Intel Developing Next PowerMac for Apple?

[SiliconAddict]

Thanks, I needed a good laugh.

You obviously weren't around when Intel released the 430FX chipset and its offspring. It was one of the most used, most clockable chipsets at the time. Intel makes some DAMN good hardware. The problem is that Windows wasn't designed around it and as such things like standby and the like tends to fail from time to time in the OS. As an example I found that with the PCMCIA WIFI card Windows HATED coming back from standby. But I popped in a Intel Mini-PCI card into my IBM Thinkpad (To make it a Centrino laptop.) Things became MUCH more stable. Standby came back in 2-3 seconds instead of the typical 30 seconds.
Again Intel does make some damn fine hardware. Its just Microsoft releases an OS update once every half a decade (If you are lucky.) and by and large they don't support what Intel is offering out of the box. Doubtless this pisses off Intel something fierce and is prob one of the driving forces behind Intel's complete support of Apple.

 

[Booga]

positive? negative?

I don't understand why so many people have voted "negative" on this article.

Apple's motherboards, with some notable exceptions, are generally at least a generation behind the rest of the industry in features and performance. The notable exceptions are generally in the area of slots, where the old 9x00, being the first computer sold to offer more than 3-4 PCI slots, and the new PCIe Macs with their 8x PCIe slots, are industry leaders. The other exception is in weird form factors, which don't apply to PowerMacs anyway. In all other respects the Mac motherboards have tended to support the latest features later and slower than their Intel counterparts.

I see this as a great move on Apple's part. They'll likely get the motherboard way cheaper, have it perform better, and get it released sooner than doing it in-house. Since, except for slots that go mostly unusued, Apple hasn't been much of an innovator here, it makes a huge amount of sense.

 

[EricNau]

This makes sense, I just hope Apple still has some control over things, but I'm sure they do.

 

[Booga]

Intel makes good motherboards

Intel makes the best motherboards on earth.

Thanks, I needed a good laugh.

What's funny? Maybe VIA does a few designs better. And AMD's built-in memory controller makes some of the motherboard designs based on the Athlon top-notch. But I hope you're not implying that Apple motherboards are competitive to Intels, because I don't think that's been true for ages.

 

[woolfgang]

You obviously weren't around when Intel released the 430FX chipset and its offspring. It was one of the most used, most clockable chipsets at the time. Intel makes some DAMN good hardware. The problem is that Windows wasn't designed around it and as such things like standby and the like tends to fail from time to time in the OS. As an example I found that with the PCMCIA WIFI card Windows HATED coming back from standby. But I popped in a Intel Mini-PCI card into my IBM Thinkpad (To make it a Centrino laptop.) Things became MUCH more stable. Standby came back in 2-3 seconds instead of the typical 30 seconds.
Again Intel does make some damn fine hardware. Its just Microsoft releases an OS update once every half a decade (If you are lucky.) and by and large they don't support what Intel is offering out of the box. Doubtless this pisses off Intel something fierce and is prob one of the driving forces behind Intel's complete support of Apple.

I agree with some, and disagree with others. Most PC's still don't have Firewire and use Serial connections. That's Old.

 

[Peace]

Intel does make a "good" motherboard but Asustek makes the best.

 

[RBR2]

What's the surprise?

Surely part of the decision to go with Intel as a "partner" rather than just a supplier (along with AMD) was the overall package of services that Intel could provide. The Intel-Apple division is obviously a part of that package and, if done well, will free up Apple resources to work on "more important things". It should also bring Apple's costs more in line with those of PC "manufacturers".

One of the good things for Intel is that the Intel-Apple division is the equivilent of a car manufacturer (such as Honda) sending their engineers off to a racing team to learn and explore new things. It both trains the engineers and frequently has implications for the technology of their retail products. In this case Intel has long chaffed at the restrictions that Microsoft's OS has imposed and the reluctance of the PC "manufacturers" to move along with technology. This is the opportunity that Intel has dreamed of...the chance to show what they can accomplish and lead their other customers along the path of change.

Intel has always been ahead of AMD when it comes to manufacturing capability. Their yields are higher, the Fabs are newer technology or are implemented sooner. Still AMD has taken the lead in the actual chip design of late...pressing Intel to catch up. The memory controller, in particular, is an area that Intel is having to revamp.

If Intel can pull off quad cores in '07 and eight cores in '08 Apple should be able to put together some smokin' work stations and servers.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Dell is expensive crappy stuff!

Their consumer products yes. (Read: Dimension series) Their corp desktops? Not in the least. Their Optiplex lines are probably one of the most reliable desktops I've ever run across. This coming from someone who has deployed around 80 of these in the last 5 years at the site I work at and another 60 downtown.
The GX110's, GX240's, and the GX280's and the GX520’s are all rock solid. I would say out of those 80 systems we have had 2 die on us. One was a NIC problem. The other was a motherboard problem. Everything else: Flawless.
Their laptops are another matter. 4 years ago I would have made the same comparison saying the Inspiron (consumer.) laptops sucked and the Latitude (Buisness.) laptops rocked. I have a 5 year old Latitude that is still running XP at home. No problems at all and this thing has been thrown around, beaten and borderline abused. That was then. Today? You couldn’t give me a Latitude. The quality is for crap on Dell’s laptop line.

PS- For those who say you can't find Dell systems cheaper then Apple hardware. You just aren't looking hard enough. Most consumers aren't looking for a new monitor. That alone drops a few hundred off the price. Then you have coupons and the like. Or the referb site where you can find systems for under $500 with the normal 1-year warrantee. I got my Dell Optiplex GX280 off of Dell's referb site for $400 and change. Over the last year I've been upgrading the components. So instead of being hit with a $1000+ charge all of a sudden I simply add a GB of RAM there (2Gb total.), a DVD burner there, a GeForce 6800 GT there, a SATA 100Gb drive there. At the end of the day and with the help of pricegrabber.com the price I've paid is considerably less then what I would pay with an iMac along with a bigger screen - Dell 24" widescreen that can stay with me when I upgrade in a couple years. Most people don't give a crap about the whole TCO on a desktop. They care about price. At the end of the day what they can afford is X amount. They don't care if Y amount comes with all these wonderful features and such.

 

[sw1tcher]

Thanks, I needed a good laugh.

What's so funny about that? It is well known in the PC world that Intel motherboards are rock solid. Sure, they might not be as feature-rich as those from ASUS, Abit, MSI, et al., but they are solid and stable.

Intel's expertise in mobo designs would be a big plus for Apple.

 

[sw1tcher]

I agree with some, and disagree with others. Most PC's still don't have Firewire and use Serial connections. That's Old.

Not sure which PCs you've been looking at lately, but of the ones I've seen within the past year or so in retail stores, almost all (if not all) of them have Firewire ports already.

 

[maya]

All this means is that, Apple hardware will drop in price. By a lot.

I like it, and since Intel is supplying the processors and motherboard might mean that when a product is announced it will be shipped in a weeks timeframe.

I hope they do not stick some crappy GPU in there from Intel.

 

[Mr.Hey]

Found this on digg.

 

[shamino]

Don't worry, they'll be using EFI for sure. So will Windows Vista. BIOS is finally dead.

So you believe Vista will require all customers to upgrade their ROMs from BIOS to EFI? I wonder how many copies will be sold when everybody is told they need a whole-system upgrade.

I don't think you realize what you wrote.

 

[Mr.Hey]

All this means is that, Apple hardware will drop in price. By a lot.

I like it, and since Intel is supplying the processors and motherboard might mean that when a product is announced it will be shipped in a weeks timeframe.

I hope they do not stick some crappy GPU in there from Intel.

They'll always give you the option. They're not going to start replacing ATI and Nvidia for Intel GPUs.

 

[shamino]

That's because AI (and now MR) are using misleading headlines The headline should read: "Intel Developing Next PowerMac Motherboard for Apple?"

And what's the difference? The motherboard is the computer, unless you believe the color it's painted is more important.

 

[rhashem]

This is excellent news. A motherboard designed by Intel means a motherboard without all the usual Apple quirks and little bugs that always end up in the shipping products. Intel motherboards are an example of the finest designs that billions of dollars of R&D come up with. This is a smart move on Apple's part.

Absolutely. I have an old Intel Seattle PII motherboard in my Dell D300 (slightly customized for Dell, as I presume Apple's will be for Apple), and the machine has been working perfectly for the last eight years. Intel's boards (and chipsets) are probably the best you can find in consumer space.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Intel does make a "good" motherboard but Asustek makes the best.

I <3 Asus mobos. I put an Asus in my home server. Rock of Gibraltar type solid. The thing stays up for seasons without reboots. The last time I had to fiddle with that system was this summer when we had a major thunderstorm with a power outage.

 

[kcmac]

I go along with RBR2 and SiliconAddict on Intel pushing technology and MS and other PC vendors holding them back. I think I remember threads and articles mentioning this very thought right after the Intel/Apple deal was made public. And I thought it came from Intel.

Apple has and displays the ability to push the edge. It appears to me that even though the other PC vendors will or may have the same access to the Intel goodies and hardware, that Apple will steam ahead with it all because they push their software and hardware design so effectively and swiftly. I gotta believe that Apple will set the parameters for the box size, shape, etc and Intel will design something to make that work and in a way that takes advantage of their processor.

I also believe that a lot of PC folks will purchase Apple hardware for this very reason, try to run Windows on it, and ever so slowly start to use OS X from that same box. Of course, once they get a good taste, I believe they will stay heavily on the OS X side.

 

[generik]

not true. All that think secret reports could mean is that intel is being told "this is what we need, build it" and they can put the resistors and transmitters whereever they please, but in the end it's an apple computer, designed by apple, in california.

Please no.. at the end of the day I will gladly take a designed by INTEL board over TEN designed by Apple boards *anyday*

Rev A issues? NEVER happens for stuff like Intel boards. Intel is used to making real server boards, not toy computers like Apple.

 

[shamino]

This is great news because Mactels could be sold at the same price as PCs out there and not twice as expensive.

Why? Macs are sold with very high profit margins. Do you think Apple will change this policy? Do you think an Intel-designed MB with an Intel chip will cost that much less?

Re: dual DVD, VRAM, front-panel connectors, and modular design:

Apple could do all of this right now if they wanted to. They choose not to. The choice of motherboard supplier isn't going to change this.

And finally, imagine a Mactel booting natively as Mac OS X, Windows or Linux. Even better: switch from one OS to other using the new Intel virtualization chips. That would be awesome for many people. That alone would sell millions of Mactels and expand market share from 3% to 20% or more worldwide. That is exactly what Apple needs.

You (and a lot of people) seem to think Apple will be able to take over the world if they'd simply jump on the bandwagon and sell the same PC's that everybody else has been selling for the past 20 years.

I'm sorry but the logic makes absolutely no sense. Nobody is going to pay extra for an Apple computer, just to be able to run Windows on it.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Found this on digg.

Yep old news. Now if there was an Apple logo in there.

 

[rhashem]

Don't worry, they'll be using EFI for sure. So will Windows Vista. BIOS is finally dead.

Vista won't use EFI, because then it wouldn't work on existing machines. Apple has already said that the new Macs won't use EFI. Since Apple has said you can install Windows on the new Macs, it's almost certain that it will use a PC BIOS.

Of course, who cares? The BIOS is just a bit of code that's never called after startup on a modern OS!

 

[shamino]

They'll always give you the option. They're not going to start replacing ATI and Nvidia for Intel GPUs.

I don't know about that.

If it's a motherboard with an AGP or PCIe slot, like those used in the PowerMac, then you'll have options.

If it's a board with video soldered-on (like on the mini, iMac, iBook, and PowerBook), Intel may refuse to solder-on anything from a third party.

 

[EricNau]

All this means is that, Apple hardware will drop in price. By a lot.

I won't complain.

 

[T'hain Esh Kelch]

This is a very good move from Apples side, except for the part that Macintosh is one step less from being so special.

People who has voted negative for this, really dont have a clue about what this is all about.