Intel Restates Support for Apple During Transition to Apple Silicon

[magbarn]

Not at all, just providing accurate information rather than misinformation. I'd advise to look at a few real tests online (other than gaming) you'd see Intel is still performing better with four year old architecture.

Maybe in a few select benchmark at the cost of almost double the power.
I notice you don't mention anything about the crazy power consumption of comet lake.
You think the vaunted Comet Lake i9 pushing 250 watts will work well in an iMac chassis? Intel is behaving the way they were when the P4 was at its limit and couldn't compete with AMD so they came out with ridiculous chips like the P4 Emergency Edition that consumed crazy amounts of power and heat.

 

[alien3dx]

Is the industry moving away from x86? Or is Apple just an isolated case?

I haven't heard about Dell, HP, Lenovo, Asus, Acer and every other PC manufacturer exploring options other than x86.

Those companies may have some models running Qualcomm chips, for instance, but those seem to be experiments at best. None of those sound like an edict to abandon x86.

got but in server arena because power consumption. nobody would try risk itanium fiasco again..

 

[SocialKonstruct]

Maybe in a few select benchmark at the cost of almost double the power.
I notice you don't mention anything about the crazy power consumption of comet lake.
You think the vaunted Comet Lake i9 pushing 250 watts will work well in an iMac chassis? Intel is behaving the way they were when the P4 was at its limit and couldn't compete with AMD so they came out with ridiculous chips like the P4 Emergency Edition that consumed crazy amounts of power and heat.

Thank Allah Ryzen chips are pretty much what Intel failed to make. My PC desktop I built are much lower power consumption than their Intel counterparts.

 

[ctrlzone]

Thank Allah Ryzen chips are pretty much what Intel failed to make. My PC desktop I built are much lower power consumption than their Intel counterparts.

on Paper, but in Reality its not that much of a Difference really.
just compare an old 4790k/7700k with a current 3300x for example.

an Arm Chip is what i call "much lower power consumption"

 

[magbarn]

on Paper, but in Reality its not that much of a Difference really.
just compare an old 4790k/7700k with a current 3300x for example.

an Arm Chip is what i call "much lower power consumption"

Maybe they're comparing the 250 watt i9 comet lake vs Ryzen 7/9?

Intel's older chips weren't that bad, but seeing their hoary 14nm chips being beat and unable to make a high performance 10nm chip, they were forced to keep 14nm and just basically overdrive the heck out of them by pouring in the power and requiring large air coolers or liquid cooling to allow them to run at full speed.

 

[ctrlzone]

Maybe they're comparing the 250 watt i9 comet lake vs Ryzen 7/9?

Intel's older chips weren't that bad, but seeing their hoary 14nm chips being beat and unable to make a high performance 10nm chip, they were forced to keep 14nm and just basically overdrive the heck out of them by pouring in the power and requiring large air coolers or liquid cooling to allow them to run at full speed.

u mean the 10900k or ? it's listed at 125w(edit, was 95, which is wrong) tdp, initially it was considered mediocre jump but then testing results showed quite an improvement, because of Pl-1, Pl-2, Tau.
there's more to the story, Tech Jesus explains it in Detail here:

 

[GrumpyCoder]

If they were smart they would do AMD EPYC - faster than Intel and less power.

I'd call it the opposite of smart. AMD doesn't have the capacity to provide enough processors for all the data centers, unless you want to wait couple of years for delivery. That's not a problem for the end user at home who want's to play a game, but for data centers it's not acceptable. Why don't you run an experiment, order 10000 AMD CPUs and 10000 CPUs from Intel. Let us know how long it takes for the Intels to arrive and how long for AMD.

 

[magbarn]

I'd call it the opposite of smart. AMD doesn't have the capacity to provide enough processors for all the data centers, unless you want to wait couple of years for delivery. That's not a problem for the end user at home who want's to play a game, but for data centers it's not acceptable. Why don't you run an experiment, order 10000 AMD CPUs and 10000 CPUs from Intel. Let us know how long it takes for the Intels to arrive and how long for AMD.

That's so weird this is the case as AMD is basically a fabless company at this point and contracts out their manufacturing. I guess Apple and other SOC are eating up TSMC's 7nm fab capacity?

 

[a104375]

You know this is quite ironically funny, I never thought of it this way. PowerPC was RISC but they couldn't make it any faster and cooler to put in iMacs and laptops, so they switched to the more powerful intel, then Apple went to make a phone and needed a smaller RISC chip which grew more powerful for iPads which grew so powerful that is going to replace 2021 Intel Chips...

The problem they had they created its own solution unconsciously and went completely full circle, I wonder what IBM is thinking🤣
Its even more ironic that Apple of them all is not a chip manufacturer in the first place, they are a software company but beat intel, AMD, ARM, and IBM #EvilInside🤣🤣

That's what I was thinking, it's definitely ironically funny. I'm really curious where PowerPC would have ended up if they had stuck with it, as well as what a PowerPC would have looked like today.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

I guess Apple and other SOC are eating up TSMC's 7nm fab capacity?

According to AMD it's not TSMC's fault. It seems to have been their own fault. Also, don't forget TSMC is handling 7nm for them. There's also 12nm for IO which is with Global Foundries (New York?). But all of that is at current capacity. Imagine what would happen if every data center in the world suddenly goes AMD...

TSMC should have more capacity for 7nm later this year when Apple goes 5nm with the A14, which will most likely be the CPU in their new Macs. Currently the the 5nm fab is running in risk production. I guess Apple is waiting for them to switch to volume production, hence no new official announcements for hardware yet.

 

[smoledman]

Well, Intel has no other choice at the moment. With their competition stepping up to the plate, they have to continue support and try to save face.

You realize Apple Silicon ****s AMD up too? Now there is no hope for a Ryzen Mac.

 

[0128672]

Intel issued a follow-up statement via its spokesperson saying it hopes to spend more time with its family and asks for privacy during this difficult transition.

 

[nordique]

The damage to Intel is not necessarily the loss of Apple's immediate business. But the long-term, cumulative effect of a growing movement away from x86, and the industry's reliance on Intel as a whole.

that will depend on how arm and windows support goes down in the future

Microsoft has already shown their interest in arm support - with their surface x line. Microsoft is already thinking forward by getting ARM support ready for Apple and their own devices that will likely also make the switch

but it will depend on other manufacturers doing that too, as it’s really third parties that drive the intel and amd business and they are collectively the largest vendors. They won’t be buying apples or Microsoft’s arm silicon. I don’t see Asus and Lenovo and dell making their own arm chips any time soon. And amd gets a lot of revenue from game consoles, which will be x86 for another decade - gaming is what drives the general consumer tech envelope as well and early processor adoption

To that end, intel and amd have more than enough business elsewhere

Apple will certainly shake up the industry but it remains to be seen how this will affect intel and amd in the long run. We don’t know today and can’t predict that yet, but over the next few years this won’t affect their bottom lines much
[automerge]1593295115[/automerge]

You realize Apple Silicon ****s AMD up too? Now there is no hope for a Ryzen Mac.

that’s fine. What purpose would Ryzen have in Macs? The main attraction would have been cheaper prices. Apples chips will have all the advantages of amd chips and then some

power draw and battery are going to be the big ones

 

[cmaier]

that will depend on how arm and windows support goes down in the future

Microsoft has already shown their interest in arm support - with their surface x line. Microsoft is already thinking forward by getting ARM support ready for Apple and their own devices that will likely also make the switch

but it will depend on other manufacturers doing that too, as it’s really third parties that drive the intel and amd business and they are collectively the largest vendors. They won’t be buying apples or Microsoft’s arm silicon. I don’t see Asus and Lenovo and dell making their own arm chips any time soon. And amd gets a lot of revenue from game consoles, which will be x86 for another decade - gaming is what drives the general consumer tech envelope as well and early processor adoption

To that end, intel and amd have more than enough business elsewhere

Apple will certainly shake up the industry but it remains to be seen how this will affect intel and amd in the long run. We don’t know today and can’t predict that yet, but over the next few years this won’t affect their bottom lines much
[automerge]1593295115[/automerge]


that’s fine. What purpose would Ryzen have in Macs? The main attraction would have been cheaper prices. Apples chips will have all the advantages of amd chips and then some

power draw and battery are going to be the big ones

At some point this all hurts both intel and amd because some clever PC company is going to get the idea that differentiation instead of commodity cpus makes sense for them,too.

 

[KPOM]

At some point this all hurts both intel and amd because some clever PC company is going to get the idea that differentiation instead of commodity cpus makes sense for them,too.

But only if there is an OS to run it. Will Windows for ARM be right for that PC?
[automerge]1593297426[/automerge]

ARM isn’t a company Intel can buy... it’s a type of processor architecture that many companies are using.

ARM is owned by a consortium led by SoftBank in Japan. Intel actually does have a license to design ARM-based chips.

 

[cmaier]

But only if there is an OS to run it. Will Windows for ARM be right for that PC?
[automerge]1593297426[/automerge]

ARM is owned by a consortium led by SoftBank in Japan. Intel actually does have a license to design ARM-based chips.

Microsoft will fill that gap. They'll sell windows for tuna sandwiches if it earns them more income.

 

[ivnj]

So the MacBook Pro my dad bought only 2 years ago is obsolete now when arm machines come out? 11 will be the last os for it?

 

[DimaVR]

So the MacBook Pro my dad bought only 2 years ago is obsolete now when arm machines come out? 11 will be the last os for it?

No

 

[ian87w]

So the MacBook Pro my dad bought only 2 years ago is obsolete now when arm machines come out? 11 will be the last os for it?

Apple stated 2 years transition, and Apple tend to support up to -2 versions of macOS.
Based on PPC to intel transition, PPC Macs were still supported up to Snow Leopard. Presuming this and the -2 support, your intel Mac should at least be supported up to 2024, if not longer.

 

[MauiPa]

So the MacBook Pro my dad bought only 2 years ago is obsolete now when arm machines come out? 11 will be the last os for it?

Huh? That makes no sense. Apple supports its hardware for years. Don’t listen to the haters, your dad will have at least 5 years of updates. Maybe longer unless technology moves to make the cpu obsolete

 

[Solomani]

Don't be surprised if this relationship deteriorated rapidly, especially when silicon units start shipping from Apple.

It's a transactional relationship. It's just business. Apple paid them money, they delivered Intel chips for Apple machines.

I don't know why it should get any more ugly. The only thing that could make it ugly is if one side (like Apple) suddenly breaks a years-long contract purchase agreement in order to sever ties. Breaking contracts usually means massive lawsuits in court, and then it gets ugly fast.

But it's fine if Apple simply said "We don't want to renew the contract when it expires. We're done ordering our chips from you, we have found a better supplier.... ourselves."

 

[v3rlon]

So the MacBook Pro my dad bought only 2 years ago is obsolete now when arm machines come out? 11 will be the last os for it?

how is your 2 year old MacBook obsolete now when the new architecture isn’t even out yet?

if you are worried that it will be outdated eventually, well that is inevitable. The computers coming in 2028 will be obsolete eventually.

You computer should be able to do everything it did when you bought it. It will still be able to do that 10 years from now. YOUR needs may change, but the computer will not.

And if you think Macs devalue quickly, feel free to explore other brands. At two years old, a windows or Linux laptop is something you give to your computer illiterate inlaws to check email and watch cat videos. At 6,even they would be insulted.

sheesh. Everyone wants Apple to include the latest and greatest while not actually advancing and outclassing their current system. You can’t have it both ways.

 

[ivnj]

New systems silicone systems are coming end of the year I saw on the website. It won't be too long however. This year or next year when silicone Mac are out that will outdated even my 2014 Mac mini. Because intel software won't run on apple silicone OS. Like ppc on intel with rosetta they have a similar system for intel to silicone. But that will only last 1 or 2 years and then it will all be silicone. Intel will be obsolete.

 

[Macbookprodude]

Huh? That makes no sense. Apple supports its hardware for years. Don’t listen to the haters, your dad will have at least 5 years of updates. Maybe longer unless technology moves to make the cpu obsolete

Actually, this is not correct. Apple is on course to eliminate Intel as it did PPC. so, within the next 3 years or less Intel will be history. Sorry, but your statement shows no merit without any sources.

 

[Macbookprodude]

New systems silicone systems are coming end of the year I saw on the website. It won't be too long however. This year or next year when silicone Mac are out that will outdated even my 2014 Mac mini. Because intel software won't run on apple silicone OS. Like ppc on intel with rosetta they have a similar system for intel to silicone. But that will only last 1 or 2 years and then it will all be silicone. Intel will be obsolete.

Apple Silicone = POWERPC on steroids.