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Instant Music Stores?
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I really hope this won't affect the iTMS like VHS did to Beta.
Beta was a better format, but the producers of VHS filled the market with movies before Beta-people got a chance to catch the train.
A similar thing may happen now. If M$ can start enough stores, WMA will without a doubt be the most used format, and people will "forget" about MP3/AAC/iPod and so on...
It's just like DJing. You got to give the people what they want. Like Photorun said: "They're sheep". Give them more stores, more choices and a sense of control, and they will follow. However crap WMA is, people don't care! All they want is MORE! At the low-end-user (nearly everybody), quantity comes first. Then quality.
As I see it, Apple can either continue to play on iTMS's sleekness and userability, or jump on the M$ train in order to spread like a virus and infect as many as possible
Seriously. Apple should look into this possibility of creating a sort of template for smaller record stores to put their own music in a web based store.
PS: have anybody else noticed how unprofessional videos on the web are turning from mpeg to WMV? Say no more, say no more...
Beta was a better format, but the producers of VHS filled the market with movies before Beta-people got a chance to catch the train.
A similar thing may happen now. If M$ can start enough stores, WMA will without a doubt be the most used format, and people will "forget" about MP3/AAC/iPod and so on...
It's just like DJing. You got to give the people what they want. Like Photorun said: "They're sheep". Give them more stores, more choices and a sense of control, and they will follow. However crap WMA is, people don't care! All they want is MORE! At the low-end-user (nearly everybody), quantity comes first. Then quality.
As I see it, Apple can either continue to play on iTMS's sleekness and userability, or jump on the M$ train in order to spread like a virus and infect as many as possible
Seriously. Apple should look into this possibility of creating a sort of template for smaller record stores to put their own music in a web based store.PS: have anybody else noticed how unprofessional videos on the web are turning from mpeg to WMV? Say no more, say no more...
Re: How does Microsoft make so much money?
And I think Steve has been down this road one two many times, if Bill knifes steves baby once again, I think steve's gonna knife Bills Baby (you can guess what that is) too..for a change.
Well, the MS way is for them to build and then tax resellers for the "foundation" that they provide, IOW its thier clients that take all the risk, and wether they profit (bleed to death) or not (ex. PC Industry) the money keeps rolling in.
And I think Steve has been down this road one two many times, if Bill knifes steves baby once again, I think steve's gonna knife Bills Baby (you can guess what that is) too..for a change.
from Bambi Francisco's column at CBS MarketWatch:
That is SOOO 1998! It is the stuff of the illusory business model that caused the dotcom stampede and ensuing panic. Frankly, anyone who goes into this venture without pushing a high-margin item like an iPod (sorry, Bambi, it isn't I-Pod) is going to be sucked into a money-sucking maelstrom.
Even that smug anus, Michael Dell, is probably going to regret his pretentious entry into the music store/music player arena since he is obviously sacrficing margin to sell more of his crappy DJ's. Well, genius, red ink on the music store and slim margins on the players make for a combination that the shareholders won't like. Either Dell will get out of the business or arrogantly subsidize it by stealing from profitable lines in order to avoid admitting defeat.
That is SOOO 1998! It is the stuff of the illusory business model that caused the dotcom stampede and ensuing panic. Frankly, anyone who goes into this venture without pushing a high-margin item like an iPod (sorry, Bambi, it isn't I-Pod) is going to be sucked into a money-sucking maelstrom.
Even that smug anus, Michael Dell, is probably going to regret his pretentious entry into the music store/music player arena since he is obviously sacrficing margin to sell more of his crappy DJ's. Well, genius, red ink on the music store and slim margins on the players make for a combination that the shareholders won't like. Either Dell will get out of the business or arrogantly subsidize it by stealing from profitable lines in order to avoid admitting defeat.
sorry for not posting the aac vs mp3 vs MWA link before, it's
http://www.tomshardware.com/consumer/20020712/2u4u-05.html
go to the second page of the story where it explains the results (albiet briefly)
http://www.tomshardware.com/consumer/20020712/2u4u-05.html
go to the second page of the story where it explains the results (albiet briefly)
Where have I seen this before?
Hmmmm......
So Apple has created a high quality music service and also has control of the hardware player that ties into it.
And Microsoft is flooding the market with music services based on their "standard" and has no hardware of their own.
Sounds so familiar.... cant put my finger on it... I swear Ive seen this before...
Hmmmm......
So Apple has created a high quality music service and also has control of the hardware player that ties into it.
And Microsoft is flooding the market with music services based on their "standard" and has no hardware of their own.
Sounds so familiar.... cant put my finger on it... I swear Ive seen this before...
That was an excellent article, punter - quite informative.
It looks like AAC is definitely the best format:
a) it's waveform most closely matches that of the original source
b) superior sound clarity
c) storage savings due to better compressibility.
It would be nice if this analysis could be independently confirmed.
It looks like AAC is definitely the best format:
a) it's waveform most closely matches that of the original source
b) superior sound clarity
c) storage savings due to better compressibility.
It would be nice if this analysis could be independently confirmed.
Microsoft's evil plan
Ok, besides the stupid idea that EVERYONE needs their own music store I realized MS evil plan to kill Apple with this new effort....
See, if anyone can have their own music store using WMA then the WMA format will become the dominate accepted way to download music (beta/vhs anyone?). In doing so MS will either kill off/greatly reduce/or reap $$$ from Apple's online music store. The reaping of $$$ coming from Apple using WMA formats.
Simple idea. Basically follows the same format they used for Internet explorer. "Give it away free since no one is really going to make any money on it" attitude.
Downside to this, MS is known for crappy security. I'm sure someone is bound to crack the DRM in WMA format if the above were to happen. Then MS would either give up (to the benefit of the labels) online downloading and ending an advancement started by Apple - or MS would have such a dominate position the labels would be lossing their ass and not have a choice but to go with MS WMA since the market wants online downloads.
Curious though, the labels bitched at Apple for the mix/rip/burn idea. Now if they get behind MS they will end up hosing themselves (and the public) over with a crappy format like WMA that is sure to be cracked.
Thank god for my iPod and iTunes.
Ok, besides the stupid idea that EVERYONE needs their own music store I realized MS evil plan to kill Apple with this new effort....
See, if anyone can have their own music store using WMA then the WMA format will become the dominate accepted way to download music (beta/vhs anyone?). In doing so MS will either kill off/greatly reduce/or reap $$$ from Apple's online music store. The reaping of $$$ coming from Apple using WMA formats.
Simple idea. Basically follows the same format they used for Internet explorer. "Give it away free since no one is really going to make any money on it" attitude.
Downside to this, MS is known for crappy security. I'm sure someone is bound to crack the DRM in WMA format if the above were to happen. Then MS would either give up (to the benefit of the labels) online downloading and ending an advancement started by Apple - or MS would have such a dominate position the labels would be lossing their ass and not have a choice but to go with MS WMA since the market wants online downloads.
Curious though, the labels bitched at Apple for the mix/rip/burn idea. Now if they get behind MS they will end up hosing themselves (and the public) over with a crappy format like WMA that is sure to be cracked.
Thank god for my iPod and iTunes.
I disagree with those who have said Apple should go this route. Ever visit buymusic.com? What about roxio or any of the other currently available online music stores? Part of what, IMHO, makes iTunes so great is the ease of use and its duality. Not only is it an online music store, it is also a great juke box that is very easy to use. Case in point, my 55y/o, technology handicaped mother. She uses a computer at school to teach but is "comfortable" once she gets to know it. It has taken her 6 months to get rid of her 6 year old PC computer because of her comfort level. She would rather put up with the crashing than get a new one and learn win xp over win 98. When I showed her iTunes, she was creating her own play list to burn her own CD's in 5 mins. She thought it was so cool (neat - her word).
By allowing "others" to have their own music store you could take away from this functionality. The integration to make it right wouldn't pay off in the long run and could end up hurting Apple. The quick and easy way is to do a hyper link but you could do that now and still have to download the app. I just don't see it being a good thing. We all agree too many music stores are just bad and will eventually thin out to a few major players. Why bother with a bad idea. Work on making it better in the long run and getting market share.
BTW, my mom will not be learning win xp. She bought a 17" iMac last night. Can't over emphasize "it just works."
The MS tactic is a rehash of a failed business model, but as the first to market with the reputation they already have for the store, Apple are ahead of the game. "All they need to do" is extend and differentiate the AAC only iPod range in some way to compete on every price range and then reskin the iTunes Store. They knock on all the doors that MS and Loudeye are going to try and break down, then offer the store under license with assorted deals tying in the iPod range.
As the middleman for tunes, Apple are positioned to take half the financial hit of this Loudeye MS set-up. Also anyone interested in a store will know for sure that the music store from Apple is proven and would work straight out the box. Plus they know Apple will forever upgrade and improve it, which is not a trick MS is renowned for.
The worst thing that could happen to Apple is some one else comes out with a genuine iPod killer ie something that syncs about as good as an iPod, (but not quite), but gets sales because its a lot cheaper. ie Apple need to do a MS in terms of flooding the market, but doing it with the best technology.
As the middleman for tunes, Apple are positioned to take half the financial hit of this Loudeye MS set-up. Also anyone interested in a store will know for sure that the music store from Apple is proven and would work straight out the box. Plus they know Apple will forever upgrade and improve it, which is not a trick MS is renowned for.
The worst thing that could happen to Apple is some one else comes out with a genuine iPod killer ie something that syncs about as good as an iPod, (but not quite), but gets sales because its a lot cheaper. ie Apple need to do a MS in terms of flooding the market, but doing it with the best technology.
What the hell the Music industry is thinking?
To my understanding last year the record labels fought tooth and nail to not release their music for sale over the internet.
Now they are giving anyone who wants it the ability to sell their music online?
how has it gone from one extreme to the other in less than a year. It cant possibly be the great DRM in the WMA format.
Im geeting the feeling that the big four dont have a clue about online music and they are just trying to make as much cash off this as they can.
I hope to see more independent labels on the net allowing artist to sell directly to their fans. Cutting out all the fat will give the atist much more return. The labels will take on more of a promotional and legal role for the artist.
To my understanding last year the record labels fought tooth and nail to not release their music for sale over the internet.
Now they are giving anyone who wants it the ability to sell their music online?
how has it gone from one extreme to the other in less than a year. It cant possibly be the great DRM in the WMA format.
Im geeting the feeling that the big four dont have a clue about online music and they are just trying to make as much cash off this as they can.
I hope to see more independent labels on the net allowing artist to sell directly to their fans. Cutting out all the fat will give the atist much more return. The labels will take on more of a promotional and legal role for the artist.
this is worse than buying into a horrible 1980s franchise...
you pay us $20,000 and we'll give you a pc, internet access, hosting software, etc. all you have to do is plug it in, name your new music site, link up to our server, and you're making money! it's so easy, even my 80 year old grandmother is doing it and she makes 250 grand a year... don't miss this opportunity of a life time! call 1-800-mymusic now... and if you order in the next 5 minutes, we'll give you a free mousepad!
makes me think, what the F#%K!
you pay us $20,000 and we'll give you a pc, internet access, hosting software, etc. all you have to do is plug it in, name your new music site, link up to our server, and you're making money! it's so easy, even my 80 year old grandmother is doing it and she makes 250 grand a year... don't miss this opportunity of a life time! call 1-800-mymusic now... and if you order in the next 5 minutes, we'll give you a free mousepad!
makes me think, what the F#%K!
Microsoft is not doing it to make money, just look at Xbox. Microsoft wants to buy market share in music downloading and make sure that everyone uses its format becasue they can afford to and becasue they can.
Incidently PS2 is doing a big pre christmas promo on the radio here at the moment giving away $50,000 of PS2 gear. They have a new PS2 coming out next year-faster gruntier.
Besides the fact that AAC is better than WMA, Apple seems to be the only music store that will insure the quality of each track. Do stores like Napster or Raphsody digitize their music, or have a third party do it for them?
One of the articles I read today says that Loudeye do the 30 second samples on the Apple store. Very confusing
Originally posted by Bing80
I really hope this won't affect the iTMS like VHS did to Beta.
Beta was a better format, but the producers of VHS filled the market with movies before Beta-people got a chance to catch the train.
A similar thing may happen now. If M$ can start enough stores, WMA will without a doubt be the most used format, and people will "forget" about MP3/AAC/iPod and so on...
It's just like DJing. You got to give the people what they want. Like Photorun said: "They're sheep". Give them more stores, more choices and a sense of control, and they will follow. However crap WMA is, people don't care! All they want is MORE! At the low-end-user (nearly everybody), quantity comes first. Then quality.
As I see it, Apple can either continue to play on iTMS's sleekness and userability, or jump on the M$ train in order to spread like a virus and infect as many as possible
PS: have anybody else noticed how unprofessional videos on the web are turning from mpeg to WMV? Say no more, say no more...
hey iTunes player is FREE to download for PC (2000 and XP) which is why I have it on My PC Win XP. what more could you as for? windows versions prior to that are to old and difficult to write for and no longer being supported buy Microsoft anyway.
Steve has gone down the track of making iTunes avaiable to PC users for free and then in all the advertising with the silouete ads it says for Mac and Windows which is all it has to do.
Apple just has to make sure that they produce enough iPods to satisfy market demand and get them to the people who buy them on time so that the customers are not pissed off.
The link down below goes to the BBC article that explains how the iPod ads work and what the brief was and what was the mesage that the ads had to get across to the public.
The public already know that the iPod is the must have gadget of the year. There has been enough brilliant press written about iTMS and iPod "to sink a battle ship"
All the ad had to do was to let everyone know that iTunes and the iPod work on Windows and Mac . You cant ask for more than that.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3321943.stm
iPod, AAC, and Proprietarism (yes I made it up)
Apple needs to open up the AAC/FairPlay format to other digital music players. With the "hopeful" advent of a cheap iPod player, Apple will no longer have worries of iPod sales loss if a consumer needs a cheaper device. Apple messed up earlier on with being over proprietary "EVEN WITH THE MARKET LEAD", hopefully they won't repeat this action.
edit: no Vb Code in title... dam
Apple needs to open up the AAC/FairPlay format to other digital music players. With the "hopeful" advent of a cheap iPod player, Apple will no longer have worries of iPod sales loss if a consumer needs a cheaper device. Apple messed up earlier on with being over proprietary "EVEN WITH THE MARKET LEAD", hopefully they won't repeat this action.
edit: no Vb Code in title... dam
My disadvantage here is that I live in Norway, where the marketing pressure from Apple has been fairly low. And the fact that iTMS is not available here either does dampen the "buzz" factor.
Get those hippies in Cupertino off their asses and make them release the European iTMS fast!!!
Then, I think it'll be easier to tell which way this is going.
Still, I think the first to flood the market with it's codec (other than MP3, so it's AAC or WMA) will be the "victorious".
Get those hippies in Cupertino off their asses and make them release the European iTMS fast!!!
Then, I think it'll be easier to tell which way this is going.
Still, I think the first to flood the market with it's codec (other than MP3, so it's AAC or WMA) will be the "victorious".
Yes, but that's no guarantee that it will work. Look at the XBox, for example - still losing out massively to the PS2 (and I even own an XBox). Look at UltimateTV - losing out (if not already dead) to Tivo.
Now, who knows...this may be different, since Microsoft can leverage its desktop monopoly in certain ways. But I don't think there's any reason to panic yet (and incidentally, the PS2 that's coming out next year is a regular PS2 + hard drive + some media center-like functionality. Not terribly compelling, at least as far as I'm concerned.)
Why doesn't Apple tout the advantages of AAC in their ads more?
If, as someone mentioned above, AAC is tied to Dolby, why not just add a tagline somewhere like: "Only iTunes and iPod music store feature AAC digital sound encoding. The advanced next generation standard preferred by Dolby and the DVD consortum."
As a consumer, if I didn't know better, I would look at all the features of an iPod vs competitor player and then compare vs price. For a little less ease of use, I'd save my $100 for a heck of alot of music downloads or something else if the features of the competitor's players were comparable. But I wouldn't want to sacrifice quality. IMO, spreading the word about AAC would add value to the iPod.
Throwing the names Dolby and DVD at the average consumer will suggest advanced and pristine audio.
If, as someone mentioned above, AAC is tied to Dolby, why not just add a tagline somewhere like: "Only iTunes and iPod music store feature AAC digital sound encoding. The advanced next generation standard preferred by Dolby and the DVD consortum."
As a consumer, if I didn't know better, I would look at all the features of an iPod vs competitor player and then compare vs price. For a little less ease of use, I'd save my $100 for a heck of alot of music downloads or something else if the features of the competitor's players were comparable. But I wouldn't want to sacrifice quality. IMO, spreading the word about AAC would add value to the iPod.
Throwing the names Dolby and DVD at the average consumer will suggest advanced and pristine audio.
Re: How does Microsoft make so much money?
Microsoft does business like most people play chess or monopoly. These are known as zero-sum, noncooperative games (for me to win, you must lose). Add to this a long history of screwing over business partners and an irrational fear caused by books such as The Innovator's Dilemma and you have a company fully willing to enter "lose-lose" situations.
Such business models fail in the long term because real economics is not zero-sum and its not non-cooperative. People like Nash proved this mathematically a half century ago.
In the short run, Microsoft has moved themselves into a niche where regular free market doesn't provide an efficient distribution of goods, in this case, they've garnered a monopoly position. Many smart companies have used their monopoly positions as an opportunity to diversify business (think GE and IBM) and to some extent we've seen that with Microsoft (Encarta, MSNBC, Slate, Expedia),
The problem is Microsoft wants to have the cake and eat it to: UltimateTV, XBox, MSN, Windows NT, Windows Media, PocketPC, Windows Mobile, IIS, Internet Explorer, Outlook, Exchange, SQL Server and Access, Office, Project, MSN Search, etc are all designed to further continue their main monopoly (the OS). We've seen that of many companies also (Ma Bell, Standard Oil).
The reality is right now in the OS, we're paying a Microsoft a whole lot of money for stuff that Microsoft didn't even invent and have long since passed into the public domain (TCP stack, compression, etc.). Microsoft knows this and has to do things that encourage lock-in: "de facto" standardization, "embrace and extend", "fear uncertainty doubt", channel stuffing, etc.
It's nothing personal. Apple's AAC/Fairplay (QuickTime) just happens to be in Microsoft's way at the moment and its all zero-sum with Microsoft. As one Microsoft executive put it to Apple years ago about this very same issue: Apple should "knife the baby (QuickTime)."
Microsoft does business like most people play chess or monopoly. These are known as zero-sum, noncooperative games (for me to win, you must lose). Add to this a long history of screwing over business partners and an irrational fear caused by books such as The Innovator's Dilemma and you have a company fully willing to enter "lose-lose" situations.
Such business models fail in the long term because real economics is not zero-sum and its not non-cooperative. People like Nash proved this mathematically a half century ago.
In the short run, Microsoft has moved themselves into a niche where regular free market doesn't provide an efficient distribution of goods, in this case, they've garnered a monopoly position. Many smart companies have used their monopoly positions as an opportunity to diversify business (think GE and IBM) and to some extent we've seen that with Microsoft (Encarta, MSNBC, Slate, Expedia),
The problem is Microsoft wants to have the cake and eat it to: UltimateTV, XBox, MSN, Windows NT, Windows Media, PocketPC, Windows Mobile, IIS, Internet Explorer, Outlook, Exchange, SQL Server and Access, Office, Project, MSN Search, etc are all designed to further continue their main monopoly (the OS). We've seen that of many companies also (Ma Bell, Standard Oil).
The reality is right now in the OS, we're paying a Microsoft a whole lot of money for stuff that Microsoft didn't even invent and have long since passed into the public domain (TCP stack, compression, etc.). Microsoft knows this and has to do things that encourage lock-in: "de facto" standardization, "embrace and extend", "fear uncertainty doubt", channel stuffing, etc.
It's nothing personal. Apple's AAC/Fairplay (QuickTime) just happens to be in Microsoft's way at the moment and its all zero-sum with Microsoft. As one Microsoft executive put it to Apple years ago about this very same issue: Apple should "knife the baby (QuickTime)."
Could Apple do this too?
I wish Apple and M$ could just agree on a format for their downloads. I know it's impossible, but it sure would set an example. If two computer monguls can get along, why can't everyone else?
I wish Apple and M$ could just agree on a format for their downloads. I know it's impossible, but it sure would set an example. If two computer monguls can get along, why can't everyone else?
they do get along
iTunes / office x
quick time / windows media player
panthr / windows + virtual pc what ever
ah no they dont ah oh well
you know this is a load of bull dust and that who ever suvives wins so lets watch and learn america will be first to see what happens in its market i think
iTunes / office x
quick time / windows media player
panthr / windows + virtual pc what ever
ah no they dont ah oh well
you know this is a load of bull dust and that who ever suvives wins so lets watch and learn america will be first to see what happens in its market i think
The reasons that all these companies are getting into this are all over the map. Only a very few are actually trying to make money on the internet stores. Those are doomed to failure. Microsoft wants to use its store to make sure of WMA's dominance. The Walmarts, Dells, and Cokes of the world look at this as advertising. They will use internet music sites to suck people into their product or products. These big companies can spend an awful lot to get you look at why you should buy their latest widget.