In the ultimate Dilemma

[bedfreed]

So I am upgrading from a 13" 2011 MBP that gave out on me about two months ago. I am graduating college this year, and plan on taking advantage of the student pricing. I am a video editor and designer, and often utilize the entire Adobe creative suite (Pr, Ae, Ps, Ai, etc.). I anticipate that my job will provide me with a computer that can handle whatever work stuff I will need to do (working in advertising), however, I want this laptop to last me 5-6 years. That means that it should handle personal projects, in between jobs/potential freelance stuff, and whatever else. Anyway, I have been looking at all the models endlessly, and have even considered the 2015 stuff, but feel like the lack of USB-c ports are a deal breaker. So my options are really this:

- Spec'd out 13" base model for $1900
- Spec'd out 13" TB for $2150
- Kind of out of my price range, but entry level 15" TB for $2250. (Although I do prefer 13" in terms of portability)

Obviously I have spent hours reading benchmarks, watching reviews etc., but I would love some real life ideas of what I should do based on my options. Hopefully this post can help other people with similar dilemmas decide!

Thanks in advance!!

 

[davidg4781]

Get the MBP TB, for $2,150.

 

[Eldar Gezalov]

I would go for the entry level 15", especially if you want it to last for 5 years. Better performance, bigger screen size, better speakers, equally fast 4 Thunderbolt ports, possibly better battery life than 13" TB model (according to some users), etc. The form factor and weight are also a little bit smaller than the old 15", so portability might be improved a little bit.

 

[bedfreed]

I would go for the entry level 15", especially if you want it to last for 5 years. Better performance, bigger screen size, better speakers, equally fast 4 Thunderbolt ports, possibly better battery life than 13" TB model (according to some users), etc. The form factor and weight are also a little bit smaller than the old 15", so portability might be improved a little bit.

Yeah, I'm starting to consider this. However, how much will the dedicated graphics improve video and photo editing? Because for 100 dollars less, I could get a faster CPU in the maxed out 13".

 

[jjjoseph]

So I am upgrading from a 13" 2011 MBP that gave out on me about two months ago. I am graduating college this year, and plan on taking advantage of the student pricing. I am a video editor and designer, and often utilize the entire Adobe creative suite (Pr, Ae, Ps, Ai, etc.). I anticipate that my job will provide me with a computer that can handle whatever work stuff I will need to do (working in advertising), however, I want this laptop to last me 5-6 years. That means that it should handle personal projects, in between jobs/potential freelance stuff, and whatever else. Anyway, I have been looking at all the models endlessly, and have even considered the 2015 stuff, but feel like the lack of USB-c ports are a deal breaker. So my options are really this:

- Spec'd out 13" base model for $1900
- Spec'd out 13" TB for $2150
- Kind of out of my price range, but entry level 15" TB for $2250. (Although I do prefer 13" in terms of portability)

Obviously I have spent hours reading benchmarks, watching reviews etc., but I would love some real life ideas of what I should do based on my options. Hopefully this post can help other people with similar dilemmas decide!

Thanks in advance!!

Premiere, and After Effects are not optimized on any of the new MacBooks Pros. If you stay with Photoshop and Illustrator, you will be fine.. Just don't do any heavy video.. just light..

 

[bedfreed]

Premiere, and After Effects are not optimized on any of the new MacBooks Pros. If you stay with Photoshop and Illustrator, you will be fine.. Just don't do any heavy video.. just light..

Right, but what I'm saying is that I need to be able to do heavy video editing. Is the performance boost between a maxed out 13" and a base level 15" going to improve my ability to edit video? Thanks for the responses

 

[jjjoseph]

Right, but what I'm saying is that I need to be able to do heavy video editing. Is the performance boost between a maxed out 13" and a base level 15" going to improve my ability to edit video? Thanks for the responses

I mean it depends on what you are doing.. when you say that. Im a professional video guy, I work in tv and film. The MacBook Pro's are not fast enough, and the 2015 wasn't either. We tried to do 4k with the 2015 and it failed, and the 2016 isn't that much faster. the 460 on the 2016 was only 33% to 40% faster than the m370x, and the m370x wound't do 4k at all.

Another thing is OpenCL, and CUDA. Adobe is optimized for CUDA and NVIDIA cards not ATI cards and OpenCL. Apple has made strides making Final Cut Pro X faster using OpenCL and Proxy. The Background PROXY's are what make Final Cut Pro X do 4k, not its fast processor and OpenCL. For most people that is fine, but it won't work for us, we have about 20 editors cutting all day, and not one person in our studio can use Final Cut Pro X for what they do, but that doesn't mean you can't.

The problem now is when we invest in equipment it has to be more Application Friendly, if it can't do Adobe CC, then we can't use it.. Just because Final Cut Pro X can work for some people, its doesn't mean anything to us. Apple used to be more friendly to other Programs and Pipelines, but as of now, if you want to use Anything other than Final Cut Pro X, your out of luck. That is why we can't upgrade this round..

As for maxing out your purchase, Always get more computer, to make it last a little longer.. So 16GB only, the CPU in the 15" is better and faster and has more cores, and you can get a dedicated GPU, so 15" maxed out is light years beyond the 13", but I can't stand the touchbar thing so I am waiting for for that to get removed.. then look at the 15" again.

If you edit ONLY in Final Cut Pro X, with the 460, you should be OK for a while.. But you can't touch any ADOBE video editing apps, Photoshop and Illustrator ok. After Effects is pretty un-usable INMHO...

 

[bedfreed]

I mean it depends on what you are doing.. when you say that. Im a professional video guy, I work in tv and film. The MacBook Pro's are not fast enough, and the 2015 wasn't either. We tried to do 4k with the 2015 and it failed, and the 2016 isn't that much faster. the 460 on the 2016 was only 33% to 40% faster than the m370x, and the m370x wound't do 4k at all.

Another thing is OpenCL, and CUDA. Adobe is optimized for CUDA and NVIDIA cards not ATI cards and OpenCL. Apple has made strides making Final Cut Pro X faster using OpenCL and Proxy. The Background PROXY's are what make Final Cut Pro X do 4k, not its fast processor and OpenCL. For most people that is fine, but it won't work for us, we have about 20 editors cutting all day, and not one person in our studio can use Final Cut Pro X for what they do, but that doesn't mean you can't.

The problem now is when we invest in equipment it has to be more Application Friendly, if it can't do Adobe CC, then we can't use it.. Just because Final Cut Pro X can work for some people, its doesn't mean anything to us. Apple used to be more friendly to other Programs and Pipelines, but as of now, if you want to use Anything other than Final Cut Pro X, your out of luck. That is why we can't upgrade this round..

As for maxing out your purchase, Always get more computer, to make it last a little longer.. So 16GB only, the CPU in the 15" is better and faster and has more cores, and you can get a dedicated GPU, so 15" maxed out is light years beyond the 13", but I can't stand the touchbar thing so I am waiting for for that to get removed.. then look at the 15" again.

If you edit ONLY in Final Cut Pro X, with the 460, you should be OK for a while.. But you can't touch any ADOBE video editing apps, Photoshop and Illustrator ok. After Effects is pretty un-usable INMHO...

I see what you're saying, it's definitely something to consider. I have worked with the adobe suite for years, so I don't plan on switching to FCP. However, I have a hard time believing that I can't use any of the adobe suite on the 15" or even 13". I had a low level 2011 13" for years, and could edit 1080p video in premiere CS5 while simultaneously editing a clip or two in AFX, plus a browser open and music etc. Shouldn't these computers blow my old one out of the water? I just want to be able to smoothly edit HD video and do light effects work across the adobe suite, maybe edit the occasional small 4k video if that's what the industry demands (4k is overhyped imo, but that's for another discussion lol).

I guess the thesis of my question is, if were to either get the 15" base model, or the maxed out 13" touchbar for $100 less, would the $100 more be worth it based on performance, or not? And maybe that answer isn't out there yet as most people have not had much experience on the new macbooks, but it's worth a shot.

 

[xSyao]

If you thinking about the 2150$ TB MBP, get the entry level 15 inch instead, its smaller then last gens 15 inch feels lighter plus for 100$

You get
- Bigger display
- Quad core i7 cpu
- Dedicated GPU
- Better battery life then TB 13
- 16gb ram
- the other 2 thunderbolt 3 ports won't be gimped like the 13 inch TB

Video / Photo editing will see a boost because of the stronger hardware inside

Only thing you'll lose is storage going from max 13 to base 15 other then that 15 is better in everyway and will last longer.

 

[bedfreed]

If you thinking about the 2150$ TB MBP, get the entry level 15 inch instead, its smaller then last gens 15 inch feels lighter plus for 100$

You get
- Bigger display
- Quad core i7 cpu
- Dedicated GPU
- Better battery life then TB 13
- 16gb ram
- the other 2 thunderbolt 3 ports won't be gimped like the 13 inch TB

Video / Photo editing will see a boost because of the stronger hardware inside

Awesome, that's kinda what I'm leaning towards. Any idea what the real-world boost would look like on the 15"? Something I would actually notice when editing?

 

[xSyao]

Awesome, that's kinda what I'm leaning towards. Any idea what the real-world boost would look like on the 15"? Something I would actually notice when editing?

So far compared to my Late 2013 RMBP,

Its faster in handbrake, adobe pro , and I use GarageBand all feel snappier compared to my old laptop. I didn't try a TB 13 MBP but tried a base model non TB 13 and the 15 inch base which I have destroys it in speed, plus the fans don't go loud and the laptop is pretty cool throughout the programs it runs through.

Battery life wise the 15 inch is a little weaker then the non TB 13 but is stronger then the 13 TB MBP so theirs that as well if battery life is an important factor.
[doublepost=1479413332][/doublepost]Sorry for double post but if you decide not to go 15 inch

The non touch MBP is a better value because at 1950$ you only give up like 10% ~ performance that you will prob not see in real world usage plus you get the best battery life out of the MBP line.

it will also be more quieter because it uses a 15 watt cpu.

 

[jjjoseph]

I see what you're saying, it's definitely something to consider. I have worked with the adobe suite for years, so I don't plan on switching to FCP. However, I have a hard time believing that I can't use any of the adobe suite on the 15" or even 13". I had a low level 2011 13" for years, and could edit 1080p video in premiere CS5 while simultaneously editing a clip or two in AFX, plus a browser open and music etc. Shouldn't these computers blow my old one out of the water? I just want to be able to smoothly edit HD video and do light effects work across the adobe suite, maybe edit the occasional small 4k video if that's what the industry demands (4k is overhyped imo, but that's for another discussion lol).

No consumer should be messing with 4k, but in my industry its standard for acquisition and archiving. I used to give lectures on this stuff.. I could fill pages, but yes, you should never touch 4k, but I will and 8k, and HDRI and 16k and so on.. You should stay in HD, but saying these new computers "BLOW MY OLD ONE OUT OF THE WATER," is debatable. If you where just editing HD, then yeah, they will be faster, but for what I do, they don't blow anything... Maybe blow feathers.
What where the specs on your 2011? You get a faster CPU, and internal storage. But they are about are just a little faster than the 2015.

ALSO, CS5 is definitely OLDER and thats not CC, so you might get away with user an older App on this computer for a while, but CC is not fast enough for me on these..

I guess the thesis of my question is, if were to either get the 15" base model, or the maxed out 13" touchbar for $100 less, would the $100 more be worth it based on performance, or not? And maybe that answer isn't out there yet as most people have not had much experience on the new macbooks, but it's worth a shot.

The 13" is Not really something you could say is MAXED out.. You have no dedicated GPU, no quad core CPU. Your only maxing the RAM and SSD... What performance are you looking for?

Also, your laptop is almost 6 years old, any 2016 model will be noticeably faster..

 

[bedfreed]

No consumer should be messing with 4k, but in my industry its standard for acquisition and archiving. I used to give lectures on this stuff.. I could fill pages, but yes, you should never touch 4k, but I will and 8k, and HDRI and 16k and so on.. You should stay in HD, but saying these new computers "BLOW MY OLD ONE OUT OF THE WATER," is debatable. If you where just editing HD, then yeah, they will be faster, but for what I do, they don't blow anything... Maybe blow feathers.
What where the specs on your 2011? You get a faster CPU, and internal storage. But they are about are just a little faster than the 2015.

ALSO, CS5 is definitely OLDER and thats not CC, so you might get away with user an older App on this computer for a while, but CC is not fast enough for me on these..



The 13" is Not really something you could say is MAXED out.. You have no dedicated GPU, no quad core CPU. Your only maxing the RAM and SSD... What performance are you looking for?

I disagree that no consumer should work in 4k. In fact, so many DSLR's and consumer cameras are pushing 4k that it's becoming ubiquitous. I can see myself easily taking a freelance job in a few years where somebody shot, say, a music video on a Gh4 or something of the likes in 4k that they need edited. Granted, it's probably in a compressed codec due to the fact that it's consumer oriented, but it is still 4k resolution. I just would like to have the peace of mind to know that that is possible for me to do on one of these laptops. And yes, I've worked in CC for a few years now, both at school on films as well as in advertising, so I recognize that it is a more demanding program. However, I even used a macbook air 2013 or something at my last job, and was able to comfortably edit 1080p footage on Premiere CC.

Also, by maxed out, I obviously don't mean "the best computer ever," I mean that I went on apples website, selected the 13" touchbar, and checked all of the boxes to the max, including CPU and RAM (not SSD because I don't really use local storage, I edit off of externals). At this point, I think I understand what I'm looking at. Thanks for the replies!

 

[jjjoseph]

I disagree that no consumer should work in 4k. In fact, so many DSLR's and consumer cameras are pushing 4k that it's becoming ubiquitous. I can see myself easily taking a freelance job in a few years where somebody shot, say, a music video on a Gh4 or something of the likes in 4k that they need edited. Granted, it's probably in a compressed codec due to the fact that it's consumer oriented, but it is still 4k resolution. I just would like to have the peace of mind to know that that is possible for me to do on one of these laptops. And yes, I've worked in CC for a few years now, both at school on films as well as in advertising, so I recognize that it is a more demanding program. However, I even used a macbook air 2013 or something at my last job, and was able to comfortably edit 1080p footage on Premiere CC.

I was being sarcastic, because we tested these computers for 4k and they couldn't' do it. So I was saying no consumers should as a joke.

Also Codec Compressions require more GPU and CPU power, lot less.. Because they have to sometimes be unwrapped to cut..

Also, by maxed out, I obviously don't mean "the best computer ever," I mean that I went on apples website, selected the 13" touchbar, and checked all of the boxes to the max, including CPU and RAM (not SSD because I don't really use local storage, I edit off of externals). At this point, I think I understand what I'm looking at. Thanks for the replies!

I would avoid the touchbar.. but thats just my hatred for it, and their is no "the best computer ever," spec wise these computers even the highest maxed out one, are spec wise right in the middle.

 

[Eldar Gezalov]

Yeah, I'm starting to consider this. However, how much will the dedicated graphics improve video and photo editing? Because for 100 dollars less, I could get a faster CPU in the maxed out 13".

I think other guys have already answered your question here. To summarize, even maxed out 13" will still be slower and less powerful than the 15". And for that extra $100, you are getting some much more.

Check out this video from last year. It's not the new MacBook Pro, but the performance levels are similar.

 

[JPizzzle]

Yeah, I'm starting to consider this. However, how much will the dedicated graphics improve video and photo editing? Because for 100 dollars less, I could get a faster CPU in the maxed out 13".

The cpu is faster in clock speed, but your comparing 4 cores in the 15" to 2 cores in the 13". Not the best analogy, but it's like comparing a car with one v8 engine vs one with two v6 engines. The v8 is faster on it's own, but the two v6's will outperform it. Yeah, I'm sure this analogy will get torn apart haha, but you get the idea.

 

[bedfreed]

The cpu is faster in clock speed, but your comparing 4 cores in the 15" to 2 cores in the 13". Not the best analogy, but it's like comparing a car with one v8 engine vs one with two v6 engines. The v8 is faster on it's own, but the two v6's will outperform it. Yeah, I'm sure this analogy will get torn apart haha, but you get the idea.

Yeah, definitely makes sense! However, what about programs that rely less on multi core processes and more on single core clock speed? Does that factor in at all when it comes Adobe programs?

 

[Samuelsan2001]

Yeah, I'm starting to consider this. However, how much will the dedicated graphics improve video and photo editing? Because for 100 dollars less, I could get a faster CPU in the maxed out 13".

They will improve that use case by quite but the quad core CPU is what will really make the difference for your use case it will halve export times etc, that's why you should get the 15 inch, all the 13 inch options are dual core!! And of course more screen space is always important for video and photo editing.

 

[Chancha]

Many Premier centric professionals right now prefer to edit on Windows based desktop workstation, at least until Apple decides to put nVidia cards in their current mac lineup. Without CUDA, none of the Adobe CC apps run faster on macos vs windows on the same mac native vs bootcamp. Even static screen draw in Photoshop, Illustrator, Lightroom etc suffer from lack of GPU acceleration, particularly if you work on retina/HiDPI monitors.

I think jjjoseph is speaking a bit deeper into the industry where the OP is probably not gonna reach soon. Since it seems you are considering only one computer as it is for personal use, it is understandable to make compromises in some corners. A decked out 15" is surely a much more future proof desktop-replacement down a few years. A discrete GPU, even a shabby one on MBPs, is going to be useful in any editing scenario, and then having quad core can mean halving your render time literally 50%.

If you ask me, the ideal solution is actually a self built PC workstation with components of your choice, running Windows 10 or hackintosh if you must. And then if you must use OS X for other tasks or just general personal computing, then get the lightest possible MacBook(Pro).