iCloud Drive vs. iCloud photo library vs. iCloud backup

Ktaifan

macrumors member
Original poster
Jun 2, 2014
45
4
Are these 2-3 separate products? Essentially what I want to know is, do they each provide a separate 5GB allowance from each other? Or does drive, photo library, and backup all come under one 5GB umbrella?

I couldn't tell from the keynote or any discussion of the cloud.
 

Apple blogger

macrumors 6502a
Feb 28, 2013
874
146
Are these 2-3 separate products? Essentially what I want to know is, do they each provide a separate 5GB allowance from each other? Or does drive, photo library, and backup all come under one 5GB umbrella?

I couldn't tell from the keynote or any discussion of the cloud.
Same question!
1. Do they take the same 5 GB space?
2. Does phone backup take up camara roll backup? Because that would lead to double storage !!
3. Does my photo stream still exist? Or is it converted into this new iCloud photos?
 
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DarkJaye

macrumors member
May 11, 2009
85
1
As far as I can tell from the beta right now:

All three products use your iCloud space.

There is only one iCloud space allowance, they all eat into the free 5GB. This is probably the motivation behind providing much cheaper storage tiers than they currently have.

Photo Stream does still exist, and does NOT use your iCloud space, just as before.

edit: As far as iCloud Camera Roll backups go, you could turn off the Camera Roll from being backed up if you end up turning on iCloud Photo Library.
 
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Ktaifan

macrumors member
Original poster
Jun 2, 2014
45
4
As far as I can tell from the beta right now:

edit: As far as iCloud Camera Roll backups go, you could turn off the Camera Roll from being backed up if you end up turning on iCloud Photo Library.
Can we call this a redundancy then if one turns both on?
 
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DarkJaye

macrumors member
May 11, 2009
85
1
Probably. This is just Beta 1, in the release notes they're already aware of various known issues surrounding iCloud Photo Library. I would expect that by the time we reach final release that changes will be made to automatically disable Camera Roll backups if iCloud Photo Library is in use.
 
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Apple blogger

macrumors 6502a
Feb 28, 2013
874
146
As far as I can tell from the beta right now:

All three products use your iCloud space.

There is only one iCloud space allowance, they all eat into the free 5GB. This is probably the motivation behind providing much cheaper storage tiers than they currently have.

Photo Stream does still exist, and does NOT use your iCloud space, just as before.

edit: As far as iCloud Camera Roll backups go, you could turn off the Camera Roll from being backed up if you end up turning on iCloud Photo Library.
But if I don't turn it off, it means it'll be taking 2wive the storage, did apple miss that it did that on purpose?
 
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schneider21

macrumors newbie
Feb 16, 2012
8
0
Miami
? about Icloud photo and Icloud drive

my question about this new icloud photo and icloud drive is this. I have an 8 month old baby and i take alot of pictures on my iphone 5s. I want to know if i will be able to take all those pictures and then delete them from my phone and still have them on either the Icloud drive or on the other devices using icloud photo?
 
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azzurri13

macrumors newbie
Jun 19, 2013
5
0
So if you turn on icloud camera roll, will that come off your device storage?
 
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Puonti

macrumors 6502a
Mar 14, 2011
839
353
my question about this new icloud photo and icloud drive is this. I have an 8 month old baby and i take alot of pictures on my iphone 5s. I want to know if i will be able to take all those pictures and then delete them from my phone and still have them on either the Icloud drive or on the other devices using icloud photo?
This is purely a guess based on how Photo Streams work and language on their Photos page *, but I would imagine the entire contents of your iCloud Photo Library will be downloaded at full resolution, in their original format, to any Mac you use the Mac Photos app on (coming early next year) with your Apple ID.

Aside from supporting RAW and video files, iCloud Photo Library would differ from the current version of Photo Streams in that you get better (and cross-device) organization and search and your photos stored on Apple's servers are not deleted after X days or Y number of photos. The limiting factor would be how much iCloud storage you have on your account (5 GB by default, pay for more).

In your case (once again, just making an educated guess here) deleting those pictures from iCloud Photos would remove them from Apple's server and all your mobile devices – the Mac would still have them though.

* "...helps you make the most out of the space available on your iOS device"
 
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Razeus

macrumors 603
Jul 11, 2008
5,244
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iCloud Photo Library is missing in action it seems.

I was hoping just to add my photo folders to iCloud Drive and then have those photos appear in my Photos app.

But it seems I need to manage 3 "cloud apps":

1) iCloud Drive for normal files, non photo files
2) iCloud Photo Library for photos
3) iCloud for iTunes for my iTunes Match music.

Sigh.

I was hoping Apple would just let me have iCloud Drive and through wizard like magic of photos appear in my Photos app and the music appear in my Music app.
 
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Padmini

macrumors 6502a
Aug 9, 2014
545
2
A lot of misinformation and guessing in this thread...


First of all, if you turn on iCloud Photo Library, your camera roll is NOT also backed as part of iCloud Backup. Why would it be? As many of you say, it would be redundant and double taxing your storage.
Instead, when you restore from backup or setup a new phone, your entire Library will appear on the device, as it should, without ever having been part of the "backup" itself.

Second, all of these iCloud services take up the same storage allotment. Apple is not going to store your entire Library of photo and video for free. They have, however, introduced fair pricing for iCloud storage, so that its now possible. The cost is measly, and your data is actually safe from loss. I am excited to get my entire library stored once the Mac Photos App is finally released. I could spend a lot more on RAID systems and duplicate drives and safety deposit boxes......no thanks....iCloud Photo Library.....automatic, secure, and easy....worksforme.
 
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Sonmi451

Suspended
Aug 28, 2014
792
385
Tesla
A lot of misinformation and guessing in this thread...


First of all, if you turn on iCloud Photo Library, your camera roll is NOT also backed as part of iCloud Backup. Why would it be? As many of you say, it would be redundant and double taxing your storage.
Instead, when you restore from backup or setup a new phone, your entire Library will appear on the device, as it should, without ever having been part of the "backup" itself.

Second, all of these iCloud services take up the same storage allotment. Apple is not going to store your entire Library of photo and video for free. They have, however, introduced fair pricing for iCloud storage, so that its now possible. The cost is measly, and your data is actually safe from loss. I am excited to get my entire library stored once the Mac Photos App is finally released. I could spend a lot more on RAID systems and duplicate drives and safety deposit boxes......no thanks....iCloud Photo Library.....automatic, secure, and easy....worksforme.
I don't think what you say is true, or at least not all of it. I guess your Photo Library IS NOT backed up to your iCloud backup as you say, it is backed up to your Photo Library backup. It's separate than your regular iCloud backup. Also, Apple does not count your Photo library backup towards your iCloud storage allotment.

Of course, it only goes back 1000 photos, so I'm guessing you have to make sure you have some kind of Aperture/iPhoto backup (or Photos when it's released) or you will lose some photos if you don't eventually download them. Photo library backup only backs up most recent 1000 photos as I said.

I think the new Photos app will automatically download all photos automatically, so when you exceed 1000 photos it won't matter since you will have them backed up with the Photos app, and your iCloud Photos backup will still have the most recent 1000 photos at all times.

Aperture sort of already downloads your iCloud Photos and keeps an actual copy of them. But you have to open the app to make sure it syncs. Even then, I am having issues since both my iPhone & iPad have 345 Photos, and 31 Videos, but I just synced my Aperture Library, and it only saves like 12 photos, so I have no idea why Aperture can't load the rest. Still trying to wrap my brain around this...
 
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Padmini

macrumors 6502a
Aug 9, 2014
545
2
I don't think what you say is true, or at least not all of it. I guess your Photo Library IS NOT backed up to your iCloud backup as you say, it is backed up to your Photo Library backup. It's separate than your regular iCloud backup. Also, Apple does not count your Photo library backup towards your iCloud storage allotment.

Of course, it only goes back 1000 photos, so I'm guessing you have to make sure you have some kind of Aperture/iPhoto backup (or Photos when it's released) or you will lose some photos if you don't eventually download them. Photo library backup only backs up most recent 1000 photos as I said.

I think the new Photos app will automatically download all photos automatically, so when you exceed 1000 photos it won't matter since you will have them backed up with the Photos app, and your iCloud Photos backup will still have the most recent 1000 photos at all times.

Aperture sort of already downloads your iCloud Photos and keeps an actual copy of them. But you have to open the app to make sure it syncs. Even then, I am having issues since both my iPhone & iPad have 345 Photos, and 31 Videos, but I just synced my Aperture Library, and it only saves like 12 photos, so I have no idea why Aperture can't load the rest. Still trying to wrap my brain around this...


iCloud Photo Library ≠ Photostream. There is no 1000 photo limit, nor is it free storage that does not count against your iCloud.

You have to understand that these are two completely different and mutually exclusive services.....the newer is not (yet) replacing the latter, but it is superseding it in the way it works.

1. iCloud Photo Library has no (known) arbitrary limit.
2. iCloud Photo Library uploads all of your photo and video, and does not ever delete them.
3. iCloud Photo Library overrides your iCloud Backup, so that the same content is not stored twice in your iCloud account.
4. iCloud Photo Library does indeed utilize your iCloud storage. Remember, there is no limit, and once the Mac App is released, people will be uploading tens of thousands (hundreds of gigabytes) of photo and video to iCloud. Apple is not storing this for free. You pay for this convenience.
 
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Razeus

macrumors 603
Jul 11, 2008
5,244
1,914
Same question!
1. Do they take the same 5 GB space?
2. Does phone backup take up camara roll backup? Because that would lead to double storage !!
3. Does my photo stream still exist? Or is it converted into this new iCloud photos?
Doesn't matter how many devices you have. It's one Apple account, so one 5GB allotment.

And yes, iCloud Photo Library, DOES use your iCloud storage allotment. It's the reason why Apple had to adjust their pricing. You're iDevice backup and iCloud Photo Library are 2 separate entities that uses the same iCloud service.
 
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Sonmi451

Suspended
Aug 28, 2014
792
385
Tesla
iCloud Photo Library ≠ Photostream. There is no 1000 photo limit, nor is it free storage that does not count against your iCloud.

You have to understand that these are two completely different and mutually exclusive services.....the newer is not (yet) replacing the latter, but it is superseding it in the way it works.

1. iCloud Photo Library has no (known) arbitrary limit.
2. iCloud Photo Library uploads all of your photo and video, and does not ever delete them.
3. iCloud Photo Library overrides your iCloud Backup, so that the same content is not stored twice in your iCloud account.
4. iCloud Photo Library does indeed utilize your iCloud storage. Remember, there is no limit, and once the Mac App is released, people will be uploading tens of thousands (hundreds of gigabytes) of photo and video to iCloud. Apple is not storing this for free. You pay for this convenience.
Crap you're right. I was tired when I typed all that out. I think that's why I was having issues last night. Aperture is only able to access your PHOTOSTREAM, but my iPhone & iPad on iOS8 are utilizing iCloud Photo Library. This is going to get even more confusing I think.
 
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Padmini

macrumors 6502a
Aug 9, 2014
545
2
Crap you're right. I was tired when I typed all that out. I think that's why I was having issues last night. Aperture is only able to access your PHOTOSTREAM, but my iPhone & iPad on iOS8 are utilizing iCloud Photo Library. This is going to get even more confusing I think.
It is absolutely confusing to the average user, and should not have been released with the Mac App not coming until 2015.
 
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Prabas

macrumors 6502a
Sep 14, 2010
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624
Europe
So, if I turn on this new library, how am I going to be able to access my photos using Yosemite? iPhoto? In Finder's iCloud tab?
 
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sflomenb

macrumors 6502a
Jul 22, 2011
914
132
So, if I turn on this new library, how am I going to be able to access my photos using Yosemite? iPhoto? In Finder's iCloud tab?
First of all, it's removed from iOS 8 so you can't turn it on yet. Second, it will appear in the new Photos app which comes out next year.
 
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Razeus

macrumors 603
Jul 11, 2008
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So, if I turn on this new library, how am I going to be able to access my photos using Yosemite? iPhoto? In Finder's iCloud tab?
That's the mystery. I don't want to turn it on until Photos for Yosemite comes out. But as long as I can still use my basic folder/file system (meaning launch Image Capture and copy the photos to my desktop folders) in the mean time, I probably will.

I still don't know how do I get my regular photos PRE iOS8 to show up in iCloud Photo Library, but I'm assuming I will once Photos for Yosemite launches.

All these services coming out a different times is a complete mess.
 
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Prabas

macrumors 6502a
Sep 14, 2010
987
624
Europe
iCloud Drive vs. iCloud photo library vs. iCloud backup

First of all, it's removed from iOS 8 so you can't turn it on yet. Second, it will appear in the new Photos app which comes out next year.

Are you sure that it's removed?
 
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Razeus

macrumors 603
Jul 11, 2008
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First of all, it's removed from iOS 8 so you can't turn it on yet. Second, it will appear in the new Photos app which comes out next year.
It's not removed from iOS8. It's there, turned off by default, with a Beta tag.
 
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Wbutchart

macrumors regular
Aug 20, 2013
142
3
It's not removed from iOS8. It's there, turned off by default, with a Beta tag.
It is removed for a majority of people, seems a fortunate few have got it, many like myself do not have the option to turn on icloud photo stream.
 
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trebb

macrumors newbie
Oct 22, 2013
24
0
I know that iCloud Photo whatever and Photostream are different, but can someone explain to me what happened to Photostream in iOS8? I don't like that I can't tell which photos are stored locally on my phone and which are stored in Photostream.

I often remove photos from my local storage, but I've always liked having most of them stored in Photostream if I wanted to look.
 
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Padmini

macrumors 6502a
Aug 9, 2014
545
2
So, if I turn on this new library, how am I going to be able to access my photos using Yosemite? iPhoto? In Finder's iCloud tab?
No. Currently you cannot access iCloud Photo Library from the Mac, at all. Ostensibly, you will not be able to access it from anywhere besides iOS until 2015. Unless Apple surprises us with some interim solution.

Its ridiculous, is what it is.

Personally, I am using iCloud Photo Library, and will continue to use it. For the time being, I will also import Photos to iPhoto on the Mac periodically.
 
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