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Intel Alder Lake Chips for Desktops Faster Than M1 Max in Benchmarks, But Use Much More Power

Kissmo1980 said:
I saw in reviews those hit very high temps - even higher than Ryzen and require high end cooling.
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This is the same maneuver Intel pulled when AMD first started pounding them years ago. Intel turned their component problem into their customers' system problem. Intel gets to tout performance numbers in cryo while their customers scramble to source and dissipate the necessary energy to make it happen in practice and their customers' customers have to deal with the monstrous end results.

This is where the Apple advantage is clear-- they are the component, system and principal software provider. They have no one to pass the buck to but themselves. They cut their teeth on the most challenging system integration problem of all, phones, and are now able to build a full system that meets their customers needs, not just a few standout specs in isolation.

I'm not sure what to expect from the upcoming iMacs, but I'd be shocked if the upcoming MacPros top out at 8 performance cores, 2 efficiency cores, and a 32 core GPU all at the same clock rates. As component, system and software developer for that platform, I'm sure they'll find a different optimization point for that machine and build to it.
 
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Still don't understand the point of the E-cores in a desktop CPU. For example, AMD 3800xt uses about 20W idle so E-cores have to be significantly lower for wasting die space.
 
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Uuh duh? Even Apple when showing their graphs was like “this laptop is actually more powerful than M1 Max but it uses way more power and at the same power draw gets crushed by our chip”

It would have been utterly embarrassing for intel if this WASN’T the case.
 
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Kierkegaarden said:
Did y’all miss the fact that this comparison is between desktop and laptop chips. These chips have already been used in vanilla iMac and iMac mini.
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Not really These chips (albeit slower versions) have already been used in vanilla iMac and iMac mini.

Apple are just going to slightly tweak them for the new iMac Pro.
I can’t see Apple going to m2 until all products have M1 variants. So they can then make everyone upgrade for m2.

This new intel will still beat the iMac Pro m1. Albeit with larger power draws. But this is in part due to pc architecture design with dedicated gpus and expandable memory etc… M1 is arm on a chip. ARM processor low power draw is inherent its unique chip design architecture. An advantage over traditional Intel x86s. It is not some Apple discovery. Better Heat management and low power draw are true benefits of ARM. ARM support is baked into to Windows since 7 I think, but it didn’t take off that much. Perhaps if Nvidia buys ARM and starts competing in the Processor space.
 
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when it comes to power efficiency, apple winds.
When it comes to performance, intel wins.

Good job intel!
 
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Is it even fair to compare Geekbench numbers across different CPU architectures? Yes, the app is cross-platform, but is there any meaning whatsoever to compare the results of an x86_64 test against an ARM64 test?

I'll be more interested to see benchmarks with real-world apps, like 3D rendering and video editing. Until then, it's just marketing materials to me.

And as others have said, AMD is quite a bit more efficient with their high-end Ryzen CPUs, which is where Intel's real competition lies.

chucker23n1 said:
These only have Intel UHD Graphics, not Intel Xe. The GPU is basically worthless compared to that of an M1 Pro.
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If you're going to compare power draw, you have to add the power draw of an adequate GPU and the entire RAM.
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I couldn't agree more. Add an RTX3070 GPU into the mix and that system is going be drawing at least 700W under load. But how will it stack up against an M1 Max at real-world GPU-intensive tasks for all that power draw?

And let's not forget the cooling solution. Apple is getting its performance with a (more or less) standard laptop cooling system - heat pipes and fans.

A high end Intel PC typically requires a much more robust cooling system (air cooling with ginormous heat sinks and many fans, or liquid cooling with large radiators and fans). If the cooling system isn't robust enough, that super-fast Intel chip will thermal throttle and you will no longer be seeing the tremendous benchmarks that they're bragging about right now.

I'm looking forward to seeing Linus Tech Tips put one of these new Alder Lake systems through their suite of rendering/gaming benchmarks. And wherever there are comparable tests, I want to see them compared to an M1 Max laptop.
 
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intel ceo has said that they have chips much more powerful than the alder lake chips in the coming years. this is good. i don't see apple ever going back to intel (except maybe the Mac Pro) so intel's best bet now is to beat apple, amd, and even nvidia as much as possible to get as many people to jump ships to intel.
 
With an Intel chip yoiu only get the claimed performance for a short time before starts to overheat and then automatically slows itself down to avoid melting.
 
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chucker23n1 said:
And? The 5700G is significantly slower than an M1 Max.
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Not really.

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So Intel’s 12th gen chip is marginally faster than Apple’s 1.5 gen chip, but uses a lot more energy? Nothing to brag about for Intel.
 
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Analog Kid said:
This is where the Apple advantage is clear-- they are the component, system and principal software provider. They have no one to pass the buck to but themselves. They cut their teeth on the most challenging system integration problem of all, phones, ...
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and watches and AirPods. I once benchmarked my Apple Watch 4 at over 1 gigaflop... on a single core (of the 2). There's a vast amount of thermal headroom between a watch on your wrist that doesn't even get warm to the touch, and a desktop with big fans (future Mac Pro M?).
 
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It’s so good to see Intel come back. Maybe Gelsinger was correct about possibly winning back Apple’s business. But even if Apple never comes back to x86, a strong intel and amd is good for the industry.

A strong x86 will keep Apple on its toes, especially if x86 PCs are able to outperform macs... Apple will continue to innovate to keep its mac customers happy and possibly woo other customers to the Mac.

I wonder if there couldn’t be a hybrid intel + Apple silicon solution that runs both macOS and windows and Linux. With amazing performance per watt. I would own such a machine.
 
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