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Subscribing to an interesting discussion...

One thing to consider is that you don't have to rip from CD twice if you want two bitrates. Do the initial rip in Apple Lossless, then change rip settings to 256k, and you can select your entire library (or whichever parts you want available in a smaller format) right click that and select "Create AAC Version." Ripping from CD, I max out at about 13x speed. Going HDD to HDD, it's about 30x. Let that run overnight and you've basically cut your rip time in half.
 
Subscribing to an interesting discussion...

One thing to consider is that you don't have to rip from CD twice if you want two bitrates. Do the initial rip in Apple Lossless, then change rip settings to 256k, and you can select your entire library (or whichever parts you want available in a smaller format) right click that and select "Create AAC Version." Ripping from CD, I max out at about 13x speed. Going HDD to HDD, it's about 30x. Let that run overnight and you've basically cut your rip time in half.

That's exactly what I do. I rip it in ALAC, add the information and then create my AAC versions from those lossless rips. Being able to do multiple albums all at once is perfect (just like ripping multiple dvds to my hardrive and then using handbrake to queue them all up)
 
..., then change rip settings to 256k, and you can select your entire library (or whichever parts you want available in a smaller format) right click that and select "Create AAC Version." ... Let that run overnight and you've basically cut your rip time in half.

Awesome!
 
Subscribing to an interesting discussion...

One thing to consider is that you don't have to rip from CD twice if you want two bitrates. Do the initial rip in Apple Lossless, then change rip settings to 256k, and you can select your entire library (or whichever parts you want available in a smaller format) right click that and select "Create AAC Version." Ripping from CD, I max out at about 13x speed. Going HDD to HDD, it's about 30x. Let that run overnight and you've basically cut your rip time in half.

Better yet, use the Convert and Export script. This script converts the files of the selected tracks in iTunes using an encoder of your choice on-the-fly (restoring your Preferences-set encoder afterwards). The newly converted files are then moved to a new location of your choice, and their tracks removed from iTunes. :)
 
Better yet, use the Convert and Export script. This script converts the files of the selected tracks in iTunes using an encoder of your choice on-the-fly (restoring your Preferences-set encoder afterwards). The newly converted files are then moved to a new location of your choice, and their tracks removed from iTunes. :)

What's the point of creating files you won't use in iTunes? Especially if they're lossy?
 
I have done that myself. Not quite as extensive as your tests, I only used AAC and went with 128, 192, 256, 320 and Apple Lossless. I didn't even do a full track, just a 30 second clip of a song I knew really well. I played the clips on my grados, my in-ears, portapros, my laptop, my apple hifi (yeah that's right, i bought one of those), and my home audio system. It was awhile ago so I can't remember exactly what the results were but the conclusion I drew was that I could tell the 128 rip (at least frequently enough to rule it out) from the rest but other than that they all sounded comparable. Occasionally I got the lossless right, but not enough to make me think I could really tell. In the interest of picking a middle ground I went with 256. I figured that 320 was overkill but for whatever reason still couldn't drop it down to 192.

Jeez, you guys really care about this sort of thing... me on the other hand. I just imported several different files into Audacity and did an FFT to see the frequency domain spectrum to determine which encoding had a better frequency response. I would have liked to have AAC included but Audacity didn't open those file types.
 

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What's the point of creating files you won't use in iTunes? Especially if they're lossy?

For an archival backup. That way you have a perfect quality digital copy at your dispense. You create the Apple Lossless versions of all your CDs and store them on an external hard drive (that is backed up) and then put the lower quality version (in my case, 256-Kbps AAC) in iTunes.

My main purpose for doing this is so that I don't have 20-40 MB songs on my iPod taking up a lot of space.
 
For an archival backup. That way you have a perfect quality digital copy at your dispense. You create the Apple Lossless versions of all your CDs and store them on an external hard drive (that is backed up) and then put the lower quality version (in my case, 256-Kbps AAC) in iTunes.

My main purpose for doing this is so that I don't have 20-40 MB songs on my iPod taking up a lot of space.

Yeah, I read it as storing low quality files. Guess I don't understand the use of that script. I keep my ALAC on an external and 128kB on my MBP and shuffle.
 
Jeez, you guys really care about this sort of thing... me on the other hand. I just imported several different files into Audacity and did an FFT to see the frequency domain spectrum to determine which encoding had a better frequency response. I would have liked to have AAC included but Audacity didn't open those file types.

Thanks for the tests - but audacity can't tell you what SOUNDS better, only what IS better. Of course lossless will look better on spectrum analysis, but if your ears can't tell the difference (and the guys who have done any real-world blind testing here can't, above 128 mp3 it seems) there's no need for it. I haven't seen anyone conducting a LISTENING test that can justify lossless over reasonably high bitrate compressed encoding, here or elsewhere.

I rip at 192 aac, because that's the sweet spot for me - I have mid-high hi fi equipment (Denon, Acoustic Energy etc, and Sennheiser 650s), and fairly good, musician's ears - and I defy anyone to tell the difference between lossless and 192 aac in a blind test. I know ears are all different of course.
 
I rip at 192 aac, because that's the sweet spot for me - I have mid-high hi fi equipment (Denon, Acoustic Energy etc, and Sennheiser 650s), and fairly good, musician's ears - and I defy anyone to tell the difference between lossless and 192 aac in a blind test. I know ears are all different of course.
I also rip at 192 AAC. I have done tests through my hi-fi (Harman/Kardon amp and mid-range Mission bookshelf speakers) and headphones (Sennheiser 595s) using a variety of sources (laptop, PS3, iPod nano, iPhone) and I can't hear the difference between 256kbps and 192kbps... let alone Apple Lossless! I consider my hearing to be quite good and I'm also something of a perfectionist. I simply can't justify re-ripping my CDs just for a near indistinguishable improvement in quality. Having said that, I understand the desire to create a lossless backup. I am, however, currently improving my album artwork. I find the highest quality available source available (iTunes or a dedicated site), tweak the colour to get proper white/black values, then scale to 500x500. The results are pleasing!
 
I also rip at 192 AAC. I have done tests through my hi-fi (Harman/Kardon amp and mid-range Mission bookshelf speakers) and headphones (Sennheiser 595s) using a variety of sources (laptop, PS3, iPod nano, iPhone) and I can't hear the difference between 256kbps and 192kbps... let alone Apple Lossless! I consider my hearing to be quite good and I'm also something of a perfectionist. I simply can't justify re-ripping my CDs just for a near indistinguishable improvement in quality. Having said that, I understand the desire to create a lossless backup. I am, however, currently improving my album artwork. I find the highest quality available source available (iTunes or a dedicated site), tweak the colour to get proper white/black values, then scale to 500x500. The results are pleasing!

The reason why I'm ripping all of my CDs again is because most of my music is 128-Kbps MP3 (the rest is 160-Kbps MP3). I figured that if I'm going to do this process, I might as well do it at the highest quality (lossless) so that I never have to go through this again.
 
The reason why I'm ripping all of my CDs again is because most of my music is 128-Kbps MP3 (the rest is 160-Kbps MP3). I figured that if I'm going to do this process, I might as well do it at the highest quality (lossless) so that I never have to go through this again.
Wise move! I wasn't criticising or questioning what you're doing - only offering my opinion on the whole AAC vs. Lossless issue.
 
The reason why I'm ripping all of my CDs again is because most of my music is 128-Kbps MP3 (the rest is 160-Kbps MP3). I figured that if I'm going to do this process, I might as well do it at the highest quality (lossless) so that I never have to go through this again.

That's exactly it. Regardless of what you settle on for your final copy, it can't hurt (other than the time it takes) to have a lossless copy.
 
The reason why I'm ripping all of my CDs again is because most of my music is 128-Kbps MP3 (the rest is 160-Kbps MP3). I figured that if I'm going to do this process, I might as well do it at the highest quality (lossless) so that I never have to go through this again.

How's the progress? Hope it's coming along...

The worst part, to me anyway, is after I've ripped all my CDs. Getting artwork, fixing compilations, organizing album artists... Ehh! But in the end it's all worth it when you can sit down and browse your collection as you want it. And remember, you'll never have to do it again! Hopefully.:eek:
 
How's the progress? Hope it's coming along...

The worst part, to me anyway, is after I've ripped all my CDs. Getting artwork, fixing compilations, organizing album artists... Ehh! But in the end it's all worth it when you can sit down and browse your collection as you want it. And remember, you'll never have to do it again! Hopefully.:eek:

I've worked on it only 3 nights since I started and have about 130 CDs ripped. I'll probably work some more on it Saturday, but tonight... it's time to relax.
 
Guys you r brave, I m to lazy to redo this...
And moreover on my actual MBP 80G i would get a space issue...

Actually I still like sometimes to pull out of the storage box some of my oldies... :)

Nevertheless if I should do it, I would do it with AAC Lossless, just to be sure not to to it again...

PS : And now I remember I ve even sold some of them on ebay... yeah I know it s barely legal :-(
 
themoonisdown09: Not add to your vows in re-ripping your CDs. This is the process I use:

1. Rip CD using dBpoweramp (BootCamp/WinXP) to AIFF. Why? Well, up until about 6 months ago I had ripped everything into ALAC using iTunes. Then I noticed on some of the tracks there were pops etc and decided to look into a more secure way of ripping. You can use XLD Lossless Encoder for instance for the Mac which is a good Mac alternative.

2. Transfer AIFFs to Mac partition and adding them to a separate Apple Lossless iTunes library. I use the excellent MultiTunes (which integrates beautifully with iTunes) (porkrind.org/multitunes/) to create and switch between libraries. I have two - one "Main Library" and one "Lossless" library.

3. I start adding all the tagging info and have even started using Doug's excellent script of adding the tagged fields to the lyrics section so that I can see the info (year, producer etc) on the iPhone. I also add high quality album art - either by scanning or through www.albumartexchange.com. Btw, I also add a special tag in the "Grouping" field called "ALAC | SR" which stands for Apple Lossless and Securely Ripped. Doing so allows me to (in the future and if necessary) create a Smart Playlist with the criteria "Grouping contains ALAC" to delete and replace with new encodes - maybe the quality will be better at 192kbps in the future.

4. Once all the tagging is done I convert the AIFFs (if I haven't done so before stage 3 above) to Apple Lossless.

5. Finally I use another of Doug's scripts "Convert and Export" to create 256kbps AACs (non-VBR) which gets saved to a temporary folder (which I always name "*NEW" - it then shows at the top of folder list).

6. I then switch libraries using MultiTunes to the Main Library and go to "Add to Library..." choosing the newly created *NEW folder. Click OK.

7. The tracks get added to the library and off I go.

Puh, may sound a bit complicated but it's very quick once you have done if a couple of times.

My 2 cents.

Nubben
 
I am, however, currently improving my album artwork. I find the highest quality available source available (iTunes or a dedicated site), tweak the colour to get proper white/black values, then scale to 500x500. The results are pleasing!

You forgot about the part where you then upload it to amazon and discogs so that the rest of us can enjoy the fruit of your labor! ;)


M@
 
Thanks for the tests - but audacity can't tell you what SOUNDS better, only what IS better. Of course lossless will look better on spectrum analysis, but if your ears can't tell the difference (and the guys who have done any real-world blind testing here can't, above 128 mp3 it seems) there's no need for it. I haven't seen anyone conducting a LISTENING test that can justify lossless over reasonably high bitrate compressed encoding, here or elsewhere.

I rip at 192 aac, because that's the sweet spot for me - I have mid-high hi fi equipment (Denon, Acoustic Energy etc, and Sennheiser 650s), and fairly good, musician's ears - and I defy anyone to tell the difference between lossless and 192 aac in a blind test. I know ears are all different of course.

Oh I know what you mean about the frequency spectrum vs. actually listening and I rip at 192 AAC too for your exact reasons. I actually achieved my Masters in Acoustics and I laugh at some people's reasoning for using lossless when they are using crap speakers. What I think is really funny is the audiophile cables that are sold... waste of money.
 
Here you go...

That only covers my current iTunes library, not my entire CD collection.

May I ask how you did this? That sounds dumb... what I mean is, is there an easier way to do this other than dragging the album art from iTunes on to the desktop and then uploading each image individually?

I only ask because it looks REALLY cool and I would to do that as well
 
First of all I downloaded Export Artwork v1.0. This script allows you to save artwork from any track as a JPEG, with the option of resizing. I then find the artwork in iTunes or a dedicated site, and export it at full resolution for editing. Sometimes I'll crop the image slightly if it isn't already square (I like all album artwork to be 500 x 500). Other times I'll slightly tweak the colours and peak black & white levels. When I'm happy with the image I'll save it as a JPEG (this is important: if the image is a PNG then the script will save it as a PNG) and apply it to a song in iTunes. Then I use the script to export it again but this time scale it to 500 x 500. This gives me the final image which I save in a folder and then apply to the relevant album in iTunes (make sure to clear the old artwork first, otherwise you end up with multiple artwork). The reason for importing and re-exporting after editing is simple: it strips away unwanted tags and colour profiles, scales the image and generates a nice thumbnail icon.

When I have nice tidy artwork for all my albums, I add them to a new album in iPhoto and then upload it automatically to my MobileMe gallery.
 
I'm halfway through my collection of ~250 CDs. Only started on Monday too :cool:...been home sick with the flu :( so I have time. Going from god knows what kbps mp3 to Apple Lossless. They are going into their own iTunes library on their own HD.
 
I'm going to re-import my entire CD collection using 256-Kbps AAC encoding and try to get all the album art from iTunes. For the tracks that are not on iTunes, I will try to find at least 500x500 album art photos.

Just to give you an idea of how long this will take, I currently have 14,000 audio tracks in iTunes! I probably only have about 50 songs that were downloaded from Amazon.com, the rest are on CD.

So... has anybody else recently decided to do this? Is anybody avoiding this because it's a long and tedious process?


Edit: After all the suggestions, I've decided to rip all my CDs as Apple Lossless. Hopefully this will be my last time to ever have to do this again.


Well, I'll give you my $.02.

I spent a long time importing/ripping my cd collection which is over 5000 cds. Yup, 5000 legit cds. I think they add up to about 40,000 tracks.

I am on Windows.

Ripping a typical 60-80min cd into MP3 format on a decent computer (chip speed, ram) is going to take roughly 10 minutes. So for me, 5000 cds = 50,000 minutes. About. Roughly. No, I would not recommend setting your cd drive's Read speed at 32x. There's no reason to risk it....set it to 8x or 12x at max and that's PLENTY fast while still ripping properly. So 50,000 minutes is about 833 hours...or 34 days non-stop ripping.

You should also have a reality check and expect that if you were to sit down for 34 non-stop days and rip, your cd drive would probably burn out. $30 for a new one. I used multiple machines which also had multiple drives. So I would swap here and there to mix it up. I spent over a year ripping due to the sheer # of cds as well as my ability to tolerate the monotony.

Next up is perfectly tagging. Most likely your ripping software is not going to identify all cds perfectly...this could be mispellings, wrong years, wrong genres, wrong track order (I hate that), artist/title are swapped, etc. This is because the ripper looks at an internet database for info...and the database is only as accurate as the human who entered it. So expect that you will need to likely edit, in some shape or form, 50% of your ripped material...you can either make the edits before you rip or after you rip. I tpyically let my ripper (CDEX) find the info, rip the tracks, and then later if it logically makes sense, use a tool to change the files such as filenaming conventions, proper case, dashes versus slashes, etc. If it's a typo, I fix it before I rip. 5-30 seconds for a typo fix but those seconds add up.

Tagging can take quite a long time since you have to at least sit down and figure out how you want to take the ID3, how you want to name your filenames, and any Comments you might plop in to help your Smart Playlists. I have been using a freeware app called ID3TagIt which is amazing. Amazing. AMAZING. You need to have general knowledge of computer Expressions so you can tell ID3TagIt how to automatically name/rename the filenames and ID3 info. It's not hard but don't expect Mom or Grandpa to figure it out. There are numerous examples and I would be happy to share some if you provide examples of what you want to do.


So...this is probably going to take you some time...and it will get REALLY boring soon. :) That's why I gave up trying to do 50 cds a weekend because at about disc 15 I was annoyed that I couldn't do something else in the house.

If you have any questions, let me know.

-Eric
 
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