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Two years ago, we said the same thing. iOS 6 sucked then and people wanted to stick with 4 or 5

Nope, given that the biggest difference between iOS7+ and pre-iOS7 is the appearance (in addition to the not-that-visible functionality enhancements / additions). That's what caused the most "I'd like to stay with"-uproar with many users. In the iOS6 times, there were far-far less "I want to downgrade" posts than with iOS7.

(This doesn't take into account the posts posted by people that wanted to downgrade because of crippled performance.)

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Of course, the developers are hardly interested in the users not caring about the app store

Not necessarily. While pre-iOS7 users aren't giving me much income, I still put a lot of emphasis on the compatibility of my iOS apps in my ads / business stuff, all the time explaining it's compatible with even iOS4.0 and can run practically on any armv7 device. (Excluding the iPad1 and the 3GS running on iOS3, obviously.)

That is, there can be business reasons for supporting old OS versions, even if there isn't much money in those users.
 
You certainly should. That thing is so old it's probably breathing it's last breath before the pearly gates. :p

Exactly, no point in finishing it off with an update it cannot properly handle - the exciting iOS 8 features wouldn't even be available on such an old device anyway, another reason not to upgrade.
 
I'll anticipate and prepare myself. I'll install iOS 8 on all my devices now so that when ios 9 is out, I'll brag about me rocking iOS 8!

I guarantee 100% others will say exactly this. I'll message you when it happens haha :D

I can see it now: "Still proudly on iOS 8.3.2" lol
 
CDM... Sales since mid september, versus installed based. Could go to 25%. But. in all case it is not anywhere near 68% (BTW, I meant 20% of 100%, not 20% of 68%... Hope that helps :).

I could flip back and ask, why the affirmation that IOS 8 machines are mostly new ones? Seems that affirmation is a lot more outrageous than mine isn't it?
I didnt make any statements one way or another, just wanted to see where the numbers came from. Seems like they are basically guesses.

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I sorta knew that ;) Just saying that this might not be the best statistics on iOS 8 usage as I'm guessing a lot of people who got a new i-unit for Xmas is still browsing the App Store to find stuff they want :)
They are quite for what they are actually for--developers to give them a good idea of what the breakdown is as far as people who use the App Store and get/update apps. That's what the stats are primarily for.
 
Nope, given that the biggest difference between iOS7+ and pre-iOS7 is the appearance (in addition to the not-that-visible functionality enhancements / additions). That's what caused the most "I'd like to stay with"-uproar with many users. In the iOS6 times, there were far-far less "I want to downgrade" posts than with iOS7.

(This doesn't take into account the posts posted by people that wanted to downgrade because of crippled performance.)



I was talking about:
"I love iOS 6 and am afraid that without Steve Jobs and Scott Forstall we will never have an iOS that is as good as 6 again. Luckily I have my ipod touch (it's actually running iOS5 because I didn't want the ad-free youtube app to go away)."

I don't understand why you people put so much love on Steve Jobs and Scott Forstall. They were great innovators but they weren't perfect. iOS 6 had it's share of bugs and performance hiccups even though you didn't see them. Every OS had problems.
Remember, iOS 6 was apperently 'boring' and 'uninspired'. It was lambasted on these forums for being an example of how stale Apple had become. Anybody that dared to defend iOS 6 was deemed the most rotten of fanboys- people like them were the reason that Apple wasn't moving forward. As long as people were okay with iOS not changing, Apple wasn't going to do anything drastic. Well, except for removing the YouTube app, that was uncool. They did make their own Maps app that couldn't match up with Google Maps yet and was buggy enough for Tim Cook to write an apology letter (one which Scott Forstall was too immature to sign).
And here we are in 2014, a time when iOS 6 is suddenly hailed as a work of art. Sure, iOS 6 didn't have the visual change, but at least it was stable. Not that anybody cared how stable it was back in 2012, but it's sure convenient to bring that up now, isn't it?
iOS 6 had issues. iOS 7 had issues. iOS 8 has issues. iOS 9 will have issues. Ditto for past, present, and future versions of OS X. Think about how people are reacting to OS X Yosemite. This was also happening with OS X Leopard, both of which had UI changes.
As more and more people buy Apple products, more and more people will have issues, and they'll be more heavily reported in the press.
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/05/marco-arment_n_6416540.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

I read this two days ago. The writer thinks Apple software is in decline.

Be sure to read the follow-on to that post: What it’s like to be way too popular for a day - Marco.org:

Marco Arment said:
"Instead of what was intended to be constructive criticism of the most influential company in my life, I handed the press more poorly written fuel to hamfistedly stab Apple with my name and reputation behind it. And my name will be on that forever.

Had I known that it would go as far as it did, I never would have written it.

FWIW, I agree with the premise of his initial assessment and also his subsequent post (linked above).

What's paticularly meaningful about that writer's opinion?

Marco is a well known Mac and iOS developer. He created Instapaper and The Magazine and co-created Tumblr, which you may have heard of.
 
Same here…. not sure why anyone would stay on iOS7 at this point??? We have iOS8 on an iPhone 5, 6 and iPad II with no issues on any of them.

I get the impression there's a very vocal minority that wants to just trash on anything Apple without any merit behind their rants.

Safari negates any comments like this. Safari is complete garbage. I've never used a browser, mobile or otherwise, that crashed, couldn't handle video, has audio dropouts, constantly reloads pages even with only two open and doesn't respond to user input until the page is scrolled up or down at least once. iOS 8 is a buggy mess that still shouldn't be public. Even on my 6 Plus is maddening how terrible it is, and the iPhones lack of RAM is really starting to show because it appears that the entire OS has memory leaks everywhere and it impacts performance. You are two peas in a pod, people like you come out of the woodwork and say people are making things up because you don't have a problem. That's called being a hypocrite. If I could put iOS 7 on my 6 Plus I'd do it right now and when I had my 5S I waited too late to downgrade. Apple FORCES people to stay on updates so they can make boasts like this, they absolutely do not care about customer experiences being positive otherwise they wouldn't refuse to let people go back to an iOS version they liked. iOS 8 is crap all around and it's full of bugs that drive me up the wall. It shouldn't be public because Apple has failed to do proper QA on iOS for at least three versions now.

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Those are security issues that have affected literally every OS that's ever been made public or for sale, not a slight on iOS 7 specifically. The other iMessage problem is a service issue, not an OS issue. iOS 8 is full of stupid bugs that Apple aren't fixing, a lot of them that require a restart to stop from happening. I don't use Safari when I don't have to, I'm tired of having Control Center refuse to work on my lock screen, I'm tired of the color of the status bar icons being white on my white background when I close an app, I'm tired of the keyboard not responding sometimes, and I am SICK of the OS making it blatantly clear that Apple refuses to put an adequate amount of RAM in an $800 smartphone. The lack of RAM is starting to really show in iOS 8 and Apple didn't find it important to properly hide that idiotic and cheap limitation from the user. It's become offensively apparent that they'd rather save a buck of a much needed component to make their profit margins higher and it's affecting the user experience in a negative way. If the next iPhone doesn't have at minimum 2gb of RAM and Apple properly writes the OS to make it transparent to the user when it hits the RAM wall then I won't be an iPhone owner anymore. I'm tired of paying premium prices for an experience that's as far from premium as can get. I never had those issues with iOS 7 in its most up to date form.

iOS 8 has made my iPad 3 behave as if its an iPad 1. Apple refuses to let me downgrade to iOS 7 where its sluggishness was tolerable. iOS 8 is a garbage update and I won't buy another iPad because they've made it clear that they want you to buy a $500-700 device and have it useable for only two to three years with no way to go back to a software version you liked/that worked if you decide to try out the newest one. I'm sick of them forcing bad experience on their customers so that they can put pie charts on a screen at conferences.

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iOS 8 is running smoothly for the most part now. Most of the bugs I get are from old 3rd party applications that haven't been updated yet.

Otherwise the only annoying things are that sometimes the screen just won't register my touch for a minute or two, sometimes Control Center won't come up, sometimes when I open the camera app the camera won't start up for a minute.

Your second paragraph sounds like the exact opposite of running smoothly. That sounds to me like it's not running at all for significant chunks of time and that's completely unacceptable no matter how often it does or doesn't happen.

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Gee thanks for signing up just to post that.....and you say that iOS 8 on iP6+ is the worst? What other OS's have you tried on iPhone 6 Plus? Tell us please? My experience is completely different. Tell us about everything that's been going on with your iPhone 6 Plus with iOS 8? I'm waiting...

Saying it's the worst isn't a comparison of that OS to another one running on their phone. Jesus, I swear you people come out of the woodwork just to defend and inanimate object without even bothering to try to understand the words written on your screen.

My experience is completely different

Oh, so that means that ANYONE that says otherwise deserves this kind of stupid response? I've had nothing but issues that shouldn't exist on my 6 Plus, are you going to have some smart ass response to me now? You going to tell me I'm a liar and that there's no way that I could EVER have a different experience than you?

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I always saw this as a not-enough-memory issue. The more images are on a page the worse it gets and don't even think of how it performs with tons of animated gifs. It got worse on my iPad 3 with iOS 8 but it was already bad with iOS 7.

That same happens with Safari in Yosemite. Try loading up reddit with RES enabled and select show all images. It becomes completely unusable after three pages are loaded. Same thing in Chrome doesn't happen. Safari is just not good and borderline broken depending on what you use it for.

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Giving users a choice isn't a bad thing, and giving half the chance, Apple would do this on the desktop if they wanted to. :eek:

I'm still running Mavericks and have no intention to upgrade to Yosemite because of bugs, and the only reason i have iOS8 is because i decided to upgrade because i liked extension support.... Realizing i can no longer go back would be *only* other reason for staying with iOS 8, otherwise if i wasn't happy, and i could go back, I would.

The jump to Yosemite is very tame compared to the one between iOS 7 and iOS 8. I upgraded the day it came out and the only bug I've seen besides Safari being an utter waste of time is that the Messages window acts a bit weird when you try to reply to a message right after you get it. It moves the window to wherever you click after it doesn't respond. Other than that Yosemite is actually a great upgrade. Just stay away from safari.

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Actually Apple is the only company really supporting 3+ years old hardware with the new software.

And when you find out the experience is complete garbage, Apple refuses to let YOU change the software on YOUR device that YOU paid for back to a version that works the way YOU want it to. The only course of action they give you is to buy new hardware, or you put up with their updates crippling YOUR device. Apple supports older things by breaking them and then refusing to let you fix it. I'm not happy with a company that won't let me fix what they broke on something I bought. To argue against that and say Apple is doing everyone a favor is quite frankly incredibly stupid.

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I don't understand why you people put so much love on Steve Jobs and Scott Forstall. They were great innovators but they weren't perfect.

No, they were great at stealing ideas and functionality and not giving any credit for their "inspirations" from other people. Those two stole many ideas from jailbreakers outright and gave no instance of credit for it. There's even a widely known term inside the Mac community about Apple taking peoples ideas and presenting them as their own and it's known as being "Sherlock'd". They were not innovators when it came to software and the iOS developer community knows that at any time Apple will take their idea/app functionality and integrate it into their OS without any credit being given.
 
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Using iOS x-1 with older iOS devices makes sense. People with the latest or next to latest models however usually have no valid reason to keep an out-of-date OS.

If you only speak about 2+ years old devices, yes....
I can't understand people keeping an iPad Air under iOS 7.1 for instance.

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All I know is...

If I could roll my original iPad minis back to 7, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Since moving to 8 (I wanted to use third party keyboards that changed their key legends from upper to lowercase), Safari reloads even more than before, with little warnings at the top about having to do so, and animations stutter just a bit.

Screen rotation is not reliable at all now. Battery life is down, too.

Worse, sometimes while browsing, my 3G model will crash back to the homescreen, but without icons. It will only display the wallpaper for about ten seconds, then pop up a "no SIM installed" warning and finally display app icons. It's like a mini-reboot.

It's almost like 8 wasn't really tested on these devices.

I still love my minis, but they're no way near as reliable and smooth.

With a quick test I realized iOS 8 takes about 60-80 Mb more RAM compared with iOS 7.
On a 512 Mb device that could be a problem.
 
Quoted from a person with enough common sense:

"People around here have very short memories. Apple in year "X" has lost its way, can't make innovative products, and is only concerned about profits. Then when year "Y" comes around, year "X" was when Apple made awesome products, focused on having a great user experience, and was well ahead of its competitors.

Remember, iOS 6 was boring and uninspired. It was lambasted on these forums for being an example of how stale Apple had become. Anybody that dared to defend iOS 6 was deemed the most rotten of fanboys- people like them were the reason that Apple wasn't moving forward. As long as people were okay with iOS not changing, Apple wasn't going to do anything drastic. Well, except for removing the YouTube app. Apple was so "petty" and "juvenile" that they removed the YouTube app and made their own crappy Maps app that couldn't match up with Google Maps.

And here we are in 2014, a time when iOS 6 is suddenly hailed as a work of art. Sure, iOS 6 didn't have many new features, but at least it was stable. Not that anybody cared how stable it was back in 2012, but it's sure convenient to bring that up now, isn't it?

iOS 6 had issues. iOS 7 had issues. iOS 8 has issues. iOS 9 will have issues. Ditto for past, present, and future versions of OS X. As more and more people buy Apple products, more and more people will have issues, and they'll be more heavily reported in the press.

In my opinion, people should spend less time worrying about the issues that other people are having and start asking themselves if Apple products are working for them. If so, what's the issue? If not, maybe it's time to find products that meet their needs."
That's so true.
I remember people here whining and screaming about how bad iOS 7 was. The same people today are blaming iOS 8 as the end of the world and want to roll back to the glorious iOS 7. The same users that defined iOS 6 as an archaic os and then, after iOS 7 release, were complaining about how better iOS 6 was....
It's macrumors forum, after all....
 
That's so true.
I remember people here whining and screaming about how bad iOS 7 was. The same people today are blaming iOS 8 as the end of the world and want to roll back to the glorious iOS 7. The same users that defined iOS 6 as an archaic os and then, after iOS 7 release, were complaining about how better iOS 6 was....
It's macrumors forum, after all....

I think everyone is missing the point. Apple REFUSES to let people downgrade. Even if the experience is something they don't like, or in the case of iOS 8 being a legitimately buggy POS, Apple simply refuses to let people do something as simple as install an OS they like on a device they bought. I really like my Apple products, I don't like having them slap me in the face and refuse to let me use my device how I see fit. Apple used to be customer friendly, now they are getting more and more hostile. I didn't pay Apple $500 to rent my iPad from them and let them dictate something as simple as deciding what OS I want to run. They need to stop that kind of crap NOW or I won't be their customer for much longer. I don't like being told that my $500 iPad and my $800 iPhone can't run the software version I want. And I'm not even talking about trying to run an unsupported OS, there's literally no justifiable reason that I can't revert my iPad back to iOS 7 where it was at least tolerable. iOS 8 has ruined all performance on my $500 iPad 3 and Apple sees fit to tell me that I'm not allowed to run iOS 7 on it if I want. That's complete ******** and that's where most people are having an issue. Software is buggy, but I shouldn't be forced to have a terrible experience because Apple wants to take childish jabs at Android over adoption numbers. I don't care how their business is doing, I didn't buy an iPad to make their numbers look better and I'd appreciate it if they'd treat me like a customer instead of someone they feel like they should abuse for bragging rights.

There is zero credible or logical defense of Apple refusing to allow people to downgrade to a previous OS that is available to a device. None. Anyone that argues that they should be allowed to do this is quite frankly an idiot.
 
I think everyone is missing the point. Apple REFUSES to let people downgrade. Even if the experience is something they don't like, or in the case of iOS 8 being a legitimately buggy POS, Apple simply refuses to let people do something as simple as install an OS they like on a device they bought. I really like my Apple products, I don't like having them slap me in the face and refuse to let me use my device how I see fit. Apple used to be customer friendly, now they are getting more and more hostile. I didn't pay Apple $500 to rent my iPad from them and let them dictate something as simple as deciding what OS I want to run. They need to stop that kind of crap NOW or I won't be their customer for much longer. I don't like being told that my $500 iPad and my $800 iPhone can't run the software version I want. And I'm not even talking about trying to run an unsupported OS, there's literally no justifiable reason that I can't revert my iPad back to iOS 7 where it was at least tolerable. iOS 8 has ruined all performance on my $500 iPad 3 and Apple sees fit to tell me that I'm not allowed to run iOS 7 on it if I want. That's complete ******** and that's where most people are having an issue. Software is buggy, but I shouldn't be forced to have a terrible experience because Apple wants to take childish jabs at Android over adoption numbers. I don't care how their business is doing, I didn't buy an iPad to make their numbers look better and I'd appreciate it if they'd treat me like a customer instead of someone they feel like they should abuse for bragging rights.

There is zero credible or logical defense of Apple refusing to allow people to downgrade to a previous OS that is available to a device. None. Anyone that argues that they should be allowed to do this is quite frankly an idiot.
Apple has reasons to enforce its policy about downgrades, and numbers demonstrate they are going well. No reason to call idiots everyone that just think that your calling iOS 8 a POS is just another forum bs.....
Don't like Apple's policy? Just buy something else, and you'll be happy to tell us how terrific is update world on the other side.....
 
I take great pleasure still being on iOS 7.1.2. I will never put the garbage that is iOS 8 on my iPhone 5S.

Still rockin iOS 6 on my iPad 3, too. Will never upgrade that either.

Yeah, me too. I doubt that the Q/A will improve for the newer versions of the OS.
 
That's so true.
I remember people here whining and screaming about how bad iOS 7 was. The same people today are blaming iOS 8 as the end of the world and want to roll back to the glorious iOS 7. The same users that defined iOS 6 as an archaic os and then, after iOS 7 release, were complaining about how better iOS 6 was....
It's macrumors forum, after all....
To be fair it's not necessarily the same users. And even then, there were plenty not not like in iOS 7.0 which had stabilized and got much better in iOS 7.1 which then got destabilized for quite a few with iOS 8.0 and still can be to some degree wit iOS 8.1. As far as iOS 6 goes, there were certainly many complaining it's old, but it doesn't mean that any change to make it newer is automatically better, so when iOS 7.0 was out it's not hard to imagine that even those who wanted something newer than iOS 6 disliked what iOS 7 (or 7.0 in particular) was.
 
I take great pleasure still being on iOS 7.1.2. I will never put the garbage that is iOS 8 on my iPhone 5S.

Still rockin iOS 6 on my iPad 3, too. Will never upgrade that either.

Oh feeling a little bit paranoid, aren't we?
 
Apple has reasons to enforce its policy about downgrades,

No, they don't. There are ways to issue security updates for older OS versions but they won't do it like they should. There's no logical way you can defend their decision to force people to have a worse experience.

and numbers demonstrate they are going well.

Their OS adoption numbers make no account of the people that upgraded but want to go back down a version. They refuse to allow people to downgrade specifically so that they can make the claim that their adoption rates are higher. That's it. There's literally no other reason.

No reason to call idiots everyone that just think that your calling iOS 8 a POS is just another forum bs.....

That's no why I called them idiots, but that would require you to read the post you replied to. And calling that "BS" isn't true, if we go by your logic then we should all be calling "BS" on these numbers from Apple because they are in fact exactly that. They are not true numbers, they are marketing words that they won't quantify because the true numbers are not what they say they are. I can see a whole bunch of people here and other Mac forums saying they wouldn't hesitate to downgrade from iOS 8. iOS 8 is a buggy and broken product. Apple is getting worse and worse with iOS updates. That's fact.

Don't like Apple's policy? Just buy something else, and you'll be happy to tell us how terrific is update world on the other side.....

This is ridiculous at best. Telling someone to go to the other side and see how bad it is there is not a logical and rational rebuttal. Saying "well theirs is worse" is childish at best. I paid Apple a lot of money for a product, I expect them to treat me as a customer. I can't return the item after a year of ownership and their updates ruining the product and the experience. Come up with a better counterpoint than that because it doesn't have any weight to it.
 
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I guess I am the 4%, can't upgrade to iOS 8. Still using my iPhone 4 from 2010.

I have bought newer models, but they didn't feel like upgrades so I have given them away. I really like the build quality of iPhone 4 and it fits so perfectly in my hand. However, after four years the home button is not as responsive as it used to be.
 
I guess I am the 4%, can't upgrade to iOS 8. Still using my iPhone 4 from 2010.

I have bought newer models, but they didn't feel like upgrades so I have given them away. I really like the build quality of iPhone 4 and it fits so perfectly in my hand. However, after four years the home button is not as responsive as it used to be.

This graph includes only upgradable devices - you are not there)
 
This is ridiculous at best. Telling someone to go to the other side and see how bad it is there is not a logical and rational rebuttal. Saying "well theirs is worse" is childish at best. I paid Apple a lot of money for a product, I expect them to treat me as a customer. I can't return the item after a year of ownership and their updates ruining the product and the experience. Come up with a better counterpoint than that because it doesn't have any weight to it.

I absolutely agree with everything you stated. It's plain ridiculous to defend Apple by stating one needs to go elsewhere (Droid / WP / Jolla / BB / anything) if he isn't happy with the updates. These "arguments" just "forget" that one have already paid a LOT of money for a device that Apple, later, essentially rendered a paperweight, only giving the owner some three years of usage.

(The three years also applies to, say, the iPhone 3G, which faced exactly the same fate. The iPad 2 / Mini aren't exactly great under iOS8 either. And, of course, the also, back in 2010, super-expensive iPhone4 is rendered plain useless by iOS7...)

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To be fair it's not necessarily the same users. And even then, there were plenty not not like in iOS 7.0 which had stabilized and got much better in iOS 7.1

I wish the speed of iOS7.1.x were at least in the same ballpark as iOS6 on the iPhone4. For example, under iOS6, it "only" took 0.67s to bring up the dialer screen. In 7.1.x, it's 1.83s... and the latter is only "acceptable" vs the 7.0.x figure, which was 2.37s, that is, plain unacceptable. Talk about "Apple quality"...

That is, these "improvements" are only improvements compared to the 7.0.x figures, not those of earlier OS major versions.

More figures & source: https://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/10/ios71-makes-iphone4-snappier/
 
I don't have a problem with iOS 8 at all. On iPhone. It actually runs very well on my iPhone 6, not too many debilitating bugs (main one that comes to mind is the copy/paste bug in safari). Overall, I'm fairly pleased with iOS 8 on the iPhone. Not saying there aren't other bugs and slop, I'm just saying it is still satisfactory for me.

Now on the other hand, we have iOS 8 for iPad. It's horrible. Overall, it's very stuttery, has a boatload of UI glitches and artifacts, and did I mention STUTTERY? I have an iPad mini 2. It's an iPad Air, essentially. ONE YEAR OLD. I can easily make the thing drop to 15 fps. Go to a website, click on the URL bar (you can already see stutteriness just from that) now, split the keyboard and pull up the control center. Drag down the Notification Center. Initiate Siri. Navigate away using multitasking gestures. All of these stutter miserably.

Pretty much anything relating to the keyboard has stutter involved (rotating for example) splitting the keyboard, stutter. Control center/Notification center and keyboard, stutter.

Spotlight stutters when you pull it down, control center/notification center over spotlight. Don't even mention rotating with spotlight open.

Sending a message with keyboard still up, stutter.

The entire AppStore is a stuttery mess.

Anything involving some sort of window popping up from the bottom of the screen, like sharing something via messages from the sharesheet. It stutters.

Splitting the keyboard makes the non-letter keys (I.e return, shift) turn a strange dark gray (only during the transition of going from normal to split and vice versa) Using reduce transparency makes the keyboard click indicators disappear entirely. When a split keyboard pops up, it has a weird artifact, the area between the split keys is connected for a second by the usual translucent background to the keyboard.

For some reason, leaving apps after I've been using them awhile, particularly more intensive ones, it leaves in one big jerk and its terrible. I may be due for a reset all settings/restore, but this would be the second time I've done this due to lag on my iPad, and I'm sick of starting fresh all the time because of the nonstop issues.

Anyway, I think they could get away with leaving the iPhone version of iOS close to as-is, just fixing the obvious and apparent larger bugs, like the broken copy and paste in safari. What they really need to do is make iPad usable again. Yes, they sell more iPhones than iPads, but we will probably be seeing a new wave of iPad sales with iOS 9 as many users are still on the iPad 2, Apple should make sure they are satisfied, resulting in the customers to stick with them in the future, and possibly buy other Apple products.
 
No, they don't. There are ways to issue security updates for older OS versions but they won't do it like they should. There's no logical way you can defend their decision to force people to have a worse experience.



Their OS adoption numbers make no account of the people that upgraded but want to go back down a version. They refuse to allow people to downgrade specifically so that they can make the claim that their adoption rates are higher. That's it. There's literally no other reason.



That's no why I called them idiots, but that would require you to read the post you replied to. And calling that "BS" isn't true, if we go by your logic then we should all be calling "BS" on these numbers from Apple because they are in fact exactly that. They are not true numbers, they are marketing words that they won't quantify because the true numbers are not what they say they are. I can see a whole bunch of people here and other Mac forums saying they wouldn't hesitate to downgrade from iOS 8. iOS 8 is a buggy and broken product. Apple is getting worse and worse with iOS updates. That's fact.



This is ridiculous at best. Telling someone to go to the other side and see how bad it is there is not a logical and rational rebuttal. Saying "well theirs is worse" is childish at best. I paid Apple a lot of money for a product, I expect them to treat me as a customer. I can't return the item after a year of ownership and their updates ruining the product and the experience. Come up with a better counterpoint than that because it doesn't have any weight to it.
What I'm finding ridiculous is your complaining with that sense of superiority that permeate every single post. You don't like Apple? Vote with your wallet and buy something else.
Do you think you are any better than experienced marketing people working for the most successful company in the world? Apply for a job, if you are so smart they'll be happy to hire you.
If you are so smart, why didn't you wait a little more before upgrading your iDevice with the latest version of iOS ? There are many ways to actually test the latest iOS, even on older hardware, since in every Apple store/retailer you still can find an iPhone 5C or an iPad mini.
And give me a break please.... They are absolutely true numbers, because out of the hysteria in forums like this, there are millions of happy customers keep buying an Apple product after another, fully satisfied by their policy.

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I absolutely agree with everything you stated. It's plain ridiculous to defend Apple by stating one needs to go elsewhere (Droid / WP / Jolla / BB / anything) if he isn't happy with the updates. These "arguments" just "forget" that one have already paid a LOT of money for a device that Apple, later, essentially rendered a paperweight, only giving the owner some three years of usage.

(The three years also applies to, say, the iPhone 3G, which faced exactly the same fate. The iPad 2 / Mini aren't exactly great under iOS8 either. And, of course, the also, back in 2010, super-expensive iPhone4 is rendered plain useless by iOS7...)

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I wish the speed of iOS7.1.x were at least in the same ballpark as iOS6 on the iPhone4. For example, under iOS6, it "only" took 0.67s to bring up the dialer screen. In 7.1.x, it's 1.83s... and the latter is only "acceptable" vs the 7.0.x figure, which was 2.37s, that is, plain unacceptable. Talk about "Apple quality"...

That is, these "improvements" are only improvements compared to the 7.0.x figures, not those of earlier OS major versions.

More figures & source: https://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/10/ios71-makes-iphone4-snappier/

Again, why such a smart user like you upgraded his three years old device with the latest iOS without gave it a try first ?

Not to speak about the "dramatic" issue of a dialer screen that takes a whole 1" more on a 3+ years old device.....
Speaking about first world problems....

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I don't have a problem with iOS 8 at all. On iPhone. It actually runs very well on my iPhone 6, not too many debilitating bugs (main one that comes to mind is the copy/paste bug in safari). Overall, I'm fairly pleased with iOS 8 on the iPhone. Not saying there aren't other bugs and slop, I'm just saying it is still satisfactory for me.

Now on the other hand, we have iOS 8 for iPad. It's horrible. Overall, it's very stuttery, has a boatload of UI glitches and artifacts, and did I mention STUTTERY? I have an iPad mini 2. It's an iPad Air, essentially. ONE YEAR OLD. I can easily make the thing drop to 15 fps. Go to a website, click on the URL bar (you can already see stutteriness just from that) now, split the keyboard and pull up the control center. Drag down the Notification Center. Initiate Siri. Navigate away using multitasking gestures. All of these stutter miserably.

Pretty much anything relating to the keyboard has stutter involved (rotating for example) splitting the keyboard, stutter. Control center/Notification center and keyboard, stutter.

Spotlight stutters when you pull it down, control center/notification center over spotlight. Don't even mention rotating with spotlight open.

Sending a message with keyboard still up, stutter.

The entire AppStore is a stuttery mess.

Anything involving some sort of window popping up from the bottom of the screen, like sharing something via messages from the sharesheet. It stutters.

Splitting the keyboard makes the non-letter keys (I.e return, shift) turn a strange dark gray (only during the transition of going from normal to split and vice versa) Using reduce transparency makes the keyboard click indicators disappear entirely. When a split keyboard pops up, it has a weird artifact, the area between the split keys is connected for a second by the usual translucent background to the keyboard.

For some reason, leaving apps after I've been using them awhile, particularly more intensive ones, it leaves in one big jerk and its terrible. I may be due for a reset all settings/restore, but this would be the second time I've done this due to lag on my iPad, and I'm sick of starting fresh all the time because of the nonstop issues.

Anyway, I think they could get away with leaving the iPhone version of iOS close to as-is, just fixing the obvious and apparent larger bugs, like the broken copy and paste in safari. What they really need to do is make iPad usable again. Yes, they sell more iPhones than iPads, but we will probably be seeing a new wave of iPad sales with iOS 9 as many users are still on the iPad 2, Apple should make sure they are satisfied, resulting in the customers to stick with them in the future, and possibly buy other Apple products.
I'm using iOS 8.1.2 on an iPhone 6 and an iPad air, and not experiencing anything like the mess you are describing.
I configured it as new, I don't know if that helped, but my user experience with both devices is absolutely the same.
 
Again, why such a smart user like you upgraded his three years old device with the latest iOS without gave it a try first ?

Well, as I've been routinely jailbreaking my devices ever since iPhone OS 2 (in addition to my AppStore apps, I'm also a JB dev and have contributed several JB tweaks / tools; for example, my Call Recorder tweak), I had no problems upgrading myself with all my devices before the A5 (and, with the A5 CPU, also the iPad2, as it can be downgraded if you have the iOS4 SHSH blobs.) After all, I knew I can downgrade.

Regretfully, this doesn't apply to 99% of users and newer (2011+, A5-based, except for the iPad2) devices. With them, the inability to downgrade is a major issue.
 
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