in a market analysis, yes. this is shocking to you? should we include apples and oranges too?
why aren't you complaining that pillows aren't included here?
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iPad Drives Apple to Perch Atop List of Top-Selling PC Manufacturers
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in a market analysis, yes. this is shocking to you? should we include apples and oranges too?
why aren't you complaining that pillows aren't included here?
What it might show is that some huge percentage of the personal computer market, both business and personal, use it solely as a consumption (plus maybe some light text/data entry) device. An iPad can absorb a big portion of that market.
Some huge percentage of enterprise PC desktop purchases were used to run only 1 or 2 apps. Anyone know what that percentage might be?
My narrow view?
You are trying to define/redefine/exlude from the definition of a "PC" by giving 1 minute fact/point (your #2 point). Good luck with that. Your #1 point regarding what platform/cpu the application was compiled on is ludicrous.
You have absolutely no clue how computers (personal or otherwise) work. Take a few years and learn by reading and doing.
An iPad is not a PC.
The meaning of words is determined by usage. And no one (aside from maybe a handful of people posting on this and similar threads) thinks that an iPad is a PC.
Steve Jobs sure didn't - otherwise the term "Post-PC era" wouldn't have been used. Or made any sense.
And of course 95% plus of the population would just be confused if you tried to use the words interchangeably. Which is, again, the best evidence that an iPad is not a PC.
And any functionalist argument in the form of: A PC does X; an iPad does X: therefore an iPad is a PC; is going to fail because it would have to include smartphones, iPods, videogame consoles, palm pilots, and certain highly evolved kitchen appliances. And that's just nonsense, and clearly contrary to how people actually use words.
So what do people mean when they point to something and say "that's a PC"? Probably they just mean that it runs windows, or osx, or linux, or any other full OS. And what do people mean when they call an iPad or a Xoom or a Galaxy Tab a tablet computer? Probably they mean that runs simplified, lower power OS optimized for a tablet.
Terms like "PC" or "Tablet computer" or "Smartphone" are human created definitions describing different categories...and it's often hard - in any area - to tell where the boundaries between categories lie, especially when it comes to describing human created products.
It's its own device, which we might as well call a tablet computer.
The meaning of words is determined by usage. And no one (aside from maybe a handful of people posting on this and similar threads) thinks that an iPad is a PC.
Steve Jobs sure didn't - otherwise the term "Post-PC era" wouldn't have been used. Or made any sense.
And of course 95% plus of the population would just be confused if you tried to use the words interchangeably. Which is, again, the best evidence that an iPad is not a PC.
And any functionalist argument in the form of: A PC does X; an iPad does X: therefore an iPad is a PC; is going to fail because it would have to include smartphones, iPods, videogame consoles, palm pilots, and certain highly evolved kitchen appliances. And that's just nonsense, and clearly contrary to how people actually use words.
So what do people mean when they point to something and say "that's a PC"? Probably they just mean that it runs windows, or osx, or linux, or any other full OS. And what do people mean when they call an iPad or a Xoom or a Galaxy Tab a tablet computer? Probably they mean that runs simplified, lower power OS optimized for a tablet.
Terms like "PC" or "Tablet computer" or "Smartphone" are human created definitions describing different categories...and it's often hard - in any area - to tell where the boundaries between categories lie, especially when it comes to describing human created products.
It's its own device, which we might as well call a tablet computer.
You had a computer from 1983, yet you're arguing that the iPad isn't a PC because it's "not as capable"? I think you might have been the poster that mentioned the well-defined nature of a PC of 25 years? What exactly is it?
The subject of this thread is a market analysis. The market is defined by competition.
There are also other ways to define a PC.
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)
* edit: okay, maybe a jpeg and vCard was a poor example. But the minute we change it to a PDF and a vCard, things start to get tricky
BaldiMac said:
* edit: okay, maybe a jpeg and vCard was a poor example. But the minute we change it to a PDF and a vCard, things start to get tricky
to all: most folks on this thread are throwing out 1-3 examples of why or why not. This discussion needs to be verbal...and likely over 15 minutes of worthwhile, meaningful, wait-your-turn discussion.
I'm not ready to spend 4 hours and write out a 5,000 word article that hopefully captures every exact detail of my thought and which predicts, in true discussion/argument fashion, every counterpoint.
Most examples on this thread are good...but just slinging them around is not a discussion.
It's debates like this that truly need to step out of the text-world and into a vocal discussion...it's much faster, folks can agree/disagree easier, and folks can possibly change their mind given unique examples.
I'm off to another thread...this one is pure silliness here.
I'm not ready to spend 4 hours and write out a 5,000 word article that hopefully captures every exact detail of my thought and which predicts, in true discussion/argument fashion, every counterpoint.
Most examples on this thread are good...but just slinging them around is not a discussion.
It's debates like this that truly need to step out of the text-world and into a vocal discussion...it's much faster, folks can agree/disagree easier, and folks can possibly change their mind given unique examples.
I'm off to another thread...this one is pure silliness here.
There are things that can be done on a HPC that can't be done on a 27 inch iMac. So does that mean from that perspective the iMac is not a computer?
Obviously, different computers are suitable for different uses. That doesn't mean one is a computer and the other is not.
Yep.
Copy the pic.
Select a contact.
Share the contact via email.
Paste the pic into email.
I never said the iPad wasn't capable...and capable of what?! Sheeeeez, can you be any more non-descriptive.
Read my most recent post.
Alas, millions of consumers think a computer is anything they can use to browse the Interwebs and check their Facebooks. If that's true, then a LOT more devices should be classified as "computers", including mobile phones and web-connected TVs and refrigerators.
It's all well and good when you can simply redefine a term any time you want to make your numbers look better. By that rule, and if the *consumers* (shudder) are right, then a "personal computer" will continue to be able to do less and less, as the scope of what people actually *use* their "PCs" for narrows in scope.
There are thousands of things my desktop computer sitting here in front of me can do, that my iPad *can't*. If all anyone ever does with their PC is check email and play angry birds and twitter their bathroom visits, what does it make a machine with the capabilities of my desktop?
What most people use a computer for:
-Internet Browsing
-Email
-Music Player
-Video Player/Streaming
-Games
Devices you can do this on:
-Tablets
-Desktop/Laptop PCs/Macs
-Smartphones
-Game Consoles
-Handheld Consoles/iPod Touch
All devices have certain benefits over the other in any given situation. It's upto the individual to figure out which device benefits them most.
This silly argument can now end.
Thanks.
-Internet Browsing
-Music Player
-Video Player/Streaming
-Games
Devices you can do this on:
-Tablets
-Desktop/Laptop PCs/Macs
-Smartphones
-Game Consoles
-Handheld Consoles/iPod Touch
All devices have certain benefits over the other in any given situation. It's upto the individual to figure out which device benefits them most.
This silly argument can now end.
Thanks.
The bolded part is a terrible way to start off any kind of argument. Anyway, again, if we're arguing how people use the iPad, which is to surf the internet, listen to music, perhaps create documents, play games, etc. much as they would with a personal computer, your point makes no sense. They "use" it as a personal computer would be used, so why would it not be called a personal computer? You can't say that it doesn't qualify as a computer because you already stated that it is a "tablet computer", so that goes out the window.
You're trying to argue a distinction between "PC" and "tablet computer" and "smartphone". And you're trying to validate it with
This is very much an unsound argument. You're assuming people think of PCs as running a full OS, where does this come from? And where does it follow that a "tablet" is assumed by the public to run a "simplified" OS? Those claims are far from proven unless there are some survey results stating so. Your distinction applies to "notebooks" and "desktops" versus "tablets" and "smartphones." Not "PCs" versus "tablets", etc. There's been an association with the term "PC" to Windows (as Apple themselves have promoted), but that does not mean Macs are not PCs, especially not in the context that is being discussed. PCs are personal computers that are comprised of notebooks and desktops currently, and are now being comprised of tablets too. PCs are not defined to be only notebooks and desktops themselves, so there's no reason a tablet cannot be seen as a PC.
Does the Xbox and the ps3 compete with pcs for those viewers of streaming material both music and video?
Does the Xbox compete with pcs for those who want to play games on a console instead of a pc?
Does the Xbox and ps3 compete with pcs to attract users with various apps Like Facebook?
Does the Xbox compete with the iPad for console gaming?
Is the iPad competing with the psp for the portable gaming market?
sounds like that would make Samsung the #1 PC maker then, that will not please the angry mob
Sure, but those are not the questions that Canalys is dealing with. They are providing an analysis of the PC market. An xBox or PS3 does not compete significantly in that market. According to Canalys, the iPad does.
No...they do not. Do people go to the store and say "hmmm, which one is better suited for my needs this laptop or this xbox?" or "i really need to type this paper that's due tomorrow, i can't decide if should buy a mac or a ps3"...that's what the market is.
Like I said, I'm not sure what exactly the point of being obtuse is, but if you can clarify what you're trying to prove that'd be great.
People don't buy xboxes and ps3s instead of laptops. Wait...you probably do, right?
I mean I can't even believe that people are actually arguing such a silly point and trying to get their point across which such horrible examples/analogies.
I assume you're typing this from your xbox, right? Since to you they belong in the same category? What silliness...
I’m not exactly sure the point people who claim the iPad isn’t a PC are trying to make? Are you simply looking to discredit the assertion Apple is now the #1 personal computer manufacturer in the world?
Follow up question if 5 years from now the majority of people are “computing” on tablet devices will the PC era simply be dead, supplanted by the “tablet era” are you simply debating semantics?
Follow up question if 5 years from now the majority of people are “computing” on tablet devices will the PC era simply be dead, supplanted by the “tablet era” are you simply debating semantics?
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Very clearly semantics. How these people keep a straight face as they try to argue that GPS units and fridges should be also be considered PCs is beyond me.
Actually I agree. Power users used to buy products called minicomputers and workstations (remember DEC, Apollo, SGI, Sun, et.al.) before PCs became powerful enough to absorb that market. I expect that as the PC category migrates back to efficiently doing just the more common and personal computer-related tasks, the more rare segment of the market catering to power-users might migrate back to calling these products workstations, and leave the term "personal computers" for devices that are far more personal for the more typical user, such as where iPads and smartphones are or are going.
It's called logic. Some people understand the concept. I'm sure you can find a good book on it at Amazon or (if you want to spend more) the iBooks store.
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Well said.
I have no problem calling the iPad a PC. But then you also have to call all smart phones PCs, and Android tablets, and yes, web-enabled televisions and game consoles. After all, it's possible to do the kinds of things most *consumers* need computers for these days on all of them.