your side of the story.

 

[newellj]

What is even worse is that the buyer now has 180 days to report an item as significantly not as described and demand a refund. I don't know who thought that was a fair way of doing business.

Good luck. Maybe Apple will have mercy on you when you receive it back. Worst case scenario is to ask for an out of warranty replacement. It's not free, but at least you would have a working iPad.

That is such an outrage, really. I've been selling on eBay since 1998 and it just keeps getting worse and worse. At this point I don't think I'd sell anything electronic at all on eBay...I've sold lots of cameras and phones in the past. Even for things without moving parts, 180 days is nuts, especially because as several people here have said eBay always sides with the buyer.

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Just see what happens when you get it back.

There may be pry marks, the serials might not match, etc. There's no point worrying until you get it back. If it's a different iPad, or has been messed with, mention in your note to both the buyer and eBay that you will be contacting the police, too. That should should **** him up a bit.

One question though - sellers can't leave negative feedback for buyers - so how does he have negative feedback from previously bought items?

^^^ More good advice. Possibly it's just buyer's remorse and it'll come back in exactly the condition it was shipped in, other than possibly needing a reset. In that case, take a breath and move on.

If it's worse than that, you may actually be able to get eBay on your side (for example, if the serials no longer match, or there are obvious pry marks on the case).

In any case, "sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." It's holiday time - try to put it out of your mind until it is back in your hands. I would be feeling exactly the same way you are and I know how hard that is to do...but a final thought. You can't control how other people act, you can only control how you act...ebay is not a competitive game. If the guy actually does scam you, I know it's hard to really get comfortable with this, but it's only money - let it go. I say that having been scammed on eBay twice.

 

[journeyof83]

In any case, "sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." It's holiday time - try to put it out of your mind until it is back in your hands. I would be feeling exactly the same way you are and I know how hard that is to do...but a final thought. You can't control how other people act, you can only control how you act...ebay is not a competitive game. If the guy actually does scam you, I know it's hard to really get comfortable with this, but it's only money - let it go. I say that having been scammed on eBay twice.

I hear ya, thanks for the words. I'm trying not to let it get to me, at least until I receive the iPad again.

 

[mrex]

dont ever sell anything in ebay if dont know the buyer (obviously you dont). ebay sucks, and favor always buyer whatever happens... many good sellers, even companies, have ditched ebay.

good luck with your case!

 

[journeyof83]

dont ever sell anything in ebay if dont know the buyer (obviously you dont). ebay sucks, and favor always buyer whatever happens... many good sellers, even companies, have ditched ebay.

Even if I somehow win this by a miracle, I'm STILL going to leave eBay. It's a broken business model they have.

 

[Brian Y]

Even if I somehow win this by a miracle, I'm STILL going to leave eBay. It's a broken business model they have.

I stopped selling on eBay for anything worth more than £30 or so some time ago now. I tend to use these recycling places for iDevices these days - you tend to get about 20% less than eBay (if you shop around) but I'll happily lose that 20% not to have to put up with eBay's crap.

Another alternative is to sell on Amazon. Amazon aren't so bad when it comes to interfering with marketplace sales, and they'll happily boot a customer off if they have loads of issues (potentially scamming) sellers.

 

[journeyof83]

I stopped selling on eBay for anything worth more than £30 or so some time ago now. I tend to use these recycling places for iDevices these days - you tend to get about 20% less than eBay (if you shop around) but I'll happily lose that 20% not to have to put up with eBay's crap.

Another alternative is to sell on Amazon. Amazon aren't so bad when it comes to interfering with marketplace sales, and they'll happily boot a customer off if they have loads of issues (potentially scamming) sellers.

I am definitely going to look into Amazon. I've been a long-time customer and very happy with that corporation. I'm going to give it a try for selling.

 

[rgarjr]

I am definitely going to look into Amazon. I've been a long-time customer and very happy with that corporation. I'm going to give it a try for selling.

I think Amazon is the same when it comes to buyers wanting returns.

 

[MikeCBR]

I am being scammed on eBay and I need advice!

You have his address. Burn his house down if he tries to screw you. Pretty much anything over 100 I require local pickup.