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If Apple is Ordered to Unlock iPhone for FBI, Some Engineers Might Refuse to Help

Governments these days are not even pretending they are on the side of people any more. And then they wonder why political systems are disintegrating. Time for direct democracy, Switzerland style.
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HangmanSwingset said:
Could always create a team of "experts" who really know f*** all about coding, let alone unlocking a phone. Technically they'd have people working on the matter.
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You know, in the same way that the government drags its feet when they don't want to do something... Oh, wait, they don't think the rules apply to them. Time for a second American Revolution.
 
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VulchR said:
They should just write really buggy code... The kind that prevents iOS from booting.
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This is an excellent idea. After they crack it, have a BSoD come up or a picture of a brick. Or another mechanism that wipes phones upon BF attacks are successful.

However, given that Apple can't push out a functional iOS after 1 year of development, I doubt they can after 4 weeks.
 
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This is actually really simple. The day they lose (if they lose), Apple fires those 6-10 engineers and suddenly, they become compliant and those iOS coders don't legally have to help.

Apple can give them an insane severance package or hire them back later, when the dust settles. Likely put them in a different department or form a clandestine internal department.

If they were to lose, there are many ways to still not do what they will legally be forced to. If they lock it down so well before the final decision, then "lose" the talent that locked it down, they have perfect deniability. Apple cannot control people that don't work for them.

Thing is, the government cannot, and will not, win this. No court, or judge, can change the inherit resistance of man.
 
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zioxide said:
Moot point as Apple is not going to lose this case.

But there's also nothing the court can do if these employees simply resign and no longer work for Apple at that point.
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Wishful thinking. I'm more skeptical on this. The FBI wouldn't have made this such a public high profile case unless they're sure they will win in the long run. But for all our privacy sakes, I truly wish Apple would win.
 
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This gets at a problem with this case that's nearly as big as the global privacy and security pandora's box it opens, and one I'm surprised hasn't gotten more discussion outside Apple's most recent filing:

The code in question here does not exist, and must be written by someone. It is a from-scratch construction of something that does not exist. Something that is not "brute force", but requires skill, knowledge, experience, and creativity.

Since the Supreme Court has (for better or worse) determined that corporations are "people" from a rights standpoint, then that is quite literally the FBI conscripting a "person" (in the legal sense) who has committed no crime to create something for them.

Let's pretend for a minute that iOS (or some other piece of encryption software, doesn't matter) had been created by me, and I followed all applicable laws that existed at the time when I did so. This decision would literally mean that the FBI could walk up to me because of a terrorist somewhere and order me "write code for us." It doesn't matter whether I know how to write that code at the time I start, or if I morally object to that code, or if that code might harm or ruin my business. If they can order Apple to do it, they can order me to do it.

And of course there's no limit to it being code once the precedent is set. What if it was hardware? Or an engineering design?

As a programmer and creative individual who is also a US citizen I find that precedent frightening and deeply disturbing. I registered for Selective Service, so I can be conscripted in time of war to use my body to fight as the government sees fit, but I did not register to have my personal creative talent conscripted by the FBI based on nothing more than a court order.

I'm also not aware of any legal or Constitutional precedent that allows them to do that, although it's possible I'm just ignorant on that point.
 
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VulchR said:
They should just write really buggy code... The kind that prevents iOS from booting.
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kas23 said:
This is an excellent idea. After they crack it, have a BSoD come up or a picture of a brick. Or another mechanism that wipes phones upon BF attacks are successful.

However, given that Apple can't push out a functional iOS after 1 year of development, I doubt they can after 4 weeks.
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If it really comes down to it, Apple could take this project as a government contract, and as most government contracts go, simply stall and not get anywhere for a long time while essentially milking the government for funding of said contract and ultimately either just don't deliver or deliver something that doesn't really do what was asked or really anything at all (again, as many government projects end up being).
 
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gnasher729 said:
If the engineers refuse, then Apple _can't_ write the software. It wouldn't be Apple declining, but Apple not being able to do it.
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Technically, that's not true--Apple could always hire and train new employees, or transfer them from another project, to be able to manipulate the source code the company already owns in order to achieve this goal. The same thing they would do if, for example, their relevant experts all died in a plane crash.

It would be drastically more time consuming (and expensive) than having already-expert employees do the same work, but it's not impossible. If you have the code and the expertise exists somewhere in the world, you can get the work done eventually.

The problem then becomes that not only is Apple being conscripted to write code that the company thinks is detrimental to its interests and the interests of its customers, but the order to do so has caused several experts to quit their jobs in order to maintain moral integrity, and then is also forcing the company to find, hire, train, and pay new employees for the express purpose of doing conscripted work for the government.

The precedent being set is that "not only can we force you to create things for us, but we can force you to hire and pay people to do the creating you are being forced to do."
 
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sshambles said:
My money says on Monday Apple releases the next iOS 9.3 update with huge security features, which, with whatever happens in court the next day, will be near impossible to break open through any method that the FBI is granted anyway.

If plausible, it would be check and mate. No doubt these engineers are frantically right now working on something similar to this.
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I'd love that to be the case, but unless the "fixes" would be very minor - they haven't had enough time to write up serious security changing software for production - I'm quite sure this blind sided Apple...iOS 10 will be where we see big changes I think (if the government can't force their hand before-then).

Remember the official word was the Administration was backing down (due to not being able to do it successfully) a couple of months back (although a document did come out where the Admin said if a terrorist incident happened they should revisit this (govt backdoor) since they could spin it with the public then (which is what happened).

Apple execs need to take a step back and think, this government desire for all knowing surveillance (false control) of every person on the planet will only get stronger as time goes on. They need to come up with a plan that will throw a wrench into any secret FISA orders to do so by Open Sourcing (not making it free though) all their OS's, compiler, apps and most importantly their BIOS / firmware to all of their hardware so it can be audited by the public. It would difficult, a pain, but the bad guys couldn't force them to slip stuff in afterwards - and I can't even imagine how big their sales would grow as a result. JMHO...
 
Z400Racer37 said:
I knew that would happen, These guys are heroic. Apple and it's employees are literally at gunpoint to produce x because the government wants it. What the hell is happening in The Land of the Free...
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United States was never the land of free. It is the land of the Golden Rule, who has the gold, makes the rules. Here if you have no money you can not do anything.

The only country where if you "own" a house it can be take away if you do not pay taxes. The X generation is struggling to survive, they have no money for retirement. And the millennials will get it even worst, they grew up in a world of "social media" and they lack of social skills.

The sons and daughters of millennials will be incapable monsters, they will not care for their parents, they will not have grand parents or cousins and in a world with no oil because by the way... there are just 54 years left of it.
 
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How about a big red button on the home screen above the fingerprint button clearly labeled "For FBI Only" that quickly unlocks and unencrypts the phone.
That should be ok right?
 
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darkgoob said:
It's not just about that one phone. The Atlantic already reported that court documents show it's about at least 12 phones. Then after that, surely the floodgates would be opened.

If Apple complies with this, they tacitly set a precedent. Then, every agency (NSA, CIA, every other government in the world and all their agencies, etc.) will come clamoring to have things unlocked.

So Apple will then have to leave backdoors in their phones in order to continue being able to comply ... they simply can't keep making unbreakable phones, then wasting tons of time finding a way to break it, over and over again.

If they leave a backdoor then hackers will find it and nobody's phones will be safe. You'll plug your iPhone in a charger in a Chinese hotel and it will be owned. Etc. Defense contractors' phones will get owned, China will steal yet more secrets; terrorists will hack airline pilots phones and be able to impersonate them and hijack planes; hackers will get into nuclear facilities through compromised devices.

We just can't have insecure phones. This is where I store my heartbeat, my sleep cycles, my wallet, my most personal notes, logins to all my social media accounts that could be used to ruin my reputation; I would not dare trust it if I knew there was even a chance of it having a back door.

The price of having privacy in society is the risk that criminals or terrorists may use that privacy to conceal their activities. I'm willing to pay that price; it's the price of freedom.

Those brave soldiers who fight to protect our freedom are fighting to protect this: our right to privacy and individuality and freedom from constant surveillance.

If we give up that, then the terrorists have already won.
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That was beautifully written.
 
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sshambles said:
My money says on Monday Apple releases the next iOS 9.3 update with huge security features, which, with whatever happens in court the next day, will be near impossible to break open through any method that the FBI is granted anyway.

If plausible, it would be check and mate. No doubt these engineers are frantically right now working on something similar to this.
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Others have written about how to close certain holes and closing said holes require hardware and software changes. iPhone 7 at least.
 
duffman9000 said:
Can the engineers refuse to write code or outright quit?
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They can refuse, and be fired, or quit. They can choose an Apple paycheck, over integrity, or find another job and not have to do anything the government says.

The government will not win this, even if they technically win. It's just not going to happen.
 
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