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I'm amazed at how many people think that's "reasonable" to require 30% of the goods made locally. If it's reasonable, then let the USA require all stores in the USA have 30% of their goods made here. I'd say about 50% of them would go out of business immediately including Apple's stores and nearly 100% of all clothing stores. NOTHING is made here these days but food (and that provides jobs for illegals, not citizens) but hey, that's OKAY, we're a developed country and people don't need manufacturing jobs here. Let them have "service" jobs (most of which pay little to nothing beyond minimum wage) and soon we'll be more of a 3rd world country than most 3rd world countries already are. Yes, there are some jobs you can't outsource and there are quite a few high-end and skilled jobs (I'm in electronic engineering myself so I haven't had a rough time finding a job), but these types of jobs aren't unlimited and with over 300 MILLION people, they simply cannot and won't cut it to maintain a large middle class anymore, which is why the middle class is slowly but surely disappearing.

Now look at the minimum "free money" proposal in Switzerland (that failed for good reason, but had a point about the future). What happens when robots replace nearly ALL jobs at some point in the next 100 years? You'll have some jobs repairing robots (although one could argue eventually they will have robots that do that too) and some government jobs and not much else. It's the Jetsons except that that "slave driving Mr. Spacely" job "that made me push 20 buttons today" won't exist. You'll have those that OWN the robots and everyone else can just DIE. You'll have the top 1% and the DEAD because there won't be ANY of the jobs we take for granted even today. We're not talking about a few programmable robots assembling cars or spray painting, but eventually we will have "smart robots" that can pretty much be programmed to do just about ANYTHING. Why pay a person even $20,000 a year (not even counting benefits) if you can get a robot that can maybe do the job of 3 people (at least 3 shifts) that costs $100,000 that will last at least 10-20 years and will be paid for in less than two?

Sound ridiculous? Of course it does NOW. But 20 years from now? 50? 100? No, assuming we don't blow ourselves to oblivion by then, it WILL be a REALITY and people aren't even remotely prepared for that time. The problem is we keep procreating like fracking bunny rabbits (and the most are the at the bottom income levels that can't afford to raise them properly) and that means even more people with less and less jobs. It's not sustainable in the long run. You'll have people volunteering to help colonize Mars just so they don't starve to death here while the top 0.01% will be TRILLIONAIRES. It'll never be enough, though. They'll want to be quadrillionaires. Can't spend that much? That's not the point. Bill Gates can never spend all his money in any reasonable fashion. You don't exactly seeing him giving more than a small pittance away (at the insistence of his wife so she can feel better about being rich) relative to his wealth. Hey, invest it in AI and even better robots! Maybe one day the AIs will become self-aware and decide that top 0.01% is a waste of genetic material and do something about it?

There's this hypothesis in the wacky world of Ancient Aliens that the so-called "grey aliens" are actually cyborg robots and that they probably have either killed or imprisoned (in some kind of "Matrix") their masters at some point ala Terminator 2 meets The Matrix for either efficiency reasons or to protect them from "harm" (you're much safer in a virtual reality) and that's why the so-called Sumerian "gods" that are supposedly 8-feet tall and look like us because they created us through genetic manipulation aren't the aliens described in all these "close encounters" stories, but rather these identical looking 3.5 foot "greys" that are emotionless and mostly interested in genetic experiments (What would machines be interested in if they were self-aware? Programming...genetic programming sounds like a good guess). So maybe some trilloinaire will have a conscience with all these humans starving to death and figure, hey, I'll "save" what's left of humanity and put us into a Matrix-style virtual reality, kept alive on the bare minimum amounts of nutrients needed to maintain a never-ending dream state and used to further some experiment or the other. It's safe to say in 100 years we probably won't be able to tell a virtual reality from the real thing.... Or are we in it already??? :eek: ;)

Don't think the lawyers will let that happen.
 
Because Foxconn will open shop there in that timeframe, and build iPhones locally.

http://9to5mac.com/2016/05/09/foxconn-india-iphone-manufacturing/

I didn't know that, I really need to get out more reading other sites as MacRumors can, miss things out.
But whilst Foxconn setting up a factory could comply with the 30% regulation, it could very well do nothing for jobs in the area.
Because Foxconn is famously replacing its workforce with robots. I believe hundreds of thousands if not more robots.
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I'm amazed at how many people think that's "reasonable" to require 30% of the goods made locally. If it's reasonable, then let the USA require all stores in the USA have 30% of their goods made here. I'd say about 50% of them would go out of business immediately including Apple's stores and nearly 100% of all clothing stores. NOTHING is made here these days but food (and that provides jobs for illegals, not citizens) but hey, that's OKAY, we're a developed country and people don't need manufacturing jobs here. Let them have "service" jobs (most of which pay little to nothing beyond minimum wage) and soon we'll be more of a 3rd world country than most 3rd world countries already are. Yes, there are some jobs you can't outsource and there are quite a few high-end and skilled jobs (I'm in electronic engineering myself so I haven't had a rough time finding a job), but these types of jobs aren't unlimited and with over 300 MILLION people, they simply cannot and won't cut it to maintain a large middle class anymore, which is why the middle class is slowly but surely disappearing.

Now look at the minimum "free money" proposal in Switzerland (that failed for good reason, but had a point about the future). What happens when robots replace nearly ALL jobs at some point in the next 100 years? You'll have some jobs repairing robots (although one could argue eventually they will have robots that do that too) and some government jobs and not much else. It's the Jetsons except that that "slave driving Mr. Spacely" job "that made me push 20 buttons today" won't exist. You'll have those that OWN the robots and everyone else can just DIE. You'll have the top 1% and the DEAD because there won't be ANY of the jobs we take for granted even today. We're not talking about a few programmable robots assembling cars or spray painting, but eventually we will have "smart robots" that can pretty much be programmed to do just about ANYTHING. Why pay a person even $20,000 a year (not even counting benefits) if you can get a robot that can maybe do the job of 3 people (at least 3 shifts) that costs $100,000 that will last at least 10-20 years and will be paid for in less than two?

Sound ridiculous? Of course it does NOW. But 20 years from now? 50? 100? No, assuming we don't blow ourselves to oblivion by then, it WILL be a REALITY and people aren't even remotely prepared for that time. The problem is we keep procreating like fracking bunny rabbits (and the most are the at the bottom income levels that can't afford to raise them properly) and that means even more people with less and less jobs. It's not sustainable in the long run. You'll have people volunteering to help colonize Mars just so they don't starve to death here while the top 0.01% will be TRILLIONAIRES. It'll never be enough, though. They'll want to be quadrillionaires. Can't spend that much? That's not the point. Bill Gates can never spend all his money in any reasonable fashion. You don't exactly seeing him giving more than a small pittance away (at the insistence of his wife so she can feel better about being rich) relative to his wealth. Hey, invest it in AI and even better robots! Maybe one day the AIs will become self-aware and decide that top 0.01% is a waste of genetic material and do something about it?

There's this hypothesis in the wacky world of Ancient Aliens that the so-called "grey aliens" are actually cyborg robots and that they probably have either killed or imprisoned (in some kind of "Matrix") their masters at some point ala Terminator 2 meets The Matrix for either efficiency reasons or to protect them from "harm" (you're much safer in a virtual reality) and that's why the so-called Sumerian "gods" that are supposedly 8-feet tall and look like us because they created us through genetic manipulation aren't the aliens described in all these "close encounters" stories, but rather these identical looking 3.5 foot "greys" that are emotionless and mostly interested in genetic experiments (What would machines be interested in if they were self-aware? Programming...genetic programming sounds like a good guess). So maybe some trilloinaire will have a conscience with all these humans starving to death and figure, hey, I'll "save" what's left of humanity and put us into a Matrix-style virtual reality, kept alive on the bare minimum amounts of nutrients needed to maintain a never-ending dream state and used to further some experiment or the other. It's safe to say in 100 years we probably won't be able to tell a virtual reality from the real thing.... Or are we in it already??? :eek: ;)

I couldn't be bothered to read your whole soap box comment.
But I did want to just point out to you that 'services' includes banking, and I don't know anyone in banking being paid minimum wage! Not in the UK at least.
 
I didn't know that, I really need to get out more reading other sites as MacRumors can, miss things out.
But whilst Foxconn setting up a factory could comply with the 30% regulation, it could very well do nothing for jobs in the area.
Because Foxconn is famously replacing its workforce with robots. I believe hundreds of thousands if not more robots.
Maybe India can pass regulations prohibiting that, somehow. They seem more proactive than the Chinese in some ways about addressing the needs of their people. Some of the jobs dealing with hazardous materials SHOULD be done by robots. But if people don't pressure their governments to do something about limiting automation, we WILL have the dire scenario @MagnusVonMagnum wrote about.
 
"Phil, hurry up, where'd you put my red dot?
You're working on your WWDC presentation?
Screw the vibrating watch band pro, find that red dot, stat!"
 
Maybe India can pass regulations prohibiting that, somehow. They seem more proactive than the Chinese in some ways about addressing the needs of their people. Some of the jobs dealing with hazardous materials SHOULD be done by robots. But if people don't pressure their governments to do something about limiting automation, we WILL have the dire scenario @MagnusVonMagnum wrote about.

A world run by robots IS coming weather we like it or not, legislation is already being passed for self driving vehicles, so robots will be building robots in that case.

And many are pushing headlong and fast with development of robot helpers, we already have robot vacuum cleaners and mops and lawn mowers around the home, it's just a matter of time, big business will drive it all through parliament with big back handers no doubt. Even call centre staff are slowly being replaced with automated online systems or automated call systems, they are developing supercomputers to even sound like call centre staff.
No more jobs there after that.

Automation is being pushed more now then it ever was, and the technology is fast catching up unfortunately.
 
So pretty soon the people of Indian will be selling internal organs to buy iPhones? Will there also be credit agencies setup to loan you money just for an iPhone that costs 3-10 years of your salary? Both worked out well for China. Perhaps they will also have businesses selling a service that tags text messages send from non-iPhones with "Sent from my iPhone"?

India doesn't seem like a great place for selling a Hermes watch band....just saying.
 
So pretty soon the people of Indian will be selling internal organs to buy iPhones? Will there also be credit agencies setup to loan you money just for an iPhone that costs 3-10 years of your salary? Both worked out well for China. Perhaps they will also have businesses selling a service that tags text messages send from non-iPhones with "Sent from my iPhone"?

India doesn't seem like a great place for selling a Hermes watch band....just saying.
iPhones are already on sale in India. Have been for a long time. In every country there's a percentage of the population who can afford an iPhone. India has over a billion people. Even a small percent of that billion is a heck of a lot of people. They have over 100 billionaires, over 360K millionaires, large middle class, and a king size lower class. They have money to spend, which is why Apple is heavily courting the country.

Hermes watch band? They could probably pick them up from one of the two Hermes stores in India.
 
So pretty soon the people of Indian will be selling internal organs to buy iPhones? Will there also be credit agencies setup to loan you money just for an iPhone that costs 3-10 years of your salary? Both worked out well for China. Perhaps they will also have businesses selling a service that tags text messages send from non-iPhones with "Sent from my iPhone"?

India doesn't seem like a great place for selling a Hermes watch band....just saying.
I was there for work last year. You'd be highly surprised to see the opulence the rich people live in and in a country of billion people that's talking about a large number of rich people!
 
Protectionist garbage. Attempting to limit their countrymen's choices because the government wants a fat cut.
 
I was there for work last year. You'd be highly surprised to see the opulence the rich people live in and in a country of billion people that's talking about a large number of rich people!

I am not saying there is a lack of wealthy people in India. I am saying there are a LOT of poor people that will turn to whatever it takes to be like the rich people. Since a large majority of them come here to earn money to BUY wives back in India....there is a certain mentality the will cause major issues in that country...just like China. My job causes me to interact with a lot of Indian people working temporaraly here of varying regions and classes....I know a lot more about the culture over there than most Americans.
 
I sense like India probably wants Apple to make an exception for the country and sell all their products for 1 rupee or nothing. Then everyone there would be happy. Sorry to burst your bubble India, its not gonna happen. You better fork out that US $650 or more if you want to join the club.
 
Well, right on track. 3 years should give FoxConn enough time to ramp their production facility in India. This will also be a big win for refurb iPhone sales in India. The question is wether Foxconn is getting into the refurb business? :apple:
 
Just a wild thought. If some of the iOS software like Maps is made in India, could an argument be made that it should count towards the 30% locally sourced component of an iPhone?

The Indian government would obviously never let that argument fly, but it would be interesting if Apple decided to try that route.
Easy answer by definition if it was Maps: "Electronic components, the constituents of electronic circuits"
 
Apple bribe. The new innovation.

How did they get to bend the rules? Must be a free ticket to wwdc.
 
Sorry India, but you will be screwed. Apple opens 3 stores the first year, 5 more the second year, 12 more the third year. Apple now has 20 stores operating in India all making crazy amounts of money. Do you think India will want to pull Apple out of the country and lose local revenue and piss off its people? No.

Apple's strategy is to move in, build a strong retail presence, and then claim their sourcing is your people as employees. We have 100% Indian employees.
 
Think about it, the tax revenue that Apple India is going to create for India Government will be so hugeeee..even Trump would agree. Pfff, actually India is trying to steal business away from China when they clearly can't.
 
This is called compromise folks India gets what it wants Apple get what it wants.

As I pointed out in a previous thread, India's rules give everyone five years to comply with the 30% sourcing.

So any less time would actually be stricter, not a compromise.

Think about it, the tax revenue that Apple India is going to create for India Government will be so hugeeee..even Trump would agree.

Not if Apple avoids paying full taxes to India, the same as they do with most other countries.

It would not be surprising if there was some tit-for-tat related discussions going on.
 
As I pointed out in a previous thread, India's rules give everyone five years to comply with the 30% sourcing.

So any less time would actually be stricter, not a compromise.



Not if Apple avoids paying full taxes to India, the same as they do with most other countries.

It would not be surprising if there was some tit-for-tat related discussions going on.


TBH I didn't read the entirety of the other thread there was too much India is 100% right, no Apple should XYZ my threshold for threads like that is fairly low.
 
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