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IBM PPC 970MP A Reality?
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I'm ready for a new Powermac!!! Gimmee!
I am waiting for a new powermac. Hope it comes sooner than later. I most definitely choked the dual 2Ghz Mac at my last job, and will need even more power now. I work with audio, which can bring 40-80 audio tracks, at 24-bit, 192khz. Add some plug-ins and you'll choke any current system.
I am now independent , so for sure, the faster i can get things done, the better the pay. I have been saving for a new G5, all off gambling on horses (odd, yes, but apparently I'm good at it) and have started from $50 and now up to $1600. I worked hard for this money (not!) and need a good system. Release the 970mp, with faster memory, and better graphics, and I will buy day one. I'll be at the track all of next month,, with my current record for the last 3 months, I will be at $3000. I want a dual-core, dual processor G5. Gimmee! Don't worry, I never put up more than $50 in a single evening, so even when I'm cold, it won't dent my winnings!!!
I am waiting for a new powermac. Hope it comes sooner than later. I most definitely choked the dual 2Ghz Mac at my last job, and will need even more power now. I work with audio, which can bring 40-80 audio tracks, at 24-bit, 192khz. Add some plug-ins and you'll choke any current system.
I am now independent , so for sure, the faster i can get things done, the better the pay. I have been saving for a new G5, all off gambling on horses (odd, yes, but apparently I'm good at it) and have started from $50 and now up to $1600. I worked hard for this money (not!) and need a good system. Release the 970mp, with faster memory, and better graphics, and I will buy day one. I'll be at the track all of next month,, with my current record for the last 3 months, I will be at $3000. I want a dual-core, dual processor G5. Gimmee! Don't worry, I never put up more than $50 in a single evening, so even when I'm cold, it won't dent my winnings!!!
Steak said:
You say that now only 'cause your winning. We'll see what happens when Lady Luck starts kicking you to the gutter and you start trying to make your way back out.
You'll be asking for handouts to get a Mac mini.
Don't know if this is the right thread, but this is kind of funny if it's true.
According to this article, MS are sending out development kits for the Xbox2 that are basically Apple PowerMacs!
http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=58341
The article initially talks about the PS3, but then moves on to mention the PowerMacs that MS have been sending out.
According to this article, MS are sending out development kits for the Xbox2 that are basically Apple PowerMacs!
http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=58341
The article initially talks about the PS3, but then moves on to mention the PowerMacs that MS have been sending out.
Sun Baked said:Good god man, how many pins do you think that would take? An insanely large amount with each one of those FSBs not sharing a darn thing.
The sheer number of pins on a dual mean they cannot stick with a single chip design. Heck the entire thing is complex enough that it needs a cheap and simple CPU just to do a power on reset (aka service processor.)
Of course the Memory Controller is an extremely hot chip and needs to keep moving to better fab techniques as the clock speed increase -- not too far away from needing active cooling right now.
The HT-Tunnels can be sourced from somebody else, and the I/O chip doesn't need to be updated very often.
Pins? Who needs pins? Were going straight to quantum computing! Muahahaha!
The number or processors that Apple can fit into a desktop workstation
is directly related to how many blades they can fit in a Gillette razor.
is directly related to how many blades they can fit in a Gillette razor.
speed?
Lets not get ahead of ourselves here.
Both AMD and INTEL introduced their dual core chips at LOWER speeds than their single core units.
Both companies cited power and heat problems. The speeds are between 15 and 25% slower per processor.
Don't jump over 2.8GHz as yet. While I hope that is the case, it could also be 2.0 to 2.3GHZ.
We'll see soon enough.
Lets not get ahead of ourselves here.
Both AMD and INTEL introduced their dual core chips at LOWER speeds than their single core units.
Both companies cited power and heat problems. The speeds are between 15 and 25% slower per processor.
Don't jump over 2.8GHz as yet. While I hope that is the case, it could also be 2.0 to 2.3GHZ.
We'll see soon enough.
They can pretty top out as fast as IBM can make enough quantities. Since the PMs use water cooling, pretty much assured of over +5GHz speeds possible with not increase in fan noise if IBM is capable of reaching such speeds in the next 3 years.
Apple can eek out at least another 5 years from their PM form factor.
Apple can eek out at least another 5 years from their PM form factor.
I didn't read the entire thread, but I wouldn't be so sure. The whole chip industry has HIT THE WALL where clock speeds are concerned. Unless some breakthrough comes along, don't expect anything that dramatic from anyone (referring to 5 GHz). BTW, the liquid cooling in the 2.5 GHz PowerMac is there primarily to keep the noise levels down - it could run without the liquid cooling in place, but it would be significantly louder.Lacero said:
ddtlm said:melgross:
Since they'd been at 2.5ghz for 10 months (or maybe 8 if you include shipping delays
I'm HOPING so. I'd love to see a dual/dual 3.0GHz.
But...
melgross:
Well, I'm not trying to enourage anyone to expect dual-dual 3.0. I'm just thinking that IBM is bound to ahve learned a thing or two in the last 8+ months, and can probably produce 970fx's a little faster than 2.5ghz by now. Also, ding ding ding, more important point: the extra thermal load from the second core may not scare off IBM/Apple like it does AMD/Intel. As long as the thermal denisty is all right, Apple can engineer as big a heatsink as they darn well please. Apple is not bound to any particular specification for cases or motherboards, and so there is no reason to stop at 95W for the complete package as AMD does. I think it is perfectly reasonable to expect them to launch a dual dual at 2.5ghz or higher.
Well, I'm not trying to enourage anyone to expect dual-dual 3.0.
I'm just thinking that IBM is bound to ahve learned a thing or two in the last 8+ months, and can probably produce 970fx's a little faster than 2.5ghz by now. Also, ding ding ding, more important point: the extra thermal load from the second core may not scare off IBM/Apple like it does AMD/Intel. As long as the thermal denisty is all right, Apple can engineer as big a heatsink as they darn well please. Apple is not bound to any particular specification for cases or motherboards, and so there is no reason to stop at 95W for the complete package as AMD does. I think it is perfectly reasonable to expect them to launch a dual dual at 2.5ghz or higher.
Lacero said:
You're kidding, right. This is a fun post?
The 970x series is going to top out at about 3.0GHz. I hope we get there. Maybe .2GHz less or more.
If IBM could get to, say, 3.5 or so in the next few months, there wouldn't be a rush from them to get to dual cores. They could wait until early next year.
5GHz in 3 years. Well, 3 years is a looong time. By then they might be using 45nm. If the problems with the waste heat from numerous areas in the chip design can be reduced sufficiently, then maybe. But it hardly pays to be talking about mid 2008. We don't even know what's going to happen by January 2006!
Remember that these cooling problems are not just about the total amount of watts. The 2.5GHz chips dissipate less excess wattage, not more. It's the fact that the wattage is coming from an ever decreasing area. If you use half the wattage, but the area that is utilizing it is one quarter the size, then the temp produced is going to be higher. Less overall "heat", but concentrated over a smaller area, the temp rises.
The problem with this is that the temp diffuses through the chip and case at the same thermal speed as it did before. That causes a temp rise to be more serious that it was before. It becomes more difficult to cool because there is less area for the cooling system to interface with. The thermal resistence of the overall chip/cooling system is higher, slowing heat transfer from the INSIDE of the chip to the cooling interface.
While liquid cooling systems have a lower thermal resistence than do air cooled systems (because liquid has a greater thermal mass, as molecules in a liquid are closer together, eg. more of them per cubic cm), the problem remains as to how to get the "heat" out of the chip itself.
There are schemes as to how to do that, but so far they are only in the experimental stages. They present drastically different solutions to these problems, compared with even the cooling systems being used by Apple today, though ultimately some of them do use liquid cooling.
After all of this, if you have actually read it all, we can see that While Apple's cooling solution is good for todays chips, it may not be sufficient for those of 2 or 3 years from now.
Basically I'm sayng that you should not bet on anything remaining the same. IBM's new chips down the road might require radically new methods of cooling. If these methods were available, and the chips were designed to take advantage of them, we would be seeing 3.5GHz, or even higher speeds today.
ddtlm said:melgross:
Well, I'm not trying to enourage anyone to expect dual-dual 3.0.
I was writing my last post, so I didn't see yours. It pertains to what you are saying. 2.8 I can see, with no problems for a single core chip.
ddtlm:ddtlm said:
I don't even remember where I read that, and a search turns up nothing, so you can safely disregard it.
wrldwzrd89 said:
The reference is to the fact that Apple said that even with the vastly increased cooling ability of the water cooled unit, the machine was quieter than previous models.
melgross said:
That is why we have the 970GX( single core version of MP) and 970MP. They are based off the same core of the FX but is able to reach faster speeds like 3 Ghz. While wizard is right about the noise thing, also the 90nm process the heat is in a more condensed area where air cooling will have a hard time cooling it. Some people say the 2.5 Ghz G5 is overclocked. There is no evidence to prove it.