iOS 13.4 and macOS 10.15.4 Prevent FaceTime Calls From Working With Some Older iPhones and iPads Amid Pandemic

[Smoovejayy]

Spoken exactly like someone who doesn't understand software development. "Planned Obsolense" is largely a conspiracy theory, nothing more. When you add new features and functionally and security fixes some older hardware has to be left behind, you can't support the old stuff forever and those older models are pretty old.

This isn't "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" frankly, its sad that's the first place you went. Reality is closer to "a change was made for <bug fix, security, etc> and either broke something by accident, or simply isn't compatible with older hardware.

Nothing more.

This. Thank you.

I don't think it was intentional from Apple, but nevertheless you can't continue supporting old hardware. If that were the case we'd never make any advancements in technology!

 

[quatermass]

Having spent decades working in R&D, Legacy testing was one of the first checks we performed. If we got new features, that was great - but if we couldn't support Legacy; it was a no-go.

Define Legacy, as in, how many years/versions back would still qualify?

 

[Kabeyun]

They’ll fix it. No need to go apoplectic, as expected.

 

[mi7chy]

Another essential app in addition to Safari that need to be unbundled from iOS updates so they can be updated independently through app store. How it's done now is clearly design for obsolescence.

 

[mdnz]

Spoken exactly like someone who doesn't understand software development. "Planned Obsolense" is largely a conspiracy theory, nothing more. When you add new features and functionally and security fixes some older hardware has to be left behind, you can't support the old stuff forever and those older models are pretty old.

This isn't "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" frankly, its sad that's the first place you went. Reality is closer to "a change was made for <bug fix, security, etc> and either broke something by accident, or simply isn't compatible with older hardware.

Nothing more.

I'd say the "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" goes a bit too far but they most certainly do stuff that is quite questionable. A good example of this is Night Shift, it only works on certain newer Macs while f.lux works on every Mac. Another one that comes to mind is the making of photos in the dark on the iPhone 11. There's an app on the App Store that does exactly the same and works on almost every iPhone. You and me will probably figure out we can just download the apps, but the average Joe will buy a new phone or Mac if he wants features like that.

 

[Cybbe]

It's irresponsible of you as a child if you allow your parents to keep using outdated and un-updated technology.

That's a ridiculous take. An old iPad may have worked perfectly well even if no longer updated. If Apple for some reason decides to make a service obsolete, it should at least give ample warning for reasons such as this.

 

[ouimetnick]

Sad to see the fanboys in full force. If it wasn’t intentional then let those who updated to iOS 13.4 roll back to a previous build, or release a special update to iOS 9.

Actually when you think about it, Apple does remove features from older devices they no longer support making them less useful than the day you bought them. My Apple TV 1st gen no longer can accessthe iTunes Store to rent or buy any movies. It no longer can access YouTube. Both of those features were advertised when the Apple TV was sold..

I’m not expecting support for 13 year old technology (1st gen Apple TV) just pointing out that it can no longer do what it did the day it was purchased. If all you wanted to do was watch 720p videos, the 13 year old hardware can do that fine, but it can’t access anything besides content on the internal hard drive.

 

[urnotl33t]

Spoken exactly like someone who doesn't understand software development. "Planned Obsolense" is largely a conspiracy theory, nothing more. When you add new features and functionally and security fixes some older hardware has to be left behind, you can't support the old stuff forever and those older models are pretty old.

This isn't "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" frankly, its sad that's the first place you went. Reality is closer to "a change was made for <bug fix, security, etc> and either broke something by accident, or simply isn't compatible with older hardware.

Nothing more.

Yet Skype continues to work juuuuust fine.... hmm. And webex... and zoom... and...

I love my Apple bits, too. But Apple lost the “majority rule” game long ago. They increasingly are the minority. This further alienates them. This is the same path that made them obsolete in the 1990s. They literally are killing themselves, again.

Sure, we don’t want the Microsoft-a-like backward compatibility cruft just for sake of backward compatibility; you do have to cut it somewhere. However, these devices and software aren’t THAT old! This reeks of arrogance and ignorance on their part. Just as it did in the 1980s and 1990s.

No average iPhone owner knows of FaceTime, Apple Pay, iWork apps, iCloud photo sharing, Apple Music, and iCloud Drive/Files. None. All they know is Facebook, Spotify, Skype/Zoom, PayPal, Venmo, and the Notes app. They don’t know they can share Notes with other people. They don’t know about Group FaceTime, they don’t know about iCloud photos...

Apple lost the mindshare game. They briefly had it with iPhone 4 and 4S days. Then other services came in with a vengeance. And won. The first FaceTime compatibility flaw (the BS “certificate expired” excuse) is when Apple lost it. They were never forgiven, and us nerds told those users “just use Skype instead”, which also worked with Android. The VirnetX lawsuit was the final nail to FaceTime. Apple had to break FaceTime to get around their obvious patent infringement issue. Apple never came back from that.

Again, speaking for “the average iPhone user”. This means your aunt, your niece, your nephew’s friend‘s dad, your coworker and his dad, etc. Us nerds and Apple aficionados know and we try to spread the word, but your kid’s school is using Google Meet instead of Group FaceTime. Your cousin uses Venmo and PayPal instead of Apple Pay Cash. Your nephew uses Google Docs instead of iWork. All your friends use Facebook instead of iCloud photos.

And all for very very good reasons. c.f. This entire thread. QED.

 

[Tech198]

I'll just say it before someone else does. People will argue that Apple is trying to force people to upgrade hardware by degrading the performance and functionality of older models.

I wasn't thinking that

 

[mariusignorello]

I’m betting it’s a bug. Give them a chance to fix it. They’re usually good about doing it fast.

Some of you look for every opportunity to rake Apple over the coals and not allow them to correct their mistakes.

 

[CrzyP]

Oops

 

[eisejm]

I've been having issues connecting and awful echo issues when doing a Facetime session with 2 others. Not sure if anyone else is experiencing the echo issues too?

 

[mariusignorello]

Yet Skype continues to work juuuuust fine.... hmm. And webex... and zoom... and...

I love my Apple bits, too. But Apple lost the “majority rule” game long ago. They increasingly are the minority. This further alienates them. This is the same path that made them obsolete in the 1990s. They literally are killing themselves, again.

Sure, we don’t want the Microsoft-a-like backward compatibility cruft just for sake of backward compatibility; you do have to cut it somewhere. However, these devices and software aren’t THAT old! This reeks of arrogance and ignorance on their part. Just as it did in the 1980s and 1990s.

No average iPhone owner knows of FaceTime, Apple Pay, iWork apps, iCloud photo sharing, Apple Music, and iCloud Drive/Files. None. All they know is Facebook, Spotify, Skype/Zoom, PayPal, Venmo, and the Notes app. They don’t know they can share Notes with other people. They don’t know about Group FaceTime, they don’t know about iCloud photos...

Apple lost the mindshare game. They briefly had it with iPhone 4 and 4S days. Then other services came in with a vengeance. And won. The first FaceTime compatibility flaw (the BS “certificate expired” excuse) is when Apple lost it. They were never forgiven, and us nerds told those users “just use Skype instead”, which also worked with Android. The VirnetX lawsuit was the final nail to FaceTime. Apple had to break FaceTime to get around their obvious patent infringement issue. Apple never came back from that.

Again, speaking for “the average iPhone user”. This means your aunt, your niece, your nephew’s friend‘s dad, your coworker and his dad, etc. Us nerds and Apple aficionados know and we try to spread the word, but your kid’s school is using Google Meet instead of Group FaceTime. Your cousin uses Venmo and PayPal instead of Apple Pay Cash. Your nephew uses Google Docs instead of iWork. All your friends use Facebook instead of iCloud photos.

And all for very very good reasons. c.f. This entire thread. QED.

Ok well how about you call up Tim and tell him to close up shop because “Apple is doomed” yet again. Remarks like this never get old.
[automerge]1585752990[/automerge]

I'd say the "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" goes a bit too far but they most certainly do stuff that is quite questionable. A good example of this is Night Shift, it only works on certain newer Macs while f.lux works on every Mac. Another one that comes to mind is the making of photos in the dark on the iPhone 11. There's an app on the App Store that does exactly the same and works on almost every iPhone. You and me will probably figure out we can just download the apps, but the average Joe will buy a new phone or Mac if he wants features like that.

Software features are not the same as hardware features. Supporting something at the hardware level often makes the integration much deeper and more stable than a software layer.
[automerge]1585753177[/automerge]

macOS 15.4 is breaking so many of my apps due to signature issues, I had to revert back to 15.3

Your app’s developers are responsible for the proper notarization of their apps, not Apple. Apple warned developers about this quite some time ago and even gave extensions.

 

[Zaft]

Viber, Skype, whatsapp, Facebook messenger.

there are other ways of doing video chat

 

[Amazing Iceman]

If my mother had my old iPad3, then I don't deserve my mother.
Why some people dump their trash to their parents, I don't understand.

 

[now i see it]

based on how Apple pushes hard to discourage anyone from using iOS 9, this latest development is expected. If enough people moan about it, they'll probably rescind the restriction and call it a "bug", but my guess it's not and was hard coded intentionally (before the CoV fiasco)

 

[mi7chy]

If my mother had my old iPad3, then I don't deserve my mother.
Why some people dump their trash to their parents, I don't understand.

No excuse for shoddy testing and lack of proper disclosure. Apple shouldn't prey on seniors and force them buy a new device for something basic that's been around since 2010 plus Google Hangouts video calls still work fine on iPad 2 so no excuse for Apple.

 

[DblHelix]

Who cares. Who is on 4 year old software which would mean they are on a 6+ year old device or just stupid. Too many security issues.

 

[one more]

A pity, of course, but with so many similar services out there (WhatsApp, Facebook Messenger, Skype, Zoom, etc.) I guess we should manage.

 

[chrono1081]

Yet Skype continues to work juuuuust fine.... hmm. And webex... and zoom... and...

These literally have nothing to do with anything. Do you think all video apps work the same? They don't.

 

[itsmaxk]

During the public beta, I reported this issue to Apple. It also effects older MacOS machines being able to connect with FaceTime and Remote Desktop.
This has stopped me from being able to help my aging mother who can not use an iPad and can not afford a new computer.

Apple needs to step up their regression testing.

 

[bsolar]

Spoken exactly like someone who doesn't understand software development. "Planned Obsolense" is largely a conspiracy theory, nothing more. When you add new features and functionally and security fixes some older hardware has to be left behind, you can't support the old stuff forever and those older models are pretty old.

This might be true, but a breaking change like this should be clearly documented and should warrant a new major version increment. Assuming it's not simply a bug of course.

 

[Seanm87]

Not being funny but if you're still using an iPhone 4s its time to move on.

 

[H2SO4]

Spoken exactly like someone who doesn't understand software development. "Planned Obsolense" is largely a conspiracy theory, nothing more. When you add new features and functionally and security fixes some older hardware has to be left behind, you can't support the old stuff forever and those older models are pretty old.

This isn't "Apple wants you to buy new hardware during the pandemic!" frankly, its sad that's the first place you went. Reality is closer to "a change was made for <bug fix, security, etc> and either broke something by accident, or simply isn't compatible with older hardware.

Nothing more.

No it's not.
Planned obselence is real. It's the degree to which it is employed that makes the difference. I remember a company that I used to work for deliberately pushed up the price of the old hardware when the new items came out.
They want to reduce support and production costs and therefore, (understandably), phase out the old. This is a conscious decision, not one taken by chance. They plan miles ahead for how long to support. Some companies look to gen 3 before Gen 2 is even out.
They may not specifically have planned this for the pandemic but they sure as sh** planned when to give up on the old and what to take away to 'encourage', migration to new.
What are you on about man?

 

[Rainshadow]

I’m usually for making certain that we maintain all old hardware... and Apple is far above the competition on this. I do hope this is just a bug.

But... really, a 5 year old OS? Just update the software instead of whining. If you can’t update anymore cause the device is not compatible... then your phone is entirely too old. Seriously. how old must a phone be to not be compatible with iOS 10?