Yup. Encoding during handbrake no longer breaks 90 degrees Celsius. I've just encoded a BR 1080p rip and the CPU temps went up to 89 and hovered around 76 for most of the time.
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i5 - i7 noticable heat and fan noise thread. The concensous is >
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Yup. Encoding during handbrake no longer breaks 90 degrees Celsius. I've just encoded a BR 1080p rip and the CPU temps went up to 89 and hovered around 76 for most of the time.
Currently have about 50gb free. I wonder if a higher data load on the ssd slows down the CPU.
Cheers... Just wondered due to the experience with the i7 first couple of days (hope it remains good now).
I read on xbench I think, either website or similar that "emptier" drive provides for faster test... Then again, I just had a look and can't find what I think I saw... So I really don't know.. But I am so sure I read that somewhere, just last night... Sorry..
But that is my agricultural understanding... Not sure if anyone would know more about it..
That is correct. Check out Anandtech's SSD reviews for an explanation. I can't remember exactly where he mentions the details of this and I am too lazy to type my own explanation.
The NAND flash memory used in SSD drives have a limited lifespan that can be a hindrance when not managed properly. Most of the SSDs use MLC NAND which means each bit(1 transistor per bit) can go through 10,000 read/erase/write cycles before the data retention becomes too low and reliability becomes an issue.
The controller chip is paired with the flash chips. The controller chip basically spreads data around to make sure no portion of the drive fails randomly, but rather predictably. Now how it does all this becomes rather complicated but the basic gist is that the reliability management is inherently tied to how it performs as well.
When you have empty space on the drive, the controller can use the empty space to do the "management" and move the data around as I mentioned above. The less there is, the lower performance it'll have and reduced lifespan.
One note: You'll never fill 100% of the drive because the SSD sets certain portion of the flash for the things it needs to do
In the end though, it turns out similar to regular platter HDDs that a full drive will have less performance than a empty one. From my personal experience, you'll start to notice slowdowns when the capacity is 75% or greater filled.
Oh crap, someone please tell me that I am not having a problem with my air:
Downloaded mozilla thunderbird. Just downloading my entire inbox I guess, and the fans are on max (> 6000). CPU temps is 82 or so. I have the i5 1.7 inch 13" mba.
Is this normal? I assume that the first time you load thunderbird it's downloading your entire inbox and that requires some indexing?
Downloaded mozilla thunderbird. Just downloading my entire inbox I guess, and the fans are on max (> 6000). CPU temps is 82 or so. I have the i5 1.7 inch 13" mba.
Is this normal? I assume that the first time you load thunderbird it's downloading your entire inbox and that requires some indexing?
Did a couple of test when I go home with the MBA. Here are the results.
- Importing a music CD, i7 wins by 2 seconds.
- Boot up, hard to tell very very similar.
- Shut up, identical.
- Opening CS5 Photoshop, i7 by 1 second.
- Importing 25 high res photos, i7 by 3 seconds.
These are just a few test to prove the i7 is faster. Now the bad news. While doing these test the i7 did get warmer. Anywhere from 5-10 degrees. But still silent. So if your concerned about heat, then its pretty much for certain the i7 will generate more. However the fan will still be silent. Speed isn't really that much of an issue here. Actually the i5 did better than I thought. But hope this helps you guys with your decision of to go i5 or i7.
- Importing a music CD, i7 wins by 2 seconds.
- Boot up, hard to tell very very similar.
- Shut up, identical.
- Opening CS5 Photoshop, i7 by 1 second.
- Importing 25 high res photos, i7 by 3 seconds.
These are just a few test to prove the i7 is faster. Now the bad news. While doing these test the i7 did get warmer. Anywhere from 5-10 degrees. But still silent. So if your concerned about heat, then its pretty much for certain the i7 will generate more. However the fan will still be silent. Speed isn't really that much of an issue here. Actually the i5 did better than I thought. But hope this helps you guys with your decision of to go i5 or i7.
Regarding performance:
I had both the 13" MBA with the Core i5 1.7 GHz and the Core i7 1.8 GHz and decided to stick with the Core i7 1.8 GHz. For day-to-day apps (i.e. Mail, iCal, Numbers, Pages) you can expect slightly faster performance, such as apps opening just a tad quicker or web pages and tabs loading a little faster. If it was just these things, I'd say you'd be fine with the Core i5 as the differences are very small. Where you'll find the biggest performance gains are with Aperture or other more CPU intensive tasks. I find when encoding/converting movies (50-400 MB), the Core i7 is able to handle more files faster and in a shorter amount of time (differences of 35 seconds to 3.5 minutes depending on the file size)
Regarding heat and battery life:
theSeb has done an extensive post regarding heat with the Core i7 and I would definitely recommend reading that over. I'd just like to add that my laptop's performance has been similar to his and the heat is essentially a non-issue. The only times my fans have kicked in were when I've encoded multiple videos simultaneously. When I converted 9 videos to an iOS compatible format, the laptop did become warm (not hot) and the fans kicked up to about 7500 RPM. Once the encoding was completed, the fans and temperature quickly went down. Aside from these times, my Core i7 runs cool and silent. As far as battery life, I seem to be getting the advertised 7 hours; however, I tend to just plug and unplug as I need so I can't really give you a hard benchmark.
Is it worth the investment?
Again, if it's just day-to-day stuff or you don't do CPU intensive tasks that often, I'd say you'd be fine with the Core i5. If you'd like a little more power for Aperture or other apps, the Core i7 will save you some time. My only hesitation for recommending the Core i5 is that you said you plan to use it for 2 years. At $100, it's not too much extra (relative to the total price of the laptop) to ensure yourself a little power in the future. If you're hesitation about the i7 is because of heat rather than whether or not you need the performance, all I have to say is that my i7 ran the same as the i5. Basically with the i7, you have a computer that runs just as cool (or hot) as the i5, with the extra performance when you need it.
I've attached two screenshots. One is of mission control with these apps running: nvALT, Mail, Casino Royale HD, Excel, Safari with 3 tabs, iCal, and a Finder window. The other is the iStats with those apps running.
If you're wondering, I have the 2011 13" MBA Core i7 with Samsung SSD and display. Hope this helps.
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Mine stays cool as ice as long as I don't have anything connected to the USB-ports (even a mouse stick does it). Also the battery status impacts, if it is charged it tends to be alot cooler.
64C is impressive with those app's running, my i7 I'm sure ran hotter doing similar tasks, maybe it was defective?
Although I am happy with the i5 I got in exchange for the i7 ... but always have speed and longevity in the back of my mind.
In my experience comparing the two side by side the bottom and palm rests on the i7 were noticeably warmer when slightly pushed ... idling not so noticeable ... open up an ai file, play a 720p video then the difference was noticeable right away.
Anyone else? The more feedback the better.
I no longer have my i7 since I went to i5. It does run alot cooler. My temps seem to be a good 10C cooler. So far so good. I'm sure it will be nice to have the i7 that was cooler, but probably not possible. Lots of you are say it runs cool for what it is. Which I'm sure, but until you have both in front of you with same ssd and same programs running, it's hard to make an accurate judgement. So far I'm a happy camper. Speed hasn't been a factor yet. So I can't really compare.
apple expert, i too went from i7 and i5. Really happy with i5 and not really perceiving the speed loss!
Same here. Only tome I saw the difference is wen I installed cs5. The i7 did if faster by about 15 seconds. But the i5 had lower temps and lower fan rpm. I'll take that since its a one time install.
My 11" MBA hasn't gotten hot or had its fans turn up for any of my normal, day-to-day tasks. However, after playing CoD 4 for 10+ minutes, the fans do kick on, but the computer still doesn't get that hot. I don't know, I don't regret my purchase. If I was smarter, I'd just stay off of these forums so I wouldn't have to stumble across all these threads that make me feel like I made a poor purchase or something haha.
With the 13 inch are the i5's running cooler than the i7 as it is a smaller processor or because there are no heat defects / problems with the i5?
Are there two camps with the i5 as with the i7 of heat and cooler models?
The bottom line for me is if I get an i7 how can I tell if it is defective with heat issues and if it is defective are apple accepting of the problem and will they swap it out (even after the 14 days return period) or do they not accept the problem ?
Are there two camps with the i5 as with the i7 of heat and cooler models?
The bottom line for me is if I get an i7 how can I tell if it is defective with heat issues and if it is defective are apple accepting of the problem and will they swap it out (even after the 14 days return period) or do they not accept the problem ?
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Running a diglloyd benchmark in cs5 my 13" i7 went as high as 95c on the cores. But temps outside of the cores were much more reasonable. the bottom was warm. Even hot in one spot. But it was nothing compared to my 2007 Santa rosa mbp.
Another interesting point: run on a bed or on a laptop stand (where there is space below) had little or no impact on temps.
Another interesting point: run on a bed or on a laptop stand (where there is space below) had little or no impact on temps.
The warmth of the I7 bothers me!
I did order the I5 the other day, and actually went into the fifth avenue store to see how some of there demo units were running. MOst were i5's and most were pretty dam cool. I was really surprised at this actually seeing as though they run em pretty much 24 hours a day.
Now with my original mac air, the last gen, I could sit with the dam thing in my lap and not have it cooking the crap out of my thigh.
Temps are generally reading btw 50-60c and I'm not running a lot of stuff, surf browsing, mail mostly, and I feel the heat from this I7 in my lap. Its about the same as my my macbook unibody with a 256 ssd. Sucks.
I'm going to test both of these suckers together next week when I get them and see if there is a difference. But while I see a lot of worry about fan speed and such here, I don't hear that much about the warmth one feels if your just using it on ones lap.
It bothers me, have to be honest. Just not used to it after enjoying a relatively cool experience with the last gen air.
I originally set this up from files from a time capsule any chance I have things running I shouldn't have running warming this thing up? would a clean install do anything?
I did order the I5 the other day, and actually went into the fifth avenue store to see how some of there demo units were running. MOst were i5's and most were pretty dam cool. I was really surprised at this actually seeing as though they run em pretty much 24 hours a day.
Now with my original mac air, the last gen, I could sit with the dam thing in my lap and not have it cooking the crap out of my thigh.
Temps are generally reading btw 50-60c and I'm not running a lot of stuff, surf browsing, mail mostly, and I feel the heat from this I7 in my lap. Its about the same as my my macbook unibody with a 256 ssd. Sucks.
I'm going to test both of these suckers together next week when I get them and see if there is a difference. But while I see a lot of worry about fan speed and such here, I don't hear that much about the warmth one feels if your just using it on ones lap.
It bothers me, have to be honest. Just not used to it after enjoying a relatively cool experience with the last gen air.
I originally set this up from files from a time capsule any chance I have things running I shouldn't have running warming this thing up? would a clean install do anything?
Ive only had my 11" i7 256 4gb for a few days, and here are my conclusions.
It is awesome, for me, temp wise.
When i'm running on a battery, doing internet browsing, research, writing documents and e-mails, and even light video viewing online, the whole computer stays cool on the bottom, and there is a feeling of warmth that I can only feel when i lay my hands flat on the keyboard. While typing (like right now), i don't feel any heat coming off the laptop.
When i'm running on AC it's a slightly different story. When the battery is charging, then the whole bottom of the laptop heats up (mostly where the batteries are, based on the tear down pics), and I have a lot of experience with li-ion, and it's not abnormal for them to heat up as they are charged.
When the battery is charged, and the machine is off, and plugged in, and I turn it on and do the same basic use stuff as I mentioned above, the heat is the same as above.
When I installed office, and was messing around with parrells, the bottom of the computer below the hand-pad did warm up, but the hand pad stayed only at the temperature that my hands left it, and as my hands were resting on the base below the keyboard, as I typed, it didn't continue to heat any more.
ALL OF THIS is far better than the thinkpad x61s duo core that I was running, which would get hot and the fan, though quiet, would work hard.
I have had similar experience with this MBA sitting on my lap, on a pillow, or on a flat wooden table. The base will warm up, not get hot, when sitting on my lap if I'm installing something or using the CPU.
I'm just happy there isn't the "buzzzzzzz" of my last laptop! And, it's day 3 of me using any MAC OS, but I'm really enjoying it (as a windows user from before DOS3.0, though I did have an apple 2c).
If you're worried and want the i7, this is my story and I'm glad I did the i7.
It is awesome, for me, temp wise.
When i'm running on a battery, doing internet browsing, research, writing documents and e-mails, and even light video viewing online, the whole computer stays cool on the bottom, and there is a feeling of warmth that I can only feel when i lay my hands flat on the keyboard. While typing (like right now), i don't feel any heat coming off the laptop.
When i'm running on AC it's a slightly different story. When the battery is charging, then the whole bottom of the laptop heats up (mostly where the batteries are, based on the tear down pics), and I have a lot of experience with li-ion, and it's not abnormal for them to heat up as they are charged.
When the battery is charged, and the machine is off, and plugged in, and I turn it on and do the same basic use stuff as I mentioned above, the heat is the same as above.
When I installed office, and was messing around with parrells, the bottom of the computer below the hand-pad did warm up, but the hand pad stayed only at the temperature that my hands left it, and as my hands were resting on the base below the keyboard, as I typed, it didn't continue to heat any more.
ALL OF THIS is far better than the thinkpad x61s duo core that I was running, which would get hot and the fan, though quiet, would work hard.
I have had similar experience with this MBA sitting on my lap, on a pillow, or on a flat wooden table. The base will warm up, not get hot, when sitting on my lap if I'm installing something or using the CPU.
I'm just happy there isn't the "buzzzzzzz" of my last laptop! And, it's day 3 of me using any MAC OS, but I'm really enjoying it (as a windows user from before DOS3.0, though I did have an apple 2c).
If you're worried and want the i7, this is my story and I'm glad I did the i7.
Yet somehow people who actually know something about development think it is great.
At the moment I have a 2.53 late 2008 mbp with the ssd which why I think I am having trouble deciding between the i7 And the i5. If it wasn't for the heat issues I would just get the i7 no question.
So being realistic about what I will use the machine for ( it will be the same as what I currently use the mBp for) - Skype. Ms office for mac. Aperture. Internet. mail. iTunes. YouTube and running windOws via some method
Firstly would I notice any real difference between the air and my current Mbp and secondly would there be any great difference in the i5 and i7. If not I may as well get the i5 ?
Conversely would the i7 be better in an odd way as what I would be doing would nit be intensive enough to heat it up?
So being realistic about what I will use the machine for ( it will be the same as what I currently use the mBp for) - Skype. Ms office for mac. Aperture. Internet. mail. iTunes. YouTube and running windOws via some method
Firstly would I notice any real difference between the air and my current Mbp and secondly would there be any great difference in the i5 and i7. If not I may as well get the i5 ?
Conversely would the i7 be better in an odd way as what I would be doing would nit be intensive enough to heat it up?
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