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Intel Mac mini at MacWorld San Francisco in January?

Photorun said:
Bingo, as the poster said above. And iLife is already optimized for Intel, as is most all the consumer apps, as is OS X. People buying a Mini would probably see an increase in the speed of these apps over the current ones, potentially appreciable but that'd be speculation as there is a LOT of stuff thats goes on between an app, a processor, the busses, etc.

And whomever thinks they're going to use the Centrino chip is completely delusional. They're so bad even most peecee makers are trying to distance themselves from it, machines built with it in often aren't mentioned excpet the fine print. Even Apple, for all their cheapness sometimes (need I mention video cards like someone did above), wouldn't be THAT cheap! I've watched people run a bake-off where the original PIII from 98 dusted a new Centrino and supposedly the Centrino is based on the PIII. Apple is going to be using the M chips (and beyond), and developers are being told to code to that, not Centrino. Pay attention before you post.
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What are you talking about.:rolleyes: Centrino is not a chip, but rather an aggregation of cpu, chipset, and networking interfaces. It's just intel's marketing name which manufacturers can use provided they adhere to certain hardware requirements. All "centrino" notebooks to this point have included some variant of the pentium m processsor, but not all notebooks with a pentium m are centrino based...Make sense?:confused: ....Now I'm confused.

Lets hope that Apple chooses to use intel's centrino platform, which theoretically speaking, should bring cost down for the whole computer, since they wont have to design their own hardware. Let intel do the work, and then just slap it in! Oh yeah, powerbook is most definitely going intel at MWSF. There's no way the mac mini will get intel before the pbook. All the people talking about pro software aren't getting it. If you "need" photoshop then perhaps you'll stay with a ppc notebook. Although from what I hear, Rosetta is damn fast, so it may be a moot point. The majority of other PRO apps that utilize Altivec, are Apple's apps to begin with so you can rest assured they will be ready day one. The powerbook needed intel yesterday!
 
922 said:
A second-generation all-new Intel Mac mini with Front Row (slighty different design) at MWFS would generate a lot of hype. Maybe even with a 30-day Test Drive plan (cough). Maybe even an ad campaign! It would be a huge swithcer magnet.

On the other hand, it would make the iBook and Powerbook look kind of weak. My guess is a Mac mini with Front Row and a Powerbook with iSight, both with Intel. The iBook will come later without the iSight and with Mac mini clock speeds/graphics.
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If you start adding too much stuff to the Mini the price will have to increase and it won't look as attractive to a switcher like myself. iSight is $190 CDN I think. That would bump the price of a base mac mini to $810 CDN. A little too high when you see Dell ads for that price including a monitor, etc, etc. Don't get me wrong, I love my new Mac, but to Joe User who is looking at switching, that price tag might frighten them off a little bit.
 
mdavey said:
Why? The Mac mini is the simplest product from an engineering standpoint, so it makes sense to work on an Intel version of that first - less risk. I wonder whether it will actually be in Mac mini form factor or have a different form-factor and name but essentially the same spec. (except processor and IR receiver).
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The Mini is a complex and cleverly engineered little computer, far from simple. The same applies to the laptops. The simplest machines from an engineering and production standpoint are the powermacs - plenty of room inside for different form-factor motherboards, cooling fans, 3rd party expansion cards etc. The only disadvantage of making the PowerMac the first IntelMac is that its used by all the professionals, and it is so much more important to get it right for this market.
 
SiliconAddict said:
Introducing the Mac Waffle.....so thin you just want to eat it.
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well Apple wants a big show of it if the Mac Mini is to be the first to go Intel in Jan 06 - so what better way then to redesign it from the ground up ?

Mac Waffle sounds tasty :D
 
922 said:
A second-generation all-new Intel Mac mini with Front Row (slighty different design) at MWFS would generate a lot of hype. Maybe even with a 30-day Test Drive plan (cough). Maybe even an ad campaign! It would be a huge swithcer magnet.
On the other hand, it would make the iBook and Powerbook look kind of weak. My guess is a Mac mini with Front Row and a Powerbook with iSight, both with Intel. The iBook will come later without the iSight and with Mac mini clock speeds/graphics.
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I really think Apple should bite the bullet and bring out PowerBooks with Intel processors as fast as possible and supplement them with an existing G4 chip so that applications like PhotoShop and FCP won't suffer performance-wise since neither have been recompiled for use on x86 OS X.

Or maybe offer a G4 chip "upgrade" (?) option via the PC Card slot. Heck, that might even be a way to finally have a G5 powered (supplemental) PowerBook as well. Granted, going through the PC Card route would have latency issues for either processor.

And before anyone disses my idea, just remember that in the late 80s/early 90s, not only Apple, but Commodore and Atari all offered options (in some models) for an 8086/286 co-processor chip to use in emulation mode for DOS applications while the Motorola 680x0 processor stuck with the native apps and OS. And yes, I realize my suggestion for the PowerBook would cause power issues when the extra chip was in use but that would not matter if the owner was using the machine at their desk.
 
miloblithe said:
Why $100 more? I think Apple's pretty happy with their price points.
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If a G4 for the Mac Mini costs $50, and a Yonah costs $240...

and Intel give Apple a $100 discount on the Yonah, making it $140 for Apple, as long as they use an Intel chipset.

Then Apple have a $90 higher bill of material. However by using integrated graphics in the chipset they might save, say, $20 on the low-end graphics chip. Maybe it cost Apple a lot to create their chipsets, so buying a chipset from Intel for $40 is another $20 cheaper overall than using their own.

So far we're $50 above the previous cost. That translates to roughly $100 of cost to the consumer.

Maybe by factoring in things like: 512MB memory then will be cheaper than 512MB now. Superdrive will be cheaper. Hard drive will be cheaper. Integration and refinement will result in cheaper system. Case is already designed, therefore less design cost... maybe that'll come out to the other $50 cost to Apple, and thus they'll keep the same price point or swallow the few dollars more it'll cost.

Of course, because the original numbers were pulled out of the air, you can create you own scenario for Mac Mini costs when they're on Intel. Sadly Dothan based Mac Mini rip-offs are currently costing $200+ more than the Mac Mini itself.

And now ... come January 2006: "New Mac Mini! 1.7GHz G4 with 512MB DDR2 RAM, using 7448..." :p :O :D

(gotta use Intrepid 2 somewhere!)
 
GetSome681 said:
With Rosetta all of your old software will run just fine. I basically see no downside to starting with the mini as it gives an impetus to developers to get going and most mini buyers aren't power users and probably won't even notice the slight slowdown while using Rosetta.
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With the exception of the pro Apps like Photoshop, FCP, etc. Who knows what Quark would run like either...
 
MacSA said:
Theres a massive gap performance wise between the mini and the iMac now... the mini needs a big performance boost, maybe going intel will provide that.
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Not to mention that the Mac Mini needs a G5 or a PentiumM to successfully encode/decode HDTV for those interested in using the system as a modern living room multimedia engine.

Well, those microprocessors and a more powerful GPU...
 
Makes sense: Front Row + Developers, not PhotoShoppers

This makes a lot of sense. I could easily see Apple releasing the Intel based mini at MacWorld in Jan. I know if they were to add s-video out and Front Row (with IR) they would sell a ton...as well as more AirPorts....hmmm...Mac mini as an AirPort Express AV?

Most mini users are not heavy PhotoShoppers which is the one major app that won't run well on an Intel Mac for quite some time. Most mini users would be fine with Rosetta.

Also, being the lowest cost Mac ever *and* Intel based, this would be a really great box to get out there for the non-registered developers.
 
Hmmm, maybe the G4 will be officially retired at MWSF, and they'll move the mini, ibook and powerbook all to intel chips. Sounds good to me! :p
 
lunchbox said:
Besides, why just the mac mini? If Apple's going to change something as major as their architecture, wouldn't it make more sense to release an entire lineup all at once? I realize that they'll have to start somewhere, but the mac mini's just a small portion of their market.
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Because OS X practically has every app you would use on a Mac Mini. If they included (or at least offered) a finished new version of iWork to go with every Mac mini, it is more than likely that Apple would make this choice.

Apple must be working very hard to get their pro apps working on Intel, but until then the average consumer market are the first ones who won't have to use "emulated" (slower) apps.
For the Pro we still have a just-released Quad G5 which I believe is not even shipping yet. That should last us for a while.
 
Macmaniac said:
The last line of Macs to get Intel chips will be the Powermacs! The Powermac is holding up fine in terms of performance, and it may even see another PPC update before the Intel switch.

Read my lips the Powermac will be the last to cross over!
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what do you think about the xServe ? ;)
 
I think its some spin, When Apple goes Intel they will do it in a big way. I doubt they just throw a Intel into a Mini or book. Im sure there will be all New cool looking and performing models. This is Apple we are talking, not maytag or kenmore etc. I expect something different. Perhaps a new Cube like desktop or Mini on steroids and a all new book with real power. Thats my bet. A machine that can run Windows and Mac:)
 
Macmaniac said:
The last line of Macs to get Intel chips will be the Powermacs! The Powermac is holding up fine in terms of performance, and it may even see another PPC update before the Intel switch.

Read my lips the Powermac will be the last to cross over!
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Considering Jobs said the Powermacs would be last to cross over I wouldn't say that is a bold assertion..

The Powerbook otoh..

The current 1.67 uses a 167MHz FSB..

Check out Intel's roadmap that starts in January

http://www.intel.com/products/roadmap/laptop.htm

We could see Intel powerbooks in January.
 
Pepper2001 said:
If you start adding too much stuff to the Mini the price will have to increase and it won't look as attractive to a switcher like myself. iSight is $190 CDN I think. That would bump the price of a base mac mini to $810 CDN. A little too high when you see Dell ads for that price including a monitor, etc, etc. Don't get me wrong, I love my new Mac, but to Joe User who is looking at switching, that price tag might frighten them off a little bit.
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fyi, I was talking About the Powerbook. Front Row probably costs next to nothing to add.
 
If they went too early (January) and didn't have more than just the Mini, the sales of all the old G5 and G4 machines would tank. They have to be ready to get them all out the door asap. I'll be very surprised to see that happen in January....

D
 
Pentium M or not.... Radeon X600 or not...

I just hope this little MacIntel Mini is fast enough to play HD movies on a TV...

I bet many will use this mini as some kind of media device, especially once Front Row will be pre-installed ;)
 
Probably, which is unfortunate.

This will be the result of misinformation due to people thinking:

"As soon as the first Intel Mac is released, Apple and 3rd Parties will discontinue complete support for PPC processors thus rendering the millions of PPC Macs useless".

Some people on this site really believe this is the case ; they should really know better. Further, some believe that Leopard will be for Intel only ( from posts I've seen )...

Fortunately, this couldn't be further from the truth. Apple should make this clearer - support for PPC will continue for years to come.


Mr. Anderson said:
If they went too early (January) and didn't have more than just the Mini, the sales of all the old G5 and G4 machines would tank. They have to be ready to get them all out the door asap. I'll be very surprised to see that happen in January....

D
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MacsRgr8 said:
Pentium M or not.... Radeon X600 or not...

I just hope this little MacIntel Mini is fast enough to play HD movies on a TV...

I bet many will use this mini as some kind of media device, especially once Front Row will be pre-installed ;)
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That would be nice - I'm planning on getting one of the minis and putting it in the kitchen and hooking it up to a 17" or 19" LCD TV/Monitor - that way I can use it for the internet or watch TV. And having wireless mouse and keyboard will be great. I'm just a little concerned about where to mount the thing, but I'll take care of that when I buy it.

I don't need it on the countertop getting wet....

D
 
Peace said:
From what I've read on Dev Kit related sites the transition is going quit well.There are many apps that have been ported to the OSX86 without using rosetta.
I even read somewhere that Firefox runs faster through rosetta on the X86 than it does natively on the PPC.
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It wouldn't take much. To me, FireFox runs like a dog on OS X. It practically locks up my parents 1 ghz eMac which has 768 megs of memory on it. FireFox sprinted in comparison on my old AthlonXP (1600?) with only 512 megs of memory.
 
One thing is for sure: the first Intel Mac cannot be perceived as slow. All eyes are on this machine and Apple is betting its future (except for its iPod division...) on the Intel platform. I think they'd rather lose a little profit in the short term by using better CPUs and GPUs than making their Intel debut on an underperforming machine. My $.02.
 
I think it's to early in Jan.
The simle reason is the processor.

They need to cram a Pentium-M inside the MacMini.
This processor is an expensive processor. Take a 1.7ghz Pentium M. Just the price for that processor is 200 dollars for OEM. I don't think that Apple will get bigger discounts than Dell.
 
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